00:00:02 Speaker 1: Welcome to the Wired to Hunt podcast, your home for deer hunting news, stories and strategies, and now your host, Mark Kenyon. Welcome to the Wired to Hunt podcast. I'm your host, Mark Kenyan. This episode number two d and twenty seven and Tana show we're setting the stage for the next few months as Dan, Spencer Burder and myself breakdown our plans and goals and hopes and hit lists for the two eighteen hunting season. And big thank you to Lacrosse Boots for the support of this episode of the podcast. As I've mentioned before, I've been wearing a Cross boots for fifteen almost twenty years now for all my white tail hunting, and this year I'm wearing the new pair of Alpha Burley Pros and I just got these in the mail recently. I'm looking at them right now, holding them actually in and I decided to kind of go throwback with it this year. You know, over the past few years, I've been wearing the camouflage versions, but this one I've got the old green and yellow Lacrosse boot and there's something about that classic look. That was the very first pair I ever saw when my uncle first got Lacrosse as he had the green and yellow boots. Now I've got those two. It's kind of cool how it's coming full circle. As I've mentioned, these boots are ultra comfortable. They worked great from early season all the way through the late I'm going to be wearing these four Montana white tail hunting in September. I will be wearing them in Minnesota and the Boundary Waters. I will be wearing them here in Michigan in late December. Their waterproof, they keep you warm. They're about is sent freeze you can get, and they worked just great for a lot of white tail applications. So if you're interested in learning more about Lacrosse boots for yourself, you can visit Lacrosse Footwear dot com. All right, welcome to the Wired to Hunt podcast, brought to you by Onyx and today the show, I gotta say, we have got an all star cast for you. We have here on one side of the ring, the nine fingered Wonder from Another Mother, Dan Johnson. On the other side, we've got the one and only Further Hilliard, Regional director for the q D May and then the fourth man in this four way is the bearded baritone from South Dakota Spencer New Hearth. So we got a crowded house here today, but with hunting seasons a few weeks weeks away for all of us, I think, or most of at least, I figured we had to get back to doing our annual goals, hopes and hit lists podcast. You know we're you know, don't you remember doing these? Probably? I think we did our first three years, maybe missed it last year. Does that sound right? Do you remember that? Man? We've we've done it every single year, so yeah, maybe we did every single year. Basically, what I want to do is we're gonna talk through, you know, what our plans are for the year, what our hopes and goals are for the year, talk through if there's any like specific deer we're after or any specific things we're trying to achieve. Kind of set the stage, um, because you know, each year you get to follow along with what I'm doing and what Dan's doing, and you know, Josh and Spencer, you guys are more and more involved. I want to kind of share what all of us are up to, what we've got coming down the road. Um, and then you know, two months from now, three months from now, when we're talking in November December. Everyone can laugh at us when they hear how widely or how wildly we failed in achieving all these goals. Um, so that's what I feared we could do. And Uh, I don't know, Dan, are you up for that? I'm always up for it. Mark, That's what I like about you. So I want to I want to talk to you real quick, Dan, because a few weeks ago, like a month ago or so, you had we kind of did like a little bit of preview to this kind of thing because you would have gone out and you put your trail cameras out for the first time, and I kind of bugged you a little bit about what your goals were, what you might be after, and you said that this year you were going to be after two bucks. I think if I remember what you talked, there's like two deer you really wanted to possibly like focus on this year. One of them was this deer you called dork. Um. I saw number one you've checked your summer trail cameras. Number two, as I am every year, I don't like you very much because how great those trail came polls were. And uh, and number three I did see the Dork's back. So can you fill us in on how the rest of the poll went and what you learned about that old buck? Yeah, I mean, I'll tell you what um. In regards to that specific buck, I got daylight pictures of him, which is which never happens. The very first ever picture I had of him, which I'm mixed, I was expecting him to be a three year old in that picture was a daylight picture. UM. And this last card pool, which was what now going on two weeks or a week and a half ago. UM, I ended up getting more daylight pictures of him. However, you know that transition hits, they come out of velvet and he I catch him on a different part of the area in a different form that I can hunt, and uh it's just one of those things, man, where he goes nocturnal and he only visits the areas that UM I hunt, or at least through trail cameras, uh as when it's uh not when it's nighttime. So it's very difficult for me to get him pegged down. It's almost like I need about fifty more trail cameras to just code, you know, make these giant, impassable nets that he has to walk through and I'll get pictures of him. But until I do that, it's one of those games that I just don't think he's killable on the properties that I hunt. What was his activity on the pictures this year in daylight? Was that on par with past years or was this like the first time he's been daylight since that very first year? Yeah, very first time daylight period, so he or I mean aside from the first year, right so, um so between two thousand and what thirteen to two thousand and eighteen? Now, uh, I have to sets of daylight pictures of him and that's it. Wow. So my farm is not his core area right now in the summer though, is it a lot of pictures in the summer, Like, is it his core summer area. I wouldn't say it's his core summer area. He comes through on maybe a once every through week rotation. So take that with a grain of salt. So if this year you are sitting in one of your stands in November and Dork comes walking by, but then right behind him is you know, because because Dork's a big bodied old buck, but he you know, not a whole lot as far as his antlers. Um So, if dork's in front of you, but then like a Boone and Crockett, four year old comes walking behind him and they're both standing right in front of you. Do you shoot like the nine year old Dirk or do you shoot the four year old bigger racked buck. If I knew I wasn't gonna get busted and I had the wind, I'd probably Dude. I hate questions like this because the you know, if I say, oh, I'm gonna shoot the older buck, there's a group of people that are like, oh, that's bullshit. He don't you know, he says that now. But you know, the big buck he'll you know, he'll go after the bigger score. But if I had, if I had to choose between him, I would say I would shoot the nine year old or the eight year old, you know what I mean? So I dude, he's like three hundred pounds, he's got he's massive. He's only going to score like one forty maybe, but he's got really big, thick brow times he's got masks all the way out to his tips, and he's you just look at a picture of him and you think of a pit bull. And now it's to the point where I bet you, I bet you he's still three three pounds, but his back end is starting to shrink a little bit. You'll get that with these older bucks where he starts to look like a triangle. The front end is so thick and it just kind of tapers off because they their hips start to sink in. Their gut comes way up into their into their chest and uh or into their back their back quarter and it just looks like a pit bull and uh, I don't know, man, that to me is just as impressive as a booner on your wall. Yeah, that would be pretty awesome to get a chance of buck like that. I can't even imagine seeing a nine year old buck in Michigan. That's like the equivalent of like a two year old run. That's an old one. So check this out. Though I have. I found a pair of a matching set of sheds in about I think it was one point from a straight line from where I found the sheds to where I got this trail camera picture one point five miles away. And I'm not joking. I think I have another eight or nine year old buck to a pair of um an eleven point buck um that I found a matching set to in two thousand thirteen. Who was on my trail camera this year? Hold on, so you're saying you have a match set of antlers from two thousand thirteen, ye that you think belonged to a deer you have on camera this year? Absolutely, yep. And he is a big bodied, mature looking, big head, big front end. Uh you know, kind of that pit bull look again. And he's another three pound buck that would probably score I mean, he's he's got to love and scorable points. Maybe put him in the low low, low one fifties. But he's just an old buck. And you can tell by their coat and by their face and by their head that he is he's he's it. I mean, that would be another buck that I would love to harvest. But this is the first year I've ever got trail camera pictures of him, so you know, uh, nope, never seen him. Man. So so what about the rest of your camera pool? Any other shooters? Oh? Yeah, I mean I got I got a handful of uh four year olds, five year olds, you know, up until these guys at the higher age range. But uh, you know it's over the years, I used to get really excited this time of year. Obviously the tjoil camera pictures are awesome to look at, but as we all know, getting trail camera pictures is the easy part. And I have two big things that play here. One is the September shift and the other is the harvest. Right, so when the crop, when the crop harvest, so when the you know, the velvet comes off, they all start jocking for position. There's a displacement, you know, the mature bucks all plan a stake in the ground and say this is mine, you know, they fight, and then they they all spread spread out. Then the crops come out. So any deer that are living in these crop fields or buffer strips, uh, they get de placed displaced as well. And then uh, I really don't know what bucks are consistent in that area until I'm gonna say mid October. Those are the ones that end up sticking around for the rug. Yep, yep, absolutely yeah. What percentage do you feel like of summer bucks end up sticking around during fall for you on that farm? Um, I'm gonna say probably one. That's it. That's it. Wow, there's I mean, I am in a spot where I mean I've sent either trail camera pictures of all these all these deer, they just feel very comfortable in the summertime hanging around this area. There's water, there's food, there's cover. Uh and a lot of it has to do with the standing corn. And then the second that goes away, it's just it's a different landscape. Yeah, and man, yeah, that's that's it makes Like you said, the summer trail camera pictures, I'm kind of like you. I used to get so so excited about them, and now I just give less and less credence to them because so many are gone during the season. I find for me it's more like only on most of the spots I hunt. Um. Further, what do you think about our Ohio property? I feel like down there it was it was more towards what Dan said. We would always get way more summer pictures like there, maybe one or two. Look, we might get like five r six mature bucks on camera during the summer or seven, but then like two to three maybe stick around for the seasons. That sounded all right, Yeah, that sounds about right. We get we get our hopes up a couple of big ones down there, and then we'd we'd maybe see one of those kind of hanging out throughout the year, um, and then we might get another one rolling you know, they might roll back through and November maybe the late season or something. But that that farm never really held many bucks, you know, there's more of a pass through farm. Yeah. Yeah, Dan, Do you remember the buck Um? It would have been probably the year that you and we did our trail camera picture contests in the summer and I got that buck that I called Junkyard. Do you remember him? He had like triple brow times on each side, crazy junk Um. Well, I ended up through Instagram someone recognized pictures of some of the deer that I was posting and said, hey, I hunt near there, and we end up chatting and he ended up knowing that that buck care it actually got hit crossing the road and was killed in by car. Yeah. So cool to know the story of that though, you know what I mean, Like a deer disappears and never comes back and you're like, man, I wonder whatever happened to that. Yeah, it was nice to get that kind of confirmation of what happened. And there was another one we're calling the Beast. I don't You might not remember that one, but it was the same year, I think, But just like super tall, just really really tall, impressive buck. Um, and he got killed by another hunter like a mile away. So it was kind of nice just to hear what happened to some of these deer. Unfortunately, most everything I heard was like, oh, yeah, that one got killed here, that one got killed by this guy, this one get hit by car. I killed that one. Um, so everyone else did a lot more killing men, Josh. But and I tell you, though, hey we did. We did all right right down there. We did, Yeah, we did. And I'll tell you this though, Um, I am really excited about one particular buck. I sent you as pictures via the phone, but I had a had a three year old. He could have been a four year old last year. I mean I never really got decent pictures of him. But he's back this year. Uh and he blew up, And um, I'm excited to see if he sticks around on the shift because I can I can see myself dedicating a season to wherever that box at. Describe that buck, and then why why would you dedicate the season him? Because it's I mean, it's a once in a lifetime, dear. Just from a number one, he meets the age class that I'm after and number two from a antler size, it's a no brainer. I mean, dear like this don't come along very often. So I'm looking at a picture here. I'm pretty sure this is the buck you're talking about. But but but described this for everyone listening. Um, and then last year, and I'll tell you how wrong you are so so last year, Um, he was a Maine him ten with long brow times. I'm probably gonna put him as a ten. I'd probably put him in the one fifties to low won sixties as a ten. This year he is all of that plus about. I think I counted probably about ten extra points this year. I think I counted maybe nineteen total scorable points. Um, his brow times are a foot long. I mean he's got he's got a palmated front end that has two drops off the front of it. And it's just it's a sick buck that. Yeah. I get, I get big deer on trail camera every single year, but not this big. And I don't know if it's just one of these things where I've been successful the last two years and I I'm okay, where if if he is consistently on trail camera, paying attention and putting effort into that particular deer. Yeah, yeah, I mean, I'm right there with you too, obviously, as people know, I've I've been a sucker for trying to get after a specific buck. But this deer, I mean, to your point, he definitely qualifies as as unique. I mean, like you said, he's got to drop times off the left main beam, and that left main beam is like a club. And then it looks like he's got a sticker off his left side G two in addition to those drops, and on the right hand side main beam on his G two. I think I'm seeing like a triple split. Is that right? Uh yeah? And then he's got a bunch of stickers on the bases and then like you said, the brow times are each like twelve inches straight up. I mean, it's a an insane looking deer. Are people are other people to wear this? Dear Dan? You know, Um, the crazy part about this is that this buck hangs out on I'm guessing a different property that nobody can hunt for a majority of the time, but only comes out comes around every once in a while to a part of the farm that typically doesn't get any um, doesn't get any action because of the road. It's near a house. Uh, and it's kind of in a just an awkward place. It's just a people you know. It's one of those places of Spencer where people would probably walk by it and say there's nothing in there, just because of you know, of what they are seeing from the road. However, you take ten steps inside of it and it's some of the thickest, nastiest ship on the entire property. So I mean it holds. It holds a good dope dough group. So you know, late October, when I start checking my trail cameras, anything's possible. You know. Now you said he had pictures of him last year, where any of those during the season. Was he a buck that stuck around for the season. Yes, he came through he is he right away October. I had some early daylight early like first of October. I had some early season pick of him. I had him in a pinch point, one of my favorite pinch points to hunt on the farm a couple of times in mid October. I'm talking like the tenth and eleventh at day during daylight. So, um, if I get the opportunity to and the winds right on those specific dates, I might be hunting a big deer during the October lowell. Uh, so we'll see that's exciting, although that doesn't exist right the what we'll call it the quote unquote October low Yeah, Um, are you are you calling this deer or anything? How do we know this deer when you talk about him? Or is it just that one big deer? Um? Like, I think I'm gonna call him Narlie Charlie, Arlie, Charlie, Charley, Charlie dude. And I got that idea off of Scooby Doo episode that I was watching the other day with my kids. Nice, what about what about the other old ones? So we got dork, we got Narlie Charlie. What was the other one? Do you have any No? Man, I didn't give him a name because this is the first year of trail camera pictures other than the sheds that I found five years ago. So no name for him. Okay, if you'll, if you'll allow it, I'd like Spencer to name that buck o. Can you allow that? Yeah, Spencer, I will allow it, but you have to do it right now, right now? Which which one is this? Again? He's in eleven. He's a six by six by five Um. Now, I know in the past there was a buck named Mark Kenyon. Is that buck dead alive? What's his status? I'm gonna have to go with dead dead. Okay, well let's make this one Mark Kenyon too, then Mark Kenyon two Kenyan two? Yeah? Is that does that work? No? It doesn't Mark Mark Kenyon had his opportunity on my farm. Okay, that's true. I do think the sheds, which is pretty much Why don't I just name it Spencer? Yeah? That works too? Like that I didn't. I know it's not your idea, but furger further, I'll let you be the judge. What do you think? Well, I mean, Spencer is definitely better than Mark Kenyan two. Yeah, all right. So Dan's after the dork, he's after Narlie Charlie, and he's after Spencer. That's good. Free Spencer. I'm flattered. Um, so you check your cameras. Are you doing anything major between now and September before it's all said done? Dan? Because I know you're like me, you usually stay out of there the month of September. Um, So any final things you're taking care of these next like two weeks other than getting in shape, you know, continuing the prep for elk season my white tail. Everything in the white Tail was is pretty much set until I start hunting. Did you do any other stand work when you're checking those cameras? The other day, I set up I did some micromanagement to one of my favorite hunting locations, which was, like, it's where I'm I had an encounter with a big eight where my arrow hit the branch last year. So I moved that stand location ten yards and then set up my stand and re recut all my shooting lanes. Um. And that's the only stand I really have up right now. The rest will be set up when I go in or sometime after my elk hunt. But there those are like pinch point type hunts where I'm not gonna be inter interrupting any betting or anything. Real. If I if I can go in there and set it up on a north wind or a south wind, I'll be good to go. Uh And I'll do that, But if it doesn't happen, I'll just set him set him up during the season. Yeah. Do you ever go in and just like prep trees without hanging a stand, but prepping area so that if you do want to hunt there, you know, like Jhnny ro does this a lot. He just preps like fifty trees, doesn't hang any stands, but he has a bunch like trimmed out stuff he wants to hunt there he can just shim me up in his saddle or something. He thought about doing that at all. Oh, I have. I've done that in the past, and actually I did it last year as well. So, I mean, I have lots of trees prepped ready to go for the upcoming season. It's just, you know, I find myself never using those trees because I'm always micromanaging my stand locations. Right, Like I did, uh two weekends ago, Right, I had an entire set cut out, but I had this feeling that I needed to be ten yards on this other tree, and that's what I did. So I recut everything and hopefully that's a better staying location than the than the previous one. Yeah. Uh, further and Spencer, both of you guys have listened to many, possibly most of like our past episodes over the last like two or three or four years. Would you guys agree with that? Yeah? Yeah, probably? Okay, what is this past? Yeah, that's that's what this thing is. Um Okay, I did not I did not listen to the one about raising outdoor kids. I actually go in weekly to the podcast and write bad reviews asking you guys to not talk about outdoor kids. That's him. Oh, now we know who it is, Dan Man. I hope, I hope your wife gets pregnant. Okay, So my question though, for you too. Since you've listened to most of these episodes except for the kid related ones, you've heard Dan talk about his hunting seasons, both what he's done leading up to them and what he's done during the season for now like three or four years, so you've heard what he's been doing, how he's been preparing for all that kind of stuff. Um. Last summer, we had a guy named Joe Elsinger on the podcast, and he was another guy who had listened to a lot of the past episodes, so he was really familiar with what me and Dan do and he gave each of us like a piece of advice or like he kind of say, Okay, based on what I know about how you've hund in the past, this is the one thing I would recommend you think about this year. And I really like that. It's kind of interesting because because people that listen to me and Dan talk, you know, every week over the years. They kind of had this idea of what we're doing, and they've they've kind of heard us talk through all these things, heard about our mistakes, blah blah blah blah blah. So I'm curious for the two of you, based off what you know about Dan, what he's done in the past, and what he's told you so far right now, about how he's preparing for this year. I'll start with you, Spencer. Do you have any one suggestion for Dan for this year or piece of advice or mistake he should avoid based on what you know about him and what he does. Um, I don't think I have anything like that. One thing I've never heard Dan talk about is, Um, I believe these properties you haunt our shared properties, And I guess I don't know what your relationship is with those other hunters, if you're aware of like what their standards are or is that correct that you haunt some shared properties? Yeah? All the property that I hunt is shared. Yeah, Like, are you aware of what they're doing when they're doing it? Um, what they're after stuff like that. Yeah, I communicate with them before the season. Is I mean they take a week. They have a week long vacation that they take, uh, and you know they go after they're on the same property the you know, one of the weeks that I'm there as well, So I just try to stay away from them. Uh. We don't necessarily talk about strategy. UM. We talk about UM. We may talk about it after the season about what bucks are are aware and um, but nothing like if I was sharing a property with like one of my really good friends or uh my brother or something like that. You know what I mean, We're not exchanging information, if that makes sense, right. Yeah. I was just curious what your relationship is with those guys, if you think that could be something that changes for you in the future, because I haunt shared properties as well, and uh, I guess my communication with those other hunters is even less than that almost. Um. You know it's uh, it can be a problem at times, like we both show up there and then you look at each other and uh, you know, I have to make an awkward decision then. So yeah, um, yeah, I mean I've I've I've been there. I mean I've We've gotten to the point now where we kind of each have our own locations, our own kind of areas. Um, they only overlap overlap a little bit, but they're they're less mobile than I am, and uh, I'm you know, I'm okay with where they hunt. I stay out of their areas, they stay out of mind. I'm that guy who likes to go in and deep and be mobile, and they're kind of you know, hey, let's wait for the last thirty minutes of light to um. You know, they hunt closer to the field edges and all that stuff. So, uh, I don't know, it's like our our strap. We're after the same deer because they have trail cameras out too. However, they they hunt a different style than me, so we're not necessarily overlapping. The only the only problem I ever can I can ever see is maybe if I set up somewhere and they set up somewhere, not necessarily in the relative area, but either my scent stream is ruining where they're at or their scent stream is ruining where I'm at. The deer are coming through one of those scent streams to get to where they're set up. So, but you know, we're both friendly with each other. It's not like, uh, I don't know, it's not cutthroat, I'll put it that way. What about this situation though, based on what you know about where this person hunts or these people typically hunt, would you like access a property or set up in a property, or set up in a spot where you knew, Well, yeah, when I head in to hunt this spot, I'm gonna have to blow my wind right through where he typically is. But it's gonna be good for me. But I know it's gonna screw his stuff, his area or something like that. Or would you say I don't want to screw that up for him? Um, that's a great question because I'm typically the first one on the farm every morning, so I don't really have to deal with that. So you just don't even know. Yeah, I just don't know if they are there. Um, I typically am not running through the same Like again, my tree stand locations are a little bit different than where their their tree stands are. And um, I mean, if it came down to it, and I was let's say I had an encounter the past two days and I was making in a big move to go in after a deer that I felt I had pegged. I mean, man, I'm I'm gonna do what I gotta deal. I mean, would you go into the area that he traditionally hunts? Um, maybe if you know, if I knew he wasn't there, I flank you know, I'm I flank these guys a lot too, right, So they they will they have their tree stand locations, and then if I see the deer working around their history, you know, because they have ladder stands there there, right, and so I will move based off of maybe where they're at, or set up where they're at. So I'm using them almost like a pinch point, right, So I know the deer funneling around maybe the stand location, I might I might set up down wind of them, or even further down wind to them, or or you know, kind of quartered away from them. So yeah, I'm mean I'm gonna, I'm gonna. I'm gonna go out there and hunt to my best ability. And yes, i'll probably be uh you know, I'm not gonna go in and purposely ruin any hunts. But if i'm if I'm if I got a deer pegged, I'm gonna go in and I'm gonna try to set up on that deer. Yeah, yeah, you gotta do that. Yeah, so you you talked about these three bucks that we've already talked about since we last chatted. I know you kind of expressed a little bit you said, this might be the kind of season where you focus on one deer or these three deer. How wi we're how is that evolved over the last month now that you've got Narlie. Charlie like, how serious are about that? Or is it gonna be You're gonna shoot a four year old. I'm gonna approach every season like I always do. This season like I always do, and that is check out the trail cameras when it you know, like I'm gonna get to the farm the first evening and I'm gonna go check all my trail cameras, the ones that won't be intrusive. I'm gonna make a decision on what's showing up. And then from there it's, uh, you start going in and you start putting the pieces of the puzzle together, and you start collecting data. And if I see a deer showing up on trail camera, uh say at nighttime, I'm gonna bump in further down wherever and maybe I can get eyes on him, or maybe I can go in and set up another trail camera or you know, oh this big scrape opened up, let's put a trail camera over it. Um, you know there's a lot I can't I can't say right now because September shift, the harvest and deer not showing up on trail camera. I mean that's a big thing. So I have to use whatever I can to make moves and if I'm not gonna waste my time chasing a deer, that quote unquote doesn't exist. Yeah, Josh, do you have any suggestion, advice, uh thing for Dan based on your historical knowledge of him? Because Dan has annual patterns? You know he doesn't He's got annual patterns every year. If you check his trail cameras, he's doing the same thing basically. So do you got anything for him? He kind of answered one of my questions. I was gonna ask him, if you know, being on a property where he shares, does he ever use the other guys as you to dictate what he's gonna do? Um, So he kind of answered that. But then he's probably not gonna like me very much about this one. But Dan, have you sat all day yet? No? Well, then that would be that would be something maybe to consider a November to check this out further. I have made steps to that. Okay, I bought a pair of hip waiters. I got I'm getting a pair of hip waiters. I'll have it before the hunting season starts. This will allow me to access my property via back door. And now I feel that if I can come into the property from the back end, well, all the pressure in the mornings comes from the front end. I'm going to catch these dear naturally coming back to their bedding areas. And that might be the kind of all day set type of scenario that sounds good. Now, what about all this leg work you've been doing in preparation with your elk hunts? Is that helping your knees at all? Oh? Dude, I've lost ten pounds. I'm actually feeling better. My back feels better. Um, I've been working out more. I've been doing like less like meathead weights and like like. I've become friends with the rowing machine. I've been running on a treadmill. Um, I've been changing my diet. Uh, and I feel good. However, I said that about our Idaho trip that we went on. We all know how that turned out. I think you've got the right stuff of mine though, Like you said, I think you were just trying to impress me with your packs last time, and uh think now you've got the right stuff in mind. Yep, me trying to impress you with my own body. I had to share a tent with another man again last week and it reminded me of you and me I had to tell him that story. Um, but I bought a bigger tent now, so it's it's much It's much more in line with the tent you had now that I've got a family of three. So yeah, man, um, alright, let's take a quick break to think our partners at Onyx and they are the producers of the Onyx Hunt app, which is INSTEADY use on my mobile phone. You know, just last week, for example, I was driving around in the evening scouting some back roads looking for velvet bucks, and I ended up getting eyes on a really nice, dear, really big tall eight pointer with with like seven eight nine inch prow times. And after I saw that buck, I was curious about two different things. Number one, I wanted to know who owned that property, and I was actually able to see that on my Onyx Hunt app. And then number two, I wondered how far away this dear is from a property that I already could hunt well. On the Onyx hunt app, there's a tool that allows you to measure distances, so I pulled that up and saw this deer was actually only three quarters of a mile away from a spotic and hunt. So that was really encouraging because that that definitely puts them within range at least for like a rut cruising kind of situation. So that was exciting. But if you're not familiar, Onyx has got also of other layers and tools as full topo and aerial map layers UM. It also has private property information, public land borders, things such as current wildfires, UM layers that show recent timber cuts. Most recently, I saw they've got a partnership now with the q D MAY where they are showing a layer that will actually outline where CWD is present, which is an important thing to know for testing purposes. So this is all really good and helpful stuff. And if you would like to learn more about Onyx, you can visit onyx maps dot com or search for Onyx on your favorite mobile app store. And if you want to get off your purchase, you can use promo code wired that's w I R E D to get off. What do you think, Spencer about UM about your season? Have you been You have put out some summer trial cameras, I've I have seen a little bit of that. What's the story there? Uh So my summer strategy and summer plans drastically changed a few months ago, UM because South Dakota change their archery opener from the third Saturday in September, which would land anywhere from like, I don't know, mid twenties of September, they changed that to September one. And so that has been a huge change for me because typically in the past, nothing that I would do in June, July, August mattered because those bucks that I would scout or get to know um or pattern would not be they'd be foreign to me come the end of September, and then ultimately October and November it didn't matter. So this year has been different because I'll have a chance that some of those deer um that I've been watching in July and now August. So you know, if we're talking about goals, like what my goal is this year, I would love to shoot a velvet buck and so I've been doing everything in preparation for that, um, getting my stands set up for uh, you know, September one through ten. If I was hunting those days, Um, you know, this is where I would want that stand, even if it's not going to be very good come November or whatever. UM. I've been setting my cameras up that same way. I've been scouting areas that are you know, going to work come September one as well. And and that's my goal I have. You know, I would say probably about ten days before or most of the dear lose velvet or starting to lose velvet, and so looking at my schedule, I'll likely get like nine of those first ten evenings to hunt. And my hope is to get a mature velvet buck. Dan, I think we've talked about this for but would you would you have interest in targeting a velvet buck specifically? Man, I don't know, it's like this time in my life. UM. Maybe it just depends on the circumstance, right, because I would like to not shoot a velvet buck. But however, it depends on the trip, right. If I'm going to South Dakota on the first week of September and that's when I have the trip planned. Well, I may encounter one and I better be prepared to shoot a velvet buck or like, uh, these guys who are going out to the high country from mule deer, right, so a lot of them are successful before the weather kind of comes in and shifts some off of wherever it is that they're living. So yeah, I don't oh you and I it would have to be a game time decision, what about you? Further, I don't know. I don't really have I don't really have this like a goal to go shoot a velvet buck, but it'd be cool. Um, I guess if I'm doing North Dakota, I guess I wasn't really even thinking about that. Just I'm hunted in September at all for white tails. So I guess I need to totally ramp up my game if I'm gonna do that and be ready for that eight spencer. I got a question for you I talked about I talked about in Iowa. We have this shift right as soon as they come out of velvet their patterns changed. Were you hunt, do you notice a shift in September as well, and you think that by them moving that season date up, you're gonna be able to still catch them on their summer pattern. Yeah. Absolutely, And that's why I said that, Um, in the past, you know, nothing that I would do in August would be relevant become like September only fourth or whatever. Um. I would say, definitely, once you hit like that September fifteenth time, UM, you know your your bachelor groups are broken up, the velvet comes off, a lot of bucks go nocturnal, and just things change, um. And I would say that there's um a few times where I haunt that the deck gets reshuffled with as far as what the deer doing and what deer around. And I would say that's one of them. Mid September. UM. For us being the pheasant capital of the world. Once pheasant season opens, that changes a lot of things as far as where deer bedding. Um. And so that's another time that the deck gets reshuffled. Everything that I haunt is is egg country. These properties are not managed for deer or the farmers are not even thinking about deer when they're doing things. And so it happens again when crop gets harvested or when cattle get moved out of a pasture into a feed lot, and that's usually like end of October, beginning in November, and then the rout that happens gain you, you lose dear game deer. And then um, once we get into December and things get really cold and snow was on the ground. Uh that's one of the biggest shifts as well that we have because Uh, like I said, properties where I'm at aren't managed for deer, and so the food sources can become kind of limited in the deer really congregating some specific areas. So given that's the case, Spencer, Um, you're gonna get this, like you mentioned, you're gonna get this early September time from you can finally take advantage of opening days, like just two weeks away. Um, what's your game plan? What do you have in place? Do you do you have a buck picked out? Do you think you've got one patterned already? Tell me about how you're gonna get it done. So I threw up some cameras in June and I've been checking on every I don't know, two to three weeks since then and July kind of through the beginning of August. Um, I was the most confident I've ever been on a buck. I have a big five by five that I would say is maybe in the one sixties. Um. That that I was very confident as to where he was betting, where he was feeding, where he was entering the field, and how do you that kind of thing, um, just by what I was. I've seen him in person one time, how he entered the field, and my trail camera he was becoming. Uh it was almost redundant, like he would be there every third day, the last thirty minutes to daylight. And that went on for like three weeks. Um. So I felt really confident about that deer. But in my last card pool he's there even last sometimes at night. UM. So that's a buck that I was probably over confident on. But with two weeks to go yet, it could change where you know, all of a sudden, I'm I'm seeing him a bunch again. But as far as my strategy, UM, I'm gonna be safe. I don't want to mess anything up trying to get a velvet buck that that's going to kick a deer out of some betting area. Um, you know that would typically hold him all the way through November or whatever. So it's uh, pretty typical early season setups, um, field edges, overlooking beans, um, and just planning on evening hunts. I got a question for you in regards to the egg there right when I think of and I don't know the terrain that you hunt in, but it sounds like it's heavy into the egg. Um. Is there like a main timber or is it just kind of like waterways and um uh fans cross fence rows were these deer bedding? So it's it's fairly sporadic. Um. South Dakota I believe is out of the fifty states in tree coverage. UM. So I think it's either Nebraska. North Dakota has the least amount of trees per square mile and and work second to last. UM. So we don't have a lot of timber. A lot of these d or do end up betting in low spots and bean fields where there's uh some crper you know, a slew or a dry slew. But then we also have like shelter belts around you know, cattle yards where deal with bed and then creek bottoms. Anything that has trees, UM is almost guaranteed to have deer because we have so few trees. Yeah, so the egg is a huge I mean once that egg comes out, is there a big shift. Yeah, yeah, that that's a big one for sure. Um, you know, losing corner beans is huge, and then moving cattle around is big too. I have some properties that I have UM permission to hunt, but they have cattle on them all the way through you know, the end of October or beginning in November. And it's the prettiest country that we have in this area. But the problem is that it gets grazed down into where it looks like a golf course, and uh, the deer just kind of avoid the cattle and and you know, or some place else, and they will move in until like mid November. So the trees are super important. And even those areas that are overrun with cattle, as soon as those cattle are out, we'll see dear move in alright. So the question I have then is with the inevitable shift of crops coming out and you you hunting now this first first week of September, what is stopping you from being aggressive on you know, during that first week of September, knowing that you know, as soon as that crops come out, it's going to change everything. Well, the harvest here can change. You know every year. Some years it's mid November, other years it's early in November. And so I feel like if I was super aggressive, I'm then giving up, you know, like two months of of hunting on pressured deer. If all of a sudden I'm pressuring these deer on like September one, I might not have a chance at them. You know. Ever again this season where if I'm playing it safe and uh, you know, hunting these field edges where I'm I'm guaranteed not to bump anything. Those are dear, I'll continue to see and I can get more familiar with at least until those crops come out sometime in late October at the beginning of November. Got it? You know that buck you killed last year, Spencer um? Which one? Oh man? Yeah? Sorry, you killed about twelve of them last year, the big one, the really big one you killed in South Dakota. I'm sorry for that. Yeah, that was a dick move, um um, did you? Because I remember that was kind of a surprise, if I if I remember correct, I was a little bit of a surprise for you. That buck kind of came out of nowhere. Did you learn anything from that hunt or that deer or that experience that you're gonna apply this year. So would I would contribute me killing that deer. Two that it was totally unpressured that buck. I got married last summer and we moved into a different house and so that ate up a lot of what would be my summer scouting and prep time and stuff, and so that was an area that was largely untouched by me. Um And so I think that deer was really comfortable. But as far as applying that to this year, the biggest change is that last year it was corn and this year it's beings. And that particular spot there's some roads around um and there's traffic in that area, and so what changes when it goes from being beans to corn. When it's corn, um, you know, that's a twelve foot wall basically between those deer in that road, and they're so well insulated that nothing on nothing bothers them then, and so when it's all of a sudden beans, Uh, it's a lot tougher to make those deer comfortable in that field. And so yeah, I'm kind of doing the same thing where I'm staying out of the areas where those bucks would be betting but at the same time, it's it's not going to be as great because of having the beans now instead of corn. Gotcha, gotcha. So so you mentioned this one big five by five that you thought you had pegged. Um, first off, I think it's funny that you call it a five by five. Um, this is a white tail podcast man, that's a ten pointer. Uh. And uh number two, were there any Are there any other mature bucks on your radar that you've either seen or got camera. Is there anything else that you might be hoping to get eyes on early in season? Uh? There are a few other deer on my radar, um, but nothing as consistent or as big as this buck. Um. I have a feeling if I'm gonna kill a deer in those first ten days, it's going to be this one. I don't have many other mature deer that are um showing themselves a lot or in areas that I want to be hunting in early September. So Uh, to answer your question, I think, if I'm successful, it's going to be this big five by five. And what are we gonna know this book? As? Um? That's that's something I was so bad at naming Dan's dear because I don't name dear. I always to me that like that adds some extra pressure. If I'm naming this dear, then it feels like I have to get him, or like I'm after that book, or or if you know, I have some buddies that name dear, and then it's like implied that they're actually hunting that deer when reality they've only seen that book like once on trail camera during the rout in the middle of the night. And so I've always been very hesitant to add dear because I feel like it adds some extra pressure. Like I'm looking at my my trail camera inventory right now, and I'll tell you what these files are labeled as. I have big ten, no brows eight small, split G two young tall eight young ten young split raw young straight eight. So you you you could have a show on the Outdoor Network with that one. So the creativity you've got there's inspiring, right. Um So this Buck's pictures are living in a folder called big ten. Okay, So I really like the idea of putting more pressure on you and making you feel uncomfortable. Um so so hot, Dan, I'm gonna have you named this buck and Spencer. You don't need to know this buck as this name, but the rest of us will. Okay, what do you got, dam You couldn't even you couldn't name it Dan damn. Yeah, give me an estimated score on him? What do you think I would say? Like? Okay, how old? Um? I'm not familiar with this year. My best guest would be five and a half. And he's very wide too, right yeah yeah you uh, he's wide and he is almost perfectly symmetrical, but he has a split brow on one side. Okay, what's your favorite movie of all time? Forrest Gump? Okay, there it is, Bubba. No, that's dumb, don't I God, I'm so sorry I even said that. Just name it, just just name it Forest. Okay, god it, I'm I'm changing the name of the file right now, perfect Forrest. I was hoping you're gonna say Jenny, Jenny Forest. That will be good? All right? Um? Now, Spencier, You've got a whole slew of other trips though, right where else? What else are you doing? As far as hunts? This here? So South Dakota is fairly liberal with their tags, and so right now I'm sitting at for South Dakota Buck tags, um, and I'm in line to maybe draw one or two more. We'll see. There's still some applications to be processed. UM knows all white tail? Uh? It varies, And so I gotta think about this. The two archery tags I have are labeled as any deer, so this could be a white tail or meal deer, but primarily where I haunted white tails. So it would be a shock to me if I were to put an archery tag on a mule deer. But I have that option, um. And then I got to think. One of my rifle tags is also in any deer tag, but again, there aren't any mule deer around. I've seen one in like the last five years. And then my other tag isn't any white tail tag, and that is in an area that's probably about fifty fifty mule deer white tail. So if if I don't get any other tags, and uh, I were to fill these four my guesses, they would all be white tails. Do you have any Do I have a preference? Yeah, Like if you were in an area and you could shoot a mule deer or a white tail, and what would you be like hedging towards one or the other. I've shot quite a few white tails at this point, and and not as many mule deer that I would probably prefer a mutle deer. But at the same time, like a lot of people keep telling me, like, you know what tail hunting is it enough? Pretty soon you're gonna want to elk count You're gonna want to mule deer hunt and bear hunting all that stuff. But I have not gotten to that point yet. I am so happy like shooting a hunter and forty in white tail that I uh, I would have a hard time passing one for a chance at a mutle deer. Yeah, what we're gonna sit down. Is that the same for nonresidents? Can they get two tags too? Or is that just for residents? Yes? Uh, South Dakota tags are guaranteed for non residents. It's not a true over the counter system where like you would drive to some gas station and buy your tag um once you've got in the state. That that's not how it works. You have to apply online, but you're guaranteed the tag. But as a non resident, you can get a tag that's good for the east side of the Missouri River and the west side of the Missouri River. The Missouri River cuts the state in half. UM. On the east side of the Missouri River, it's probably white tail. There are some mule deer along the Missouri River. On the west side of the Missouri River, it's probably, uh, white tails. Mule deer got you interesting, a lot of opportunities there down, don't come. Don't come. You've you've done a very poor job of hiding the success that you've been having out there. So secrets out, Spencer. What's so where else though? You? I know you're going to some other places, right, Okay, So I force South Dakota tags that will lead up most of my time UM, and then I have some openingvites to like come on Kentucky or Oklahoma that I might do. But for the most part, Uh, I'll be focusing on on South Dakota. I should draw rightful analog tag. I'm gonna go archery animalo hunting this weekend, um, and then I'm also going to be applying for bison tag. So there's a good chance that I don't leave the state. UM, but I'll still be busy. You gotta tell us about the bison. I know you told me about this like last week over the phone or something, but tell us what the deals of that hunt. So we have I believe it's like the the third largest wild or third largest publicly owned bison population in Custer State Park that's at the like the foothills of the Black Hills in the western part of the state. And they give out like fifty tags each year. It might be less than that, maybe it's like thirty. I don't remember. Um, but uh, getting a tag isn't isn't super hard. You're able to draw sometimes with like four or five points. So once you do draw, you have a certain amount of days that you are allowed to go haunt at like the end of October, and your your tag can fall into like two categories non trophy bison or trophy bison. And so because of the cost, I would be getting the non trophy bison tag. Um. And when you get out there, you have to have a biologist with you that approves of you, you know, taking a shot at or harvesting uh a specific bison. So that's what would be And because these things are in a state park, UM, they're not super wild. Like it'll honestly probably be one of the easier hunts that I would ever do. It would just be special because it is bison, and I would probably try it with my bow. What differentiates this trophy versus non trophy classification? I think age structure. So I think the bi elogists there are very familiar with what you know, an older bison looks like versus younger bison. And so I think you're going off the width of their horns. Are they called horns on a bison? Right? Yeah? So I think you're going off the width of that. Or maybe if there's like a a younger male that's problematic, that he's you know, running off a bunch of females or something that they would have you try to get that one or whatever it might be that I'm not super familiar with. I just know it would be a smaller bison. So you draw a bison tag. It's sometime in that last part of October. What happens if it's the like the night before your bison hunt and you happen to check your trailcra picture and you see that forest is moving in daylight, uh, and you've got the perfect wind and conditions the next day cold front, you know, the winds just where you want it. Maybe a high bear metric pressure, whatever it is you like, whatever your flavor is. Um, would you still go on the bison hunt because you got that tag and it's the special hunt? Or do you say, right, I gotta put that hold because Forest is ready to go. Now, I would go on the bison hunt for sure, But I've made that mistake in the past where I've you know, it's been approaching the rotten like a deer, just slowly been showing up closer to daylight. And then I go chasing a different tag that I have in a different part of the state or something, and I come back and I had multiple missed opportunities or a missed opportunity. Um, that's something that I considered with other tags I have, but that wouldn't be the case with the bison tag. Yeah, Um, Dan, do you have Now this isn't this isn't quite as applicable. But given what you know about Spencer, other than telling him that he should have kids, do you have any recommendations for him this season? That's Joe, dude, don't have kids? Are you kidding me? No? I don't. I mean, I can't. I can't give him a vice, man, I don't. I don't know. The only thing I would say is, don't be afraid if you feel there's gonna be a shift coming, don't be afraid to get aggressive on a couple of those early season hunts. Um. You know, maybe even if it has to be like a quicker running gun inside a timber line to catch him maybe a little bit before daylight. I don't know, that's just I guess that's just what I would try to do. If I had a deer coming out on a field edge and it's a little bit past dark, I'd probably be a little bit more aggressive and bump into maybe a stage area or a first kind of pinch point between where you think he's betting. All given the correct wind direction, of course, so you probably do. I'm assuming a lot of your hunt adjustments, Spencer. Is it more observation based than trail camera base? Just because the fact there is so little timber that you can just see much farther was that? Would you say that's accurate? Yes? I would say that if I'm moving a stand location mid season or something, it's because I was hunting a different stand and you know, saw a buck using a different trail or in a different area. Um, I I don't get a ton of relevant information from my trail camera. So yeah, I would say that it's mostly observation based. I love hunting places like that where you can see far because number one, it's it's a huge just tool. Just being able to observe from a distance is so helpful. And that's a harder thing to do here in place like Michigan with so much timber um in flat land, there's just not a whole lot of great observation points. But I love going to places, you know, like out west, where you can see so much further like that. I mean, that's just fun. It's just fun to be able to see deer, lots of deer, and observe that movement, even if it's out of shooting range. That's just that's just a cool. So I'm jealous of you from that perspective. Um, And on that front talking about hunting these big, wide open places, Um, further, are you hunting North Coota this year? Is that actually gonna happen? We'll see. I gotta make my mind up here real quick. I'm I'm probably gonna make my decision here this week. And uh, I got some things I gotta work around with work, see if I can get those rearranged. But I think if I can do that, I'm gonna I'm gonna give it a go. It's two weeks a week, I know it's two weeks away, so I'll probably be out there. I don't think I'm gonna be able to get out there the first, um September one. I gotta look at a calendar here real quick, if you'll pull up, I think I'm gonna try to get out there like that Tuesday. So like the fourth, September four. How long are you gonna be a budget to it? Probably a week, probably a wee probably till the eleventh. So here's here's my dilemma that I'm torn between. Is that my original plan was to go to Montana for well then you know, actually, now that you just told me that, that makes this decision much easier for me, Um, because I was if you were going to go there for opening Day in North Dakota, I was seriously considering joining you there just because it'd be fun to be hunting together for a few days and then hopefully fill a tag in you know, three or four or five days, and then still have time to go to Montana. But if you're not going to be there to the fourth anyways, I'm just gonna go Montana first and hope that I can get it done there, and then maybe by the time I get it done, you know, you'll be just arriving or only starting there, so that could work. Um, what are you gonna be How long are you gonna be out there for? I have from like September one through the tenth that I've kind of budgeted for those that hunt Montana hunt, and then you know, now that you're going to Dakota, I'm gonna try to make it happen, make it work, to sneak over there too. Um. So have you been have you been thinking about anymore? Have you thought through have you looked at any more maps? Because I'm yeah, I've been. I've been looking at it on not ex I've just been looking at that stuff a lot here and out there, just trying to figure out some places. I got a pretty good idea of where I want to go, where I'm going to stay in camp and all that good stuff. Um, and then some of it's just gonna be get out there. I'll probably I'm probably not going to hunt the mornings. Um, just use that time to do a little scouting or do some glassing and see what I can, you know, see what I can figure out where they're, where they're going, where they're coming from, and then try to set up on them in the afternoon and kind of do a little bit driving around out there and kind of ground tooth and the stuff that we weren't able to get to um when out and shed hunted. Yeah, you um see here and me mobile here and be kind of running down and right, didn't you You've kind of put together a new mobile set up this year, isn't that right? A little bit? Um, I'm just kind of tweaking up from what I had. But I was just so sick of like carrying sticks on the bottom of my backpack and making all sorts of noise and they never stayed together. So I got some of those, um got what they call the talents mark, is that what they're called? Yeah, So I got those. Are gonna strap them on the back of my tree stand. Hopefully, well we'll be a little bit easier. I was talking about maybe thinking about maybe getting some like individual steps and just be a little bit more lightweight. But then I got to thinking, I don't feel like strapping up ten or twelve steps every every time I'm going in. And um, I've got the muddy sticks with the kind of the rope attachment system that I really like. They're quiet, they're they're easy to use, um, but they're just a little clunky getting it out. So I'm hoping those stick talents will will work, um well for what I want. And uh, I've got a I got a new tree stand last year. I got the xop Vanish I think it's called. UM. Really like that really comfortable, really light, easy to get in and out and up in the tree. Um. So I'm just trying to fine tune that and I think I'm think I'm where I want to be. But then you got me thinking about trying to harness a couple of weeks ago when you had that podcast talking about the harness stuff. So now I'm toying around with that. So I'm probably just gonna stick with the tree stand. But man, the saddle stuff is really intriguing. Yeah, I still haven't gotten mine, so I'm hoping i'll have I'll have one of them in time for that hunt. But it is really very intriguing option. Um, So what are you thinking for that hunt? What's your what's your what's your goal there? What are you gonna shoot? Anything that would be remotely mature? I mean, I'd love to kill a three and a half year old. Um, that's kind of it's kind of my goal anywhere I go. Really, I mean, I try not to differentiate it too much from from where I'm at, But you know, if I get out there and there's just an abundant amount of those three and a half year olds, maybe I'll try to be a little bit more selective. But if I'm spending the time to drive all the way out there, and and I don't want to, I don't want to kill the first thing I see, but I don't want to. I don't want to be too picky and then go with an unfilled tag. Um, if there's anything that remotely makes me happy, I'm gonna I'm gonna try to make it happen. So you'd shoot? Would you shoot? Let let's say it's like a really kind of like average run of the mill, three and a half year old buck. You see the very first night you're out, you're out there, you're like an hour in and like like a nice buck, I oh it's a nice buck. Definitely. A three year old comes walking by, he's at twenty five yards, you're gonna shoot him right away? Or do You're like, you gotta see what else is out here. You've only been here an hour. Yeah, No, that's that's that's a that's a conundrum I would face. I probably would not shoot that buck the first night. Um, if we're like, but then that's the old adage, you know, don't pass the don't pass the deer the first day that you kill on the last day. So this is North Dakota right further Yeah, right, so can other tag I don't know. Um, I probably would only get one if I did, you know, I probably only do one. Um if you can even get a second teg, I don't know. I don't know that. I don't know the answer to that. But man, we found some nice just like really quality sheds water out there, so I think I have a decent idea of what's running out running around out there. Um. So if it was something that was like whoa, Okay, that that looks like a real nice you know, first night, I probably would pull the trigger. Um. But if it was just kind of like ah, if if I questioned at all, I wouldn't. I don't know if that gives you a real straight answer, because I don't even know if I know. But um, it just had to be a heat of the moment kind of thing. I think. Now, what if you've got to no questions to ask? Like nice buck? Definitely three, maybe four? Um, he's in front of you, but then the drop time buck is a hundred yards behind him, but heading your way. Do you take the Yeah, nice buck, that's a sure thing. Or do you wait and see if the draft time or will come by. Where are we at during the week, Uh, we'll say we're middle of the week exactly, dead center. Oh man, you and your scenarios you did, Yeah, shoot the one that was in front of me, and shoot the one that was in front of me. Is that the right call, Spencer? Uh? Yeah, I shoot that one. If you're out of state public land like that, for sure, you shoot that buck. You get out of your tree stand, you go scare the ship out of that buck so he goes. Not turn the rest of the year market on your map and go hunt him the next year. It sounds like a good plan, Dan, I thought you were gonna say scare the ship off any deer that are near marks stand. I can see that happening too. Um. Yeah, man, that's gonna be a really cool hunt. I'm yeah. In a perfect world, I'll finish off Montana in like four or five days and meet you there right in time. And Um, like you said, we did see good sign and I think there's some promise there, so for sure the rest of you go ahead, Spencer. Will your standards change? Maybe you already answered this, but will your standards change like the last one or two days of that hunt? Would you then shoot like a two and a half year old if it came out? I probably wouldn't. Probably wouldn't shoot a younger, dear, Um if I if I think he's three and a half, i'd shoot him. I probably wouldn't shoot a young deer just to fill a tag. Um. Um, I don't know. I don't. I haven't really even thought about that. Um, that's a good question. Who is that damn that asset? Yeah, I'll have to think about that one. If I just wanted to fill my tag with the dough, and again, I have to look at the regulations see if I could even do that. Um, you know, I'm not sure those honestate hunts. So it's always the last five minutes of the last night when the big boy rose through. Well that's how that's how it happens on TV anyway, And everything on TV is reality, Josh exactly. So I probably would not shoot a dough Dan, I probably wouldn't shoot a do out there. I'm hoping to kill a couple of dolls in Michigan this year. Um, I don't think I shoot a dough out there. The rest of your season, Josh, is kinda different than usual, right this year. Yeah, it's kind of weird because of our Ohio debacle. Um, so what's what's your plan for the rest of the year. What kind of goals and thoughts do you have about the rest of the season. Yeah, it's been a different year, and um, you know, I'll be completely honest, I was totally totally complacent with the whole Ohio thing and and really just was relying on that. And I don't know why it was, knowing the situation that we were in, we knew it wasn't gonna be forever, but I just kind of got lazy and didn't really find any backup spots down there and um, you know, paying for it now. But um, I kind of mainly just relying on public land this year in Michigan. I've got a couple of of opportunities where some some private might work out. But um, the more I've been thinking, I'm kind of excited about it. Um not being limited to just a couple of spots. I've I've got quite a few, um areas around me that I'm gonna check out this year, and I'm just gonna try to be real aggressive and um and not worry about not worry about, you know, blowing something out. And I'm gonna kind of just be aggressive all season long if I can and get in some places that maybe I wouldn't have gone in the past, and see see what I can make happen. If if nothing happens, so be it. Um. But man, it would be pretty cool if if I could run into a three and a half year old Michigan and public land, that'd be pretty cool. Um. I've got a I've got a small place up north. My my in laws have a little ten acres up up in northern Michigan that I've got a camera out and I hung a stand a couple of weeks ago and did a couple of things up there to get that ready. UM, try to hunt that maybe a little bit more this year. But um yeah, really really, I don't have any other trail cameras out besides that. So I'm just gonna kinda you go back the seat of my pants and see what happens. And it's kind of exciting at the same time, UM, not really being not really know on what's out there. You know, Hey, I got a question, what what's the chances that let's say you strike out in the Dakotas you come you come home, and you know, you do your thing in Michigan. But is there a chance that you're being able to make a second trip out to North Dakota to hunt. Yeah, that'd be a possibility if I could. I could probably work that into my into my schedule to get back out there, maybe for four or five days or something. Um, I could probably make that happen if I needed to. I hope I don't, but UM, it could definitely definitely be an option. It's a cool area. Yeah, it's just as a long drive. Yeah that's super because yeah it's it's a long drive. Um, so goals then this year, whether there being you're hoping to kill a three and half yell in North Dakota and then it's gonna be three and a half for public land in Michigan too. Yeah, yeah, I'm gonna I'm gonna go for it and see what happens. And like I said, if if I don't kill a buck, I don't kill a buck. Um applied for some public land public land doe license stuff. I can kill a doe, that'd be that'd be cool too. I mean, you don't see a ton of them on public land. So, um, is there is there anything you do differently this year? Because because last year, I know you you did some exploring of some of the public land around you where you're at. Anything this year that you know you want to do differently or that you learned from that experience or anything. Yeah, yeah, check out more places. I kind of I kind of got zeroed in on like two different you know, two different pieces that I was going to. I'd i'd move around while I was there, But I want to go check out some of these other spots that, um, I've looked at on that and now I've kind of walked some of them. Um, so I just want to. I don't want to be I don't want to be committed to just one spot or two spots. UM, just be willing to kind of go outside of my comfort zone check out some some new areas. Yeah. Did did you guys try getting any private access in North Dakota or is the public so expansive where you're at that you don't need it? We didn't, Um, and it wasn't It wasn't so much that, um, there's so much public. It was more so that we just didn't enough time. Um, we're kind of we're kind of more focused on shed hunting than scouting. And we had you know, six days or whatever, and we figured out hit these main public spots we wanted to and then we also want to check out this stuff in Montana. So then we went to Montana to to do that because I wanted to do a little shed hunting and scouting there as well. So it was just more so the fact that if we had more time down there, I think it definitely would have made sense to try to get some permission, um, because there was a lot of good look and stuff that is under private ownership. UM. I think that's a possibility once the season starts. You never know, especially out there there's just not as many people, not as much pressure. Um, there's probably a little bit better chance of getting permission kind of last minute like that, especially you know early bow season. Hey we're just here for three more days. Any chance we could you know, sit out here a couple of times. Um, there's a chance that could work out. Um, but kind of like you said, Josh, hopefully don't need to do that, but if you do. I believe that North Dakota is a purple fence post state where if it's not posted no hunting that you can legally trespass. That's probably not very helpful with like archery equipment, but maybe that would give you an indication of landowners that are you know, possibly open to hunting if their land isn't posted. That would give you better odds of you know, finding a place that you could get permission for. Yeah, that's such a that's such a weird thing to me, Like I I never would even think about that because I've forgot just in Michigan or wherever else, you would never think that would be okay. But for those that aren't familiar that can you explain that Spencer so there are some states and it's fairly random. I'm not even familiar with which other ones there are. I think maybe one of the Carolinas is that way. North Dakota is that way. Um. And then there's like some parts of other states, like in South Dakota, for example, there are some areas where if the property is not posted no hunting, that you can then legally trespass and haunt that property. Now, the regulations are more specific than that as far as what's allowed and what's not allowed, but that's kind of a simple way to put it. And there's also some areas that, um, if the property isn't posted for no hunting, that it's also acceptable to paint your corner post purple, which then indicates no trespassing. M hm, wow that's unique. What about, um? What about what are the laws over there by you, Spencer? As far as recovering dear like a lot of states by us here, like you can't even you can't trespass even to recover a deer. You need written permission to recover a deer over property lines? What's that by you? So to recover a deer you need permission? Um? But where I'm at Um, you know it's uh, very small town field. You know all the landowners around you. You you probably know where they live or know their phone number. And on very rare occasions I would say people have problems with that. But otherwise it's you know, usually as easy as a phone call or a go and knock on their door and they say, hell, yeah, you know, go get it. We have. We have some other unique laws too because of our pheasant hunting. Like, uh, I believe you're allowed to make on armed retrievals of small game like a pheasant if it lands on private property. Um. Some people would get that confused with like deer recovery laws. Um. But as far as like a deer goes, um to cross the fence line or go into another property, you need to have permission. M. Interesting. Um, it's hard to keep track of this. All the different states have so many different ways of approaching that kind of stuff. It's just another reminder to me, how like, every time you hunt somewhere new, you really need to like scour the regulation books because every one of these states got wonky different things like that. I uh, you can't make any assumptions. I think it's probably the one thing you should always remember. Yes, So I I know a few people who have hunted North Dakota in the pastor at family in North Dakota, And what I've been told is that it used to be really great for that. Uh you know that not a whole lot of landowners had stuff posted. But the oil boom happened and you had a huge, huge influx of um out of staters that were living there for you know, six months, twelve months at a time, and a lot of them were early twenties men or whatever. That A lot of ground then became posted after that. So I think the North Dakota strategy of hunting like that has changed, like in the last decade or so. Versus what it was like in the early two thousands, you would have had a lot more opportunity. Um. But that's just weird to think about. And maybe that'll flip again here um as the oil industry kind of leaves North Dakota. All right, that is an interesting thing to think about. I have it. I have it pulled up here. This is from the North Dakota Game and Fish website. No hunting is allowed without permission from the landowner or leasy on private lands. In North Dakota that have been posted. So there we go. But if it's on posted, if it's on posted, yes, I believe look into that more before you go after here. I believe that's the case. Okay, that's good to know. Good little tip there, Spencer, thanks for that artward pause here for the last break of this episode, and just want to thank our partners at White Tailed Properties for their support. And we're back today with another one of my quick YouTube recommendations. They have this land beat YouTube video series where they're getting all such different advice recommendations as far as hunting and property management, all sorts of things like that. And in one of their more recent videos, it's titled Fall Food Plots Great mid to late season hunting. White Tail Properties land specialist Tom James walks us through what he likes to plant in small woodland food plots. He likes to combine a cereal grain like oats or cereal rye and brassicas and I love that combination to That's something that I use on my boom food plots. And in this quick video Tom explains why that works so well, how he does it. It's definitely a quick and helpful video. That I would recommend, so check it out. We're at the White Tailed Properties YouTube channel. If you want to learn more about their specialists or their properties, you can head to white Tail Properties dot com. Um. What about Well, you know what, we better we better wrap this up a little bit here. We gotta talk about my goals and some things going on. But Dan had to drop off early, so you guys now are in charge of grilling me um and making me look like a fool if you want UM since Dan can't do it. UM. You know, the only things I guess I would say about my hunting season this year. We all kind of know that I'm chasing Holyfield still here in Michigan, UM, and I do have that North Dakota and Montana hunt in the beginning, and then I've got that Boundary Waters Minnesota hunt in the middle of October. UM, and then it's gonna be a lot of Michigan stuff after that. I'm trying to slip in a quick Nebraska trip to UM. But you know, so, I just don't know what the situation is going to be here at home. I don't know if holy Fields still around. I do get the shed in January, but I don't. I have not had any sightings or anything of him since then. I've been driving around my main Michigan properties try to get eyes on Bucks. I have seen two good deer within like half a mile three cores a mile of that property. One was a really nice big eight pointer. Um. Another one was almost just a big six. He does have g threes, but they're like just barely an inch long, So there might be an eight, might be a six technically, but super tall, really tall times um braw times. You saw a picture last night, Josh right, yea. Um, So there's those couple of good Bucks in the general area. But I haven't checked my summer trail cameras yet. I just put them out a couple of weeks ago. I'm not going to touch them until closer towards the end of the month. I'm planning on trying to, like on my main Michigan properties. I'm gonna try to do all as much of my intrusion as possible just in like a day or two period. So like in that one day or two period, I'm gonna try to finish my food plots, do my last couple of stand adjustments, check the cameras, and they get out of there, So just kind of have a flurry in a short amount of time, but not a bunch of activity like every couple of days, over and over and over again all through August. Um So, I gotta get that finished up here in the next week and half. Um So, I think you know here in Michigan, holy Field is the number one goal. But then a four year old, just about any four year old I will probably take a shot at if it's a good quality mature buck. Um. We do have two tags here in the state. Um So I could always depend on Holy feeling that second tag. And I've got you know, my main Michigan spot where holy Field is a couple of the little places. And then there's our northern Michigan deer camp that me and further hunt um be amazing too shoot a mature buck up there, and as you've seen, Josh, we're getting some mature bucks on camera finally, so that's a possibility. Um. And then I've got this new property on the west side of the state where I think there's a good chance of seeing some good deer. I'm not sure exactly how much time we're gonna be well spend over there, but at least a week in November, I'm gonna be there. So it's gonna be four year olds in Michigan with Holy Fields the number one buck, that buck Survivor. There was a three year old last year. If he shows back up, which I haven't seen him yet, but if he shows back up, I would love to get a crack at him, since I have so many pictures and studings of him last year. Um, Montana, North Dakota it's gonna be probably a four year old or older. UM. Not gonna be too terribly picky other than that. UM. And then Minnesota it's gonna be anything. I think. If I see a deer, I'll probably shoot any deer, just because I don't know if we're gonna see any deer at all. It sounds like it's big timber, big woods, few deer, very few sightings. So it's more so like an adventure of just getting in there and if you see a deer that's the success. And getting it out um is a project in itself. UM. So that's kind of my season's goals, you know, in the main deer it's not like you know usually Josh, We've got our Ohio property We've got a bunch of bucks down there we're chasing that we've seen year after year, but you know we don't have that this year. Um, so it's gonna be kind of Michigan is the spot with history. Everything else is going to be kind of showing up brand new, figuring things out. But but kind of like you said, Josh, I mean, that's that's kind of exciting and it's in its own So are you willing to I know in the past you said that you don't want to take multiple deer off of your holy Field property, But is that something that you would consider this season that since I don't think you shot one there last year, but would you take to this year? Yeah, that's a that's a great point. Um. I haven't shot a buck on that property. Um, since two thousand and fifteen. That the first year I saw holy Field was two killed a buck on that property opening night and then yeah, I didn't try to shoot any other deer there because of that one buck roll there. Um, and then the subsequent subsequent years I've just been chasing holy Field. But this year, yes, I would shoot multiple bucks on that property this year, because like I just said, haven't taken any deer off this property and three years, any bucks off this property three years, and um, it would have to be it has to be a really good one though. It had to be like either one of these four year olds I know, like survivor or one of these no brainer dear. Um, you know, if it's like the biggest buck I've ever had an opportunity in Michigan, Yeah, I'm gonna take it because I could always still hunt holy Field that second tag. But in years past, you know, I've shot some three year olds on this property, So I'm like, you know, it's nothing. It's not the kind of buck that's like gonna send you over the edge. But in this area, the three year old is not terribly common either, So I've taken some deer like that. Um this year, no like twiners like that. It's either gonna be like a no brainer, like drop your job, gets you really pumped holy fielder survivor or just just wait it out. Um. But I'm not budgeting a whole bunch of time to that property either. You know, in past years I hunted it too much early I think when the past years when I was hunting holy Field. So this year it's gonna be like Opening Night if the conditions are right, and then nothing till November unless I get some kind of intel that tells me that I need to change that. Um. But you know, two years ago I hunted and I've talked about this at at Nasam, But two years ago I hunted like almost every weekend for him because I kept thinking these little mini cold fronts might get him moving. And then last year I thought, he know, he historically starts moving around, which is what he did the two years prior to that. So I thought, Okay, as soon as that date range hits, I'm gonna start hunting him hard. And so I started hunting him hardy and I didn't see him for like seven eight days. UM. So I think I pushed it too soon. Now he's a little bit older, I think he's just even tightening up his daily activity even more so this year, I'm gonna try to play it even more cool and wait till October or November one and then hunt him hard during that one time period where he seems to be every year. The last three years, he's been moving during that time frame on this property. So I'm gonna kind of put all my chips into that basket. Um unless you know of cameras running, I'll be trying to observe from a distance. On the nights I can get away and and and scout from a distance. So if something that tells me to do something otherwise, then I will just But that's kind of what I'm working with. And um you know, I've been making all sorts of different stand adjustments and property adjustments, doing a few things differently with my food plots this year to try and make those a little bit better. So you know, each year that I've been hunting Holy Field, I've been like trying to just sweeten things a little bit more, just improve the stands. It's a little bit more improved, the food plots, a little more improved. Whatever habitat work I can do just a little bit more. Um So, I definitely learned some things last year as far as where I was seeing them. So I'm gonna be setting up a few more stands this week and some new locations based on what I learned last year. Um So my focus here is gonna be much more back in the cover, on the back of the property versus up in the front towards that food that I focused on the first couple of years. Um, but that's kind of that's kind in my head's at right now, doing these other haunts, doing these other haunts. Mark in Minnesota, North Dakota, Montana. Do you worry at all about being able to age a deer that's unfamiliar to you? You know some of the like the area that you hunt in Montana, those bucks seem like their bodies are smaller, they almost look malnourished. They're not malnourished, but uh, you know, I think it's very different than the deer you see in Michigan. Does that worry you at all about being able to age one of these bucks that you've never seen before? Yeah, yeah, No, it definitely was something that I noticed, um last year in particular, when I went to that property in Montana. I was looking at these deer and thinking, uh, I don't think I think that's just a two or three year old. When I look back on video later in the year and started thinking, maybe, you know, and not only not only are the different bodies sides, but also this is really early in the year. So a lot of the criteria that we look at to try to age bucks usually those things like how big is their neck or how you know, where's their neck meet their chests or different things like that. A lot of times those things are much easier to distinguish when you get closer to the rut. You know, in September, a lot of these even mature buck will look younger in September, much more sleek. Um. So I do think that's a little bit of a challenge that I Um, I think I've learned a little bit now that I've hunted out there twice, But this year I'm definitely gonna be thinking about that a little bit more. Um, maybe even look at some pictures online or doing some different things just to try to like make sure my eye is tuned to that western white tail a little bit more, um Because like I just think between the body size, the time of the year, and even like the antler size, it's just all just the ratio. It just seemed a little different. Um. So yeah, that's that's definitely gonna be on my mind. And then throwing it bucks still have any velvet on. I mean that that makes it tougher too. I Mean that's a good point, and you don't see what you're talking about earlier spencer. I think I would actively try not to shoot a velvet buck. So if I had two bucks in front of me on our North Dakota Montana hunt, I'm trying not to shoot the velvet one. Um, I don't know why. I just don't have that desire. And then number two, I don't want to deal with it. I've heard it's a real challenge to deal with velvet like lots of times it ends up getting all messed up, or you need to pay to get like this fake velvet to put on it because they can't preserve it. How do you have a plan for dealing with that? Uh? No, I do not, And I'm not sure if it's like I'm not so much like attracted to the idea of getting a velvet buck. I think it's more that the hunting style is different, um, you know, just like that time of year sitting at tree stand is so different when it could be eighty five degrees and there's mosquitoes and stuff. Um, and just that their pattern is different, that they're still potentially on their summer pattern. I think the challenge of something brand new like to that something brand new like that is is appealing to me and it's less about the velvet um, but at the same time, that would be something unique with a deer that I've never you know, had a chance to harvest before. Yeah, yeah, I know. I'm I'm right there with you as far as how much fun is to start hunting that early September when I started doing that, you know, two or three years ago, whatever it it's I'm hooked on that, like, that has a lot of fun. They're on that that pretty consistent bed defeed pattern. They're on the following those summer habits. It's a cool time year to be out there. I you know, this is my third or fourth year not doing it, and I think, Josh, you're gonna feel the same way. So that's it's awesome to get out there at that point. Did you have another question? I got a couple of questions for you, and this is this isn't uh, this is from Michigan. Are you worried and I thought this is maybe where Spencer is going. Are you worried with how many trips that you're taking that it could negatively impact your ability to have a run in with Holy Field. Yeah, um, I'm kind of taking the I'm almost swinging the pendulum in the far opposite direction of last year, almost too far, maybe because last year, because I was so obsessed with holy Field, I canceled all my other trips and I just hunted holy Field the whole year and I didn't get shot anything. Now this year, I'm going the opposite. I told myself, you know what, I'm not gonna let my obsession over one buck like did find my whole season. I'm gonna go do other fun stuff and I have other experiences. So now all of a sudden, I've stacked myself up with all these other trips. Um. That is a little concerning to me. Um. But but the more think about it, I really think that I only have a handful of hunts in the season when I actually have a real chance at that buck. I think, given what I've seen now and as long as I'm there on that during that right time frame, I think I think leaving this property alone completely except for like seven days, is better than like dabbling on a property like fourteen times but scattered throughout the year. I think this is like my my hypothesis right now. So yes, that's a possibility, and I am going to have maybe a cell camera two up there. So I'm gonna be kind of monitoring the area, and if all of a sudden you start showing up a bunch if I'm around home, I will, you know, close enough to that property, I will change that plan and go in there. But there's a possibility could be in Minnesota or something or wherever Nebraska, and I could get a bunch of daylight pictures of him, and I might be kicking myself. Okay, here's here's a scenario for you. It is that it is the night before, the afternoon or whatever evening before you're leaving for Minnesota, and you get a cell camera photo that holy Field is sitting in one of year food plots in daylight. The next day looks perfect. You could get in there and potentially kill him. Are you leaving for Minnesota that next morning? I am calling up Andy and saying I'm sorry, I'm sorry, Andy, we gotta push the Minnesota trip back, because yeah, I'm at least flexible on my dates on that one, on most of these trips at least um So yeah, I will definitely push if you're halfway. How about if you're halfway to Minnesota. In that case, I'm probably sticking with Minnesota because I think that Andy's a nice guy, but he probably punched me in the head if I turn this around and try to do that. So I don't know. I feel like there's a good chance it's something on these Michigan properties. I just don't know if holy Field is gonna show, and if he does show, I think there's a chance. Next next question, are you planning on being more aggressive with dough harvest on your main piece? Yes, Ish, I'm still in the same boat as I am every year because this property, I know I need to do more dough control on it. But at the same time, I feel like if I start being aggressive with dough control, it's gonna blow any chance at Holyfield. So I'll probably do what I've done in past years, but try to do a better job of it. So I'll probably be targeting him on this property. Um, and if he's still alive, you know, if I haven't killed him in this December, I'll probably set like a deadline like if I don't kill him by December fifteen or eight or something like twenty, whatever it is. If I don't get him by then, then I just have to switch to dough hunting and um at that point, just all right, he's made it this far. I gotta try to kill some doughs and start start doing that. And I'm gonna force you to come help me and try to get some other friends to come help me. Um because I need to be even. I need to get more off this farm than I have in years past. Um. So, so yeah, that's that's all what you mean. You know, it's a dilemma have every year. I'd love to start taking some doughes earlier in the season, but it's just, you know how it is. It's so small here. If any basically me where I shoot a doll in this property, they could run into like one of the two main betting areas and it would force me to completely blow out, you know, the one mature buck in the area, and and they just they won't tolerate that. If it happens once, you're kind of s ol So that's that's a tough thing about this, Hilaria. Anything else, gentleman, I got one more question. Yeah, are you are you willing to go after I think you did last year if I remember right, But would you are you going to be willing to hunt your place or the place where Holy Fields app during the firearms season. Are you gonna You're gonna stick with your sanctuary method and try to completely stay out of there. I think I'm planning on sanctuary strategy again. But if you know, if I'm if I'm seeing him actively like that last day or two, I'm willing to I'm willing to bend on that. I'm not. I'm I don't need to be so locked on that. UM So, yeah, I would, I would push it in hunt opening day or something like that if I had a really good reason to UM. But in general, I think that keeping it relatively low pressured there is still I think that's been a good thing. I don't think. I don't think that that buck would be six years old this year if I was hunting him hard during gun season, because I just think there would have been too many chances that I'd push him and he'd be on a neighbor's where they're just letting guns guns fly. Now this year is gonna be weird, though, because, as you know, Josh, in a handful of counties across the state, they have now implemented some new regulations because of c w D, and they are now taking our two week firearm season, and they're now extending that through the entire muzzleloader season. So we have a two week firearm season, and then in southern Michigan it's it's about a three week muzzleloader season, maybe a little less than that, but somewhere around that timeframe. Now that's all going to be general firearm. So there's gonna be almost a five week general firearms season where I hunt and mark. Can you can you clarify one thing that that's for. That's for a sixteen county CWD managements on. It's not everywhere in the state UM, and not all of southern Michigan. There's sixteen counties where that's gonna be. Yeah, you can find that all in on Michigan's d and our website. Yes, so that's the counties where CWT has been found and then all the counties that touched them right basically well basically like UH surveillance areas that they set up that they want to get more deer tested on, and yes, most of them do touch UM counties where cw D has been detected. Yeah, So so that's one of the new things we're gonna be dealing with this year. I have some concerns, you know, just persist like selfishly about how that's going to impact like my own personal hunting. UM, I worry a little bit. But at the same time, you know, as you know, Josh, you've been well, you've heard all the different controversy around these new regulations. Has been a lot of people worried about it, upset about it, lots of opinions about what's happening. UM. I was gonna try to get into all that today, but maybe we'll say it for another time because we're kind of running out of the podcast, like all in its own probably and you could probably get some you should probably get some people that are much more versed in it than I am, or have a have some more background and have a biologist, a couple of biologists on. I could really go into it. Um. But yeah, it's it's there's been a ton of drum over it, and there's just a lot of passionate deer hunters here in Michigan, and UM, a lot of people that have been working for a long time to to see some good change here and you know, may not be the case right now, we will see. UM, So I'm gonna say we wrapped this one up here, um, because I've got other things I got to run off to actually, but we have got Josh, your number one goal is to kill a three and a half year old in North Dakota or public Liane Michigan, would you say that's it? Yeah, Yeah, that's it. And Spencer, your number one goal is to kill uh forest or a buck like that? Would you agree? Yeah? It made sure, velvet buck, okay. And my number one goal is to kill holy Field. And Dan isn't here, so we can make up a goal for him. Um, but I'm gonna say it's probably to kill Narlie. Charlie, I guess. So that's that's what we got ahead of us. We have hunting seasons kicking off for at least the three of us were kicking off in two weeks. Dan will be six weeks from now. Um. But over the next four months here on the podcast, I'm going to try to have both of you guys, and of course Dan and myself sharing what's going on through our journeys and whatnot, and Spencer speaking of following along with hunting season and what's going on. We are back us here in two thousand and eighteen with the third season of Radio. Right Yes, September five is the first planned episode of season three eut Radio. So for those who aren't familiar, For people new to the podcast, can you give us like the thirty second cliff notes on what radio is what they have to expect. So each week through the fall from September to January, that's what we did last year. I will talk to notable white tail experts across the country and see what they're getting for deer movement, UM and hopefully bring you the most timely uh buck intel anywhere possible. UM. You know, we will be recording these interviews with people on like Tuesday, episode goes up Wednesday, and uh you know that today you'll be able to listen and hear what they're predicting for buck movement, what they've been seeing for buck movement. Uh. You know, we'll talk about factors like moon phases, weather, crops, dad is hunting pressure, all those different things, uh, with hopes of providing you with uh you know, like I said, the most timely dear intel available. Yeah, it has been a really well received, UM kind of new format that we added to the show. People are really finding it helpful. So like Spencer mentioned first week in September, you're gonna start getting too wired Hunt podcasts a week. The RUT Radio will be on on Wednesday, are regular episodes on Thursday. So between those two um as you just said, lots of great real time information that can help you guys, and you'll be able to follow along with the four of our hunts and seasons pretty close to real time as well. So Spencer further appreciate you guys joining me today. And that is it for us today. So, like I always mentioned, if you haven't left a rating review on iTunes, would really appreciate that. If you're not following us on Instagram or Facebook or Twitter or YouTube, would appreciate that too. And until next time, all I want to say is thank que for falling along, thanks for being here, and stay wired to Hunt. M h m hmmm

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