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The MeatEater Podcast
Ep. 156: Battle Scars
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1h41m
Steven Rinella talks with Ryan Callaghan, Ben O'Brien, and Janis Putelis at The MeatEater Podcast LIVE from Sacramento.
Subjects discussed: poaching a great white shark with a .22; the peculiarities of California; trading “smokies” for taxidermy, selling walleye fillets, and other details of an Ohio's wild game racketeering case; Lazarus species; step ladder diplomacy and fishing for monsters; naming one's rifle; shooting turkeys off the roost; the morality of stealing from a bird; kids are a pain!; and more.
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00:00:08
Speaker 1: This is an eater podcast coming at you shirtless, severely, bug bitten, and in my case, underwear listening. Don't make me eat the podcast. You can't predict anything. Oh listen, there you go, boys, how y'all he's fired up to night. I feel the energy sacramental. What's up, guys is? Uh? I got a couple people I want to ask about. Larry Costigo here, Yeah, what's your wife's name? We'll get to that. Uh. Um and uh, Greg Fonts, you guys know you guys know the Free Dive Shop West Sacramento. Right, Okay, we're gonna do a bunch of things to night. We're gonna do our normal show. Um. Then we're gonna do a thing that we're doing at our live shows, which is called two Lies in the Truth a k a. Seeing through the bullshit, Seeing through the bullshit. And uh, we already picked a seat number before any of you have to trust us that we just randomly selected a seat number. Do you remember what it is, Steve? Do you remember what it is? And that person will get to play the game. Uh, so we're gonna do that. Get a lot of interesting emails from California all the time. When I think about is It's like what wasn't I'm not sure whether there was a laugh there. It's like, uh, it's like a lovable kind of nuthouse around here. Uh. The uber driver. I was with the uber driver this morning and he got kind of circumspect for a minute. I wrote it down what he said to me. He says, you know, the problem with California's We've got too many fucking crazy people. He were not long ago. We get an email from a guy not long ago who was complaining about they had to go get a mountain lion depredation permit because the mountain lion is wiping out his ostriches, and uh, it's an our seat in the news too, Like you guys just have your own special set of things. There was I was reading an article do you guys now have There's an article in National Geographic talking about how you guys now have like the world's only population of blue eyed coyotes, which feels so intensely California, like there's no there's like no way that Nebraska right is gonna have blue eyed and Chuck Taylors and and of course National Geographic manages to spin the fact that California has blue eyed coyotes into an anti hunting article. It's like if they did an article about my mom's cookies and the end they'd be like, you know, people shouldn't really be able to hunt. I was reading not long with a lot of people wrote in this guy, I want to get this place? Why Rio del Mar? Yeah, yeah, what's the beach you're laughing about? New can Beach. That's that's California. You're crazy, right, Therapy Can Beach, Beer Camp Beach and a d dude recently shot. That's the time I've ever heard of this. A man. Uh, he was fined for this shot and killed a great white shark with a twenty two rifle off Beer Camp Beach, over five hundred pounds, over nine ft tall, nine ft long. The guy only get so this is the international like it's international conservation status of the great whitest vulnerable. The guy gets only a five thousand dollar fine. Hold on, are we playing that game right now? And it was it washes up on the beach. People are like laying down with it and taking pictures of it, and it looks totally fine. But they did a knee cropsy on it and had a and a guy that had had shot at three times with a twenty two. He was fishing. He's a commercial fisherman. Disney doesn't even lose his license. Uh, shoots it three times with twenty two. One of the shots separates the backbone. Hit hit it through the spine, kills it. Washes up on a beach. They do knee crops and find three twenty two rounds in it. Someone's like, oh, yeah, there was a guy or like some squad fishermen are out, they go and find him. They find the exact rifle behind his seat, destroy the rifle and only a five thousand dollar fine, two years probation, two years of probation. He did get probation, he did two years from fishing. Oh I didn't see that because we were being an article recently in Ohio. They're they're they're harder in Ohio for catching yellow perch than they are here for great white sharks. There's been no yellow perch movies I've ever seen. It's great. Instead of jaws, it's called little lips. I want to talk about this case from it, this Ohio case, because it was it's like, uh, this big poaching case that came out. It's called why is it called the north Shore north coast, North Coast, but it's the south coast of Lake Erie where this occurred. Cover. Yeah. And it's like a case where poaching gets so bad that they that it actually earns the term racketeering. The largest poaching case ever for Ohio Department and Natural Resources. They wind up it's racketeering. So they wind up confiscating ninety six deer in Turkey mounts, thirty five sets of antlers, two dred pounds of flayed sport fish, four hundred pounds of dbone venison, and process dear meat. And here's what it gets interesting is that the racketeering ring is a whole bunch. There's like forty some people involved in this. They shoot hundreds of deer, bone the meat out and take it to what's the guy smoking team and have over the course of investigation, they take two thousand pounds of deer meat down and turn it all into what they call smokey's, so like smoke sticks. The processor then sells the smokey sticks and they use the money to buy to get their own ship stuffed. Is like this ring, and so they're there, which earned them a money laundering citation in there as well. Yeah, and communications fraud because they would just shooting dear but then have like their old lady called the deer in and act like she got it, which makes it communications fraud and racketeering money. Yeah. The smoking tease, he gets it for money laundering because he's converting poached deer into smokey's, which I didn't even know that term. They use smokey's in the article in quotes one of these guys, he gets, uh, twenty two months in prison. He can't hunt, fish or trap until. I can't even do that much math um. Another guy who in the same like racketeering ring, he goes out and catches a bunch of walleye in lake Erie, takes him in alive well, enters a walleye fishing context on the river when and then he gets fraud. He gets fraud by their theft by deception and has to pay the bait and tackle shot back their money. Another dude get he sells to undercover agents a hundred pounds of perch and Wally and bass Filat's two investigators. In all, it's forty six defendants charged with ninety one felonies seventy three misdemeanors, forty six individuals assessed to combine one hundred and thirty one thousand, seven hundred sixty three and fines and restitution eight point six years jail time, seventy nine years of hunting revocation, and eighteen thousand in court costs. These sounds like the dudes I grew up with, though, but nothing ever having on It was like kind of like the dudes my my dad fished with dudes that would But John Garry I could say his names. He's dead. Uh. One day he was like flame perch and he was telling me how he the U was telling me about where he sells his perch flats, and he said he was telling me that whenever you sell him flays, he's always got his thumb on the scale, and he says the when you're buying something from him, he's got this finger under the scale. But yeah, these guys like it's like I remember this John Gary. He was right down. He had a notepad and he'd write down every book he read, and he'd write down what happened every day he fished. And this guy would fit. Everyone likes to say they fished two hund days a year. But this guy would legitimately fish two hundred days a year, but he lived by himself. There's no way to account for all the pan fish he caught. And he was just like a UM racketeer. We had to look up what racketeer meant. We want to make sure that that applied in this case. Yeah, it's like, uh, basically an unlicensed business with the intent too kind of deceived. I guess like you have a of crime business. Seems like we got it really figured out. We looked it up, and then uh, it's still gonna be one of those words where you're like, yeah, racketeering. I don't I don't wanna, Yeah, I know, I just like I'm like, who man, that racketeering? Um? So we also got an email from a guy. It's like like poaching takes different form and these guys are obviously professional like a holes, right, But we got an email from a guy recently. The guy like he got in trouble or he thought he was gonna be in trouble. So he's in an area we can only shoot a buck, and he accidentally shoots an analyst. Deer self calls up and self reports. So the game warrings like I'll come over. So he's he thinks real fast and he's like, how can I make this look as good as possible? So he said he like dresses the deer skins. It scrubs it down real good. So when the game warding walks and it's like ready to present and the game warding comes in, he's so pleased with the thing. The guys don't even get a fine nice Yeah, you like played it right. Reporting. We're always they advocating on self reporting. We get cool stories about people that do self report. And when I'm not getting in any kind of trouble, Um cayl, can you break down? Can you talk about the Lazarus species that you just fished for? Yeah? Uh, hunting cutthroat trout around Pyramid Laic. Anybody ever been over there earlier? Four four people brought this up to me earlier, like asking if I knew about it. There's a couple of dudes in this room and are doing way better than then we were doing. How many people have fished this? What's the lake? Pyramid? Pyramid? Like everybody everybody fish very well known, but this, uh I did see like as far as like the lazarous effects. So Lazarus rose from the dead. Jesus resurrected Lazarus after four dass. This is in the good book, the Book of John. I believe um. And and now it gets like lumped into the scientific term. It's called um Lazarus tax on. When something disappears from the archaeological record, no not archaeological, uh goes extinct? Do you think it went extinct? But it wasn't. And then all of a sudden it pops back back up, like the seal camp right, like armored fish. Um. That one was rediscovered in the fish market in Africa, right, that's where everything gets rediscovered, like that fit. That's interesting fish because what they realized they everyone thought it was extinct, or the scientific community thought that fish was extinct. How do you say it? And I know Cela Camp, Cela Camp, and the winds up that it was that they a guy discovers it in the fish market and they were using the scales you don't need, like get those shitty little tubes to patch tires and grocery stores. And it's got the tin that comes off, the lid that comes off, and it's got a scratchy on it your bike tube. They would use that fish as scale at tire shops two rough up the rubber for patching, and so they're using it for that and the rest of the world thinks that they don't exist anymore. Oh the tire fish. Yeah. And then uh, the black footed ferret was a Lazarus species. Yeah. Everybody thought they were extrapated from the landscape. And then all of a sudden, it's like, oh, yeah, look what I ran over. So what happened in here mid lake? Okay, So two strains of color um. One was kind of the river cutthroat. One was the lake cutthroat, very much paraphrasing here um. But there's this pilot point strain of cutthroat, which is like the big big dogs pilot peak and thank you. And that is so they found like bone fragments where they estimated that these fish got up to like eighty pounds cutthroat. Um, Well, I just cut throat in the world, and uh, they market fish those things, ship them all over the country at one point, but fed you know, the big California gold rush, uh, giant cutthroat going from Pyramid Lake down to San Francisco, and then in nine biologists is out on a ranch, so they wipe them out or presumably wipe them out, presumably wiped out biologists out on this uh private cattle ranch, private ground. And um, it's like, boy, this fish looks odd. This is a different looking cutthroat. Were you just doing a little nod you're doing a little nod towards private lands conservation? Yes, I caught that. Yeah, thank you, I thought. Yeah. Um, and uh, it takes five of these fish, takes them in the lab. Holy cow, this is our extinct cut throat trout. Um. And they were able to resurrect raise from the dead, this uh hunting cut throat trout. Now they're there are today. Yeah, I caught one. How big? Like she'llmove your hands? How big? Uh? The one I caught was probably about somewhere in here. Seriously. Yeah, but you were with the dude that caught a toad. Oh yeah, and that thing was like hitting probably probably Yeah. When we we did away, it was eighteen pounds and guys fish them off step ladders. Yes, that just doesn't like it is. I don't just like it. I don't dislike it. I like it, but I just it's a hard dude. This is like a full Michigan thing. You would love it is. These are like the race cars, like the souped up race cars of step ladders. Are dudes drinking beer? Are dudes drinking beer caddies? There's neck caddies. There's bass seats on top of step ladders. So you go down to the to the ramp, launch whatever, what have you? The access point and dudes walking down the beach with a ladder and a fish rode. Yea, did you do this on a ladder? Yes? Did you wear a life vest? I did not? I did get bucked off though, yeah? Doesname it for a little diving board on the end. There's a little wave action, a little floaty floaty arms. Yeah, bomit. You're sinking the legs into the mud, yes, yea. And you're trying to get up fish? Are you just trying to get up? Clear the water? Well a couple of things like getting clear the water saves you from like totally freezing your ass off and then um, yeah, you know if the water clarities. I did see a couple of fish like cruise and eat some midges off the surface, which was awesome. It's like a seven pound cutthroat eating the dry fly off the surface was But you're just bobber fishing. Oh, full bobber fishing. Yeah, I couldn't be called anything else. What do you mean a bober could we could be called a strike indicator. I've heard it call him. Well, it's only a strike indicator when there's a strike Okay, the rest of the time, bob. Yeah, it's like, you know, I always struggle with that because we used to fish them all the time, and we call them like bobber felt reductive. Yeah, it does. Strike indicator felt pretentious, so we took to call them floats, which felt like there's gonna be some combination like bob indicator or something like that. Yeah, he's like, you're fishing to float, you know. It's like you're not dressing it up. But they do not act. It's not like your kids zep Co Rod. Yeah, not the dog on zep Co gets people fishing. Uh. And then talk about the dude you met. Oh yeah, man said my new best friend wear this no no, uh, super cool old cager but he kind of he's got one of he's souped up, you know, sports car type step ladders. It's got easy even got wheels. Sorry, this is a six ft step ladder. What what are the wheels doing? Well, he's an older dude, so the wheels make it easier for him to like drag his ladder down the beach. And I had I was freezing, so I had gone back to the beach to do some some walking and uh and he kind of parked his ladder, you know, twenty to the left of my ladder. What's like when you put a ladder up how much? How much? The way it was explaining me is like, you want, you know, thirty ft would be great, but a lot of guys just fish fish closer together for the bullshit and you know, sladder the ladder conversation that's going up there. Yeah, And uh so I went out there to grab my ladder and drag it back in. And I was actually gonna go like prospect some some new beach and Joe is like, what are you doing? He's like, am I too close to you? You want me to move? He's like, no, I'm just gonna take He's like I'll move, Like, no, man, I'm gonna just drag I've been standing out here for like three hours. Well you should get back on there and stand on there a little bit longer. He's like, and I'll tell you another thing. I have no idea why those people are cast in as far as they are. The fish aren't out that far. The fish are right here. He's like, I've already missed two in the time it took you to walk out here. I'm like, I can't argue with that. He's like, seriously, stand up there, just wait it out a little bit. He's like, the big ones are gonna start coming out. And about six minutes later, he's got an eighteen pound cutthroat. Yeah. And this guy was, I mean, it was just amazing, right, this is like his spot. I'm like, oh, you come out here often every week day for twenty years. Oh huh, Like I'm from Montana. Uh, I really dedicated myself to this for six hours. Um, and uh yeah, I mean he was just phenomenal. He's like, yeah, he's like, here's my flies. Check him out. He's like, guarantee it's the same fly as you're using. And he just had like this, I'll help you out as much as as I can, and there's still no way you're gonna be as good as I am at this. So it was just it was awesome like this, it's phenomenal. Yeah. Yeah, that that go against uh the John gear Rock maxim that I like to quote is that when it comes to fishing, there's the people you're with and then the assholes. Oh now, and I'd be just layed at myself and everybody in this room if I wasn't like when I heard this like step ladder with wheels on it coming down the Rocky Beach, I wasn't kind of like, is this jackass? Yeah? But it turns out, Uh, super nice guy? Um did it? I mean, explain everything? He's like, Nope, those bugs don't exist here. Those bugs don't exist here. This is what happens in this lake. This is how cold the water is. Um, this is exactly why I wasn't standing down here freezing my ass off all day and why I came down right now and just like went through the whole thing. Was like trailhead diplomacy is ladder diplomacy, step ladders, step ladlomacy. Yeah, be like Joe, good dude. Uh, what'd you guys take? Someone wrote in about this, what's you guys take on the habit of the practice of naming your rifle? This guy is observing that he thinks it's extremely childish. Really, I think Daniel Boon. I think Daniel Boone. I'm not mistaken his what's called tick liquor? Tick liquor. That's yeah, that's one letter away from offensive. Maybe it's just got spelled wrong. Childish. Yeah, Since then, historians have been baffled by what. You can't lick a tick too small? These things get out of hand quick. Who do want someone licking your tick? I've never named one, but you know what, my my my halibate rod has a name, but it came with the name. The guy that made my halibate rod named it the Widowmaker, which is like weird because you don't think of like when you catch a halibit that you've now like there's another one down there, like all bumed that you caught that one. I was gonna go up, How do you ever talk to it? I feel like that's where it gets weird. You're like talking to it using its name. No, and I do it like kind of ironically when I say I'm gonna grab the Widowmaker. Yeah, but I think if you start talking to it, that's where it gets kind of kind of caught bullshit on that because I've been fishing with you and you're like, no, no, no, widowmaker's mind. They're they're widowmaker will get him. You fish confidently, and that is the widowmaker. Uh you honest? You have named a rifall Yeah, several? Yeah, like what kind of like you know what call it is? What it is? I do that as well, like you know, like my one gun or whatever. The most recent one that had a name that sucked for a while, I sold it, but it was a three hundred short mag. The first one that I owned is soon after they came out. I got caught up in the hype of three D short mag, did I? Yeah, it's a great round And it was all black synthetic gun and had the steel on it was black. Um, you're not gonna say something real offensive, are you. But it was the same time, come on, it was the same time that killed Bill. Those movies were coming out, very good movies. You remember the scene where I can't remember the name the snake and handel hand on, Yeah and yes, and the actor that opens up the briefcase full of money is Michael something. Yeah, thank you Mattson And some cinophiles out there tonight. He gets bit right, and he gets bit again. And and as he's getting bit and struggling on the floor, and as the Black mom is poison is getting to him, they don't. They don't. Hannah proceeds to read like a little know that she has about like how venomous the black Mama is and how a strike anywhere to the upper torso will cause imminent death. I believe it's how she says it. Well, man, that's kind of like my so. I called it the ye you're gonna say. My guy's name is Darryll Hanny. You ever take so I named it Daryl d h d h Um. Yeah, So black Mama was a name, Yeah, black Mama. Yeah. He stacked him up. Man worked for this outfitter. Uh. And he had one named rifle. It was a three mag whin Chester mag the better of the two if you're comparing him. Uh and uh. That rifle's name was Birdie, and it was its own entity. And he'd always be like, yeah, old Birdie and I were out, and it's like and I turned to Birdie. Was was Birdie? Was Bertie ever out? But he wasn't out? I was back home with Birdie. But I've never found like an approach, you know, impressionable kid working for your first outfitter. I was like, yeah, I'm gonna name Yeah, I just can't. Never never clicked for me. I feel like such a phony man. There's a lot of like Dolores's and Louise. You hear that. There's like some common names for lady names for rifles. Yeah, like old Betsy. That's a good one. But you've never named one. Never named just since since you guys can't really add to the conversation here, let me tell you about another. But please too. But don't think that me not having named one means that I don't have the authority to speak about this. I'm thinking. I'm thinking just that. I'm thinking just that. Now, my good friend Scottie of Nebraska, he's not giving away this. It's a shotgun. It's not a rifle. But he's not given away the shotgun because it got to be too much for him. Because he got blown up in Afghanistan in the concussion that he received there. He couldn't take shooting big Was he a contractor nefgamest? That's right, Yeah, drove big rigs and yeah, I got hit by I d but not as he wasn't a service member, right, No, Um, but he has. And now another friend of mine has the shotgun and it's a single barrel ten y and um its name is thunder Breath. But you don't tell the story without doing his voice. Saudi's from Maine. And uh, you guys have heard a lot of pronunciations of Janus over the years. And Scotty says, you want that took he was gonna get away. That's why I had to shoot him for you. This is how my very first ever turkey that I got went. Scotty was nice enough to have me out. Uh, And I'd hunted for three or four days on my own and uh, at that point I couldn't tell a hand, you know, apart from a gobbler. And so the last one he takes me out and uh, we're doing a little Uh. He took me to some ground that we hadn't haunted, some private ground friend of his. And when we're cruising in his uh pickup truck, and we kind of come over this role and this is we're coming over the role. Scotty's looking over the dash and just by the time I see him. He just he's a he's got a um sticksheft pickup truck and it goes into neutral and that truck just just comes back down over the role. I'm like, oh man, it must have been something. I didn't even see the birds, you know. I'm like, all right, it's on now. So he's like, come on, they didn't see us. So we hop back, Doc, come on, you want to let's go, and we go sneaking up this little ups this little knob and uh. We get about ten feet from where you could actually see over and he's like, stay down, they're gonna see you, and he goes on up there. Come on, man, I feel I'm pretty slick in the woods, you know. And he's just like, stay back, stay back. So anyway, we peek over and he comes back and he's like, let's go, and we just do this like full on army commando, run around basically just circumnavigate this I don't know terrain feature. And we're getting down into a cannone creek and circle around and pop up near a windmill and we go belly crawling next to the windmill to the water tank and they've gotten out to I don't know forty yards or so, and he's like, I can't remember what he said, you want to shoot that bird? So it's listen, man, you're the only dude worse that accents and neat that doesn't sound like everything is like, that's like sound like maybe like a pilgroom or something. I don't want to you have a blunderbuss. Yeah, my mind is like Americans and everyone else speaks kind of like a Irish. You're Australians. Like, so, I shoot the turkey and it's flopping over doing a dead turkey should do. Instead, he just like puffs up and all his feathers just fly everywhere. Obviously body shot him, you know, And I'm still just like kind of calculating everything in my head, like what I should do next, and you know, putting the safety off on the shotgun, and the bird takes flight and he's now gone another twenty or thirty yards and he's in the air and Scottie and Thunderbreath just jump out in front of me and pow And I've never seen a turkey do this this day, but at like seventy yards, a turkey just did like a somersault through the air and then he said, you want to go get your bood. So I walk over there and the first still flapping and I'm walking back and it's, you know, sperming and beating me and I'm trying to stretch its neck and I'm getting beat up by the turkey. And you want to give me that bud? And he grabs it and goes and throws it, you know, and then it finally lays there Dennis can be and then again you want to get your bood. That's how I got my first turkey. Yeah, if you bring it up, because the guy recently wrote in um, like you wing shot the turkey. But guys like why is it uh oh, like, why is it so bad to shoot a duck on the water or a pheasant on the ground, but it's okay to shoot a turkey on the ground and it's bad to shoot one flying? Like who came up with that good question? Steve? Well, the the flying turkey, I think you have a way higher probability of a body shot. He's like the turkey on the ground, it's you know, he got a lot of necks there. Yeah, because this this guy's main he was mainly exploring, like the morality or the ethics of you know, like shooting ducks on the water. Yeah, but you're talking to a dude, shoot a duck on the water. I don't have a problem with it either. I've never had a problem with it. I mean, if you were to ask the duck, right, yeah, I mean he's like, I don't really want to be shot in the air either, to be honest with you, you know, I mean it's like, like, who are you? Who are you? Ducks can't talk? We know that, don't don't. Some water fowlers say that because when they're on the water and their wings are folding and they sort of protects the water is protecting some of their you know, brass, the wings are protecting some of their I'm a water fowler and I say that, But I don't know if that's widely accepted. But yeah, I think that it's. Well, how many shells are Like when you say the saying like, like shooting ducks on the water, you might say, like, you mean like they get up and fly away? Because yeah, I think there's a I think there's a that's a part of it. Have you ever trained your shotgun on turkey and the roost and thought about it. Yeah, yeah, I have. We thought about it hard one time, and we got me and my brother in the dark, crawled in under a roost treat one time, and we're looking up very struggling with this very question, and you could seem goblin up there. I've had turkeys fly over my head at dusk, and as as they're flying over, I'm thinking, I know where he's going. I can probably get him. But just never do you Just I can't can't bring myself to shoot a turkey on on the roost. We're just reading that study the other day. Were they in Colorado speaking to roosting in Colorado. They were doing this thing with Miriam's turkeys. Um, what was the percentage of time that a gobbler will roost in the same tree? Do you remember this? I do remember it, but the number escapes me very low. But the biggest thing is they tend to like you think they oh, they're going that same tree every night. It was less than twenty of the time a gobbler or roost in the same tree, and on average they roost one thousand yards away from where they roosted the knight. And that number increases during turkey season. They're in Colorado in this study you know, in this study area on Miriam's in Colorado. Um best post apocalyptic gun guy was saying that he the guy was saying that this guy wrote in him and his buddy like have this argument the amount of energy to put people put into imagining, like lusting for a post apocalyptic world certain types certain types of people. Can we just say what we wouldn't use? Hell, let me give you the two He's kind of laying it out, like the two things. There's this he his buddy has this idea that you'd want to be a twenty two, so you have all this ammunition because you're gonna be dealing with all these dogs that are attacking you all the time. And the other guy feels like there's gonna be a lot more wolves. The other guys like, there's a lot more wolves and grizzlies. There'll be a lot of wolves and grizzlies, and so you need a high cat like a large rifle to deal with the post apocalyptic world. Is there zombies? Let's just say no. Let's say no. Let's say no, I'm just anti crossbow. I'm the anti crossbow in the post apocalyptic the world. There's a certain show where there's a fellow drungey fellow with a mullet runs around shooting things in the head with a crossbow, and like, come on, man, you're not gonna run. You're not running crossbow. You'll be eating alive while you're trying to cock it to get the next one. That's a fact. So mean in days are not in a lot of days are not even legal, So you have to cope with that. You have to cope with that. You'd be a poacher and and you'd be dead because you'll be cocking your crossbow. You're eating alive. I'm just gonna sit back, see what happens in California, and then I'll make my decision. Do you got any input? And you know, I like, why is it so hard to entertain the idea for you? I mean, it just seems like so easy post apocalyptic world. Yet I am still alive. He game whatever this is coming from the guy red Ryder bb gun, I know I have a ton of I have a ton of thoughts about this, and it's not about slash a lot of funds, but I'd like to do it like the full boat. I just want to suck my gun. I like my vehicle. I'm get a van for sure, Like I'm gonna put like a you know, snowplow on the front. I got a lot of things I think about, but just not the gun. So I'd like to paint the entire picture if we could. You know, what are you doing? Honest, you're sitting back and doing what Just wait and see what happens here. First I figured this is gonna be ground zero where Yeah, and we'll probably still be covering out on the news in Montana. I'll be like, oh, that didn't work. That did you can? You can email over and ask what's been working out for everything? My thing about it and we get like this question a lot, not a lot. Somebody I'll be blogging right, somebody in California will be belonging about like I figured, I knew it. I told you so it was. It's crazy you still have the internet in the post apocalyptic world. Yeah. Still, that's where I wind up having problems with the thing because it is this. It's so I think we're coming out of it now. But it was really like cool for a while to like be ready for the apocalypse, But then you're banking on you're like spending. There's people that spend sort of their entire lives getting ready for something that by definition means most people are gone. And there's this assumption that you're not. But the other thing is that you can find examples all around the world have collapsed societies. And the first thing that goes into collapse society is wildlife. Right like you go to the Democratic Republic Congo, or go to Syria, I mean, wildlife vanishes. So we have this like fictitious idea that that society will collapse, You'll be alive, everyone will be dead, and we'll have wildlife, when in fact, a stateless society almost like it's almost like by definition, stateless societies lose their animals, like the animal, the wildlife we have we only have because we decided to have it. It's not here accidentally. And with the with the with all the regulatory structure and anything of that that, like the imposes restraint removed, that's gone too. So the best you really just buzz killed the apocalypse. It was way cool to that to that monologue. Yeah, it's big fun gonna be there. Oh yeah, speaking of we're not supposed to talk about that speaking of what like a big weird state. You guys living um has anybody here seem a big Foot? I'm not gonna I'm not gonna say a word. Yeah, yeah, I don't. I won't talk about it. I'm it's curious anyone seem because this is like, this is a lot of bigfoot country north of here. I think you have said ye like they yeah, sure there is. Yeah, you look on an onyx match, you can see that one area that's where they are. I want I want to grab a subject that comes all the way from Norway. The guy from Norway wrote in him and his wife were out hunting black grouse, which we had to look up to verify was a bird. It's a bird, black grouse. It looks it's got the red eye comb. What's that whiskey or scotch with the red grouse on it? Which is a ptarm again basically famous grouse, famous grouse. It's got a red eye comb like that grouse. But it's a black grouse. That's not that capper Kyle Kelly, which is the thing I most want to hunt. Yeah, yeah, someday in my life I'd like to do that. I should contact this Norway fella. So he's out with his wife and they jump a black grouse and it heads off. He's all whacked out. He says he went a hundred meters by wish, he means a hundred yards roughly. He goes. So he strikes off and him and his wife march in the direction it went to go catch it, and it's wherever it landed. And they get there and before he can get there, a goss hawk kills the grouse. It's just laying their warm dad bird takes off and he pulled. He even said that this he presented the email. The subject line is a moral question from Norway. Oh and you point out that I want to tell you this, your honest blouch where he's from, is paying So you in a hunting story in Norway. Apparently you're like, and I raised my rifle and paying pa like it doesn't that's very a feat. Yeah, uh so, so he never gets to paying paying. Is it immoral to take to steal? To steal the bird from the bird. His wife stole the black growls from the gosshawk because she felt, well, I kicked it up. She has an assist at the very least she should. She should have just taken one lobe. I think, yeah, a wing, No take it. You have hands and feet the bird it doesn't have those taken any It's just it's that you think you just like exploit the bird. Yeah, I'm exploiting the bird. I would not have touched There's no way I would have touched that. You have some like big bird respect, Like I just feel like it's like, yeah, kind of, I feel like you've lost fair and square. Man. Put it this way. You kick up a bird and then it flies and often dis iss year paying like, yeah, what are you gonna go make the case? Are you gonna go make the case to that guy? Yeah? But I can talk to that guy, like, listen, guy, you good. Good for you. If you were a bird, i'd take it. You're a small little you're a small little bird or smaller. Yeah, similar story. No, I don't know this is similar. I can make this similar. We just got in the just of the last un So the two thousand eight hunting season, the guy who wrote us a letter drew a Utah Henry Mountain. So there's a there's a buffalo herd in the Henry Mountains in Utah. So he draws a cow bison, Henry Mountains tag. They hunt their asses off and can't find one. Oh, we met some people last night. They got too. No, but they hunted ten days before they found one. Yeah, there in this mountain range where they give these tags out. I've applied for these tags in the past. He was saying that the density, it's such a low density. It's one per four square miles. So they put in ten days and then he found they put in ten days before they found him, and it was a woman. She had a tag and she got one. But his other mud rights in that they're hunting and they're not finding anything, but an all of a sudden, his buddy is like, get over here, get over here, get over here. And he comes over and peers off this rock ledge and there is so he has a cow tag, a female tag, and there is what they suspect to be a bull. Bet it down and they observe it for a long time, and they're going by the curvature of the horns and they're thinking it's a it's a bull. So he can he can't get it, and you watch it and watch it, watch it, and eventually they get to want and to make a cell phone video of it walking away. I don't Lord knows why. He doesn't explain why, but they want a cell phone be able walking away, so they decided to try to spook it up, and they can't get it to spook and even throws a rock down there, and it won't get up. And they picked their way down there and realize that it is stuck in a crack in the rocks. It's like got his leg wedge and the rocks and is laying there unable to move. They can stand up and struggle, but it's stuck. So they still think it's a bowl. And they try prying and poking and digging and wrestling the thing out of there, but they don't want to get hurt by it, and they exhaust all the possibilities of trying to free this thing, and they're getting ready to walk away when one of them finally has a good I need to lift the tail up and it's a cow, so paying and field tag. So if you extend the goss hawk logic to an inanimate object such as a rock, he took that rocks catch. But I would have done nothing different, Like I would have absolutely done what he done. Yeah, I don't like it. You don't like, but you kind of have to. What do you like about it? I just don't. It's not ideal. No, it's not ideal. Yeah, I mean that's not what. Yeah, you know. I I am very particular on my hunting and I have like this idea of how a hunt should go and if it doesn't, like go out kind of follow through on my big ideas. A lot of times I just don't pull the trigger. But that'd be a hard one to if you were hungry, would be ideal? Oh yeah, that'd be queen mother. I don't think it would be ideal. It'd be like it be on it. You couldn't anticipate it. No, you can't anticipate it. And if you leave, you know what's going to perish? And you didn't, I mean not that you know. I believe when you treat recycling and all that, like nothing actually goes to waste, right like out in that environment, it's not it's not it will be consumed and write a circle of life all that kind of stuff. But yeah, I would have absolutely, but it still was the first day. But also like were you like, man, I wonder like how much struggling has this thing done, and has there's been like is the meat going to be affected? Which kind of is kind of like prick thinking at that point, it's like it's all about me. How's it selfish? Yeah? What would you done? Ni? Yeah? I was gonna say in both those instances that it would depend on how hungry you are, right, because if you're really hungry, sure you're just gonna take the bird from the goss hock and you're gonna kill the buffalo with its legs stuck. But we don't ever have to face that question. But what would you have done? Just knowing what I told you with the buffalo? No, and it was a weekend of the hunt and been tough hunt, probably would have killed it for sure. Yeah, And then you know, people come more. You got like the skull on the shelf, You're like, you see that and you tell them what happened? That's right, You're like, I before I killed this bison, I lifted its tail up. I was just thinking the same thing, like you've kind even know what I was looking for? Put your head up a bison's ass. Yeah, Yeah, there's no going back after that. What you're taking that bison home? What was what was Larry's wife's name Emily. Emily. That's right, Emily. She was wondering about this. What's that? Okay? Can I talk about it? Your question? Yeah, I'm just joking. It wasn't Emily wonderness. Okay, there's a fella. Let's just say, let's just say there's a guy. He's a section. There's a guy that was wondering and this is this is like, this is a difficult thing to address. It's hard to bring up. Uh, you process an animal, okay, and you got an animal, and there's a there's a smell to it, and we're all familiar with um. Has one ever noticed that after that, one might uh, one might pick sent some of those same orders around their own flagelence or bobble movements. And he's proposed this. This individual has proposes to family members. And some people think it's that sensation of when you put garlic between your toes and feel like you can later taste it. Or is it just that it's a familiar smell and you tend to then find that smell, you know, you recognize it in other areas. I have no idea. This isn't something I've experienced, but I do like to take all like I like to take all things that get and and lay them out to be helpful to people. I'm genuinely confused. Ye. Can we go back to the garlic and toes? Okay? If you have you've never done this? What? No? What was garlic? Yeah? You take peel and crush a peel and crush clover garlic and then jam it between your toes and wait a while. I've had some boring nights. Wait a while, and you will get to where you can taste the garlic, or you can't but you think you can, and you've been smoking what It works so well that the trick is this? You need you tell someone We've done this at my house. You tell someone, Um, I'm gonna put something between your toes, but don't look, and then after Wow, they'll be able to tell what it is. Dude, I wish you had some in your toes right now? Got there in the crowd. We can not back to the Okay, the guy you any you got any to add there? Should we hit the actual question? Yeah? I mean if it's okay, Clara or whatever. Brad, you're not going on the question. I'm not clear. I'm not clearer person. A person observed he observed this phenomenon that that he experiences where if when he you know, I'm just gonna move on. This is a psychosomatic we really get into. So a twenty year old person wrote in, and he's dating and using dating apps. There's nothing to do with the there's nothing to do with the the different person's nothing to do with this has nothing to do with gutting an animal and then feeling that it has affected the odor of one's own flatulence. This is completely set off. The subject where a guy saying he's digging through the rubble of the modern dating world on dating apps, and this guy is one of those closeted hunter types and he won't tell he won't tell women that he meets that he hunts. Yeah, I don't even have the luxury. Well, I don't have luxury. Got married. If I wasn't married, I wouldn't have the luxury anyways. But like that's some bullshit, man, get it together, man, closet, get it together of virtue? Ye put it out there. Yeah, i'd say, not only do I haunt by a shoot ducks on the water. Let me tell you a story about this goss hawk that I know. I steal food from birds. I put garlic between my toes, a fish off the ladder. Oh, this is not a control. We're gonna have to adjust your tender profile tonight. We got what have you been? Have you been out there lately? No? I like how you put it out. I think it's appropriate, Like I'm you're sifting through the rubble of how did you put it? That's what he how he put it. I'm a mid late he doesn't know how damn old he is. He's no wonder. He's like, this guy is like suffering from some personal problems. I'm a mid to late year old male sifting through the rubble that is the dating world. Well done. You know what if you were, if you would come out and just be upfront about what kind of feller you were, you might not be sifting through rubble. You might be like climbing the tower. We talked about this in the office, about hunters only dot com where it would be like a dating site where it's hunters only. Yeah, because they got Christians only, they got all kinds of farmers only. Doctor, why not hunters only dot com? You have your ripping grin, right, on there. It would be a good website because farmers only, I gather I think there's a lot of non farmers, Cal being one of them. He's probably never Cal. Have you ever dated on the on the internet there? Because I I we all. I think we all probably got married before it was prevalent. I missed it. I missed. It's like I missed a good old day, you know, like the good old days of dating, I like totally missed. Back then, you had to like get ship faced if you wanted to go on a date, because you yeah to go down and put in the time. Man, I've never swiped a lady any really any direction, but never swiped anybody. Right. You had, like, you know, drink a bottle of Boons in the shower, go down and have a long Island ice tea and then start talking and then once you got to the garlic in your toes, the day was over. My buddy Ronnie was just telling me about a guy that he who's in the dating game and he still does the old passioned way in bars, but he uh carries a thing of tic TACs in his pocket and he reaches in his pocket and rattles are like a rattlesnake and says, there's a snake in my pants, and he says it's this, he says, he says that it works. I started, I started doing to my wife and I haven't gotten anywhere with her. That's a good ad for tick tacks. But I was using those orange tic TACs and my kid's hand. Now I was rattling to my wife and she's just like having none of it. Another question, it's kind of like same vein is post apocalyptic? Guns? Is is U when it comes to backpack and you like spoons or forks? No, that's like that's like the middle of the road centrist bullshit right there. That's like fence sitters. Those guys are the fence sitters. You know. Well, I'm pro nuanced. I feel like that's the prone nuance, very nuance. It's got some curvature and some spiking things at the end. It's very nuanced. Yeah, I'm a long uh fork. I feel like the natural world is nothing but like fork things, pokey sticks, knife tips. Like I'm never out in the woods and be like, man if I only had a fork. Yeah, I feel like the meals that we eat out there aren't sophisticated enough for a fork, right, And it's like, if there's some time when you need a fork, your knife will do the trick. Yeah, like you don't like tuck in your napkin and ship like you And yeah, it's a blunt object. I guess just that one hunt where where the helicopter took us in and then with the Hollywood people. Yeah, we had to use the small fork from first one from the Johnny that's you salad for big Like I, we've taken to run and almost exclusively like big long handled spoons, which are meant for digging into, so you don't you don't soil your knuckles eating freeze dry. In a moment of weakness around Christmas time, I bought myself a titanium spoon. That's what I have, like the long one. Uh. And I got suckered in because it also had like a table of measurement on there as well, and I like everything to have more than one job. And I was like, wow, that's kind of sweet. So now you did, you're able to ditch the measuring cup and just run the spoon. It's got a toothbrush. On the other hand, it's but like the dirt, cheap long plastic g s I spoons I think are better talk about. It's kind of off white. Yeah, it flexes too much. You can't get into the corners and you don't get a good stair. It's it's actually actually weighs less than than the titanium spoon. What I find the titanium gets wicked, hock. What I find because everyone now has the same Like most people I know have the same spoon. What is that spoon? Speaking of name and ship, what's your spoon's name? Dope V notch? That's childish. Well no, because here's the thing, people will everyone owns. Everyone that I know owns the same spoon. I don't know what it is. It's a titanium spoon. It's like we usually just wipe out a size trout. Is that long? See the summit titanium spoon and something like the camera guys are wrap gaffe tape of various colors around their spoon. But then that gets soiled. So I take my the file and my multi tool and I all my stuff. I caught two V notches and all my ship, all my stuff. So I cut two V notches in my spoon. I called the double V notch why too? Why not one? It seems like a extra work. I saw someone else baby do that. I just wanted to have to in air, and I like cutting the thing, and it's like a thing I like enjoy doing. I do that with my I do my sleeping pad too. I kind of it keeps, it keeps popping. I don't know what that's. Yeah, that's sleeping pad with the two holes. Um, and I did that. I did it to my my steep country knife. I cut two things in there. And then someone was like, oh, does that mean you've made two kills since you've got that? And I was like, oh no, You're like, well this is but yeah, the double V notche. But no spoons all the way, man spoons all the way. Everybody out there is into the sport. Sports. Dude, there are sticks. You have a knife fingers. Yeah, I'm not saying I. I did a lot of early season, no dove. I was packing the salmon packets and uh, there's a shop and catch him there that if you went in for lunch, they had like a Mondo bucket of the wooden chopsticks. Sorry for whatever they were serving for lunch. I wasn't buying it, but I was grabbing a handful of the chopsticks. Um and smash up that salmon and rock the chopsticks. It was great and then just go like stove with cold foot. Yeah you took sticks in the woods, Yeah, yes I do. Did you bring it? Did you bring your hands? I brought some grass to make a fire and a little back. We talked about that. They were clean sticks. Do you know him? Do you know what Kurt Roscoe? Yeah? Yeah, your to hear what he does freeze dry food because he doesn't like to carry a stove around. He around noon puts the water in the freeze dry pack called cold because by dinner, Wow, it'll be edible and just eats room like cold ass freeze dry and that has never like exploded all over his You know, I didn't ask him about that, but it's a great question packing that around. Yeah, you know someone wrote in that he's harder and woodpecker lips. We've talked to multiple people that have tried the Kurt Roscoe method of or the cur Roscoe back country menu and camp come back and said, I was miserable. It can wreak havoc on your gut eating like impron like read like beans that aren't totally made back normal again, you want to talk about a gut pile? Uh? Guy wrote in about um, it's like the weird little deer hunting things. Guy wrote in that He's like, do you think it's a good idea if I put a mannequin in my hunting blind all year so the deer get used to being someone in the area. Yeah, that's the best question. That's great. You should dress it like you put your clothes on it. Well. In the same week, a guy wrote, and he's saying, like, why if, why don't I just keep like I'll wear clothes and I'll put my clothes in a pile on my tree stand so that the deer in the area become accustomed to my smell. But and I like, you're kind of like sure, but I just don't. I don't know. I feel like you're tipping in some weird direction. Oh for sure. But I think it's kind of beautiful too, because I that's what so much like, go away from tradition, Like you got this whole wild world out there to mess with. Yah, I like it invites experimentation. Yeah, exactly. Rebel little old spice on there. And but there's moment you gotta just realize when you're carrying a mannequin out through the field and it's like, what the funk am I doing here? Like? Am I really? Like? Really? Guy walks about a step ladder and a mannequin? Am I really that into this? Like? Is that really where up going? Um? Yeah, I don't know. I can't. Like, I just feel like I don't know why I feel that it's bad to do that. I say, get weird, dude, I can't. You can maybe even make like a little scene because you could just bring out your dope and buck decoys at the same time, bring a couple of mannequins and then so when the buck comes out on the field, he just looks down. He's like, Oh, everybody's just hanging out together. You know, have a little card They got a little card table set up a little outstretched. I feel like that's a slippery slope. Then you're gonna be starting to put mannequins in different places they shouldn't be. If that works, okay, Uh. Another guy wants to know this, Um, if you how does he want to put it? He includes this, It has me that if you it's about if you're gonna die in a in an outdoor wilderness disaster accident, but he but he prefaces it by saying if you knew you were gonna die anyway, which I feel like has implications, but I don't know what they are. So it's like, I guess it just makes it easier, Like God comes down and says you you now have to die, um, and you can pick how you would like it to happen, any wilderness accident or whatever. Predator avalanche, Okay, what do you like? What do you get into? Yeah? I thought the question is gonna be like, how are you gonna prepare for this? But no, no, he's got a prepper. This dude's a fatalist. Oh man. Yeah, it's just like in the outdoors. Yeah, probably on a surfboard, drinking a beer with some fireworks and twenty two great white shark keeps men something cool like that. Though you're in a jet ski your kids on the beach be like, yeah, dah, yeah, I'm on a jet ski. Probably it's on fire, but it's a great white the probably, so it's all that. But it's like leading up to a shark. Yeah, I want people to think, Oh, that's how he's gonna get it, But no, no, he survived. He's in the water, great white. Yeah, I like I I fall two different directions on them, right, which is one that would be a grizzly because man, you know the experience of that. But then I also think that way back up, what do you want? Well, yeah, but afterwards you're not gonna get to hang out and enjoy like your past experience anymore. Now you're like laying out. Now you're like laying out. Um, You're you're laying out a rather grim afterlife scenario. Yes so, but okay, okay, ivascilate between the two extremes. One would be freezing to death. Would you lose your sense like if anyman has ever been hypothermic, You lose your you lose like your wherewithal and then you have that phenomenon called paradoxical dressing. Or it'd be like the struggle with a wild beast, not some middle ground ship like a tree falling on you. No, take, ma'am. You ever see a Royal tennan bombs right? A couple of times? Phenomenal movie, But you know at the end he's got this tombstone, and it's like his dying request is and the tombstone reads like died saving his family from a destroyed sinking battleship. Right, it was total bullship Gene Hackman, right, Yes, uh little Bill from the Unforgiven, So like apply that to uh Jeremiah Johnson. Right. And he comes across the old trapper in the woods, you know that where he gets uh, the dude buried up to his neck in the sand, know, hatch Jack's hatch Jack. And he gets he like leaves this little like, hey, you get the rifle that killed the bear that killed me type of deal. So I'd kind of like combine the two where I would get myself into a situation where somebody would inevitably find me, but maybe I would like give my rifle barrel just like an ever so slight little tweak to where they're not gonna be able to hit ship with it, but lay out this amazing story. That's a great point. Hatchet Jack did the two I don't even think about that. The greatest movies ever made. Hatchet Jack did the two things. He did both my extremes. He got mauled and then frols of death that's what I want that. Um, that's tough one though, Yeah, what about last words? He like, I'd want to have some kind of last words that were impactful sons. I think he could die happy though, with like a well played joke where you're like, eventually somebody's gonna find me read this note. It's gonna be great. Yeah, might be like damn jet Ski. We with a guy rolled into us once and we're talking about what we wanted to have into our bodies actually died, and a guy wrote in that he wanted to have his kind of dried out out in the woods. So he's kind of pointing, but have it be this point that I just absolutely nothing, just a mess with everyone that found him, and they'd go over just dying to know what it was over there. But he's was like, it's just bad because what else do you do with your dead people? Just burn them up nowadays doesn't do anybody any good. Um. In the same vein what's the best they like, the best scar that you had have from some kind of outdoor venture. I got a good scar, but it's not from and like it's very weird life I have led. Let me tell you, Um, I've never been like thrown in jail despite my best efforts. I've never you know, I've been in some situations in the woods where I'm like, well that's it, and uh here I am. But I have this scar on my shoulder from leaning back at my desk with a cup of coffee. And I have no clue to this day what happened, but I ended up flat on my back with that cup of coffee on my shoulder and I this wicked scarf from the scalding cup of coffee. And it's just like a great reminder of like the humor in life. Right, that's my scar. You know, Well you want to think you got some cool thing we just got from like being a don't mass at your desk some day, Like see that, kids, that's hot coffee. I'm a riddles decaff you anything. He's gotta have something. I've got a few scars, um, but the one that happened kind of outdoors, the hunting related scars. Don't talk about what I think you're in top about. It's not right here, is it? And That's not what I'm gonna talk about. Um. But I had let a buddy of mine who was coming up to hunt with me at in Colorado after we've been done guiding, who's gonna come up and hunt? I think, I don't know. And the third season, maybe fourth season, we're gonna hunt Elk. And he didn't have a rifle, and um, I was gonna borrow a rifle and let him borrow mine so that I didn't have to let him be borrowing my buddies rifle. Right, So I was the one responsible for my buddys. I let Chris borrow the black Mamba, and I took a three d weather be Did you say something like careful bite? No? So, but I took a three hundred weather be that I can't remember that if she had a name. They're always females, aren't they. Why is that? Well? Yeah, but that's like that ship sailed now, man, they started naming storms after dudes, now really, yeah, you know that. I didn't know that all these storms women's names, and the storm come and kill everybody and women got pissed. Now they alternate. Now there's like storms like Bob came ye, Like, oh man, Bob used to go by Robert. But yeah, when when Bob blew through here? You know, so the three weather be which black Mamba No One Nameless UM. It was rigged out very ultra light weight, super lightweight stock and as you know that going has a lot of kick um. The three weather be likes to balance. Well. The first elk that week, This is back in the day in Colorado were like every year you could have to count tags. So I was doubled up that week. And the first elk that I get into um for some whatever, for whatever reason, but I'm not hanging onto the rifle and I touched off and that thing come comes back, and uh, I just got blood, you know, in my eyes. So I've got this nice cut right here. But I get back to camp and I kind of cleaned it up and look at him like it's not too bad, you know, it's it's just slight. You know, it's not gonna scar. A few days go by, kind of starts, you know, closing up, and there's really not like a big, great, big um scab or nothing for him. And I was sweet, but I'm still hung with the rifle. And the last evening of the hunt, I get another shot at a cow and somehow forget that this gun's got a ton of recoil and the same thing I get into some awkward position and I'm not really hanging onto it, and I touched off and wam so twice in one week. And so now that's why I have that nice scope scar between my eyes. I know a lot of people to have those. Remember something, My brother one time, he was real sick. He had like the flute. And now I'm watching him and I can't figure out what's going on with him. Like we were on either side of this valley and I hear him and I hear him shooting. I look over and I'm looking at is trying to figure out what's in the grass. He shot something and he's vomiting. But also his face is covered in blood and so he already had the flu. And then he like cut his face open, and it was kind of a miserable sight. I dragging dragging his deer back like that. You know you got nothing? I got, man, I got nothing. I feel I feel sad about this. I'm gonna go out and cut something up. So I got a story. These like date like this, beautiful hands that are soft, soft hands. It's a it could be a testament to how skilled you are. No, it's not. No, it's definitely not that, Uh, the only one, like my kind of main outdoor one. This is this would drive Mark Canyon crazy because you know, like all this like Super Joe Ninja white Tail stuff, you know. But we're out like in Michigan Open Day deer seasons November. So at a round eleven PM on November fourteen, roughut in the woods building ground blinds in the dark. Uh, and I waylaid my leg with a machete and that was it. And I don't even know I did. I thought I hit with the back in a while later my brother wondered why my car hard overalls were all read that was the only one. Yeah, lifetime of safe practices. Yeah, these are terrible scar stories. No, I don't. I want to be like, well then I got that. Yeah, gressly be just in my real foot. Okay, one last one before we getting to see him through the bullshit is uh, what did you learn? I mean, it's an infinite number. There's an infinite number of answers, all the prefaces where I even say it, but pick one. What did you learn from your dad? You look at me? Anyone everyone hunting outdoor. Later we're just guess that's kind of like the I don't think he's talking about He's like you like, you know, when your balance and your check buk. You know, Yeah, I would say I think that that's probably what he's getting. It's that's probably what he's driving at angling camping that rassling animals, you know, m hm hm. Yannie sounds the most inquisitive. I'll let him go. Well you met Yanni's dad. Oh yeah, yeah, well I guess I can. I can tee off. It's uh, it's probably is to stay positive out there in the woods. Always be thinking, like you're just about to come up on something. He's gotta hashtag, he's gonna start using. What is it? Keep smiling? Keep smiling? Smiling that's your hashtag, not stay positive. There's no hammering, but only smiling, just smiling. Um. But yeah, I mean, and I don't think he actually like went out to teach me that, like for you know, to be successful hunting. It was more of a I think a life lass. And my dad was definitely always pushing to be looking on the brighter side of things and too always know that we had a choice how we really reacted to. You know, most of time, if it's something good, you react good. But even if it's something bad that happens to you. He taught us that we had a choice how we wanted to react to it. Right, you can react positively or negatively make the best out of a situation. But you know, just that constant positive good attitude, you know. And that's something we talked about this last night. It's like an argument we have me and your honest which is I feel that, uh, because I'm not I'm not into I'm not into metaphysics too much. So I feel that the what's in your brain ends at your skull. Okay, so that you could have all you could have a negative mind frame, but if you're sharp enough to have it be that your physical execution doesn't betray your mind frame, you will have the same out home then if you had a positive thought in your head. But Yanni believes that you push out a sort of energy wall of positivity or negativity which impacts animate objects kind of kind of I think. So I believe that, at least for me personally, I might not be how did you put it, um sharp enough to separate the two? That was poor. It was poor word choice. I didn't mean sharp enough. But you know what, but no, it's it's fine, But yeah, I might not have the ability to separate those two. So that don't made me live with the word choice. I don't care, um, but yeah, I can't separate the two. And so I know if I'm like having a bad attitude, negative attitude and being pessimistic and thinking, man, we're probably not gonna kill something, that I just feel like, yes, that's gonna affect what I'm doing and turn it into probably not killing something. But how are you able to control, like people say, stay positive, think positive, how are you able to control what part of your brain controls the other part of your brain? You only have one mind, So if that mind is feeling a certain way, what part of it is able to manipulate that part. It's not like there's two brains and one's telling one how to be Like, if your brain feels negative, what in it is telling it convincing it to not feel that way? You don't ever want to have a two way conversation with yourself ever, No, I can't say I can't be like if I did, I just tell myself to be super happy all the time. You know what my dad taught me, He said, if a conversation goes on too long, always step in. Uh now I, oh yeah, old man, what's your old man telling? Oh man, Yanni's dad taught him to be positive, Be positive, man. I I feel like my dad's teachings were just, uh, we're so consistent that I couldn't just say, like he taught me this one thing, be positi or whatever. But it was be present, like enjoy what you're doing and be with people you love what you're doing it. When I was coming up hunting with my dad, it was less about the deer, less about the act of hunting, but it was more just about being together, you know, being together with For me, it was just following this large and a life figure around in the woods. And so he didn't really say it, never really said that to me. He followed me, son, but he he walked and I followed. So I learned that just being there with him and him appreciating that I'm there and me you know, giving that back to him was enough to to propel me to you know, hunt the rest of my life. So it wasn't one thing he said to me, was just his presence there and his willingness to take me wherever I wanted to go. Know that was pretty metaphysical. Cal oh the old man. Um so yeah, not the sharpest woodsman out there. Uh. And he would tell anybody that himself. But what he did do was spend the time, uh, because I was infatuated with being outside. Um and as much as he really wanted me to be like into you know, a fun sunday watching ESPN and college sports and things like that, Oh, he tried to be a bad influence on you. It was very very palpable, Like I knew this is what he wanted to do, but he was willing to, you know, take me on the woods again, not his comfort zone, but spent the time. And I never really knew this. Yeah yeah, So I mean that's that's a great lesson and something that I certainly keep in mind all the time. It's like, so he bent in your direction, yep, because he just knew. He was like, yeah, this is what this kid fell off with, apple rolled far from the tree. But I'm gonna do what I can to help him along, help him along. Yeah. Yeah, it's not a word I say very often. Um. Yeah, yeah, So I mean that that was a good lesson for me. You know, it's like and then a lot of what I've done in life, UM is helping folks in situations where you know, sometimes I don't really want to be there at that time doing that thing, but I know it's for a good, good purpose. In the amber, the thing I didn't even like. My old man was a real advice giver UM and had like a lot of life philosophies and whatnot. The lesson, the latest lesson that I've learned from him, I'm only now being depreciate is having he had. You know, I well he had multiple kids because he had been you know, I had like half siblings, right, but I was raised with two brothers um from day one. And now that I have three kids, Uh, just how difficult it is to take kids, like take kids in the outdoors. It's a struggle, especially with that many of them. It's like hard, and I see a lot of there's a lot of people that I know that just kind of get, like a man, this is too hard, and they kind of ditch them. But the fact that he, I mean, since we were little little with take us all out and the pain in the ass that was. But also to make it feel that you were very welcome and he'd freak out like over anything, but um and wish I get now, wish I get now? But like you bet you like you live a bunch of life. You kind of like free wheeling and do what you want and you stay out and it gets cold and you still stay out and then all of a sudden, have it be that? Uh also have a bet you're at the whim of all these little freaks, you know, and that he did it for that long and it kind of leaves you like, man, I'm gonna have to do it too. But man, it's hard. Oh dude, running my five year old al hard. It was the other day and it hurt her feelings. This is hard. And let's how you use something. Um Oh it's hard. It's hard even finding all the mittens. There is no silence. There's no silence like running out with you and the kids and like no, even when things are going perfect, it's like, hey, well what about this? Can't I do that? What about that? Well? If I can't do that, can I have a snack? There? Like it's they wanted their own little face masks, So I gave I had to like net gators, the Marino netgators. I give one to each of them. Then they got to wear there. We're wearing them to school, and they now take them school because you'll lose No, we won't lose them. Next day we're going out side, okay, get the things, neither of them. And one day they've both gone. Yeah, like you can't find the mittens, you can't find the hats, and you just got to like somehow just but you can't ditch them. It's too wrong to ditch them. Ditch your kids. Yeah, you know, it's fun, it's fun, but hand it's hardened. And I think like in my dad, I'm like way more tolerant than my dad was the fact that he managed to hack it out is inspiring to me. Well, you said that your your dad was that he was never like into being friends, you know, friends with No, he didn't even tell you though. He wouldn't like secretly not want to be your friend, to tell you he wasn't your friend. He was about it friend. You know, in that moment when you're struggling with the kid thing, that's when you're just telling yourself, man, these are the days. This is like awesome, this is great. Yeah, I do try to do that. And when they when they say, what's that you're saying? You didn't talk to yourself earlier? Try, I said, I do, try to remind myself. It's all coming back. I tried to remind myself and listen. My wife is very forceful about which side of your brain is reminding which side of your brain. I'm trying to do it. There's a difference. There's a big difference because I do it, but it's not effective. But I tried, Like I try to remind myself. My wife makes it, makes a constant practice of verbally reminding me of how good like right, and you'll cherish these days and they grow up so fast and all that stuff you do not try hard. I really do try hard. I'm committed to trying to do I'm committed to like raising them up. And when they complain, um, they're like, why don't we have to do that? So cold or whatever? I tell him, Because you'll be able to hang out with cooler people if you learn how to hack away through this kind of stuff, which doesn't really sell them on it, but that's kind of what I'm pictured like, you like, you'll you wind up, you wind up with cooler friends. I found myself the other day trying to like define and explain grit and how that was gonna help my girls later in life. And yeah, they just is in one year out, you're trying to tell me you need to have grit. Yeah, ger Tony the Tiger, all right, seeing through the bullshit. The game we're gonna play with Vortex Optics, Yes, because they gave us we needed to have a prize. So the guys of Vortex gave us the new Uh, they got new three five thousand. I think one time I said six three five thousand range finding binals. That's right, you can ditch your range finder and just carry binals. And we've been playing around with these, and yeah, they will pick up reflective objects out to about five thousand and deer type animals. Um Steve was paying Cou's deer, which is a real small critter out at a thousand or over a thousand yards. Yeah, so we had a sweeten deal and get these. So you get this, and we randomly selected a seat number which I think the numbers are right here, right, and that person will come up and play and we select did my son's nicknames Jim Jams Jams and he's eight j J eight. So if you're in J J eight, shall we say come on down? Come on? Then how did they get up here? I don't know how they get up There is is somebody in that seat. Was it a full seat or empty? I hear somebody coming, make some noise. Okay, So now remember it's uh, what are you doing, Ben? I'm gonna let him sit down here, come on up. I'm gonna let him sit in my seat. That way he can look at you guys in the eye while you oh yeah, because he needs to look us in the eye. We're gonna tell you what's your name, John, and it's up, man, take a seat, John's hot seats. We're gonna tell pressure. No, I know, it's a lot of pressure you're gonna get. You have to pick out. You need to see through the bullshit to see the true, the one of these it's true. All right. We're each going to tell you a thing. You'll mean to go first. We're each going to tell you a fact. Remember to maintain eye contact, especially with Yanni especially. I needed I need to check my facts. And it is two lies and the truth. You gotta find the thing that's fine, the truth, Alright, binoculars. Currently, I do alright around. Let's make it sure. I worked real hard on this story, so I want to make sure I had nail it. Yeah, I'm selling it. I'm selling it. Yeah. See he's seeing through it. Um. Recently, the Florida Fish and Wildlife Commission finished a four year study on white tail deer in South Florida, where the largest deer research finds ever conducted in the state. Two x three year were fitted with GPS collars eighty camera traps fer set. The gold project was to gain a better understanding of deer ecology in the unique South Florida environment where there's pythons and panthers and all sorts of stuff they can get deer ned next. Um. Okay, so they studied all different kind of stuff. Um, the habitat, predation, hunting impact. Um. What was interesting to me was the mortality results. A hundred and fifty four deer died within that four year time frame. A hundred and two were ruled as possible or probable by a panther hif four Wait, what did it start with panthers? Oh? Two sixty three two Yeah, so it says here. Hundred two were ruled as panther or probable panther. Bobcats killed three, bears killed two, alligators killed one, disease got four poaching and probable poaching two. And the lowly Florida hunter only killed one of those deer California. He's been listening shit all right. This is the unlikely heritage true story of Jan Smith. Right mountain man Who Je Smith is? I know the name you by Grizzly. Were you gonna clue that? No? He was balled by Grizzly and his buddy sowed his head his skelp back on, and you always wore his hair long. Yeah. Uh, the stitching wasn't very tight, so he had to part his hair just so. Uh so jets Man, famous mountain man, had an incredible life, but he ran into a bunch of trouble just about in this area. He actually ran into the Spanish military. Um, got detained for amount of time, ended up having a kind of a harrowing run through a bunch of cactus, got all bloated up from his body reacting to a ton of cactus needles. Um. During that kind of healing process, he is tended to by this very nice Spanish lady named rose Rita. Um they have twelve kids. Uh yes, um, that's where all the Smiths in the world come from. Now here's where things get pretty deep. So stay with me here. Uh. As this uh family grows, the Spanish heritage takes over and they produce a line of high quality Mexican foods that you can find at your grocery store today. If you've ever eaten rosary to refried beans. That is the unlikely true heritage of Jedediah Smith. Jedediah Smith, and I just Jed Smith Jedediah Strong Smith. Okay, the Florida panther is reduced down to maybe fifty animals, and there's talk about supplementing the population with mountain lions from West Texas. The debate centers around what is the Florida panther? If we bring in a genetic line from another area, are we destroying this isolated habitat. They do a collering study on mountain lions to try to determine their range and distribution, and they have a collar on a mountain lion in the Everglades of Florida, And for some strange reason, one of these lions, whose name is G four five migrate south and swims and starts going out into the Florida keys And there's that diminutive white tail sub species, the keys deer, which is an imperiled species. And this lion is praying very heavily on these very small populations of keys deers, and a number of times the Florida Department of Fishing Game thinks they're gonna need to remove one of these lions. But eventually it is hit by a tour bus in Key West. A little too detailed in little too Yeah, it's a little you to figure this out. You can't ask the audience if you'd like, I can go and hold my hand over each person. They can cheer for you can you can go to audio. You can go to audience support if you really if you if you think you need I think I have an idea, but I'll go to the I mean, where where are we going? Alright? Alright, alright, cheer when I hold my hand and do this motion over the person. You're looking for the truth. If you think this was the truth, cheer for Yanni his story. Do you think cal was telling the truth about asked me something? Now? If you believe it's Steven Ronello is telling truth about that women to pay, he suppose, and you're gonna go with that. Mr Ronello over here, I think he's I think his story. It's true. He gets your story, that's true. They just they just put out the results. Man, Panthers killed over a hundred of the tuner sixty three that were collared. Yeah, and Florida Hunters only killed one. They were even told don't let the GPS collars and the ear tax bother you. Please kill those deer when you see them, right, believe for playing you still anyway? Yeah, thank you for playing. Oh yeah, good, thank you, thanks man. Oh excellent, that's great. Alright, guys, don't go away because we're gonna Uh first off, thank you very much for coming out, but don't go away. X. We gotta do a we gotta do a birthday give away. But first if you go out, we have our merge table set up. We have signed books. We have new are signed cookbooks out there. We have our meat Eater mug mugs, uh squirrel meat hoodies. We have our ice age hunter doing a grip and grin with a saber tooth cat t shirts and then our only and then our shirts that we only sell at live events, which is our famous steam Breathing Turkey shirts, steam Breathe in Power gobbler and those. They're not available to anyone but you folks. Um so does that? Now we gotta do our birthday giveaway? Can we bring up the however you call the yeah, the lights out there just a little bit. This will help us. Is anybody celebrating their birthday? Oh? Wow, alights a better idea? How we have stand up ship goes back and check your ideas? Are you really serious? We did this two nights ago and we had all right, everybody, everybody who has a birthday come down. So we're gonna look at you. Come on, if it's your birthday to day, No, it's gotta be a birthday to day right now. Come on. But then if you're real young, don't bother because we're gonna go with older because you're closer to being dead and I want you to enjoy your time. We've got more people. Yeah, really, what was going on nine months ago? Tonight? It's Valentine's Day? Kids? Oh no, never mind makes no like a very like a negative concept of negative. So everybody, it is your birthday to day? Oh it's just four of you. Well, by golly, you guys. Are all these chairs t winners of a new chair? Stay around, you're right here. Chair it up. That's very heavy. Watch yourself. Thank you, great dude. Al Right, guys, we love you all.
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