00:00:02 Speaker 1: Welcome to the Wire to Hunt podcast, your home for deer hunting news, stories and strategies, and now your host, Mark Kenyon. Welcome to the Wired to Hunt podcast. I'm your host, Mark Kenyan, and this is episode number nine tann the show. We're taking a break from white tails and instead are focusing on our favorite credit to chase during the spring, and that's turkeys. All right, welcome to the Wired to Hunt podcast, brought to you by Sick Gear. Today, we're taking a break from our hardcore white tail hunting focused episodes and instead focusing on another species that's incredibly popular with US deer hunters, and that's turkeys. And you know, the spring turkey season having been opened across a lot of states over recent weeks, and you know, continue to do so across most of the rest of the country, and the next week or two, it seemed that now was about as good time as any to talk turkey. And I get a lot of emails and messages asking for us to talk about other species like turkeys more often, especially from guys or girls that maybe haven't tried turkey hunting yet but are interested. And you know, how do you do that? Coming from a deer hunter's perspective. So that was kind of my idea for today. I thought we could, you know, share some of the things we've learned as turkey hunters, me and Dan walk through some of our stories and kind of give a deer hunter's perspective on how to get started turkey hunting and and kind of everything else falling under from there. But I don't know, I kind of needed a day like this Dan, to just kick back and have a cold beverage and just talk turkeys. Know, we had a b S episode two episodes ago, but I kind of feel like I need that again today. So so I'm gonna try to do BS with a purpose today. That's kind of what I'm feeling. That's good because that works. Everybody. Everybody needs a little a bssh. Yeah. I just I just need to, like, I need to take some weight off the shoulders. I need to unwind, and um what better way to do it than talk about turkey hunting, which for me opens up in less than a week. What about you? Youth season is going right now. But before we get into this, I want to tell you something real quick, please do I was driving from work here, you know, I get off work and I come straight here and I go down this black top and on my radio, guess what song comes on. I don't know if you're probably not into this kind of song, but the song, uh Mother by Dancing. Have you ever heard that song? No? Oh my god, are you kidding me? It's like it's hard rock, heavy metal mother tell your children not to hold my hand? That song? Now it rings a bell anyway. So that song got me thinking about a peanut butter and jelly sandwich that I made when I got home for some reason. And so I got an awesome song in my head, and I got a peanut butter and jelly sandwich in my belly. So I'm like jacked up ready for this podcast. So wow, So we're both like we're having to go yeah right, I mean, I'm I'm jacked. Oh, I'm glad. These episodes are best when we're jacked and pumped up for them. Um, So I'm good. I'm glad that you're pumped. I'm a little bit like I'm coming off of like an adrenaline burst, and so I'm like kind of on the hangover effect right now. So we'll, um, we'll meet somewhere in the middle. Right. It sounds good. And if you if you start fading, man, just holler at me and I'll pick you up. I'll carry you tacking out Dan, pick it up, pick it up? Oh man, I guess I actually I'm glad you threw me off the turkeys there for a second, because I should share why I'm a little exhausted today. Um, which is some exciting news which we'll talk about more. But last fall I launched The White Tail Q and A podcast as this secondary show I was running is a kind of short form Q and A style show, which I'm sure most of you know about. Um, But just recently I've announced and you might have seen this already if you subscribe to The White Tail Q and A podcast, or if you follow us on social media and everything. But long story short, have decided to excuse me. I've decided burp right now. I have decided to We are partnering with the guys that Drewy Outdoors, Mark and Terry and Matt Drury. We are partnering to kind of revamp that White Tail Q and A podcast, so we've renamed it the Wild Podcast. We're doing an audio version continuing like we've done the past but adding Matt Drury as a co host, and we're gonna be bringing on Mark and Terry and other guys from the team as guests on the show. And then we're also doucing a video version of that podcast um and live broadcasting it when we record those. So today was the first live broadcast, so we had to go through all this stuff to get this thing up and running, and doing this live video version has been way more difficult than I think we thought. There's been so many different technical difficulties. We've tested like a million things and trying to get my video set up to work and look good. It's been like two headaches and a half. Um. So we had that first one today it went okay, nothing, nothing broke, nothing like totally embarrassed us. So I guess that's a win. UM. So more details to come on that. You can subscribe on iTunes and stitch you're just like you would have to any other podcast, and then you can watch the video version on the Drury YouTube channel. UM. But yeah, that's why I'm kind of burnt out because that all happened today and now I'm just like who with all this this live streaming that's being done right now because I I do a little bit of that myself. Wouldn't it be really embarrasseding if you passed gas like really loud and it got broadcast to the entire world. What's bound to happen. Yeah, it's gonna it's bound to happen, that's true. But I will say something. I worry that this live video stuff which everyone is doing, which is cool. I like it, but it's getting It's already getting almost kind of overwhelming just for me, like on my Facebook feed or everywhere else. And I wonder if it's just gonna get to be too much and then the noise is so heavy that then it's just I don't I don't know. Well, you're gonna have that, especially with any new technology. I mean that's why I do it, because it's new and people are excited about it. But just like anything, there will be a plateau, and uh it will you know, everybody will go back to you know, things will settle, the dustal settle. But you know, as far as technology is concerned, it's Moore's law, right, every eighteen months something like that. I agree, Um, it is getting crazy though my Facebook feed. I feel I don't know what you think about Facebook these days, it's just all videos now. Yeah, I'm getting kind of down on Facebook just a little bit personally because there's like so much video stuff and like it's mostly from people I don't even know, and it's random like viral videos that are posted on Facebook now and I'm just like, I don't know. I've been spending a lot more time like Instagram is where I'm still getting like some stuff that I'm actually interested in seeing. While I feel like Facebook, I mean, Facebook is cool to stay up to date on, like some of the websites I like to follow and some of the things like that, but I don't really see like updates from people I really know or care about anymore. Right So, for my personal Facebook feed, it's pretty much just a place to post pictures of my kids for my family members. I don't really go on there, you know. My main my main focus on Facebook is obviously the blog and whatnot. And you know, probably just like you as well, it blows my mind how much trash is on Facebook in my feed and how much trash people post meaning and I'll take it a stat father. You know the podcast that we do the company. Let's say I do a podcast about products. They won't post my blog the posts that you know, they just got done talking about their products. They just got done talking about um information that consumer might want to know about their products. They won't post that Facebook post on their feed, but they will post some dumbass meme about hey is it you know rutting and Strutton's turkey season? You know of some like don't you know, like some redneck with a case of beer. You know, they'll they'll post something like that, but they want It blows my mind. I don't frustrated. Yeah, I'm frustrated, but just you know, there's a lot of trash too. I mean, just like junk. It's just junk. It's becoming overwhelming. Yeah, it's it's now it's more of like a how do we filter through all this to find a few things that are interesting and available? Speaking speaking of interesting and available things, I found on Facebook, did you see the picture I found of you? That was kind of funny. I found this news article with a picture of a guy sitting at like a Denny's that looked exactly like Dan. If Dan had some more tattoos, man, I tell you what, if it was a little bit more socially acceptable. I would definitely have a neck tattoo. Since when have you cared about social acceptable acceptability? Well, you know, I have children now, so instead of looking like a dad, you know, if I had a neck tattoo, I might look like, hey, I just stole this kid out of a car type. You definitely had that going for. That's passing judgment. But I don't know. I uh, I think a neck tattoo would really just would would be sweet on me. I mean it very clearly says something about you. As soon as somebody walks up they know this guy. I don't know what it says, but it says something. It's like, why does this guy have a care bear tattooed on his neck? That would be a legit neck tattoo. Many real quick, before we get to turkeys, we need to pause very briefly to thank our partners at Sick of Gear who have made this podcast possible. Like I mentioned last week, we're going to be changing things up with our little Sickest segments here very soon as we're going to begin sharing super short stories during this time from people who have had incredible experiences while out hunting in their Sick of gear. Now, these aren't going to be stories necessarily about gear at all. We're just looking for great stories. So if you're a fellow sick of user and happen to have a story worth sharing, shoot an email through our contact form at wired to hunt dot com and we might just feature you on one of our upcoming segments. So with that said, thanks again to Sika for making this turkey talking episode possible. And now back to the show. Let's talk about turkeys. So why did you start turkey hunting? I'll be honest, the very first time I ever went turkey hunting was in two thousand and to my junior year in college, so it would have been two thousand and one, spring two thousand and one. I think, how old are you at that point Spring two thousand and two. I'm sorry, I was twenty two years old. Okay. So I didn't do any type of any type of turkey hunting until one day my uncle because I transferred from one college to another college and I lived closer to my uncle, and my uncle's like, hey, you want to come turkey hunting with me this spring? And I'm like, yep, So shotgun hunting for turkeys And it was it was really fun. Yeah, So so we're both late onset turkey hunters. I didn't start till oh, gosh, I don't know. Probably hell now, I was probably twenty two. Maybe they have been turkey hunting for six years maybe now, um, But it was one of those things that the first time I ever tried it, I was like hooked. Yeah, it's it's definitely. I mean, what would you tell someone who's never turkey hunted? Somebody listening right now, Let's say if I had a guess based on we did a survey like this for the National Deer Lines. I should have pulled this up, but earlier, probably last year, we did survey asking people if they also turkey hunted, and I think something like seventy or eight percent of those deer hunters also turkey hunted. So if we assume that is the case, maybe seventy percent of our audience is already a turkey hunter. The other thirty aren't. What would you tell the other thirty percent who haven't tried it yet? Well, if they if they're wanting to hunt in my woods, I'd say it's not very fun. But if but if it, uh, I'll tell you what there's nothing better, in my opinion. We had kind of had a conversation like this on the b S session that we did a while back. But it's pitch black, right. You're walking into the timber, you're set up in your blind, you're on a field edge or something like that, and then you sun starts coming up, the birds start tweeting, and you hear that first gobble and it just makes the if it's close, it makes the hair on the back of your neck stand up, and it's I mean, it's it's very interactive. And that's what I why I don't understand why more people don't turkey hunt, because it's not really a lot of if you're a gun hunter, it's not a lot of sitting and waiting. Like for me, I'm I'm on the go. So if if I was to continue gun hunting, I would Okay, they're not coming this way, so now I gotta make a move. It's like it's more of a chess game for me than it is sitting in a blind waiting for something to come through. Yeah, yeah, so true. I think it can be that way. I mean, some people do hunt that way, so it's kind of nice. You can kind of pick your pick your poison. You know, you can do the sitting and the pop up blind with a decoy set up and hang out, or you can running gun, moving around, hopping from set up to set up, hiking all over the place. And it's really it's it's just a very dynamic hunt. You can do so many different things with it. You can hunt them totally different one day than the next day. Try something different. And I don't know about you, but with turkey hunting, I feel like the steaks aren't as high and that and that I do it. Obviously I want to kill a turkey for the meat and to eat it, and it's also just for fun. But I don't put as much pressure on myself to try to target some big, mature, really really super smart turkey. Although I'm trying to become maybe a little more selective. Um, But because of that, I don't need to take myself quite as seriously. It's a little bit more laid back. It's a little bit more fun. Last times, I go hunting with buddies, so like we'll go out together, sit together, call for each other, do that kind of thing. Um, you don't need to wake up as early in the morning at least for me, um, compared to what I do with white tail honey. I'd like to get out there, you know, just before dark or just before daylight while turkey hunting, while deer hunting him out there, like an hour and a half before daylight. Um. You know, you can take a nap in the middle of the day if you want to sit out there for a little bit and lost of times you'll hear turkey and it'll wake you up. You don't need to be constantly scanning. Um. I mean you should, but if you wanted to take a napty could um. So it's just like a It's a nice way to get out in the woods in the spring, which is a super pretty time of the year to be out there as it's just warming up. The sounds are beautiful. I love the spring sounds. You got the turkey's goblin. You know, we've got pheasants out here behind my house where I've been turkey hunting, their crowing a little bit in the morning, and all the other birds. And you know, you can you can be active and hunt, you can be laid back and hunt and then like you said, all the you know, the interactive nature of these birds talking to you and you're talking back and all that. I mean, it makes for a super fun, super fun hunt. And not to mention, if you do it right, they taste really good too. That's a fact. Jack love turkey. How do you like to cook? I can't. If we've talked about this before, I'm sorry, but I can't. I don't think we have. And we were talked about eating wild turkey. I don't think so. I mean we probably mentioned it with the cooking podcast that we did with what's his name? But so my wife likes it when I make it into turkey nuggets. So I'll take a breast and I'll cut him up into like bite size, I'll bread them and then i'll fry him, and I turned him into nuggets, um, and then I put them you know, I'll make some kind of hot saucer barbecue sauce type, you know, wing sauce basically, and then eat him with some blue cheese. That that's that's what my wife likes. So that's what what I cook now. Um. I've also do the crop pop method, which well I'll take a breast and I'll cut it into like three pieces. Because for those of you who don't know, a turkey wild turkey breast is gigantic. It's not a turkey breast from the grocery store. It's like four turkey breasts from the grocery store. It's it's awesome. So I like to slow cook it a long time with potatoes and carrots, and then I'll make a gravy like, um, a mush a cream of mushroom type gravy too that that goes with it. And uh so those are two methods that I use. How about yourself? Sounds pretty good before I Before I answer, do you just take the breast or do you eat the legs too? You know I've done I've done the legs one or one or two other times before and I didn't get it right, So now I don't. But this year I am going I saw a recipe online and I'm going to take the entire bird this year. Yeah, I've got I've got a secret for you, a secret recipe that will make you enjoy those legs like never before. You'll have to post it online. I will, um it is it is the best recipe I've tried yet for legs, and I've I've been trying a lot of different things because I've been wanting to, you know, find a good way to use them. And like you said, it's easy to get it wrong because it can be really tough, you know. That's that's you know, very muscle fibers in a wild turkey, so it can be super tough unless you cook the right way. So this recipe I found is in a cookbook called A Field. Um, I cannot remember the author, but it's a pretty cool cookbook. And basically, you well it's called tomato braised wild turkey legs. Yeah, I saw you posted that. Yeah, I posted some about Instagram, I think, um, and basically you just well take a step back and I keep I got the hiccups. I'm sorry. First, we brined the turkey legs overnight, So Brian's like a super salty water and other vinegar mixture that you put the turkey legs in and brined them overnight, And we now do that with breasts and legs. That seems to make a huge difference on the tenderness factor. No matter what recipe we do, we brine them first overnight and then the next day we go through the regular recipe process. So that's a little tip that we've kind of picked up. That's helped a lot with the wild turkey we eat, so we we brine it, and I cannot remember what my wife puts in the brine, but if you just look up online various different turkey Brian's, I'm sure you'll find one. Um. And then you put in tomatoes and a whole bunch of other stuff, and then you you braise it, which is essentially a slow cook in liquid for like five or six hours or something. And when doing that with the slow cook mixed with the very acidic tomatoes, it breaks down the muscle fiber and those turkey legs and the tendons and a lot of stuff and makes it so tender, like no knife required. I could just pull it off of my fingers and eat the meat off of it. It was really really good. Um, by far the best recipe I've tried for wild turkey legs. So that's one definitely worth checking out. UM. And then I really like what you said. I like with my turkey breast. Doing the nuggets is a great way frying them up. That's a tasty treat. And then we also do a pretty main wild white wild turkey white turkey chili and that's pretty good. But again, everything if you briand it first, it just seems to help a ton when it comes to that tenderness, which is the big factor. I think that's the big thing with wild turkey that people get wrong and that people say they don't like wild turkey because of its because that's too tough. But if you if you get that tenderness taken care of, it's it's good good eating. Yeah, I agree. We always um, when whenever I cook the breast, I tenderize it with a mallet or a cookie dough roller. So just like smacking it really hardful long time smacking it hard, just a bit and um that that does a good job of tender tenderizing it as well. Yeah, that's smart. I think that's if you if you take that tip into mind, some kind of tenderizing treatment, I think you have a lot better meals from those from those wild turkey. And so we talked about eating turkeys. Um, when did you kill your first bird? Going back to the back of the day you started hunting when you were twenty two or so, take for you to kill your first, very first, very first season. I um, I have killed other than the year my wife was pregnant, which would have been last year. Um, and then there was another season. It rained every day of turkey season. I've I've shot my turkey every year. So since since uh two thousand and two, there's either two thousand two or two thousand and one, I killed a turkey every year except two years. Nice. Yeah, it's a nice Uh. It's a nice way to get some consistent diversity in your diet. Oh. Yeah, like you said, I think, at least for me, I don't know. I hear some people talk about how turkeys are like super super smart and so difficult to hunt, and I don't want to say they're not, because you need to do things right and it's a challenge still. But at the same time, I feel like and and maybe this is maybe that's completely wrong, but from my experience, once you kind of have some basics down and you kind of kind of solidify a basic level of calling expertise I want to say expertise, but oh, what's the right word here? Just a certain standard of quality in your calling and a few basic things like you can pretty consistently get a bird into at least shotgun range. Um, you know, if you if you go out a handful of times a year. So, so yeah, since I started turkey hunting, the first two years, I think I did not kill a bird. The first year, I just went out and sat with a friend who didn't really know what he was doing. Um. And the second year I went out on my own, just trying to figure it out myself, and had a couple of close calls but not quite close enough. And then the next year I like bought decoys. I bought my own decoys finally, and from there on out it's been every year, multiple birds. Um. So it's like I just had to kind of take a couple of years to figure things out and just kind of wrap my head around it and then get half decent with the call. And now it seems like, knock on wood, I can get out there and there's gonna be a pretty good chance of fill in that tag if I've got a couple of days to hunt. But you know, now I'm trying to take it, you know, like we talked about the other day, trying to make it a little more of a challenge maybe, but with bow hunting or doing different things, they're traveling to different places of turkey hunt because it's a ton of fun, and I kind of now don't want my season to end so quickly, you know, right right, I tell you here's here is my very first turkey experience. So, UM, I meet my uncle at this little this it's an old farm, and my uncle and his brothers and my two uncles basically they built They build a little shack and it had bunk beds in it and enough room for a cop so it was real tight in there. But me another buddy and UH, one of my uncles and my other uncle lived close, so he drove. He drove from his home every morning. But the very first morning, my buddy went with my one uncle and my other uncle took me and UH took me down to this river bottom. He we waited, We walked into the timber, waited to hear the first gobble, walked up to about i'd say a hundred yards to where um this turkey had gobbled. He sat me down in a tree. He backed up about fifty yards and UH started calling this jake for yeah, this jake flew out of the tree started strutting right in front of me. Boom. It was maybe six in the morning, Like it happened real fast. And that was that was my very first turkey hunt. Is that basically how your turkey hunting process looks now, is that you're basic just still Uh yeah, I mean so that for the most part, that's what I do. I mean, if I'm gun hunting, obviously bow hunt. I haven't bow hunted before for him, But like I said, it was my wife was pregnant last year and I didn't hardly get out at all. But this, you know, if it's just me, what I'm doing is I'm waiting to hear gobbles. If I'm and this is if I'm gun hunting. If I'm waiting to hear gobbles, uh, then I make a move on to where they're at still roosted in the tree, and uh, I'll sit down and wait, and I'll try to get into a position where I can maybe get some kind of response from them and then call them. Most of the time they come right in as far as mornings are concerned. Um, if they don't come right in, then I'm I'm doing a lot of running and gunning. You know, maybe move fifty yards or maybe to the next ridge, call a little bit, call a little bit, try to hear those responses early in the morning and then when it comes to the later in the afternoon, that's when I do a lot of sitting and using maybe some more decoys to try to get to try to get you know, something to cruise by me or or get interested or I mean, it's just different. Every years different. So do you when you're going into your proper do you know, do you have a handful of spots where you know that they traditionally roost So when you go out there opening day and the next week or whatever it is that you're gonna go out there, are you going to go to this general area where typically you know some of roosted in here and get out there in the morning, listen and then from there ad just what you assumed. Is that correct? Yep? So this year is going to be different because I'll be I guess I shouldn't say this year, but my wife I go I go turkey hunting with my wife, um, and she loves it because it's turkeys are ugly, they're not dear, they're not cute, so she has no problem killing an ugly animal. I guess. So. Uh so they're kind of like, they're kind of pretty in their own way. Yeah, I mean they're pretty, yeah, but have you ever seen their face up close? I mean if I had a face like a turkey face, I wouldn't have my wife right now, Dude, me me, My face on a video podcast is like when you finally get up close to a turkey head. That's why this whole video podcasting is stressful. I gotta face for radio, dude, gonna sensor your face. They might need to someone. Somebody told me the other day, well, I was doing a live Facebook feed that I look like Roseanne from the Roseanne Show. Definitely don't look like Roseanne. Well, thank you, because I started googling Roseanne try to look at pictures. I'm like, really, yeah, so why do we even try? I don't know, I don't know, but sorry what you're saying. So because I go uh hunting with my wife now, um, she's not a huge fan of the running gun type tactics. So I'll so like, let's say, for example, next Friday is when the season starts, So Thursday afternoon, I'm gonna go out. I'm gonna set a blind up uh for Friday morning, and I'll get it close to where Turkey's historically roost in this particular field and they like to pitch down into it. So so sorry, this is a field. You're set up on the edge of the field, right, So it's kind of like a cattle pasture. It's not an egg field. It's like a mix between CRP, but cattle have access to it. So it's a little overgrown, but it's not it's not a straight pasture and it's not straight CRP. And they fly down in there and it's kind of in the wide open and they like to strut from there to some fields and uh to a different kind of horse pasture, and they just kind of work this this high point and uh so what we do is we cut them off, and uh that's where we're gonna go hunt this year. So okay, so this is good. I think this is you know, for those of you or thirty percent of you out there who have never turkey hunt before and maybe you're going to try, I think what Dan laid out there is a pretty solid way to go about getting started turkey hunting. That's very similar to what I do too. You know, once you have a property you're gonna turkey hunt. The first thing I would recommend probably doing is just like Dan said, go out there early in the morning and just listen and find out where these birds are roosting. And I mean traditionally, and I want to take a quick stuff back. I am not. I don't think Dan would claim to be either. I don't think either one of us claimed to be expert turkey hunters. No, we are not because Strickland were we. We simply are guys have managed to figure out some way to have success. Um. But that said, um, you know, go out there trying to try to hear where these birds are gobbling, because they gobble off the roost when they're when I say roost, if you're not familiar, that's you know. At night they go up and stay in a tree and they stay up in that tree until daylight, and then after daylight they will fly back down to the ground and spend their day in the ground. So that's why you want to go. They'll be gobbling one they're off the tree. You want to find them when there in the tree so you can get close to it. And then, like Dan said, maybe you'll be able to get them to fly down and then work their way towards you because they think you're a hen. So a couple of things to keep in mind when it comes to finding out where turkey's roost from what I understand, um, in front of scene, you know, turkeys typically like to roost on a large horizontal limb, if you know, if available, so lots of times. If you you know, maybe if there's a big ridge with a bunch of old oak trees on it, with some big old branches that come off of that, that might be a terrific roosting location. Um, that kind of spot is where you're typical going to see those birds staying at night. And then they like to be somewhat close to some kind of strutting zone, some kind of field or open area like Dan mentioned in his case a horse pasture or something, or cow pasture. Lots of times, one of the first things they want to do is they come off the roost, they fly down, and they want to work to a strutting area or some kind of spot where they can strut around and hopefully find some hens. And you know this is this basically this time of year, the spring is the turkey rut. You know, this is when you know they're trying to find their hands and um, you know that's Basically, the simplest way to think about turkey on it is that right there, find where they're roosted, get as close as you can, and then try to get them to come in your way once they drop down. Um, so I'm curious about your calling thoughts and techniques. When they're on the roost, you get in there in the morning, you get is well, actually, let's take stuff back. How do you decide how close you're willing to get when you're trying to get over to that roosted the bird still the tree gabbling? What do you do? You just have a rule like a hundred yards is as close as you want to get? Or fifty or sixty or seventy yards or do you just kind of wing it? Yeah, it's all. It's all winging because if you go too close, they'll see you and then they will not come in your direction. Um. But so I like to I like to get into a position where they where. If I know where they're at, I know I can use terrain or other object obstructions to get closer to them. You know, if that's just me and a gun. Now, if I'm if I'm hunting out of a blind, I'm gonna hunt in an area to where I think they're gonna be going, so, you know, like a field edge or more of a wide open space because turkey or not like deer, right, so they like a little bit more of a wide open type of area to to do their strutting, because you're not gonna see a turkey go through a multiflower rose sticket, you know what I mean. So someplace where I have historically seen him strut in the past, which is like field edges, fields, um cr CRP, cattle pastures, that kind of stuff. So if I'm in a blind, I'm gonna be going to where they are wanting to go. And if I'm with a gun, I'm gonna get as close to him as humanly possible while still in the tree, and then try to get them as they fly down and potentially have maybe a decoy out to get their attention or do some light calling to get them interested in coming my way. Yes, let's talk about that. So one of the things that I think I was screwing up early on when I ever first started turkey hunting is that I couldn't get enough of goblin. So when I could get a turkey to gobble I want to call right back, and then he gobble, and then I'd be so excited I want to call right back, and then he got obbowl and I do that, and I was overcalling, and those birds would never come to me. So so now I'm I'm really actually pretty careful about not overcalling, and I'm much rather prefer too, to be very strategic with just just enough to keep him interested but longing for more. So you know, when it comes to when when a bird's on a roost and I get set up on that bird, I typically just like to do enough calling, some light yelping, just enough so that I know that that bird knows I'm there. I get a gobble from him or from all the birds that are there in that area, and once they know him there, then I kind of shut up and I wait for them to fly down. I just want to make sure they know there's a hen there, but they don't get worried that maybe it's a hunter and then it's not legit. So I'm pretty careful. I'm pretty up what's the right word, I'm struggling to find the right word her, but but really limited in my early roost calling. Once they come down onto the ground, then I'll give it to him a little bit. But again I'm much more. I Oh, I don't know why I can't think of the word here. I can try struggle to find the same word over our again. But long story short, I let them want more from me rather than consistently try and get them a gobble over and over and over. What's your thought process on a mountain of calling? Do you agree with me on that? Are you different? Well, it just depends on who I'm with, right, So like if I'm with I've taken kids out before and kids love gobbling, right, So if they're a new hunter or my wife, you know, it gets excited because if you just sit there and don't call, it's kind of it's I mean, you hear a gobble. It's fun. But at the same time, UM, I want to try to be successful as well, and there is a time when it's it's time to shut up. And that is if you here for me is if a turkey is, if a turkey is if a toom is gobbling and getting closer to you as you call, I continue to call. But if for some reason this turkey maybe um heading away from you, then what I do is I will stop calling, and I may even move my position backwards just a little bit and then maybe do some more calling. Now what that does, you know, there's I don't know if there's any scientific fact to back this up. But what this does is it makes the turkey, the tom feel that, hey, that hen is going away and I need to go. I need to, I need to, you know, go that way. Now, I'm not so I'm not sure of this this fact either, but I think male turkey's gobble and in in nature, the hands go to the tom's. Now that is okay, yep. So what as a hunter, we're trying to do things backwards, right, we are trying to get the hams to come to the hens, which is not it's not natural. So if Tom is with another hand, that's what you know, we call that being hend up. And it's very hard to get a Tom to break off, you know, break away from a hen, especially if he's the only time with the only hen. So it's it's very hard to get them to break off and come your way. Now, you know, if you sound horned up enough, you know, I've seen some crazy things happen where Tom's do come to investigate and you know you got a shot there. But I tend to be aggressive in my calling, but then then just go completely dead quiet. And I feel that that's where I had success over the years, is to get them all horned up and then stop and then they're like, hey, what the heck is going on? Yeah, I think that's that's a spot on tactic. When they get kind of hung up. You know, when there's a bird who just will not maybe they get to like eight yards or whatever and they just will not come any closer because just like you said, I think that's this exact situation. They say, Okay, there's the hen she should come to me now. And I think when you when you just shut up and then just wait, and then all of a sudden, ten minutes later, bam, there they are right in front of looking around that the headheld high, looking around um, and that's when they That's when my favorite moment in turkey hunting happens. When you get that gobble from fifteen yards away that you had no idea was there. That is awesome. And then there's another thing that it's also important to know, right, So if a turkey sounds like he's getting closer and you call, and you call, and he's getting closer, and he's getting closer, and he's gobbling this entire time, and then he stops. You know, if you're a relatively new hunter, you're gonna say, well, he went away, he's done. If they stop gobbling, that means they're close and they're continuing to come in closer because once they have identified where the calling is coming from, they no longer need to gobble, so so they're coming to your location. That's a good point I've found in both ways. Like sometimes I'll have these gobblers that come in loud the whole time, but then you definitely do get those that that shut up and then keep coming in but silent. And that's so true, like you need to keep your eyes on a swivel without moving um, but be ready. I would probably say for good, like ten fifteen minutes. Even after thinking that bird has been quiet and maybe isn't there around anymore, you should still just just assume that he's coming in and be ready for it, because they all of a sudden pop on nowhere. And I I don't know about you, but in a lot of cases, turkeys are like with a deer, they're they're a pretty big animal, and even though they're well camouflaged, if there's one getting close to you, it's usually you're gonna know it. But lots of times a turkey can just like sneak up on you because like most of their body can be underneath grass and stuff. You just see there's a little head that kind of pops around above if they're in some kind of cover. Um, all of a sudden, there could be one or right up behind you before you even know it, if you're not paying attention to it. So yeah, there's definitely, uh, there's definitely, you know, just like deer hunting man, there's there's tips and tricks and things you've got to learn on your own in order to you know, in order to be successful. So true, Um, what kind of calls to use? Did I tell you what? I cannot use a mouth call for the life of me when it comes to turkey hunting. I suck. I suck at mouth calling. So I have a box call and I have a slate call, and you know, I mix it up based off of what you know, what's getting them responding. But most of my calling is done with a box call. I'd say, I'd say, yeah, so you prefer a box called the slate, yep, I do. Interesting. I'm I'm the opposite. I'm not well to your point with the reed calls, mouth calls, I'm not great at those. I'm a little bit better. I've been trying to get better at that, because there's something to be said about not having to use your hands when calling a burden. So I've I've tried to get just good enough that I can use it, you know, in some situations. But I still prefer a slate most of the time. For me, for whatever reason, I feel like I have the most control and I can just get the most accurate sound. Um. I don't know why that is, but it just seems to be a little bit more of I don't know, I can just I've got a little more control over the sound than I do with a box call. I feel with the box is just like loud and squawky, while with my slate call, I can I can kind of you know, I can purr, I can cluck, I can yelp, I can do a bunch of little things with It's essentially just working a pencil on this on this slate, and you just can kind of finesse it and get different sounds, and for whatever reason for me, that's what that's worked for me. Um. But the reads are definitely a challenge. It takes a while to figure out how to work your mouth to get the sound. You know. That's right. So we've talked about our favorite calls and how we like to call. Um. Now, you said you sometimes these decoys, sometimes you don't, right, And I always I always start out like in the morning, my first setup will be with decoys, right, and then as the because sometimes when turkeys fly down off the roost roost, they all go in different directions, right, So the goal after they get out of the tree and onto the timber floor is to meet back up again with one another. The tom's and the hens. They all want to be in this group, especially, so if you can get close enough to where they pitched down and having you know they have the opportunity to see a decoy, they're gonna they're they're more likely to come in right off the morning to you know, to uh meet up with those other turkey. Yeah. So what's your typical dequeste? Um? I I usually run a jake and a hand one jake, one hand and do you have a particular way you like to have them set up looking at you or a pet or heads up, heads down, anything like that, you know, not necessarily. I I typically have my hand decoy, she has her head up, and I try to keep her as low to the ground as possible, and then I'll have the Jake decoy right like kind of off to the side of her and but close to her. And that's what works. But I mean I've I've had success with two or three decoys. Um, I've cut the I've cut a slice out of one of my Jake decoys and I attached an old fan that I had from a previous turkey kill and made what looked like a full strut gobbler out of it. And uh, that's I've killed turkey over that. You know. I've also killed turkey over um, no decoy. So it just depends it kind of what situation if you were, if you're gonna sit a lot and it's early in the morning, I use decoys. But after that I try to, you know, take the decoys out of the equation and then make them think that they have they can't see it, so you know, if they if they can see something and they're not terribly interested in coming in, then they won't come in. But if they can't see it, it kind of gets them thinking, hey, what uh, what's going on over there? They may be more likely to investigate. Yeah, I've definitely had I feel like I've had both situations where like I felt like, you know, some kinds sometimes like you just said there, But on the other hand, sometimes they feel like I was calling a bird. He gets within sight and they say, okay, I should be able to see that turkey. Now where's the hen? Why can't I see a hen? And then he won't come closer. So I feel like for me, I I always am experimenting and sometimes adjusting and seeing that change, you know, make a difference right away. So first usually kind of now after trying a lot of different sets with Jake's and hens and Tom, I've kind of settled on. Usually I start with a single old strut Tom and hen with the hen's head down like she's feeding, and then Tom behind her. But I will then gauge, you know, the turkey's behavior and how they react to that after a hunt or two, and then adjust. So the other year I had a situation like that where I had some birds come in. They saw it and it was just too much. They didn't like that tom in there. They backed out, And I think that's sometimes kind of a sign of the kind of like the phase of the ruts, sort of we're talking in deer terms, you know. The turkey mating season goes through a through kind of a process, consistent process every year too, so there might be in a different phase sort of of where they are in the breeding season. So sometimes those turkeys, those tom's are a little bit more competitive and they're interested in coming in and beating up on another town. Other times of the year they're not as interested in it. So I kind of gauge that based on how they react to that Tom. And so if I see those birds, some gobblers or Jake's coming in, they see that tom, they don't want to have anything to do with them, and then I'll remove it. Lots of times just leave that hand or put out two hands. And then sometimes that ends up being the trick, because I think you need to kind of pay attention to what they tell you and then adjust accordingly. But I personally have always I think I usually start with that tom and head and then and then go from there. But it's there's no there's no one size fits all, you know. When it comes to strategy for turkey, I almost I almost think it's like deer hunting, but the information is processed faster, you know. For you know, if you're after a buck, you have to wait for him to come through, or you know they're not making noise. You know, you you try to find out a pattern. I feel that with turkey you can process that information faster, which allows you to make quicker decisions, which allows you to compress all that all that decision making into one day to get on a turkey as opposed to maybe a couple of days to get on a deer. I think there's a lot of truth to that. It definitely does allow you to speed up a lot of that process because of the audio, Nate sure of it all. It makes it a lot of fun too, That's right, that's the truth. So have you ever missed a turkey? I have never missed one. But I did shoot one head on full while it was in full strut and it it did a backwards flip somersault type deal and it didn't kill it and it ran away. So I hit I didn't hit it directly in the head. I hit it basically in the breast a little like in the breast, and uh, it just it was probably at about twenty yards, so it it got a lot of the load, but um it didn't you know, it rolled it over backwards. And it's like my uncle always told me, if the turkeys in full strut and you and you shoot him and he doesn't hit the head, that's almost like a plate of armor for it. I mean all those yeah, a lot of feathers that are bristled up, and uh, it allows a turkey to kind of have a little defense mechanism sort of. Yeah, that's very true, and that's why you aim for the neck and head. Yeah, if you're hunting with a gun, if you're hunting with a gun, correct, if you're hunting with a bow, you want a more mid body, You've gotta be careful about that. They've got actually a pretty small vital area in the heart, lungs area in the body. So it's worth looking up at a diagram to see exactly where they are because it can be kind of tricky to pick up the exact spot, especially if you're looking at a turkey that is full strut versus not um from the diagrams I've always seen it, it's usually helpful to look at that turkey's legs where they come into the body and then go straight up from that. No matter what angle the birds at from you, if you look at where the legs come into the body and then go up a little bit from that, that's a good kind of frame framing to look at. But I dan have missed three turkeys with a gun or with a bow. Once with a gun, twice with a bow. Um. My first bird I ever shot at well was with my gun. No, no, let me take that back. That was this is the first birds I ever shot at were with a bow. And I missed both of them, one of them, I just well know both both of them. I shot right underneath them. I missed judge the distance and just shot too soon on both of those birds and shot kind of right between their legs, right underneath them. Uh. And they were both probably a little bit too far than I should have been shooting at a turkey. Um. And that was like that second season i'd ever hunted him. And then the next year I went out with a gun and the first gobbler I called in that year. He had come in and came in directly behind me. And the way I was set up, I was set up on my back to a tree, not in a blind or anything. I was just sitting up against a tree. And behind the tree I was sitting next to it was a huge pine tree, like a really thick, really big pine tree. So that big pine tree kind of blocked a lot of my vision behind me. So it was this was an evening set and I was sitting on the edge of a winter wheat field kind of where I thought these birds might be headed back up towards to roost and low behole. You know. After yelping away, I finally got one gobbling way off from the distance, um, and it saw that he was coming by direction. But then nothing. I didn't hear anything for like half hour forty minutes, UM, and I was getting you know, closer and closer and dark and heading or anything. And so finally I tried another yelp again. And this is just like that situation I talked about earlier, Like ten yards behind me, Max, a gobbler just blows up right after I started help and he came all the way in. It was right behind me, but he was on the other side of that pine tree. Well, I can't move because I'm worried that he can see I can't. I can't get behind me because he sounds so close. I don't want to turn because he might be within sight. But at the same time, I can't see him at all because it's these pine trees right behind me. So I'm just frozen there waiting. And as he starts coming up behind me, I realized he's going to literally walk like right next to me, like he's gonna be within like almost like armed distance. I can just kind of hear this like slowly working towards me, and so I realized, Okay, he's going to walk right next to me, and he's gonna spook. So I'm going to have to do like a one two three spin around and try to shoot him, and like try to do all that in a split second. At least at the time, that seemed like the best thing to do. So I just decided, okay, right when I thought he was like getting like close enough that I could do this, I did the countdown and then I spun around and there he was like three yards away from me, and I ripped the trigger and I don't know what happened, but did not hit him at all because he just went tearing off. And that was my first mess with a gun. I was very upset. How do you miss a turkey at three hearts? I felt like a real idiot. Um. But then like five ten minutes later I heard another gobble and lo and behold, I was able to call in three more birds in the last like five minutes of daylight before dark, and uh, I got a really nice bird. Um. It came out in front of me the way I was hoping the first one would. So that was how I killed my first bird. Was I was missing one of three yards and then five minutes later getting a chance of a real nice one right out in front of me. So that's that was pretty cool. I have not missed one since, so knock on wood, Yeah, that might change the seif I go out with the bow again. I think I told you ever since I started dating my wife, and it was like the first yeah, I don't even know if we were married yet, and I took her out in the first two years I took her out. We didn't hunt in We hunted in a blind in the mornings and then we just running gun all day. Well, now I know better to do that, But the first the first two years were it was a lot of raining and a lot of walking, and I could look in her face while she was behind me as I'm calling we're trying to get on in position for these birds, just not having any type of fun like the it was just soaking wet. So I was surprised on that third year when she decided, hey, yeah, I'll give this one more shot. And that's when she got her first, her first turkey. And uh, it's kind of funny to two toms came in at one time, and uh, so I'm coaching her through the I'm coaching her through the uh you know, the tom's coming in all right, you know, all right, get your gun up. Are you ready? Did you turn off your safety? Your safety is off? All right? Are you ready? Are you ready? And she's like yeah, boom drops it just drops it right in its tracks. And the other tim was kind of just hanging around. So I took the gun away from her and I started. I pulled it up to shoot the other time, and she jumps on me, giving me a hug because she's so jacked up that it kind of like the gun kind of goes off and I'm and I have to like adjust in my seat and put the barrel, you know, line the sights up again, and then I shoot the I shoot the next tom next to it. So her first turkey was a double or a double for us, and it was it was very it was like siding I had. So I'll tell you what, I have a lot of fun hunting with my wife, so I can definitely see that. It's it's just fun too. I can well, I have to turkey out with my wife too, but it's just fun to turkey out with another person. It's one of those types of things that you can really enjoy with another person. Yep, Now hold on one second, dance. My cat is in the office of me. Okay, it sounds like a pigeon. It sounds like a pigeon is in your And I was just gonna ask you, hey, man, what's uh for somebody jack hammeron outside? But it's a cat purring, the loudest cat ever, Cana. Her name is Bella Bella Okay, and she only has three legs. Really, yeah, she only has three legs. One of them well here's what I'm doing. I'm gonna remove her from the office and then I'm gonna come back and tell you about that. Okay, so it's gonna take two seconds. I'll sing to everybody while you talk. You talk to people. Okay, guys, now that Mark is on, uh, let's let's talk really about what we think of Mark Kenyon. Okay, I mean, if you ask me, I think, man, I don't know. I don't get him. And what were you saying there? And that's why, you know, those are my five favorite things about Mark Kenyon. I can't wait to go listen to that. When I edit, I was gonna edit this whole cat section out, but I think I'll keep it. Not Yeah, so the cat, she was sitting here on the chair and she was sleeping, and I was like, okay, you know what, Like usually I make all my dogs and my cat leave when we recorded, but she was sleeping on the chair next to me. I thought, oh, she'll be fine. But that was a big mistake because she's the loudest cat ever. When she purrs, she's got this like smoker's cough per So, so what happened to her is she when we moved in this house. She was like a barn cat that was in this barn behind her house that my wife took a liking to. When we moved in, the cat would come up my wife with petter, and eventually she give her milk and food and kind of started liking this cap and it would be there like every day at our back door. And then one day the cat disappeared. And at about the same time, a local trapper had told me that he had asked if he could trap behind my house and I said, yeah, I told him the day before that yes he could. Um. Well, then the cat disappears, and my wife is freaking out, what happened to Bella? Where's bellah? Blah blah blah, and like it had been like, I don't know, several days or something, and finally I was like, well, I don't know, maybe it got caught in one of the traps. So I called the trapper and I said, hey, man, my wife's cat disappeared. Is there any chance that you might have trapped that cat? And he's like no, no, and then it hangs up. And then that night the cat shows up on our front doorstep with its back leg just mangled. It was it had obviously been trapped and was just absolutely mangled. So my wife wigged out and took it to the vat and she decided that, you know, we it was either the cat had to be put down or we had to pay to amputate the cat's leg. And my wife was crying and I couldn't say no. So I spent all this money to amputate the leg of a barn cat that I didn't have anything to do with until we showed up here. And now that cat is a house cat that we've had for the many years since, and she's a great cat, but she is just really loud. So so that's that's the story of Bella, and that's why you heard the loud purring pigeon for the last ten minutes. I do not know what we were talking about before that, but oh, you know what I was thinking. One thing you mentioned that that one day with your wife was reigning, right. Um, I'm curious about how you think different weather impacts turkeys. The one thing I've seen personally, well, there's two types of weather related factors that have influenced my turkey hunting success. One. I don't like windy days because it's hard to hear the gob it's hard to hear turkey and it's hard for turkey to hear you. So those are tougher days from what I've seen. And then rainy days can actually be good days because from what I've read, from what I've learned from guys that are actually really good turkey hunters, turkeys really like to be out in the open during the rain, even more so than usual because that rain impacts their ability to hear stuff when they're in the woods, So they go out into the wide open so they can see everything around them really well. That's where they feel safest during a heavy rain. So you can actually find birds a lot easier when it's raining because they're gonna be almost always out in the open. Those are two things I've learned about weather, anything that you've seen. Yeah, similar to what you know if it's if it's raining, or if it is really windy or even overcast. I mean, I feel that those three scenarios prevent turkeys from gobbling and being vocal. Now, on the opposite end of that, if you have a really crisp, no wind, beautiful sunrise morning, those are when the turkeys go the craziest. Those are days to be in the woods. That's that's right. So what's your worst turkey hunting mistake do you think you've ever made? Um? I don't know. Man, probably being too aggressive and just trying to bulldoze right into where I think they're at and you know, obviously not run full sprint through the woods trying to uh go get them. But you know, probably I've I've been busted several times where um, you know, because some sometimes they're heading away from heading away from you. It's it has it's typically in one of those days where they're not responding and uh you know it too calls either it's windy or training or it's maybe a little cast and I'm trying to, uh, I'm trying to make a move towards their location where I last heard him or saw him, and in the meantime they've shifted position and I have I got busted by a hen or a tom or whatever, um going to their location when they maybe a head flanked me or something like that. Yeah, that's easy to do. Yeah, when they when they quiet up and then you start it's like, at least for me, I once you have talkative birds, you start just assuming that you know where they are, but you then make the mistake and that you thought they were two hundred yards away or whatever because you heard them there a couple minutes ago, and then you come around the corner and fifty yards aware there is when you thought you were still safe to be moving through there or whatever. So you just definitely got to be I think I've tried to teach myself to be a little more careful, Like you want to be aggressive, but careful, because you can't assume that if a bird's not talking, a bird's not there. You know that's right, that's right. So yeah, I've definitely made similar mistakes or something similar to that. I was hunting with my buddy Josh and he was one hunting. I think I was calling and uh, we were set up in the evening trying to we were trying to be close to where we thought they'd be roosted, and it was kind of a windy day and just nothing was talking as they're heading back to roost and so I think it was like, I don't know five heck, I don't know what it was. It was getting to be pretty dark. I was starting to think, I bet you that, Uh, I bet the birds have already gone up to roost. Maybe nothing had been talking for like half hour forty five minutes that we had heard one gob away off distant a long time ago, but nothing now, and so we're like, all right, you know, let's just call it. So we stand up, and just as we stand up, we turned around, a big old gobbler goes running away. He was like twelve yards behind us, was right there, and uh, we just we didn't wait it out. We didn't put in the whole time. We were going to bail out of there early. And because of that, my buddy missed down and be able to kill his first turkey. So that was a bummer. But there's a lot of instances like that. I think that I've where I've spooked a bird because I moved too soon, or you know, I should have stayed put for a little bit longer. But the one that I said, I guess the turkey is that, at least from what I've seen, is they might be a little bit more forgiving of those kinds of mistakes than mature bucks are. Yeah. The uh, my favorite is, you know, I I'm hunting all morning, I'm going up and down these ridges and draws and chasing these birds. And then I walk up and I have my gun, um down, I take my I took my bullets out of it already. I you know, every all my calls are in my backpack. I got my head down walking and um. I step out into the field and I look up and there are two tims and like one or two hens. The toms are in full strut, probably ten yards from my park truck. H oh jeez. So so they'll sit there and they'll get spooped at a leaf fall in the tim, but then they'll go and strut by a tractor or a part truck. That's awesome. It's gonna be frustrating, yeah, but the cool thing about turkey hunting is you can you can be unsuccessful with a bird and give them maybe thirty forty minutes, maybe even an hour, and then those birds will go away to the next ridge. They'll get calmed down and they'll start strutting again, and they'll start you know, they'll they'll think that they're away from danger. They may not gobble as much if you busted them, but you definitely have an opportunity to call him in again, or or make a move get around them exactly and get another shot in that way. That's a That's a good way to go about it, for sure. One other random thing that I just thought of. It is not related to what we're just talking about at all, but I want to make sure we mentioned it before we go. Is one tip related to calling that I found has been really effective is mimicking a hen, and that if you hear a hen, there's another hen with tom somewhere near you. You're trying to call that Tomin, but there's also a hen that's making some noises to some me oping, mimic that hen, whatever noise she makes, make that noise, and then get more aggressive with it, and then just keep going back and forth. If you can piss off a hen lots of times and they'll get so fired up they'll come in and they pull on the town with them. I've done that many times, several times, I guess, just in the last two years that I have gotten a hen fired up, brought her in, and then a town was right on her tail. And uh, we got my dad a bird like that last year, and we got a shot at to Tom's in Ohio like that last year, and then the year before that we did a double May and my buddy Joshua hunting down on our Ohio lease and we had one of the situations where two toms came in together at the same time and we did the one two three shoot and got them both, which was pretty cool. Yeah, that's always fun. So, yeah, that's that's something that I've I've heard from a lot of people like that was something I learned from some magazine and article, I right, or something that that I've seen work very well in the field. So if you hear, if you hear a noisy ahead, get right back at her. Yeah. Do you have setting Stone Turkey plans yet? What do you know when you're going out? Yep. Um, let's see. In Iowa, let me pull up my calendar real quick on my phone here. Um, let's see the youth season already has started, and I believe I don't know if it's I think it's like it goes in different seasons for gun hunting now. Uh, I think it's I don't know if it's this weekend or it's actually the eighteenth where archery season starts. So for Iowa, you can buy one archery tag and you can hunt from the of April all the way until I think May or something. Now, for gun hunting, you're limited to seasons, so like the first season is the eighteenth through uh, and then the second season is the third, fourth, and fifth, maybe the sixth, and then the third season is then through. So the seasons get a little bit longer as the season or the Yeah, the seasons get longer as the month progresses, all the way into April, where I think the we have a bonus week, and then the third season is to two weeks, I think something something like that, but we always go the second week the second season, which is the first weekend. So it's a Friday, Saturday, Sunday, Monday, Tuesday, the first weekend. You said, it's the it's the first weekend that is available to hunt in those particular seasons. Yeah, but it's it's considered second season. So that's what you said. April that opens, So is that April or seventh or something. You'll be out there. I'll be out there next weekend, not this weekend, but next weekend. Nice. Nice. Yeah, I I will be starting to hunt next Monday, so a week from yesterday, and then my dad and Josh will be coming into hunt with me that weekend that you'll be hunting, so we'll have some fun hunting. God, I'm just so ready to get out and do some hunting. I've been struggling. Are you going to Ohio at all? Yeah, We're gonna do a weekend song hunt here during the week next week. Then that weekend, Josh and my dad will be down to hunt here, and then I think the following weekend is when we're gonna go to Ohio. And so that'll be when I put out cameras, do a little stand adjustments and turkey hunt is Uh, let's see here is Michigan in Ohio? Are they one or two bird states? They're both one bird, So that's the same as Iowa. I know there's some southern states where I think you might be wrong. Ohio it might be a two bird state. Okay. I know there are certain states that are one one bird. There's other that are two birds, and I think there are certain states that there may be. Yeah, a five turkey throughout the entire year like so that that just seems like a lot. That's a lot of turkey. That's a lot of turkey. I do wish that I could take two in Michigan. UM two seems nice because like that's why I feel like this year, like for a number of years now, I've killed a bird within the first day or two and then I'm done, And so then i just end up going out with a bunch of other friends and calling for them, which is still fun. As long as I'm out there, I guess it doesn't matter. Um, but I'm going to try to be a little bit more selective just so I don't end it too soon. But I've just been like getting Kevin fever, Like it's been such a kind of cold, crappy spring here, at least for us here in Michigan that I've just been dying. Like since shed hunting season, I've not had anything terribly fun to go do outside. So I'm just like I'm ready to get out there and do some stuff. I've been scouting, doing the work like that, but i want to be out there hunting, so I'm excited for that. I'm very excited. And then when do you start your bass master turning? It's no bass Master tournaments this year, okay, but I will be trout fishing here and dude, I'm gonna be heading out to Idaho and like five or six weeks, I think. So you're going to Idaho for one month, in Montana for one month. Yes, yes, so, son of a gun. Hello, I'm very excited. I'm very excited about that, so counting down the days for all that good stuff. But but I'm thinking we should shut it down because you might be able to tell I'm very stuffed up. I've got a cold, so I think I need to take some medicine. And I'm gonna be going to bed kind of early tonight. So let's wrap the sucker up. And before you guys go, just a reminder to subscribe to this podcast if you haven't already yet, check out Dance Podcast and nine Trigger Chronicles, and also the brand new, revamped two point oh version of what was once called The white Tail Q and a podcast now called the One Sent Wild Podcast. That first episode is dropping online this week, so make sure you subscribe to check that out. Other than that, I want to say thank you to our partners who helped make this podcast possible. So big thank you to sit Gear, Trophy, Ridge, Bear Archery, Redneck Blinds, Hunter A, maps, Ozonics, Carbon Express, Maven Optics, and the White Tail Institute of North America. And finally, thank you all for joining us today. We appreciate your time. Hopefully it's got you stoked to do some turkey hunting, and if you haven't gone turkey hunting before, hopefully this will give you that little push out the door to give it a try. So thanks again, good luck hunting, and stay wired to hunt.

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