00:00:01 Speaker 1: Welcome to the news show, everybody. This week, we've got news from Washington's crooked Game Commission. Did a secret service canine handler get caught with his pants down? 00:00:11 Speaker 2: Hanoi? 00:00:12 Speaker 1: Randall reports on IDOH hunting tech bands, which I'm generally sympathetic to, the most hated wildlife crossing in the world, which is in California, A plan to save Great Lakes whitefish, and Clovis First is back Baby plus more Clovis What Clovis First? It's a theory on the peopling of the Americans. Clovis First. Clovis First was there, then they killed it, and it's risen from the dead. 00:00:46 Speaker 3: Those people can't make up their minds. Man, It's like the Ceila cans that fell flat. 00:00:54 Speaker 1: Yeah, no, I got it. That's good. That was a good joke. It's like a Lazarus species. Yanni's back fishing in Key West. What's going on? 00:00:59 Speaker 4: You? 00:00:59 Speaker 1: Honest? 00:01:00 Speaker 5: It's funny. 00:01:01 Speaker 6: The like this second or third night after fishing, I was on FaceTime with my gal and she's like, how are you not burned up? I'm like, man, I'm just I've just learned. After forty seven years, you put a bunch of SPF fifty on and you can just stay not Red Randall and Max are a little bit cherry. 00:01:21 Speaker 2: I put on spfere on Sunday. I thought it would bounce out that. 00:01:26 Speaker 1: I had a point. It tapers off, doesn't It is that like a like there's like a sunscreen scandal that maybe I'm not aware of. 00:01:33 Speaker 2: I'm not quite sure the science behind it all, but I retroactively applying strong sunscreen after not having sunscreen doesn't actually, Yeah, in fact. 00:01:43 Speaker 1: Like I got burnt bad, I'm gonna put it on here. 00:01:46 Speaker 3: You need to invest in a ten gallon hat man. 00:01:48 Speaker 1: So is that the best is that that's what you got? That you got sun you did that you didn't get sunburnt. 00:01:53 Speaker 6: Mark Kingan and I went down to Key West to do a little fishing with our good body Jake Grim that I think most of us here in this room, no you know him. 00:02:02 Speaker 1: No. 00:02:03 Speaker 2: It always makes me feel left out when and then I still feel like the new guy. 00:02:08 Speaker 6: That's good, it's fresh. Jake's the guy that took me under his wing for some hound hunting. I've had forgotten this. The whole way that we met Jake is that he was like an early meat eater fan and was emailing us about going rabbit hunting with beagles in Montana. Do you remember that, Like, that's not how I know that's our first contact. 00:02:29 Speaker 1: No, it's not. No, it's not how I know. His his his wife used to work. 00:02:33 Speaker 6: With us, I know. But that is after Oh yeah, he was like clay Newcombe. That's how we came about Clayton Newcomb too. He sent an email being like, y'all need to come to Arkansas to squirrels and bears and deer and look. 00:02:47 Speaker 2: How that turned out. 00:02:50 Speaker 1: And you caught a tarpin. 00:02:52 Speaker 6: Yeah, so Mark and I almost caught a tarbin, right, Uh yeah, catching catching tarbin comes in many different versions, and yes, is unfortunate but fortunate. I've spent probably seven full days of my life standing on the bow of a boat looking for casting at tarpin. I've hooked one, jumped one, nowhere near catching one. Literally the third cast. 00:03:19 Speaker 5: Of the trip. 00:03:20 Speaker 6: So first morning, it's still dark outside, kind of like it's there's not enough the sun's not high enough where you can actually see in the water, And all of a sudden, we're like kind of getting ready because we're filming, so we're getting ready to do like an intro scene, and all of a sudden, somebody looks over and goes, oh my god, they're right there and like literally already within casting range. And they're just when TARPA and when they call tarp and happy, they're almost not even moving. They're just kind of sitting in one spot and bobbing in a way like in the current, you know. And so you know, the yelling starts, and you know, Jake's like, get the rod, but be quiet, don't make a lot of noise when you move to the bow of the boat. And so I grab a rod, get out on the bow, and literally the third cast. I'd never done this, Brody, Have you done this much? Where you cast and then instead of stripping with one hand, you put the rod in your arm pit and then strip with both hands. 00:04:12 Speaker 1: I'm familiar, but I've never had occasion to do that. 00:04:15 Speaker 3: Good because you won't screw up in trout set. Yeah, oh if you set with a rod on a tarp and it's not gonna end. 00:04:22 Speaker 1: Yeah. I've hooked three and I've never got past the part where they jump out of the water. 00:04:25 Speaker 3: Yeah, that's goes for most people. 00:04:28 Speaker 1: And I didn't even I wasn't even I only became I was so fast, I was only aware that it happened after it happened. Yeah, it's sort of dawned on me in the I'm like after it was already gone. It was dawning on. 00:04:40 Speaker 5: Mean what the. 00:04:40 Speaker 3: Fish in the key, the tarpin and the keys. I mean, you're honest, Canna tell you, But there's just like the tarpin and the keys are hard man, And I would love for someone to explain why they's so much harder to catch on fly in the keys than they are in Mexico or Belize, because I've got shiploads of them in Mexico and Belize never landed one in the keys. 00:05:00 Speaker 1: Go on, ye us tell us the real. 00:05:03 Speaker 6: Another reason for the two handed strip is because it keeps the fly moving. There's never this this. Yeah, you don't like let go and then have to reach up and pull again. But yeah, that moment when that fish it takes the fly and then you know Jake's yelling at me to strip, and you strip and you feel it come tight from there. The next three seconds I think it's like the most like violent and exciting and chaotic three seconds of fishing. That I've ever experienced, because like you know that you've attached yourself to something big. It's right there, it's in shallow water. You've got fifty feet a flyline that are it's like half wrapped around your toes, and you're just hoping that as the fish runs and jumps that the line clears the deck and gets on the reel before it, you know, binds up. Because then later that same morning, Mark fed One got him on and we had a loop go around the reel. And I try to do everything I could to you know, I'm trying to pull against a one hundred pound fish and make a loop to you knowing it around the reel, and I just I couldn't do it for him, and it broke. It's just over mine ended this way. I fought him for an hour. It jumped twice, the big ones. Jake said, they don't jump too much. He guesstimated it. He's like it was a solid hundred. He's like, I don't know if it was one hundred and ten or one hundred and thirty, but it was a really big tarpin in his mind. Fight him for an hour, which I was a little disappointed that I didn't fight him better. I had read all the stew apped articles and books. You know that name, No Brody knows it. Yeah, stew App taught down and dirty, basically meaning that anytime you fight any fish, but for this instance tarpin, is that anytime that fish had goes left, you bring your rid tip down into the right, and when he when you turn him to the right, you bring your rod tip down into the left, and you're basically not only tiring him out, but you're breaking the fish's will, is what he thought, and so that he. 00:07:01 Speaker 1: Always like in a psychological battle with him. 00:07:04 Speaker 6: He felt that like in fifteen minutes, he could pretty much land any single tarp and by doing that. 00:07:09 Speaker 5: So I didn't I thought I was going to do that. 00:07:11 Speaker 6: I didn't do it. But yeah, we chase him all across this base and like a mile or something, and we get to the back of this base and the water's getting shallow. We probably hooked him in five or six feet of water, and we're in like two to three feet of water now, and there's this little bridge that's kind of like in our periphery. We're not really paying attention to it, and there's a creek you know, leaving the basin going out, I guess, depending what the tide's doing going in or out, but at this moment, it's going out into the creek, and. 00:07:43 Speaker 5: Somehow the tarpin. 00:07:44 Speaker 6: Just slowly moves and moves that direction, and we're kind of like Jake's like off the polling platform and he's getting ready to anchor, and we're getting ready to literally like put our hands on the fish. And I honestly think that there was just enough suction from that creek that that one hundred pounds of weight in the water gets pulled to that to that creek mouth and he goes under the bridge. So we pulled the boat right up to it. The entire boat will fit under the bridge, including the polling platform, except for the sort of holder bracket deal that sits on top of the polling platform that holds the the pole itself. 00:08:23 Speaker 1: We'll just snap that off. 00:08:25 Speaker 6: We discussed it, and we thought that it might cause more damage to the platform if we just went for the snap, and so Jake just told me to hold the reel and bust him off. 00:08:35 Speaker 1: And now you never got to scale off it. 00:08:38 Speaker 6: Now, I wasn't going to take a scale. Steve's if you don't know, that's the thing they used to do, Like I don't know, Well they. 00:08:43 Speaker 2: Used to take that in the dark agent. 00:08:47 Speaker 1: They used to take it, take another one and then they took a scale. And now you just let it go in the shark eats it. 00:08:54 Speaker 5: That is the thing you worry about. 00:08:56 Speaker 6: Yeah, we actually so we went offshore to a day and where we fish these wrecks like it. Jake was like, look, don't fight him fast, just to be a tough guy, like, you're literally going to get more filets if you guys can get these fish in as fast as possible, so don't have to round. And we still, luckily we're mostly catching banita, which aren't really you know, know we really eat those anyways. But we probably pulled in half dozen benita where it was only the front half of the fish left, you know. But yeah, Jake had a great trip for us. We went down to dusk three days in a row offshore day we caught mahi, blackfin tuna, the banitas, and then we ended on a mutton snapper and we each got to catch one big, old giant like fifteen. 00:09:46 Speaker 5: To twenty pound mutton snapper, which was sweet. 00:09:48 Speaker 1: That thound was weird that I didn't even get not only not invited, but didn't know. 00:09:55 Speaker 6: It happened. To know, there's a lot of things that happened around here I don't think you know about. Yeah, did you know Brody and I are both training for big running races? 00:10:05 Speaker 1: Quick note from the last episode. Yeah, so the last episode of the news show, we reported on a chip civil war. Yes, Randall reported on a chimp civil war. Rand Old Phil had made a ken Burns spoof video about a chimp civil war. I think it's funny we put in the show. I think it's funny. I go home and I'm laying with my wife and I showed my wife the video. She thinks it's funny. I send the video to ken Burns, who's been on the show before, and I've said, thought you'd get a kick out of this. He replies, Oh, I just did one of those for the Colbert Show. Yes, who, as I explained before the show, I think does too much facial humor. 00:11:02 Speaker 2: Uh So, then. 00:11:04 Speaker 3: I'm like, he didn't do a chimp video for the Colbert Show. 00:11:08 Speaker 2: He did really chimp civil rite down. 00:11:13 Speaker 1: People haven't seen Randall's video yet, right down to like banana jokes to like a handwriting a letter, which I then thought I wasn't aware. It seems like those guys would have mentioned that they stole the joke from a TV show, and then I was pissed. 00:11:36 Speaker 3: Did they steal it? 00:11:38 Speaker 1: They claimed no. 00:11:39 Speaker 7: I'd like, so Ken, oh yeah, here's the link to the to the thing, and I'm like, oh my god, I had no idea, and he's like, hey, the more the merrier, and I'm like, dude, I had no idea that I stole your joke. 00:11:54 Speaker 3: You know, Spencer always claims that Jeopardy is stealing questions from him. 00:11:58 Speaker 1: The New York Time steals all my reporting. 00:12:01 Speaker 2: So I would like to point out just how obviously linear this. I fish my story. 00:12:06 Speaker 1: Yeah, please please, then you can take it away. Then Randall produces for me. It's not dated, but he produces for me a text dating. 00:12:18 Speaker 2: Back well before the Cold Bear. 00:12:22 Speaker 1: Thing, in which he says him and Filler texting, and he says, I want to do it like a Ken Burns Civil War. 00:12:30 Speaker 2: Mm hmm. But there's no date on it. 00:12:35 Speaker 1: So now I'm so embarrassed. I'm sending this to Burns. I'm trying to validate. Yes, because I was embarrassed, and he sent me exclamation points. 00:12:47 Speaker 3: It made me laugh. 00:12:48 Speaker 1: Well, it made me laugh too. But then I'm like, you can't run it. Yeah. And then as they're convincing me that they didn't steal the joke, and then it was it was like it was that two people, and my wife's like, I don't think they stole it. I'm like, who they is selling? 00:13:09 Speaker 6: Of course they didn't steal it. 00:13:12 Speaker 2: I'm like, if there's two guys that watched Colbert, it's these two. 00:13:15 Speaker 1: That's what I said, I haven't watched. 00:13:18 Speaker 2: When you just said no one watches he sent me the email saying Colbert had done it. I thought the Colbert Report isn't on the air anymore. I forgot that he was doing shows or something. I forgot, well, I forgot that he was doing Late Night. I was thinking about the comedy, the old comedy. 00:13:36 Speaker 1: A right wing Guy. 00:13:37 Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, so I will point out that. Yeah. Like one, this news story was from about a month ago, and it kept getting booted. I texted Phil about covering this as ken burns. It kept getting booted because the administration kept doing more horrible things with the Forest Service, and and then the boundary waters, and so I think in that text I did say, like ship, we got to cover the boundary waters. We'll pun on the chin. Brody said, it seems like something our audience wouldn't be aware of, so it'll still be fresh. 00:14:08 Speaker 1: Okay, but here's here's his proof. I mean there's no date. We know that at some point at ten fifty three am date, Randall says, if we had more time, I'd prefer to do it ken Burns style and read a bunch of fake chimp letters over some mournful film music. Definitely need to talk boundary waters. 00:14:32 Speaker 2: And and I'd like to say I need to read a text from Phil. Well, there's a bunch of text I'd love to read. So okay, he says Phil. 00:14:42 Speaker 8: Hold hold on l for a quick timeline. 00:14:44 Speaker 2: I had no idea. 00:14:45 Speaker 9: Steve and ken Burns were having this conversation about like, oh, well, we should probably pull it, like. 00:14:50 Speaker 1: Are my guys frauds or not? 00:14:53 Speaker 5: We so we. 00:14:54 Speaker 9: Published the podcast episode, so some of you may have heard it in the audio only version. We published a podcast episode. I am. I get a text from Randall and our content guy at like six in the morning saying, hey, do you guys know Colbert did this two weeks ago. Randall and I start panicking and texting each other. It was my decision to pull the segment, and Randal ken. 00:15:12 Speaker 2: I wanted to pull it too because I was like. I texted Phil and I said, efing, Colbert beat us to it, and then he said, this is two weeks this is crazy. I said, I know, blah blah blah. Phil said, I've seen this happen with comedy writers and every time I think, yeah, right, you totally stole this. And I pointed out, there's this there's a news story about a civil war among animals. If you want to make a spoof, you make a ken Burns spoof. 00:15:40 Speaker 1: That's my wife said, I don't think that's true. 00:15:42 Speaker 2: And if you want to make a ken burn spoof, your only options are gray and white like like sepiotoned images, and then you fake writing a letter. Phil, this is my fair text. Phil says, I'd like to think he knows we're not so blatantly dumb as to rip something off from an incredibly well known popular show where it lives on the Internet for everyone to easily find and see. And the fact that we gave the thumbs up to send it to Ken burns Uh when he was part of the Colbert One. So we went on and on about this. I'm starting to believe you. 00:16:17 Speaker 8: I'm glad we're making some headway. 00:16:19 Speaker 1: But isn't it nice to know that my wife believed you all along? 00:16:21 Speaker 3: You know what we should do? 00:16:23 Speaker 2: Yeah, I was horrified by this. 00:16:25 Speaker 1: Can you play the can you play the joke? 00:16:27 Speaker 3: I think we should play him both and see who which one wins. 00:16:30 Speaker 2: I think copyright times random much because we saw there a. 00:16:37 Speaker 1: Thousand times. 00:16:38 Speaker 3: There we go. 00:16:40 Speaker 1: His his, it's a thousand times better. Just listeners, go find the Colbert One watch that. 00:16:49 Speaker 2: Yeah, be disappointed when you know the funny thing. 00:16:52 Speaker 1: It makes the same joke A bunch of times. 00:16:53 Speaker 2: Phil and I were when we were texting with We're texting with Barge about this that morning, and we're both like, one, we have to pull it. This just looks so stupid. And I was talking to Barge later and he goes, he goes, what convinces me that you didn't steal this is that if you'd stolen it, you would have been pointing out the differences between the two, and you would have been like I still think we could keep but Phil and I were both just like so stunned by it. Our initial reaction was pull the whole thing. I'm going to crawl into a hole. And then after I watched the after I watched the Colbert One, I was like, you know what, I actually think, like ours is. 00:17:33 Speaker 1: Good enough? 00:17:35 Speaker 2: Ours is better? 00:17:36 Speaker 1: And you know why, Barge told me he knew you were telling the truth. What's that he said? People aren't that good at lying? Oh yeah, well he said they would have to be like pathologically good at lyne. 00:17:47 Speaker 2: This is like my worst nightmare. 00:17:49 Speaker 9: The fact that you guys are having side conversations with all my knowledge about whether or not we lied is like I want to stay in that hole that I crawled into. 00:17:57 Speaker 2: Yeah, because because I will. 00:17:58 Speaker 5: I know it too. Film. 00:18:01 Speaker 1: It was all happening at the same time. Film. I'm like, hold up, because just to come clean, I'm saying to Barge, hold on a minute. There's the same joke. There's a banana, there's there's like a hand writing a letter, and he's like, but that's a Ken Burns documentary. Yeah, it's just you. They'd have to be pathologically good at lying to like lie about this. 00:18:24 Speaker 2: And I my Probably one of my favorite parts of the day was when I said to you, like the most obvious spoof in the world civil War, ken Burns, and and you said, I wouldn't have gotten there. I would have thought guns n' roses civil War. I would have written the whole song I don't need Chip, but uh yeah, because feeds the furry. I woke up and saw the email from ken Burns in my phone, and I thought to myself, Chip Babies, In what world is something that I produced? Like what like some piece of content? In what world does Ken Burns watch that? Like that's a wild thing? 00:19:10 Speaker 1: Was you stealing his ideal? 00:19:12 Speaker 2: And now I found out he's also read one of my texts. 00:19:19 Speaker 1: Someday he's gonna hear something else you did and he's like, why do I know that name? Yeah? Exactly this. Yeah. So anyway, this goes. 00:19:27 Speaker 9: Back to last week when we found out, when we found out Colbert had done it, we had, like I thought, we had three options. One was to just run it without saying anything, and then I thought, well, people are going to think we stole there. Someone's gonna make the connection and leave a comment and say, hey, Colbert just did this. Second option was to like record a quick disclaimer beforehand and be like, hey, steal it, but enjoy I guess, And I didn't want to do that either, So like the third option was, we just pull it and we'll address it later. 00:19:52 Speaker 8: So that's what we're doing. I think we should show it. 00:19:54 Speaker 9: It's better than Colbert can go watch his on your own time. But here's here's the one that we ran last week. 00:20:03 Speaker 10: My dearest Bubbles, I write to you from beneath a forced canopy that no longer feels like home. The rainy season has come and gone eight times now since I last held your hand, and still this ruinous conflict shows no signs of relention. What once seemed a temporary rift among brothers now portends. As the primatologists say, in a permanent vision of our community, the Western forcesm go go, press on with a ferocity that defies comprehension. Twenty eight of our number have now fallen, twenty eight souls. The reports from the front are not fit for juvenile eyes, chip genitals torn from the chimp genital places. How awful that the opposable thumbs we have been blessed with by our creator are now used for such unspeakable acts. The men now whisper of infe struck down in their innocence. The white tufts of hair on their rumps will never darken, as they typically do among our kind in their fifth year of life. At night, when the moon hangs low over the forests of Kibale, I close my eyes and I am home. I hear the screeches of our brood, and I feel your saginal crest under my elongated fingers, our family swinging peacefully amongst the trees in a behavior known as brockiation. In those moments, I imagine that none of this is real. I am merely living in a nightmare of war, and I shall awake with you lying in the dirt beside me. First Sergeant Knuckles, third Canopy, Regiment Central and Go Go Forces. 00:21:50 Speaker 1: It really is. It's it's a big part of being a man is admitting when you're wrong. 00:22:01 Speaker 2: I wasn't wrong, No, no, I was wrong. Oh oh okay. I like after twenty four hours had pat I'm trying to acologize. No, no, no, But like I felt like after my blood pressure went down twenty four hours later, I thought, maybe we should have just done it. Maybe we should have played it. 00:22:18 Speaker 1: Maybe we overreacted. I never thought that you weren't being truthful. I just thought that. I even was saying to Katie. She's like, there's no way they know about that. I'm there's no way they don't know about it. And I said, there's a thing with younger people that you'll come up, like someone will come up with an Instagram joke for instance, or the example I used, making it April Fool's joke that your company has a product that they don't actually have. Right, someone did that it was funny. People now feel it's like people are very free and easy with just doing the joke over and over and over and over. Like the new generations don't mind just stealing everything. So I said, I think that they're from like the generation when that's actually okay, and she's like, that's dumb you think that. But this has all happened very fast. I just so I never thought that you were fibbing. I thought that you just thought it was okay. 00:23:16 Speaker 2: No, absolutely, that's the thing. I was like horrified by it and just thought the world is ending. I have like a fear in the back of my mind sometimes that like there's you know, like that that unintentionally, you know, you get something like this happens and you're just like, this is my worst nightmare. So thanks for thanks for standing by us, And thanks to the Internet for all the good facts about chimpanzees that I learned while researching that I just wanted to search for, like fun things about infant chimpanzee. 00:23:52 Speaker 1: Yeah, you really mixed the vegetables with the meat on that one. 00:23:55 Speaker 2: Yeah, I learned about the rump of the tuft of fur. 00:23:58 Speaker 6: You know, And did Katie think it was weird that you thought that that was a thing that the new generation will just repeat the same joke or the fact. 00:24:08 Speaker 1: That no, she got she understood that it's okay to steal jokes and if someone has a funny joke on internet, like if you're like me, every time I hear whatever, right, and then everybody's like, hey, I'm gonna do that too. She recognizes that that's the thing that you used to not do. But people do now, Like the people steal stuff now in a way that they don't even feel. 00:24:28 Speaker 5: You don't even think it's stealing. 00:24:30 Speaker 6: I think that like what the kids do now so often is there's a trend and like if you don't do your version of that trend and post it like you're not in the game. 00:24:40 Speaker 2: Yeah, but you're stealing other people's jokes. 00:24:43 Speaker 6: I don't know if it's a stealing. I think it's a participation, like you have to do it. 00:24:49 Speaker 1: The auction House of Bodities is coming back out. The Auction House Otities is going to be very good this time around. Why what happened that? Oh? Almost almost great. We had a guy in Pennsylvania find an albino raccoon roadkill, roadkill on the side of the road. He reports to Brody, Hey, does a pure white raccoon dead on the road? Broty's like, grab it. We're used for the auction houseavodities. 00:25:17 Speaker 2: The guy then. 00:25:17 Speaker 1: Lets eight hours pass eighty degrees laying on the asphalt. By the time it gets to our guys, it's got maggots coming out of it. So that's not in the auction house. But here's an interesting thing that is in the auction house. My old man had a I think it was an eighty nine Ford f one when he died. I drove it for a while. Then I sold it to my buddy Matt Drost, who I had no idea is still driving that thing. He's done with it. We just bought it from him. We're gonna we're gonna have an auction item called Steve's dad's shitty old truck filled with great new hunting gear. We're gonna fill that truck full of hunting gear, new brand new honey gear, and Mark Kenyan is gonna drive it to your house. Wow. Did I say how much he bought it for? I wish I would have done that. Can you bleep out when I said how much he bought it for? 00:26:19 Speaker 8: Yeah, I'll make it out. 00:26:20 Speaker 3: Are you gonna do a little tune up and paint job on that thing? 00:26:23 Speaker 1: Is paint already tuned up? Tuned up? I have to me and the old man doing grip and grins with rough grouse on the tailgate. It's like, yeah, that's in the auction house. What's not the auction house is our punt gunks. We're selling that on the same auction we bought it from. 00:26:38 Speaker 2: Is this a stick or an automatic auto loader? 00:26:41 Speaker 1: I'll tell you something my second date with my wife. 00:26:45 Speaker 3: That truck single bench seat? 00:26:47 Speaker 1: Yeah? Nice? No, it's got an extended cab. 00:26:50 Speaker 3: Oh it does. I'm looking at pictures I don't see the extended cab. 00:26:53 Speaker 1: It's got an extended cab. You call me a liar. 00:26:55 Speaker 3: No, I'm just seeing. I'm telling you what i'm looking at. 00:26:58 Speaker 1: Oh, it doesn't have an extended cab. 00:26:59 Speaker 3: The ones ice. 00:27:00 Speaker 1: No, you look at my ole Man's Now I'm looking. 00:27:02 Speaker 3: At pictures of eighty nine. 00:27:03 Speaker 5: For what color? 00:27:05 Speaker 1: Is it? Green? 00:27:08 Speaker 4: Was? 00:27:11 Speaker 5: What like? 00:27:12 Speaker 6: We're gonna stuff it full of hunting gear, Yeah, all of our all the stuff that's under the Mediumbrella or way more. 00:27:19 Speaker 1: Well, we're gonna Mark's gonna dig deeper in that. 00:27:21 Speaker 3: You might want to put a few fifty five gallon drums of gasoline, maybe put a. 00:27:27 Speaker 1: Gallon judge fuel, and Mark's gonna drive it to your house. This is a great auction item. We've got tons of auction items in the auction house this year. It's gonna be a great auction. 00:27:37 Speaker 5: Uh. 00:27:38 Speaker 1: Trying to think some other highlights from that thing. Oh, when we redid the new studio, all the leftover barnboard, we got a one hundred and fifty horse power Honda outboard with about three hours on it. That's going in the auction house. You have to pay shipping. It's palletized. You just gotta pay shipping. We'll ship it to you. It's gonna be it's gonna be hot. Uh, we gotta keep moving, brody. 00:28:06 Speaker 3: Oh my kid, my little kid got his first gobbler this past weekend. Speaking of Jake Gribb, he's got a little little small chunk of land and central Montana that we went out and hunted, and uh, Steve told me there was never any birds there. 00:28:23 Speaker 1: That's not what I said. 00:28:23 Speaker 3: I killed a bird there, just you were like, it's the kind of place that doesn't have birds regularly. 00:28:30 Speaker 1: But said they might be on the neighbors anyway. When I got one there, we called it off the neighbors. I said, there might not be one on it, but there might be one on the neighbors anyway. He got one after that, of bad, the same thing. 00:28:47 Speaker 3: Okay, we had a long morning of like listening to turkeys and not killing the neighbors. No, they were close, they just wouldn't cross the creek. So we had to do a big loop and get around them, and we got in got into their zone, and uh, it was very strange because like I could hear one strutting like spitting and stuff drumming, like could not see him, and he was like kind of behind us, and I didn't want to turn anyway. We made another little move and where that bird was, the grass was like almost hip high, very thick grass like kind of stuff you don't really see turkeys like moving around in. And then like six inches of neck and head pop up out of that grass. 00:29:34 Speaker 1: And that was that. 00:29:36 Speaker 3: But the highlight of the trip was no, I got him on the twenty. I'm over those four tens, man, it's like limited capabilities. The highlight was maybe not that, it was the fight we had about seeing a wolf the night before. 00:29:52 Speaker 1: He saw a wolf and you didn't, well, it was. 00:29:54 Speaker 3: A coyote, a very white, fluffy coyote he was. And we got in a big fight because he's I would not believe that it was not a wolf. 00:30:02 Speaker 1: Did you make him cry? 00:30:03 Speaker 3: No? 00:30:05 Speaker 6: Anyway, Steve said that you were angry about getting that boy a turkey. 00:30:11 Speaker 1: What do you make You had a passion? You're so you had a passion. 00:30:15 Speaker 3: Here's the thing. 00:30:16 Speaker 2: It's like, it was I have to I do because he didn't. 00:30:20 Speaker 3: Get one last year, which is his first available year to do so, And like both of my boys are playing baseball and I'm training for that race that Steve doesn't want to talk about it. I'm like, dudes, you guys have limited availability. Like we got to make it happen, so it was perfect, got it done. 00:30:39 Speaker 1: Yeah, Uh join now by uh we're joining remotely with Brian Lynn, VP of Marketing and Communications with the Sportsman's Alliance. If you're not aware of Sportsman's Alliance, it's a very good organization that does a lot to uh defend protect hunter rights, trapper rights. Like you have different different organizations do different things, Like you have a lot of conservation organizations that do stuff to preserve habitat, they do wildlife work. Sportsman's Alliance has a lot of work to defend your rights as a hunter, as a fisherman from attacks coming from the animal rights world and other things, and just also just kind of just generally making sure that sportsmen interests are being represented on. 00:31:28 Speaker 2: The political and the political sphere. 00:31:32 Speaker 1: And he's here to talk to us about something we've alluded to a bunch over the years is what exactly what in the world is going on with the State of Washington's Game Commission and why has there been so much distressing news coming out of the State of Washington, such as that they lost their spring bear season back in twenty one, that the new talk of bumping the start of the fall bear season because of this sort of fictitious idea that there's conflict in Washington between wildlife viewers and bear hunters, which is not a true thing. So over to Brian, thanks for joining us, man. 00:32:25 Speaker 4: You bet you happy to be here. 00:32:27 Speaker 2: So tell us real quick, like a high level like why is there so much. 00:32:34 Speaker 1: Why is there so much talk about Washington's Game Commission? Like what's going on with Washington's Game Commission? Why have we been talking about this for four years? 00:32:41 Speaker 4: It seems Yeah, it's been longer than four years. It's been about six now. And it all goes back to Jay Insley, our former governor. He and his wife were this was their pet project, is to dismantle the Game Commission and bring in the animal rights movement and let them run things here. And he did years and years worth of planting those seeds and this is what we're reaping. 00:33:08 Speaker 1: And so what are some of the things that what are some of the things that happened that have led to the current situation where we actually have some of these commissioners being investigated for a host of I don't think it's maybe you can correct me. I don't think it's criminal activity, but it's definitely malfeasan's and you know, a mild level of corruption at least. 00:33:31 Speaker 4: Yeah, I would push it beyond a mild level. It's there's definite corruption and collusion going on with the animal rights movement. We have the documents, we have the we've put him out there. It's on the public page out there that we have. There's even potential felonies being committed by the former chairman our chairwoman of the commission about deleting records text messages between commissioners. We we've put out there that they violated the Open Meetings Act in Washington by daisy chaining emails together and basically coming up with a game plan on how game commission meetings are going to run, who's going to introduce, what, where everybody stands on the vote, while leaving other game commissioners out. They don't do it all on one email that would be a quorum, but they'll do it with you know, three or four and then forward it on to another one and say here's the plan. 00:34:29 Speaker 1: How many game commissions does Washington. 00:34:30 Speaker 4: Have they have nine, okay? 00:34:33 Speaker 1: And how many were there to represent the animal rights or how many were there to represent the animal rights movement or the anti hunting movement? Like what was the split? 00:34:44 Speaker 4: Well, right now, it's well when it all happened, when this all went down, spring bear kind of was the impetus for it all. And at the time there was only eight on the commission and the spring bear hunt is a special regulation hunt that had to be approved every year. When they voted on it, it was a four to four split. Therefore it didn't pass. It wasn't approved. Oh that's why it was canceled. It didn't actually get canceled, It just didn't get reinstated, I see, And that's why I kind of kicked it all off. Fast forward from there about a year and they wanted to make that permanent. Well, by that time, Jay Insley had put people back into place and reappointed or not reappointed, and it's about it was about a five to four split then, and that's what it went into was they made a permanent change to cancel it about a year after that first initial pass. And so now it's canceled unless there's a biological reason and they try to make this weird distinction between recreation and wildlife management, which is if you know, you know, everybody looks at that and it's like, what are you talking about. 00:35:57 Speaker 1: Yeah, that we reported on that last week, or talk about that at length last week where they put their this this idea that they're saying there's no demonstrated management need, meaning they're saying there's no need to hunt black bears. I would say, but there's no need to fish walleye. 00:36:21 Speaker 4: There's no need to. 00:36:23 Speaker 2: Hunt turkeys like that. 00:36:26 Speaker 1: That's not the that's not the standard that a wildlife species needs to hold up to. That. It's like we we only hunt things that are deleterious. 00:36:34 Speaker 4: No, and and even this the spring bear hunt, actually even breaks that idea even more because the whole piece of it why they held it for the major reason, yes, recreation, but the biggest piece it was only available in like three units, three areas, and that's where timber harvest took place. Because the bears are waking up and shredding the trees up, like seventy five trees a day. I think they're just shredding, and so there's a need, there's an economic need, there's a resource need right there. 00:37:06 Speaker 1: If that's the. 00:37:07 Speaker 5: Argument, got it? 00:37:08 Speaker 1: Got it? So tell me some of the things that the commissioners were doing around Like I've seen references to destruction of government property, of having basically side meetings outside of the formal meetings, removing public removing public input, planning on disregarding public input. Can you hit us with a couple examples. 00:37:34 Speaker 4: Yeah, they were working. I mean even they were working behind the scenes, communicating with each other and working with Washington Wildlife First, which is an offshoot of Wildlife for All. And their whole purpose is to cause this disruption and to change game commissions nationwide to be quote unquote more representative and get other people's interests and use basically the popular vote to run game management. And so they would collude. They would they had a list of commissioners when they were filling empty seats that they wanted in the place in place ones they didn't, ones they'd put out there for decoys. They colluded with each other on votes, and yeah, they were just basically anything and everything to do with advancing their ideology. They were pushing. They would even say this is an ethics issue for me, I don't care. I don't like it. What the science says, it doesn't matter. Melanie Rowland said. 00:38:38 Speaker 1: That, Yeah, and you guys put out you guys put out some information where the commissioners will be discussing official business on official emails, and they would literally just say let's take this over and then take commission business over to their private emails. Yeah. 00:38:58 Speaker 4: Yeah, and they were told, I mean, the Nole memo came out and they were told not to use private emails. I think Lorna Smith was even using her husband's emails. So you're using private emails, you're using your spouse's emails, you're discussing official business offline in chat rooms, you know, over text messages, phone calls, whatever. This is not how good government operates. I mean you can even step back in Washington State and say, this isn't even about spring bear hunting. We have appealed to our pra lawsuit, you know, to the appellate court. If it's if this standard of government is upheld, all transparency and accountability in Washington is gone, like good government is shot. Because the ruling in our case was as long as they give you a couple of records and tell you every three to nine months that they're still working on it. They can take as long as they want to to give you any public record request. In our case, it would have taken five thousand years to get all of our records. 00:40:04 Speaker 1: I remember, I remember reading that at the Yeah, at their proposed rate, Yeah, you'd have been five thousand years in to get the records. And then frankly, like a lot of a lot of the records are gone right, like no one's ever going to see them. 00:40:15 Speaker 4: I mean, we don't know. I guess that's what happens when you can't get into it, you know. And again the Nold memos showed that they were Laurna and Melanie especially were delaying things, pretending they couldn't find it, didn't know how to search our emails, couldn't look this up or that up, had deleted it. Oh that's destruction of property. Oh let me find it. Then then they found it. But when the Animal Rights Movement would put in a pr request, they were on it just like that got it within days. It took weeks and months. 00:40:49 Speaker 1: So what's the next thing that's going to happen here? 00:40:52 Speaker 4: Oh, there's a there's a lot going on, Like that's all. What's happened. We have the PRA lawsuit that's going to appeal the old memo that came out, you know, kind of last fall or so that that popped out. Well, they didn't give that to us in discovery when we filed our PRA lawsuit, so we filed sanctions against the department for doing that, and that hearing was moved from May first to I'm not sure when it got kicked to, but that got moved back. So got those two lawsuits. Washington Wildlife First and Lorna Smith, who's on the commission, have filed the first First Amendment federal lawsuit against Kelly Susswin and Deputy director Ammy Windrow for First Amendment violations and saying that they chilled her speech and silenced her, which I don't know what they silenced because she hasn't quit talking in the five years she's been on there, and you know that they're intimidating her when our records show the exact opposite. She was bullying staff and you know there was people trying to stick up for the staff. So they have that lawsuit going on. They've also sued Washington Wildlife FIRSTUS also sued the Washington Department of Fish and Wildlife over their game management plan. Sportsman's Alliance just stepped in as an intervener to make sure when that goes to trial and there's discussions that sportsmen are represented. It is not just the Department to end Washington Wildlife first doing this. We're going to watch out make sure that hunter's interests are represented. 00:42:34 Speaker 1: And then where does what's your level of optimism about the commission getting back the commission getting back into like a firm footing where it's going to do a better job of managing wildlife as a renewable natural resource. 00:42:53 Speaker 4: That depends wholly upon Governor Bob Ferguson. You know, if it was Jay Insley, I'd say zero. With Ferguson. He pulled back to you know, eleven eleven hour and fifty nine second. Right before Insley left, he appointed two fishing game commissioners who would have really tilted the balance. Ferguson, to his credit, came in, kick those guys to the curb, put in two new ones who are fair and balanced and good and whatever. They listened to both sides. So we'll see the investigation has been taking place. There's been an internal investigation going on for nine months now. It was due well, it got extended four times, was hit the Governor's desk April thirteenth, and so the rumor is that it got sent back for revisions. I don't know what that means. So supposedly sometime in mid to late May, that internal investigation is supposed to come out and we'll see what Governor Ferguson does. Hopefully he removed at the minimum Lorna Smith and Melanie Rowland, and we'll see what happens with Barbara Baker and John limcool. But if we can get those four who have colluded and done other things off of there and just put people in there who understand and want to see wildlife do well and balance it all between the different competing forces, we'd be okay. 00:44:25 Speaker 1: But we'll see all right, man, Thank you for coming on and talking about it. 00:44:30 Speaker 2: Uh you, Brian. 00:44:32 Speaker 1: Lynn, VP of Marketing Communications at Sportsman's Alliance. If you want to find out more about Sportsman's Alliance, you can find them online and see about the different ways they engage on your behalf all around the country. Thanks a lot, appreciate it, Thank you. Okay, Oh Phil, can we put that video up real quick. 00:44:50 Speaker 5: Yeah. 00:44:50 Speaker 1: So here's a video everybody's seen a thousand times. It's you might have fast forward it. This is like if you on the news, if you've seen the video of the of the wood be political assassin who came into the White House correspondence dinner. So I watched this video four or five times. I'm exaggerating. I watched it three times. I watched it three times without ever realizing what I was looking at. Then a recent podcast guest texted me, if you listen to the show we recently had on a canine handler an lap He trains apprehension dogs and other kinds of canine unit dogs for police departments. He was just on the podcast. This video comes out of the guy of the would be assassin barging in to you know, banking up, breaking in through security, and the guys like, watch this. The canine handler isn't trusting the dog's instinct. 00:45:56 Speaker 6: And if you see this, it's crazy. 00:45:58 Speaker 1: This when that suspect he comes in, he's trying to find his way in. 00:46:05 Speaker 5: Here. 00:46:05 Speaker 1: He comes to and he fires at one of the secret service guys with a shotgun. What that guy walks by, You see him walk behind the background. He has a canine like basically with its nose in his back pocket, and the handler is just walking along with the dog and the dogs like this guy, this guy, this guy, and the dudes just like missing it. Go back and play it. Watch that's the suspect. Now watch that dog. That dog's like, hey, him, him, him, It could have cost that dude his life. 00:46:40 Speaker 11: And then his handler walks him back and two seconds later. 00:46:44 Speaker 1: Yep, the dogs like no, no, check this out, check this out, check this out. The dog check it out. 00:46:48 Speaker 6: The handler is looking in there. 00:46:50 Speaker 11: Seconds later, the guy emerges. 00:46:52 Speaker 1: Then the guy busts out of there with a shotgun. Didn't that while I would have never noticed that? 00:46:56 Speaker 2: And the I guess, like the the do is going off fear or. 00:47:02 Speaker 1: No, he said, that's a he says it's a he goes he's he's not sure, but he said almost certainly it's a bomb. Dog. Yeah, And he's smelling certain like he's like vapor trailing residues and gunpowder. But the interesting thing is everybody there is armed, So it's kind of funny that the dog is like no, no, him him, yeah, yeah, but the dog is like glued to the guy. 00:47:23 Speaker 11: That's crazy because two seconds later, he just emerges. 00:47:27 Speaker 1: Yeah, there he is, pulls pulls his gun out. The dogs like, hey, check him out. 00:47:30 Speaker 6: That handler was looking at something longer. Yeah, like he was interested in something in that room. But then he said that. 00:47:38 Speaker 2: The guy says, I feel like he was slow to pick up the queue. 00:47:41 Speaker 1: He was slow to pick up the que because his thing was the guest thing was you might doubt. He had a lot of examples of where the dog's like, no, that's it, but people people miss it. Meaning a dog comes into a room, he goes to a corner of a room and he hangs out. But you don't realize that what he's talking about is the suspects in the drops. He's like, he's like, the dog's not wrong, it's just right. The dogs like, no, right here, here's the spot because the dog can't be like in the drop ceiling. But the dogs and people look like, oh, there's nothing in. 00:48:11 Speaker 2: Here, you know. 00:48:13 Speaker 1: And so he's just talking about like knowing your dogs so well that that you know what he's getting at. 00:48:20 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean you see it. It's a lot different, but you see it even with hunting dogs like bird dogs when they like get Birdie and you're like, ah, there's nothing there, or you don't trust. 00:48:29 Speaker 2: Or when your dog goes and sits by the door and you're like, he just went out, there's no where he needs to take a shit again, and then five minutes later you have a mess. 00:48:38 Speaker 1: Ted Turner died fourth largest landowner. 00:48:45 Speaker 3: Just down the road here. 00:48:46 Speaker 1: Yeah, so depending on how his will worked his air, it could be that who's number five. 00:48:59 Speaker 3: It could be that, oh you're saying, if it gets broken up somehow. 00:49:06 Speaker 1: He'll be number one Lando in America. Stan Kronki Sportsman channel, Outdoor channel right, Stan Kronky number one land at two million, seven hundred thousand acres, The Emerson family two million, four hundred and forty thousand acres, John Malone two million, two hundred thousand acres. Ted Turner two million acres, The Reed family one million, six hundred and fifteen thousand acres is number five. So there could be a little disturbance. This article just came out the other day. There could be a little disturbance in the force here. 00:49:42 Speaker 3: Yeah. I was asking earlier. I want to know, like if he's got because he's got you know, conservation minded, whether you. 00:49:49 Speaker 1: Like him or not, very controversial figure. 00:49:53 Speaker 3: Whether he like had it written up so that land remains, I don't know. As a conservation trust. 00:50:00 Speaker 1: There's no way it will not, because that was of high priority to him. Controversial figure, had a lot of lady troubles and whatnot, but a big conservationist. 00:50:08 Speaker 4: Ye. 00:50:09 Speaker 1: When you're at Jordan Bud's place, you're looking over at one of his properties. 00:50:12 Speaker 5: I've never been there. 00:50:13 Speaker 1: Have you never been to Jordan's her neighbor of the two million blankety blank acres the dude owns, some of it is next to him, neighbors with him. 00:50:25 Speaker 11: A couple of weekends ago, his bison herd was like just right behind River Road. They were all hanging out, pretty cute there, you know, hundreds of them. 00:50:35 Speaker 2: Randall, Yeah, there's a story. It's been in the headlines the past week or two. Idaho just spent about two years working through one of the most comprehensive overhauls of hunting technology regulation across the country. And so that's good. Last month Governor Little signed HB nine thirty nine into law. And that all got started with a public process. I think that started in twenty twenty four. 00:51:07 Speaker 1: With a. 00:51:09 Speaker 2: Working group made up of hunters conservationists wildlife managers who then produced a set of recommendations to the Fish and Game Commission, and then that through a bunch of political input and all this stuff, they decided that that needed to be laws rather than just rags, I guess. So the final law restricts drones, thermal imaging, night vision, and transmitting cell cams for hunting and scouting big game and upland birds from August thirtieth to December thirty first. Each year there's a carve out for wolves and mountain lions, private and public. No, it's got just private or just public right, I believe so. And so there's there's this carve out for these technologies for predator management and for recovery of wounded game. The interesting things is that this working group, they were unanimous in their recommendations for drone restrictions, and they were one vote short of unanimity for the recommendations on thermal night vision and sell cams. So like that, they came to pretty strong conclusions all the stakeholders, and then the end result is this bill. For one of the interesting things is Idaho is one of the last states to regulate thermals for hunting ungulates. You know, they had obviously restrictions against hunting at night, but the best of my knowledge, they you could still use a thermal like at dawn or whatever to locate animals on the mountain. But that's now out drones. There's forty five of fifty states already that have restrictions on drone use. And actually the carve out for game recovery kind of puts Idaho and I guess you'd call it more of like a liberal positioning compared to other states that don't allow drone recovery. 00:53:10 Speaker 1: Meaning you can put a thermal unit on a drone, yeah, and then go be like, well, I'm trying to find the buck I lost. 00:53:16 Speaker 2: Right, And so one of the things with these technology bands, when they have these carve outs, it comes down to what you can prove in court and what the intentions are, like as far as if a conservation officer runs across someone flying a drone, did they wound a deer? Did they see a deer and then not get a shot and then use their drone to locate it? 00:53:40 Speaker 1: Right? 00:53:40 Speaker 2: The same thing for like the wolves. You know, if if you come across someone who has a thermal in their possession. They say they're wolf hunting. You know, as I understand it from talking to a former Idaho game warden yesterday, you know, what you have to do as a warden has sort of asked them questions, Oh, hey, how's it going, what are you doing? 00:54:01 Speaker 5: Uh? 00:54:01 Speaker 2: You know, and and sort of make a circumstantial argument about what they're using that thermal for based on where they are, what time of year, what kind of equipment they have, all that stuff. 00:54:12 Speaker 6: But you know, it's good. 00:54:15 Speaker 2: I think that they're they're being proactive, even if on some of this stuff they're a little late. But I feel like as a hunting community there's been kind of a need for some reconciliation around all these emergent technologies. And it's cool that the working group, I think too was was hunters and all different stakeholders and they were on the same page. 00:54:41 Speaker 1: They can't yeah, they had that. It wasn't a split yeah down the middle. 00:54:46 Speaker 2: And I think too, like a lot of this stuff, you know, when you when you look at the considerations in terms of enforcement and whatever loopholes there are enforcing them, a lot of it will come down to social pressure and hunters sort of agreeing on what's fair chase and what's not, And the fact that the working group was on the same page I think bodes well for that. So yeah, I mean, obviously, like if you look ten fifteen years ago, the idea that you would have real time camera traffic keeping track of wildlife and places is sort of hard to fathom. Thermals have come a long way, drones have come a long way, obviously, so there's always kind of a an arms race between enforcement and fair chase principles and whatever technology is coming down the pipe. So in Idaho, they they got they got together and they came to agreement and they got it done. 00:55:39 Speaker 1: I've heard two interesting stories about one was told to me about drone use for hunting. One was told to me and one I read about. The one that was told me was a guy was saying that they were using they would use drones. This isn't a drone legal state. What was a drone legal state? They would use a drone to when they had a target. They would use a thermal on a drone to find out where the buck betted, which would influence how they set up on it, because once they knew where it was betted, in its betting area, then they could pick where best to sit to spend the evening. So that's how they were using it. The article I was reading with some guys got busted for tracking a deer with a drone, and reading the article, neighbors kept saying, these guys have that drone over that buck all the time during hunting seasons, like a buck that a bunch of people knew about when the game warden came out. They were doing it. When the game warden came out, Yeah, that was in a drone not legal state, and they were cited and the game board came out and sure enough, it's like there's a drone over a wood lot, right, and they were like tracking the following this deer around to figure out where it was. 00:56:48 Speaker 2: Well, and that's I mean, that's the funny thing is like, if you have these carve outs for game recovery, and I understand you want to recover animals if you wound them or whatever, but had the warden come out out and seeing the drone flying, they could have just said, oh, yeah, we just got a bad shot on a dough. It just so happens there's this big buck in the area, right. 00:57:07 Speaker 1: It's tricky man, like I usually have such certainty about what I would do if I was emperor of the world, Like I'm supportive of, for instance, I'm supportive of being able to use a dog for recovery. Yeah, I don't think that that's I don't think that that's really a thing that's going to get abused, you know. I don't think guys are going to be running deer with dogs right in States was not allowed and pretending that they're using a dog to track a wounded deer at night. I just like it's that's not an issue. Yeah, I don't believe. I'm very supportive of those rules where you allow a guy to track a dog to track a wounded deer or the dog man. I would have to sit long and hard and think about my thoughts on the drone recovery. 00:57:56 Speaker 6: Yeah, what's like the main reason that they're doing this, Like why do they think that they needed. 00:58:04 Speaker 5: To do this? 00:58:04 Speaker 2: I think just I think just public pressure, you know, I think it's just a talking I think like there's a lot of states where I was just at a Boon and Crockett event last summer, and that was the main topic of conversation with emergent technologies and fair chase. 00:58:20 Speaker 1: Yeah, why not if you can, why not go to like a north face and slope and like go to a north flace and slope and buzz a drone around and be like, oh, the elk are bedded right there. Yeah yeah, I mean like plenty of people canna do it. I I already I already talked to guys, like even guys I'm friendly with. I already talked to guys that that's the elk hunting they start a lot earlier now because they just thermal scan. They thermal scan in the morning. 00:58:45 Speaker 2: And any anything that tips the balance in terms of efficacy then down the road is going to result result in reduced opportunity. 00:58:52 Speaker 1: Latvian's Latvian's all thermal scan. 00:58:58 Speaker 5: In Latvia. 00:58:59 Speaker 1: Yes, yeah, yes, yeah, he says in Latvia you don't like even start hunting, so you've done a thermal scan. Yeah, they like scan the area. I'd be like, no, next bout I get it. I just that's why the Russians don't like them. 00:59:24 Speaker 5: No comment. 00:59:28 Speaker 2: I was just waiting to read the room before I said anything. 00:59:30 Speaker 1: There. Thank you, Randal, Yeah, is it okay? Segment? What I didn't like, is you never really said, like, what are the rules? 00:59:45 Speaker 5: Sure? 00:59:45 Speaker 1: Did? Did? 00:59:46 Speaker 4: He? Like? 00:59:47 Speaker 1: What are the rules? 00:59:48 Speaker 5: Uh? 00:59:49 Speaker 2: Restricts, stone thermal imaging, night vision transmitting, trail cameras for hunting and scouting big game and thirtieth December thirty First, it's a great job. 00:59:57 Speaker 1: Thank you said it off top. I just got confused. 01:00:00 Speaker 2: Well, I had it further down, but then I thought I should just get it out of the way up top. Maybe I should have returned to the end. 01:00:05 Speaker 1: And saved it. No, because in classic journalism, all the main pertinent you load you top load it with the main pertinent stuff, and then if you want like weird details, like if you're reading about a politician being in a sex scandal and like they're sending bad text messages and you're like, well, what was the text message? You'll often find the actual substance of the text messages in the end of the article, right because they're sort of like most important to descending importance. So you wind up being like, well, where's the part about what he wrote? And sometimes at the very bottom of the article what I would be like, well, I just put that right up top, because that's what every want. Yeah, everybody's wondering that, but they'd be like, well, that's of descending importance. So like traditional newspaper journalism, it's like the main thing is here's the rules, here's the new rules. And as you go down and be like, here's how they put the group together, and here's their fune. 01:01:00 Speaker 9: So these days they want you to scroll past as many ads as possible to get to the thing you want to see. 01:01:04 Speaker 5: I'm going to try to apply that in my segment. 01:01:07 Speaker 1: Do it. You're gonna go old school journalism or like old school okay, yeah, uh, okay, go ahead, yanny, Oh oh my turn? Yeah? 01:01:18 Speaker 5: Or I can? 01:01:18 Speaker 1: I can? I can talk about my thing? 01:01:20 Speaker 5: Oh I'll just wait. Yeah, I'm fine going. 01:01:23 Speaker 6: My dad sent us an article Michigan lawmakers made fun last ditch effort to save whitefish. I was like, oh, that's interesting. Started digging into it. My god, those poor white fish like bad, bad, bad bad. 01:01:42 Speaker 1: This is a two hundred and twenty five year old story, or so. 01:01:45 Speaker 6: Well, I don't know what caused the declines prior to the eighties, do you know? 01:01:52 Speaker 1: Yeah? 01:01:53 Speaker 5: Oh, most please speak to that. 01:01:54 Speaker 1: The biggest, the most cataclysmic thing to happen to a lot of these native Great Lakes specieses during the logging era when they were making when they were booming all of the logs. So when they came in and logged the Great Lakes, yep, they would boom all those logs out in the water and they would shed their bark, and so all the bays, the river mouths, the spawning stuff was buried in sometimes ten feet of bark. 01:02:30 Speaker 3: Then later came industrial pollution. 01:02:32 Speaker 1: And that was a big early hit industrial pollutants, and then the non natives. 01:02:39 Speaker 5: Right, so the non natives is kind of where I'm going to pick up. 01:02:43 Speaker 6: Zebra muscles and quagga muscles both kind of came in the same period of time eighties, mid eighties one quaga muscles late eighties, I guess I mean back up. So this last ditch effort that I read about, it's a good website if everyone wants to read more. These guys have really covered this for years now and done a good job. It's called Bridge Michigan dot Com really really did an excellent job covering all this stuff. But the Michigan State sense is trying to get some money. An appropriations bill was right now they just have like a placeholder amount of like one hundred bucks, and like if it goes through or it goes farther, they'll like actually put a number to it, and something one number I heard is like fifty million over the next ten years. 01:03:28 Speaker 5: So they're looking for a lot of money to to do some research on this. 01:03:34 Speaker 6: Research and their idea of how to save them now, or at least part of it, because there's I guess there's specific strains within the Great Lakes that are doing worse than others, and they're thinking of actually taking them out and then rearing them in hatcheries and then being able to hold on to some stock to then be able to repopulate the Great Lakes once the issue that I'm going to tell you about now is taken care of, which is the muscles. 01:04:00 Speaker 1: Yeah, like a like a seed bank. Yeah, like the same way you'd put you'd store seeds in a cave, like the seed bank is in Norway. The Global seed. 01:04:09 Speaker 12: Bank sounds like good, good, but it's somewhere somewhere anyways that you'd store these propagate and store these fish for later. 01:04:21 Speaker 6: So the muscles that are the big problem right now, they're One guy I talked to pretty much said that if it's not sand, and it's in less than fifty feet of water, and here on or Michigan, it's probably got a muscle on it, and not like a muscle, but covering like it's a coating of muscles. What these muscles do is that they filter the entire volume of lake here on Lake Michigan every two weeks. 01:04:51 Speaker 1: Geez, that's incredible. 01:04:52 Speaker 6: It's incredible to think of it that way, right, And what they're doing when they're filtering, they're feeding on phidoplankton, and then all all the other little microorganisms that would then eat fital plankton don't have anything to eat. So you're basically cutting out the bottom of the food web right or the bottom of the food chain, and stuff just can't move forward from there, right So when so the white fish have two issues with that. One is if they're spawning grounds or these reefs where they like to spawn, if they're covered in muscles, they can't spawn there. It just doesn't work. Then two, because this water is filtered and somewhat clarified, it's brighter, right, and so the more sun gets down in there, and literally the young fish when they're just little minnows on the beaches. They're literally getting sunburns that kill them because they should have a more turbid water, right the Great Lakes like even now, I don't know if you've noticed it when the last time you went to Lake Michigan, but last time I was there a few years ago. 01:05:54 Speaker 5: It's a like a very stark difference in the clarity compared to when we were. 01:06:01 Speaker 1: You know that all the yeah, like all the microscopic food out. Then the sun penetrates more, causes more vegetation growth, the vegetation decomposes, makes the water oxygen poor. Some fish are winters, like walleyes. 01:06:17 Speaker 5: Yeah, some some fish are. 01:06:19 Speaker 6: It's uh, I think it's a little short sighted to look at it that way that you know, I mean that they're they're winning right now. It seems like it's not something that's sustainable. That was a word that was thrown a lot around the people that I talked to that just like we they we have to start thinking about sustainability if we have if we want to keep this thing going. 01:06:39 Speaker 1: I often describe the Great Lakes as they have become an experimental aquarium. 01:06:47 Speaker 6: Yes, as one fishery's biologist I talked to, he said, we're trying to basically manage an ocean m hm. Like it's it's just it's a giant piece of it. So it's very hard to do, is what I'm trying to say. You know what he was trying to say by saying that, is that it's just such a giant piece of water and you're trying to manage it. And yes, in some ways it's like an experiment, but I think that it's like you can't really control the experiment. 01:07:12 Speaker 3: You also got like anglers who are way more interested in walleye, small mouth, ass, salmon, steelhead, Yeah, whitefish at this point right, like the sport fishing demand for whitefish, I think, even if they're around, probably wouldn't be that high. 01:07:30 Speaker 1: Yeah, those lakes, like if you go back, if you go back to the eighteen hundred, seventeen hundreds, eighteen hundreds, the commercial fisheries in those lakes are things like huge sturgeon commercial fishery, whitefish commercial fishery, like different ciscos and other white's driving the commercials fishery. And then the big one lake trout what what what smoked the lake trout was al wives coming in or sorry not elwives coming in lamp Rais once lampreys made it over Niagara Falls. Boom. 01:08:03 Speaker 4: You know. 01:08:03 Speaker 1: So it's just like things come in, they shuffle everything. They got that whole effort underway to keep the asiatic carp species out of the great legs, like the Chicago Sanitation Canal has an electric barrier yep to try to keep those out if those jump. 01:08:19 Speaker 5: I don't know. 01:08:21 Speaker 6: Yeah, it's it's interesting because I think it was like a penny per dollar dollars spent on those carp one penny is spent on trying to deal with the muscles. So it's just like, for whatever reason, it's not top of mind because I don't know. 01:08:35 Speaker 1: How like short of like they're talking about so they're talking about banking these whitefish species. 01:08:42 Speaker 5: This is just yeah, this is one idea. 01:08:45 Speaker 1: Yeah, like bank like bank them, And this is not a new idea. You remember that Mike rule. He's a fisheries mile just so he's gone in like they had big in New Mexico, big forest fires where you have unique strains of cutthroat, and when a big fire goes, you know that when it rains, it's gonna send all that silt and it's gonna kill the river. They have gone in ahead of that occurrence to get strains of cutthroats to basically just go hold them. Yeah, because you know that you're gonna the whole river's gonna get nuked by ash. Let the river clean up, let the vegetation come back. With the thinking you could then put the fish back, some of them back when the habitat comes back, or else you're gonna lose yet another river's worth of cuts. So I get the idea. It's like just genetic banking. But the part where I get skeptical and I don't understand is I don't even know what the rough idea would be to get muscles under control in the Great Lakes. Short of that someone develops a virus, are a pathogen, but that which is being discussed, but that trick doesn't get played. 01:10:07 Speaker 3: Yeah, playing god can go wrong. 01:10:09 Speaker 1: Yeah, because that's already so many of the Great Lakes problems are already come from people. 01:10:15 Speaker 6: Being like, I got an idea, Yeah, let's introduce this fish that'll eat that fish. 01:10:20 Speaker 1: The common carp. The common carp was intentionally introduced into the Great Lakes when the other when the native fisheries collapsed, they were like maybe these guys want to eat carp and they put them in on purpose, and then people just never adopted it as a food source and now they have a huge cart problem. Spend tons of money trying to get rid of carp and there you can get rid of carp with targeted poisoning. I don't and I don't know. Maybe someone has sort of the basic idea of what you do, but I just don't know how you fix it. Well. 01:10:54 Speaker 6: A couple of the other things that they're that they're testing and researching now as far as getting rid of these muscles is one is a they're literally they have a like they're developing these scraping machines that can will literally go in and scrape these reefs clean to create so that they hopefully can have habitat where these white fish can do their spawning, scrape and crush. The other thing that gets getting that's getting thrown out there and messed with, and they're researching if it works, is suffocating the like going down in there with tarps and covering you know, large areas with tarps because they produce carbon dioxide and so if they can't get that fresh water in there, it literally it sufffocates them. 01:11:39 Speaker 1: So like the headache can get when you fall asleep down in your sleeping bag. 01:11:43 Speaker 6: I guess I haven't had that. 01:11:45 Speaker 4: I know. 01:11:47 Speaker 6: I haven't had that. 01:11:48 Speaker 1: Yeah, I get like carbon dioxide poisons. 01:11:51 Speaker 6: Yeah, like I So I talked to some fishes Bolodis. I also talk to a guide that uh Pat Dirk and and I or fish with when we did the for ice fishing tour, JJ Malvetz, and then the fish processor Dan Lindahl, who's they're all in the same area, which is green Bay. Green Bay is like this like really weird stronghold where the rest of the lakes have gone down something crazy. From two thousand to twenty four. They went from one point six million pounds in two thousand this is like commercial catch of whitefish down to two hundred thousand and twenty twenty four. Well, in that same time period, green Bay has gone from one hundred thousand to eight hundred thousand. 01:12:35 Speaker 5: It's gone up. 01:12:36 Speaker 1: What do they attribute that to? 01:12:38 Speaker 6: Well, green Bay has a ton of rivers flowing into it, the fox, the monominee, and so that is providing those nutrients all that we need. So the fisher's biologist was like, yeah, we basically need to figure out how to either produce that base level of the food web or how to you know, keep the you know, muscles from disrupting it. But that's what those fish need. 01:13:06 Speaker 1: You know. 01:13:07 Speaker 6: That being said, it's even in Green Bay. It's like they're saying it's on the decline. And again I didn't know how bad it was, but Dan was like whitefish in the main lake in Maine Lake Michigan are all but extinct. 01:13:22 Speaker 1: It's like, oh, what an amazing fish to you, man, I used to love fishing those things, just like a great eating fish, beautiful fish. 01:13:29 Speaker 3: I know place here we can go get them. 01:13:31 Speaker 6: So he he is a commercial fisherman now is only catching twenty percent of his quota JJ Malvitz. Where the sports limit per day is ten, which is what it was when Pat and I were there, he's now recommending to clients like, look, they don't freeze all that well, like take what you only need, like how about five, you know, instead of doing ten. So hopefully everybody was kind of surprised that the DNR hatt and dropped, you know limits over in Michigan. They had really dropped the commercial limits. But according to Danny's like a little bit too little, too late, because he's like, there's no fish to catch anyways, So dropping commercial limits is not going to do anything at this point. But he wishes that Wisconsin and especially in that Green Bay area, would you know, reduce harvests a little bit overall. 01:14:23 Speaker 1: The caviar on those fish for a while. I'm not sure now, but I had some friends that were native fishermen, and they were doing better on the caviar than the meat. You know what they call that cavear American gold. You know they were exporting it. It's good man. Yeah, I had a whole tub of it. Man, we were dipping cool ranch dridles into that stuff. I had that much of it. Yeah, not no more. 01:14:50 Speaker 5: It's like a king. 01:14:52 Speaker 2: I know, we have stuff to get to. I had breaking news though, to my mind, to turn his back alive. 01:14:58 Speaker 4: No. 01:14:59 Speaker 2: I clicked on this link that Yanni shared about the whitefish, and I saw on the right hand column the next article most read. It says after eighty nine years, Michigan Hunting and Fishing Group is done, And I thought, surely it's not the conservation clubs. Yeah, they just they dissolved on Monday I had no idea. 01:15:16 Speaker 5: That's oh, that's that's sad. 01:15:18 Speaker 2: Yeah, we met some of those guys when we were in arbor. 01:15:21 Speaker 1: Yeah that's a while. 01:15:22 Speaker 6: I hopefully will end on some brighter news, but I don't. I asked everybody like, what do you what do you what can you do or what do you wish you know people could do? And they and everybody kind of said, look, it's about showing that you care. So whether it's like calling you know, your state. So if you're in Michigan, you know you want to you know, tell your state reps to uh, you know, past the funding. And I think any great lake state just like talk about it and make everybody know of this issue is uh. The Fisher's Ball just said, there's a ton of people working on it, Noah, USGS, tribes, all the state wildlife agencies that touch the lake, a bunch of you universities and so there's people out there working on it. And I think that the more people know, hopefully the more they care. 01:16:09 Speaker 1: And I have a feeling that every federal agency you just named, when the next budget process is done, they will be just nothing but like a little smoke poof and and uh, that money will be Maybe they'll fight and keep some of it, but most of that money will be stripped. I think you're these dudes, and these dudes in DC right now, ain't get care. They're gonna be like home at what whitefish? Screw that? Mm hmm. 01:16:41 Speaker 5: Got a word to fight instead? 01:16:43 Speaker 1: Clothes firsts bag baby. It's the third time I said that this is okay, So big news here out of the breaking news out of the Monteverde site in southern Chile. Unexplained this whole thing or bad news for the Monteverde site and Chile, depending on your perspective in March twenty twenty six. So just recently, a guy that was on the podcast for Todd Servil from the University of Wyoming. He's an archaeologist. He published a piece and that there are two premiere scientific journals. The two premier scientific journals are Nature in Science. Okay, they published in Science a paper called a mid I'll interpret all this is. Don't worry if this doesn't make any sense. A mid Holocene age for Monteverde challenges the timeline of human colonization of South America. All right, fills gonna pull up some images for me. There is a site in Chile where they have very good roast beef sandwiches with French cut green beans on them. I recommend to anybody that gets down there. There's a site in Chile called Verde. We have a map pulled up showing people it's down in. It's down in Chilean Patagonia. It sits at the base of a little peninsula coming out of the Pacific Ocean. So way, like pay attention to all this way way way south and South America getting to the point where you're as far away from Siberia as you can get in the western hemisphere. And we know that the first humans that entered the new that entered North America, came through Siberia. This, this in my mind, is not a debatable point. No serious person is debating this. There were Siberians that came in. So here we have we thought we had, or we have one of the oldest known sites of human occupation, being as far away as you can get from where they entered the continent. The southern tip of South America. Monteverde has a bunch of sites, but there's one site called Monteverde. Two we still look at a couple more pictures. Yeah, I'm not sure, but Doug I put them in order. This is the Monteverde site. Okay, it's a creek bottom. 01:19:10 Speaker 2: Looks fantastic. 01:19:11 Speaker 1: It's a lush creek bottom in Chilean Patagonia. 01:19:15 Speaker 5: How far is that from the ocean? 01:19:17 Speaker 1: Thirty six miles Okay, there's an overhead view. Looks like a great place to hang out. Yeah, you could picture getting some docks there. You could picture get some trout, turkeys, maybe not trout. They started digging this site in the nineteen seventies and they found that there were tent structures built there. The tent structures were wrapped in leather, meaning that they were using leather cordage. They found some remains of place to see megafauna, They found hearths where like they found campfire sites. Okay. They dated it at fourteen thousand, five hundred years ago. Okay, which puts us at one thousand, five hundred years earlier than Clovis sites. 01:20:10 Speaker 2: What's it before? 01:20:11 Speaker 3: What's the general like margin for error and that kind of dating. 01:20:16 Speaker 1: Oh, there is one. 01:20:17 Speaker 2: I'm not sure what those margins, but that's outside. 01:20:20 Speaker 1: What's funny is the margins are the margins are flexible, meaning there are areas there are eras where it's the margin is wide, and there are areas where the margin is close. But when you get a bunch of samples and you date a whole bunch of samples, you get tighter and tighter margins. So they were throwing dates here one thousand, five hundred years earlier than Clovis sites. Now Clovis sites. There are many Clovi sites from all over the country. When I talked earlier about like the humans that came into North America came out of Siberia, that's like, that's scientifically established. No serious person argues that point. Another point that no serious person is going to argue is that there is a Clovis culture. 01:21:02 Speaker 8: He jumped my next picture, The next one I have is just is the T shirt? 01:21:07 Speaker 1: Yeah, pull it up. Okay, here's one of our own very own T shirts at me Eater. I was worn this this weekend, the Clovis Hunter's T shirt. Those are Clovis projectile points. These Clovis projectaile points. Hell, let's go to the next picture. 01:21:21 Speaker 8: Is that I think that that one didn't transfer Steves at the hand. 01:21:24 Speaker 1: Next my it's my house. 01:21:26 Speaker 8: Yeah he was in the wrong photo format. Oh I can, I can bring it up a different way. 01:21:30 Speaker 1: Then bring it up a different way. Hell yeah, I'll keep talking. Sure, Clovis points have come from all over the country. You got Clovis points from Washington State, you got Clovis points coming out of Florida, you got Clovis points coming out of New York. 01:21:42 Speaker 2: The Clovis culture was everywhere. 01:21:46 Speaker 1: That's a close, that's a that's a Clovis point hanging on my wall in my house, drawn by an archaeologist, and that was that's the actual size of that point. That is a honking Clovis point. Nice job Phil film working in a bind over there. Now we know that we have clovi sites all over the place, and there's always been this this this leading debate and then and like ice age archaeology and anthropology is did the Clovis culture show up from somewhere or was the Clovis culture an American born phenomenon? Meaning did Clovis hunters making these Clovis points, these big these like mammoth hunters. Did they walk into the lower forty eight as like a people with the technology with a hunting lifestyle, did they walk in here as them and then explode across the continent. Or was there some trickling of people a long time earlier that came into the continent and lived here for two thousand years a thousand years, and out of that culture emerged this widespread Clovis culture. Because after Clovis, you see in the country, like Native American cultures after Clovis split into all these different societies. But it's like this idea that at a time across the whole country was a culture of people that were unified in their technologies and then over time they like evolved and split apart and developed all these different ways of living. But at a time there was like these big game hunters making these big honkin points and they settled everything. Okay, this debate is called like this debate would be was there was it Clovis first or was there a pre Clovis culture? And here's why this this Monteverde site's kind of interesting. Ask yourself, what are the odds that you found the actual oldest site ever? There's no way, right, there's no way. So if you find one that's fourteen five hundred years old, what are you missing? Right? Like we didn't find the first one, and it wouldn't in the first one. The oldest site wouldn't be as far away as you can get from the entry point. Meaning if that is legit, what did we not know about in terms of who was running around here and when did they get here? Can you jump to my Alaska images? Yeah, this is here. 01:24:34 Speaker 8: I am. 01:24:34 Speaker 1: This is a long time ago. I spent some time up at what would have been the entry point. So this is the Western Brooks Range. This is what would have been the entry point to the first Americans as they entered our continent, as they entered the western hemisphere. I'm standing with a French Canadian archaeologist and we're standing in a tent ring. Okay, flip to the next image. Nope, not man, had mel Campbell him. I'll get to him. Here is this arrowhead hunting in the Western Bricks Range is the best possible place to arrowhea hunt because there's no one around to pick anything up. That's a that's a paleo point, just laying there. Look at that thing, Look at that thing, and we would walk away. We would walk away, go to mad mil Campbell. This is our helicopter pilot. After I wrote about this. A private investigator reached out to be trying to find that man. 01:25:33 Speaker 3: He's got some heavy he got some heavy bear ordinance there. 01:25:37 Speaker 1: It looks like, yeah, he didn't like bears. So I'd be flying around with this dude that told his story. But he they would take a cargo plane and kick fuel drums out on parachutes because you're so far you can't get a helicopter there. They'd kick fuel drums out on parachutes and parachute field So we had fuel drums here and there out on the tundra, and me and that dude to land that helicopter and we get out and roll those field drums back up to the you know, and then hand pumped the gas into the helicopter. And he was scared to get an attacked by a bear while he was pumping gas. So that's why he carried that. 01:26:10 Speaker 2: It's like a rub super regga redhawk. 01:26:13 Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. And the private investigator was like, I'm really trying to find that man. Any idea what for I do? Don't care to get into it. 01:26:22 Speaker 2: We'll chat afterwards. 01:26:26 Speaker 1: Of these pre Clovis sites, the archaeologist Todd Serrvil from University of Wyoming. He has always been a little suspicious. Here he is in this studio saying, how how come all of these really old crazy sights? 01:26:42 Speaker 2: He said, He's explained to me they're always weird. 01:26:47 Speaker 1: Why can't anyone find one of these really old pre Clovis sights that is just normal? I said to him, what is a normal site? Here he is back when the walls were white. 01:27:04 Speaker 3: And they're normal. 01:27:05 Speaker 5: Yeah, and they're normal. 01:27:06 Speaker 2: It's not weird shit. 01:27:07 Speaker 3: It's like chipstone around hearth features, butchered animal bones. 01:27:11 Speaker 2: It's normal stuff. 01:27:12 Speaker 3: And what we call distreet discrete stratigraphic levels, meaning they're just like really clear occupations if you're to look through them. 01:27:18 Speaker 1: Yeah. 01:27:19 Speaker 13: Yeah. 01:27:20 Speaker 1: What he's saying is, so you heard them a normal site. You have hearth features, mean campfire features, So you got datable charcoal stone where they're making arrowheads or spear points. You got animal bones. And he's saying, you have layers that are not disturbed. If you go back to that site that I just had from the Western Brooks Range, you're looking at a tent ring, like you can see the tent ring. Okay, so you have a fairly undisturbed like that's not all buckled under five feet of ground and it's been washed away by a river. Right that surface right there is like a clean surface that hasn't been jostled around. So what he's talking about is he wants sites where that hasn't been disturbed. You have stratigraphic layers, all right. He went down to this MASA site, the Monteveriti is not the MASA sites in Western Brooks, Rane. Sorry, they just went down and applied a bunch of new dating technologies that guess down to the monte Verde site. Guess what dates he's come back with. And this is advanced techniques. 01:28:31 Speaker 5: Published in Science twenty thousand years. 01:28:35 Speaker 1: No, No, he's coming back saying it's not a normal site. It's a messed up site. You got a bunch of stuff all mixed up his dates for Monteverity. And I want to back up a point I didn't make about Monteverde. We had one of the leading are the one of the leading anthropologists on the peopling of the Americans is a guy named David Meltzer, and I love him, God bless you, David Meltzer. Meltzer went down with other people down to the Monteverde site, and these scientific community put their like stamp of approval on Monteverde. Your kid's history books may have been rewritten based on the Monteverde dates. 01:29:13 Speaker 3: Can I ask, is there the people that believe it's that old? Is there exclamation a Kelp Highway theory? 01:29:20 Speaker 1: That they great point? I should have brought this up. I meant to bring that. I think I had my notes by skipped it. If you've ever heard us talk about or people talk about a thing called the Kelp Highway, here's what people are talking about. Humans. If humans were here fourteen five hundred years ago, down in southern Chile fourteen thousan five hundred years ago, they couldn't have walked in because their path would have been blocked by glaciers. You could have been in the Brooks Range, you could have been up and you could have crossed from Siberia and entered Alaska, but you could not have walked south because you would have been blocked by glaciers. So then people had to go like, but they were here because Monteverde, so we know they were here. Since we know they were here, how did they get here? They had to have taken boats. How could they have survived? Well, the Kelp, the band of Kelp, and these inner coastal marine environments were so rich in fish and shellfish. The people up in Japan and the illusions in Siberia would have built boats, and they must have just boded the shoreline, and they were up against shorelines that were glaciated. But somehow they were out and they were able to survive off marine resources and make their way south of the ice sheets, because we know they were there, because we have these really old sites. The Clovis first idea was people showed up the minute the glaciers melted and they walked in. Basically there was a thing called the ice free corridor. So the theory goes, there was an ice free corridor. People came down from Alaska, entered the Great Plains right around Edmonton, Alberta, through a narrow opening in the glaciers, and spilled onto the Great Plains rained hell on megafauna killed all the mammoths, spread around the whole country instantaneously, the richest hunting ground ever discovered by man gradually split apart into all these different cultures and languages, and that's how the story went. But sites like Monteveritate shot at all to hell, and then it entered this idea. They must have boded down well, this new thing, and I'm that way. I'm done weighing in on this whole thing. I'm just trying to deliver the facts, or I'm just trying to deliver the debate. I'm done weighing in on it. I bought into Clovis first, I bought into the Kelp Highway. Now I'm done. I don't have any opinions this new crew. And it wasn't just the University of Wyoming, people from Chile all over the place, four two hundred. They're saying that site isn't fourteen to five, it's forty two to eighty two. And it's all mixed up. It's all mixed up. I mean, it was just churned up. I had a great I thought of it this morning. I was out turning over part of my garden. Okay, I got the old dirt, I put down compost, I put down grass clippings, and in the spring I turn it. So if you were to go down and dig down twelve inches down in my garden and be like, ha, look at this piece of grass clipping it's as old as this other stuff laying next to it. Is it or did it get turned over the course of thousands of years it got turned floods or whatever flooding, And then imagine that there's a flood and it washes stuff that doesn't belong there into there. Also when you get into like when you get into it, and I'm doing any archaeologist would would hate everything I'm saying. I'm just trying to demonstrate some points. I'm not an expert in the field, but picture that out in your yard. You're digging around in your garden and you find some old bone land there and you're like, huh, look at that, and you deposit it on the ground. And then later someone comes and finds your gardening area. They find your skin cells all over and they're like, good god, this man had a mammoth. Here's the mammoth bone right next to his garden tool. And then they date the mammoth bone. Good god, he was using a steel gardening tool fourteen thousand years. 01:33:40 Speaker 3: Ago and a cell phone. 01:33:44 Speaker 1: Meaning stuff just gets mixed up. So in this paper they put out in explaining some of the things, there is an idea that I don't know. Maybe it was reworking. People probably picked up fossils, Like if you were alive eight thousand years ago, would you have thought a mammoth fossil was interesting and brought it home with you? M I don't know. Maybe I don't know. 01:34:14 Speaker 2: It's like when I find a beer bottle from the sixties or seventies. 01:34:18 Speaker 3: Or an old thirty six shell. 01:34:20 Speaker 1: I found a really old beer one time. It drank it, remember that, Ye honest, I got sick. 01:34:23 Speaker 5: It wasn't quite that old I drank. 01:34:26 Speaker 1: It was the rolling out of a bank. 01:34:28 Speaker 5: Yeah. 01:34:29 Speaker 2: I drank a white claw that was unopened at the range clean up last year. You guys are growing terrible, terrible mistake. 01:34:35 Speaker 1: Did you get sick? 01:34:37 Speaker 2: I didn't finish it, sonyheah, it happened Clovis first might be back. 01:34:42 Speaker 1: That's what these guys. If you go back and listen to that episode, these guys were like I in terms of people coming here fourteen thousand, fifteen thousand, sixteen thousand years ago, they're like, uh, just generally paraphrasing a very complicated conversation. They're generally like, show me a normal site. It's really old, Show me a great site. Why do we have so many great Clovis sites and everything older is. 01:35:13 Speaker 2: Wishy washy. 01:35:16 Speaker 1: Or weird? 01:35:20 Speaker 6: Now, I mean, I feel like they have some explanations for that, just because the older stuff is the more. 01:35:27 Speaker 1: Likely it's you know, I'm sure it's very complicent. 01:35:31 Speaker 5: Time is rough on stuff, very common. 01:35:32 Speaker 1: Yeah, the older it is, the less likely it's still around. But why do you see such an explosion of sites at thirteen thousand all of a sudden, It's like, I don't know, why are there tons of thirteen thousand year old Clovis sites? But no one can show me a normal fifteen thousand year old site when there's normal thirteen thousand year old sites all over. This is the last point if forget to make it. This picture of us stand a by his tent ring. I was invited here by a pre Clovis enthusiast named Tony Baker, invited me on this Bureau of Land Management survey cultural survey. He volunteers for this, and he was He spent a good part of his career. He retired as an oil executive and became obsessed with pre Clovis. He became obsessed with who really were the first Americans? So he was always interested in finding. He thought that someone up here was going to find, you know, a twenty five thousand year old site, a thirty thousand year old site, something really old, because it stands to reason, wouldn't the oldest stuff be closest to where you entered the continent? Picture your kids come in the room with muddy shoes. Where's most of the mud? 01:37:02 Speaker 5: Mm hmm at the door. 01:37:05 Speaker 1: It's imperfect analogy. That's all clothes first. Back, baby, I don't know. 01:37:13 Speaker 3: I like it. I like it. 01:37:15 Speaker 1: I'm done having opinions about it. Well, I've been burning times. 01:37:20 Speaker 2: To chase the headlines. 01:37:22 Speaker 1: I'm too global. I was a big Kelp Highway guy, like a fool. 01:37:26 Speaker 3: But but why can't it be that the Kelp Highway existed and the other one, like you know what I mean. 01:37:31 Speaker 1: The Kelp Highway without really old sites, the Kelp Highway becomes a lot less interesting. 01:37:37 Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm just saying, like, couldn't have happened concurrently, Not that it happened way before, but that the same thing that some of them went through the middle of the continent and some of them went down. 01:37:47 Speaker 5: The coast. 01:37:49 Speaker 1: Yanni before we started recording, was all excited about a woman being the first to win a race. Some race. Mm hmm, Okay, there's a thing about being first. I'm interested who was the first if. 01:38:06 Speaker 10: It was a tie, just like Yanni and Brody, was. 01:38:12 Speaker 1: The first American? And it was probably a little cluster it was it was it. I'm gonna go and say so, I'm gonna say a thing that I know to be true. It was not one hundred people, little family group. It was thirty, twenty thirty the first Americans. It was twenty or thirty people. They walked in killing mammoths, or they boted in eating clams. 01:38:39 Speaker 3: Yep. 01:38:41 Speaker 2: Should we all be so lucky someday? 01:38:45 Speaker 3: I gotta know, I gotta know you gonna have to wait for that time machine to get built. 01:38:50 Speaker 1: I want to be with them when they do it. I want to be like you boys don't even appreciate this. We just crossed into America. Let's crack a champagne. 01:39:02 Speaker 3: They didn't know they crossed anywhere. 01:39:04 Speaker 1: Yeah. Really, this is the last point I'll make about the peopling of the Americas. Generations generations would have been born and died in what is now the Baring Sea and not known they were going anywhere. Yep, right, you were born there, you died. Maybe you died two hundred miles east or east southeast of where you were born. Maybe because you're always curious, like what's over the next hill, right, but you weren't, like, Bob, let's go to America. I just got a feeling they were just being like, it's always better hunting when we go kind of that way because over there, like he's like, just watch, if we go to the next valley, you watch if there's something there, I be back and walk up and stab it. But in our valley she keeps running away because we've been here for two years. 01:40:07 Speaker 2: Let's go over there. 01:40:08 Speaker 1: He's like, sure enough, look watch, I'll walk up and stab it. Bob and then and and like that, like that people found chilean Patagonia. 01:40:19 Speaker 13: Mm hmm. 01:40:20 Speaker 1: Because it's always better over that direction. 01:40:24 Speaker 2: Somebody probably said, my dad told me, if you go to the next valley, you can kill more stuff. 01:40:30 Speaker 1: Like you know what Dad always said, Yeah, if you can't kill anything, go aways south southeast. 01:40:39 Speaker 2: He says, it's always better. 01:40:44 Speaker 1: Dad's right. Thanks for joining the news show. 01:40:48 Speaker 3: We're not doing the wildlife crossings. Oh skipped right over me. No, I thought you were with me or something. 01:40:55 Speaker 1: I skipped it. 01:40:56 Speaker 3: Yeah, sorry, I want to get you skipped it way back before, be honest, went that's why I was caught off. 01:41:03 Speaker 2: Oh I was there twice. 01:41:04 Speaker 1: Sorry, I didn't mean to do that. 01:41:05 Speaker 3: So jump in now. Yeah right, it's not the end of the show, guys. 01:41:09 Speaker 1: No, we'll clean it up. The colobs versus back baby. 01:41:13 Speaker 3: Yep. The headline is world's largest wildlife highway bridge crossing in California is nearly complete. That's not where I'm going to start. That's the recent headline. If you jump back to the nineteen nineties, scientists identified Liberty Canyon in western Los Angeles County is a critical wildlife corridor that linked the Santa Monica Mountains to other other ranges. A couple of decades pass and there's a lot of concern over habitat fragmentation, especially concerning mountain lions. And this is something we've talked about in the past. The mountain lions in Los Angeles County, southern California. 01:41:58 Speaker 1: Just pulled up that iconic image, that mountain line on the Hollywood Sign. 01:42:04 Speaker 3: A lot of problems. One of the huge problems was they're getting hit by cars a lot, and in this particular spot is like pinch Point and Liberty Canyon. Three hundred thousand vehicles daily go through this canyon on Highway one oh one. 01:42:24 Speaker 1: Yep, my god, yeah, considering a lot of those are going through twice there in back. 01:42:29 Speaker 3: Sure, but it's a lot, and it's uh, it's several lanes on each side the highway there. So this idea starts to germinate about a wildlife overpass, which is kind of like when the idea of wildlife overpasses really started getting popular all over the place. And the reason you build these things are habitat connectivity, because interstates are like walls basically to a lot of wildlife. 01:42:55 Speaker 1: Sometimes literally because you got a fence on each side and you got a barrier down the center. 01:43:00 Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly. Another reason is critical, uh to maintain critical migration quarters. Like we've talked about the Hoback to red desert mule deer migration in western Wyoming, and I'll circle back to that, but that's that's an example where wildlife overpasses have been used. And then obviously it's it's to reduce roadkill mortality. So this idea kind of germinates, and the concept evolves into a large vegetated overpass spanning Liberty Canyon on US one oh one and the Agura Hills, which is western Los Angeles County, I believe. And so the idea comes and then bang, some major private funding kicks in which was just going to allow the construction of this overpass and that construct That money came from the Annenberg Foundation mostly and some other private partners. So April twenty two, on Earth Day, groundbreaking begins on the Wallace Annenberg Wildlife Crossing. A couple of years go by, there's like heavy structural work going on. Millions of pounds of concrete gets poured, the deck of the bridge gets built over ten lanes of the highway, and the expected completion is, wow, twenty twenty five. 01:44:21 Speaker 1: How big is that sucker? Side to side. 01:44:23 Speaker 3: I'm gonna I'll get I'll get there. So a couple of years go by, their building building, building, expected completion is twenty twenty five to early twenty twenty six. So twenty twenty five was a final construction phase which was you know what you see there, like habitat shaping and soil placements, things like native vegetation, a million local seeds were planted and it's described as the world's wildlife largest wildlife crossing, which we'll we'll get to that and again again as far as se steve two hundred and ten feet long, one hundred and seventy feet wide, largest of its kind globally. You can see that it's made to like look natural, not just like a dirt bridge eight acres. Wow, that looked like acre eight acres? 01:45:22 Speaker 1: Is it not done with it? 01:45:23 Speaker 3: Yeah? The species that they believe it will support will be mountain lions, deer, coyotes, bobcats, reptiles, says birds, Well, I guess some birds. 01:45:33 Speaker 1: Yeah. 01:45:35 Speaker 3: Yeah. So anyway, they're building and in twenty twenty five, as as happens with construction projects, there starts to be delays and cost overruns. There was flooding that delayed it, inflation, labor, supply chain stuff. So the budget goes up by about twenty one million dollars to one hundred and fourteen million dollars total. What one hundred and fourteen million dollars from what well went Oh, it got to one hundred and fourteen million with a twenty one million dollar overrun. Okay, so it was whatever. Round ninety was the original budget. So this year it's nearing completion and wildlife are already appearing on the bridge, pollinators and reptiles, birds, things like that. The planned opening is now December second, twenty twenty six, so you know, six or seven months from now. It's developed a little controversy throughout the years as it's been built, and it it was coined the Bridge to Nowhere by some right wing media and politicians. 01:46:54 Speaker 1: Stealing that term from the bridge in ketch Kan, Alaska that would have connected the town to the area. 01:46:58 Speaker 3: There's a lot of bridges, a lot. But yeah, but this is like cost delays, like time overrun, cost overrun, and the fact that it's not critical. This is a a a detail that kind of tells you a lot. I think about the attitude towards wildlife, which is it's not critical infrastructure that benefits people. But the thing is is most of the money came from private and philanph and filanthropic funding, so it's not like the taxpayers are on the hook for the cost of this thing. So I'm not I'm not. 01:47:40 Speaker 1: Sure why it's in some people's minds, including some friends of mine. It's become like in their mind, emblematic of everything wrong with California, right sure, And you know which, And I think because they look at the amount of money, they look at that you're you're basically connecting to over developed, Yes, pieces of a habitat that are beyond repair. 01:48:04 Speaker 3: For a handful of mountain lions. 01:48:06 Speaker 1: Yeah, they point that it wouldn't happen if it wasn't for this, would like it's it's happening because of the mountain lions. Yeah, all of which that doesn't row me up. 01:48:18 Speaker 3: Right. 01:48:19 Speaker 1: If people want to spend their money making giant overpasses for wildlife, I'm like, great. 01:48:22 Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly. And we're gonna talk about some other ones the until this one is finished. The in Colorado, there's one called the I twenty five Greenland Wildlife Overpass. 01:48:36 Speaker 5: Do we have that pill? That's it there? 01:48:39 Speaker 3: That was nice film that was completed last year and they were calling that one the largest in the world for a little while. But that one is completed in use I twenty five just south of Denver. So again, probably hundreds of thousands of vehicles a day and already thousands of animals crossings of and recorded there significant drop and collisions really yep, or if you could trap that, I don't think people are allowed on those. 01:49:09 Speaker 1: Kids can't string snares on those trails and see what comes through. 01:49:13 Speaker 3: Another real, real famous one is the bamp Wildlife Crossing System. 01:49:17 Speaker 5: Wow. 01:49:19 Speaker 3: And this is they have like forty of these things and it's overpasses and underpasses, eighty ninety reduction wildlife collisions there really yeah. 01:49:29 Speaker 2: Over how many miles of road? 01:49:31 Speaker 5: Though? 01:49:31 Speaker 1: Well, like over that patch of road. 01:49:35 Speaker 3: I mean, I'm I'm sure it's with forty crossings. It's miles and miles and miles there. 01:49:40 Speaker 1: I'm not they made forty of those. 01:49:42 Speaker 3: Yeah, in the BAMF area. 01:49:44 Speaker 5: Damn. 01:49:46 Speaker 3: So like these things work, they're becoming more popular and uh like for a comparison, I wanted to show like actual numbers for reductions and roadkill. There's there's there's a Seriannis might remember these. There's a Highway nine between Breckenridge, Colorado and Kremlin, Colorado. About ten to fifteen years ago they started building a series of overpasses there. Can you pull those up phill nice. 01:50:17 Speaker 1: And you can pull up the seconds kicking ass man. 01:50:19 Speaker 3: Yeah, there's there's a cool one. This was like a real bad spot for particularly for mule deer mortality in the winter, but also elk, a lot of car crashes, a lot of animals getting killed. So within five years of these wildlife overpasses being completed, reduced vehicle, mule deer and elk collisions by ninety over a ten mile stretch. Really wow, crashes from over thirty annually to nearly zero. No kid prevented hundreds of potential collisions and effectively reduced carcass counts by wow. 01:51:00 Speaker 1: We should do. I don't want to have an essay contest, but a bullet pointed email contest. 01:51:06 Speaker 2: Yes. 01:51:08 Speaker 1: If you hate if you're one of the people that hates well overpast and you think it demonstrates everything that's wrong with the world, send us a bullet pointed email and we'll have a contest. Yes, who can have the best bullet pointed email? That's so that it better explains why it's so bad to have wildlife yep crossing. 01:51:29 Speaker 3: Before before you said that that was bullet pointed emails. Watch this video going back to these previous ones. UH crossing structure. The structures will cross more than forty five thousand times by elk, moose, black bears, mountain lions and other species. Do you have that video? So this is this is a video from a wildlife crossing in Utah, and I wish we could fast. 01:51:56 Speaker 1: I don't like how they decorated it. Yeah, this one, this one kind of you know, I would have done it way different than that. 01:52:02 Speaker 3: I can script through it looks you start like if you start, this is one wildlife crossing. 01:52:09 Speaker 1: Pine squirrel, moose. 01:52:10 Speaker 13: Porcine, out cougar, some kind of ground squirrel, round squirrel, little baby mule deer. 01:52:23 Speaker 1: And it did a terrible job decorating it. 01:52:25 Speaker 3: But still, I mean, like the things getting used. 01:52:29 Speaker 1: I think it looks like if you gave your kid an aquarium and he puts some sticks and rocks in there. Just I'm not buying it. The animals obviously, ever, was a coyote cutting through there, black bear cutting through there. 01:52:40 Speaker 3: So you get the picture, like this one small overpass it and you bobcat could back up cottontail. 01:52:48 Speaker 5: What is it? 01:52:50 Speaker 1: That's not a pika? But I saw is he carrying something? 01:52:56 Speaker 3: Something? 01:52:58 Speaker 1: He's carrying some ship he found dead on the road. 01:53:01 Speaker 3: The road and carried it out. 01:53:06 Speaker 1: Wow, look at that thing. 01:53:07 Speaker 2: You get the picture? Yeah, there's a damn A former colleague of mine of tears, there's another bear. Daylight Hours is on the Colorado Wildlife and Transportation Alliance. He's a co chair of it, and he actually sent me a video a couple of months ago that I watched they have on YouTube that explains how effective these are and the need for additional funding. 01:53:26 Speaker 1: Back up, Brody missed something important. Watch something spooks this bear here he's going, he sees it. He stands up and he's the. 01:53:33 Speaker 3: Other bigger bear on the other side of the bridge. 01:53:35 Speaker 1: Is it? I don't know, saying he winded, Yannie, Oh nope, he's going back ground blind. He changed his mind. 01:53:44 Speaker 2: That's amazing. 01:53:46 Speaker 3: Yeah, you kind of dig into one and find out. 01:53:51 Speaker 1: Why does it bring so much right wing hatred about wildlife crossings? 01:54:02 Speaker 3: I don't know. I mean, I think it's what you said is very true. It's just like a reaction to something going on in California, right, It's just like that's that's the. 01:54:13 Speaker 1: Added Just like a money thing too, you know. 01:54:17 Speaker 3: But if some private donor wants to kick down one hundred million of their own money, like. 01:54:22 Speaker 1: Come on, yeah, wildlife costs money. Yeah, it costs money. 01:54:27 Speaker 4: To have. 01:54:30 Speaker 1: In world history. It was like we had wild places because we hadn't gotten around to destroying them all yet. And now we have wild places because we've tried to have them. 01:54:39 Speaker 2: Yep, it's just switched. It's switched. 01:54:41 Speaker 1: You have them now because you're willing to make sacrifices for him. You used to have them because everybody was lucky. Now you have them because you try hard. 01:54:51 Speaker 3: There we go. That's the news folks. 01:54:53 Speaker 1: Good job, Brody. That's the hell of it. Hell of a deal there. I want to go and redo that. Yeah, that's all what it said. The animals obviously like that. 01:55:03 Speaker 3: Steve wants to drop tag for that one. Yeah, for that wildlife crossing. 01:55:09 Speaker 1: I drew the eye forty tag. 01:55:12 Speaker 2: Weapons are restricted. 01:55:14 Speaker 1: All right, thanks to joining the news show. I know it was a long one, ladies and gentlemen, but that's how it goes