00:00:00 Speaker 1: Oh hey, everyone, welcome to the bizarro world that is hunting collective podcast about a Tiger King and Phil We just went through essentially two hours of conversation about the Netflix documentary called Tiger King and it I've had at this moment three white claw Seltzer beverages and then a meat eater whiskey cocktail, So I'm feeling pretty good. I blew off a lot of steam for the last couple of weeks of quarantine, all the feelings that there are that come up from being stuck in a house, um and not being able to do what I normally do. So I it really enjoyed blowing off steam talking about Tiger King and enjoying this moment in time that is the coronavirus pandemic. What do you think they're Philip. I mean, we talked about it at the the end of the episode, which people will hear coming up. But this, this documentary could not have dropped at a better time, I mean, for Netflix and for us. Honestly, I think it was at a It's like a week into the kind of quarantine business, maybe a couple depending on where you live, and people are looking for something to just kind of like let go and just you know, kind of a release or an escape. And then and here comes Joe Exotic and it was a nice seven part, seven part escape from the from the outside world. Well, either way, if you've watched it or you haven't watched it, I think this will be entertaining. We did our best just to let it fly. And so there's some colorful language, there's some crazy stories. All of this follows um one of the wildest documentaries you'll ever watch. And so enjoy episode number ten of the Quarantine Cast our review of Tiger King. M Lay down there, lay him down, Hell them not the danger. Ah. Oh, it's beautiful. Let him run the jo oh let him Hey? Are you cool? Cats and kittens. It's Carol Basking here from Big Cat Rescue. Welcome to the Hunting Collective. Hi, that was perfect, Phil, Did you like that intro? It was the best one you've you've ever done. I would I would have talked about Carol baskin voice for the whole whole podcast. All right, Well, welcome everyone to the first and probably not last Tiger King review podcast here at t HC. Everybody, get a round of applause for for the Tiger King. Oh my god, beautiful. We're joined by the great and powerful Annie Racer. Hi, Annie, Hello, uh the flip flop flesher, Seth Morris, Hello, Seth, Hello, Ben and everyone, and Philip the Engineer, Hello you finishing dinner? You've all what you have in there? Bud? I got some like a like a vegetable grotten, got some like cauliflower and broccoli, and some some some some pork chaps. Okay, that was substantial. That was pretty boring. That's fine, Thanks for boring boring news. Now onto the more exciting stuff. I'd like to thank. I'd like to thank sweet baby Jesus for six pound eight ounce I don't even know a word yet in a golden fleece diaper, for creating the Tiger King and all his friends. I can't think of a better way to get through this tough time than by having a happy hour with you three and talking about what is possibly the greatest show ever made. Annie, what are you feeling right now? You're excited? Oh, I'm great. My dog just got in my business, but I'm great. Um. I thoroughly enjoyed this six hours, and so much so I unconsciously put on these pants this morning leopard pants pants, and then I was going to change out of him, but I was like, quit, I'm going on a Tiger King podcast later. Yeah, I feel like it's a Catharsis. It's it's off steam. I have a Jetti tumbler full of ice and also mediate or whiskey, and then I have a raspberry and ruby red grapefruit white claws to top those off. So I'm looking to get real, real buzzed right now, just enough, just enough to bring all of you the most scattered, most random review of this this seven episode menagerie that you'll ever get seth. How are you feeling right now? Just taking a temperature? Are you nervous, You're scared, You're excited? No, I'm excited to talk about this it. Like I was said, like telling you before, I just I couldn't believe what I was saying the whole time I was watching it. Yeah, Phil, I'm gonna give you a chance to be the first. This is a like I said, a lot of people wanted to be in on this podcast, but I'm gonna give you a chance kind of a reward of sorts. I'm gonna give you a chance to summarize what the Tiger King documentary is and what it means to you. This is okay. This is the story of of Joe Exotic yep um a while a big cat. Um, I don't know what, what do you want to say? A big cat? He ran a big cat. Let's just say zoo in southern Oklahoma. Yeah, if Dog the bounty hunter Liberaci and Joe Dirt had a baby kind of a story about how he in the span of I mean from the beginn when they started making this documentary it was probably I think the three or four years. How he ends up in prison. They tease that at the beginning, and then also just the world of big cat owners in this country and and their personalities and how they all their relationships with each other. I'd say that's kind of like the whole. That's like the documentary as a whole. Yeah. I mean, if we were going to do This is Us and start at the end, which I like to do so I love the show. This is Us. Uh. The terminus of the story is when Joe Exotic, who has for many decades held animals and cages to to make money, ends up in a cage himself and it begins to complain about being locked and said cage uh and and the beauty and the poetic ending is that he starts to realize what it means to be locked up because some of his improprieties along the way, So that I feel like that's andy. You feel like that's a good way to kind of analogous way to um and things like the terminus of the story, yeah, for sure. And the other thing I've been telling people that I don't want to tell them too much because it's just like the craziest thing you've ever seen, and you have to watch it. But just that statistic where it's something like seven to ten thousand tigers live in the United States under captivity, but there's only like three or four thousand or something in the wild, four thousand in the wild, five to ten thousand in the United States of America, most of those in Texas As has been discussed on the Mediator podcasts and others I've been a part of. You know, is that something we know of and something we just kind of think of as a piece of Americana, Like we only America would be so bold and egotistical as to own more. I had no idea that this was happening though. Did you guys know this? I would. I knew of it because I lived in Texas and pretty much everybody with a ranch has a tiger. Um. Yeah, I mean I was hunting. I told the story before in the podcast. I was hunting turkeys one time. Uh killed a turkey and then do it was on a high fence ranch, killed a turkey and in doing so got almost got stepped on by an eland, which is the largest African antelope, uh, living, And I thought that was weird. And then it was walking back to the lodge, to the house where we were going to check in to show everybody the turkey. And then I turned the corner and there in a cage was a leopard and a Bengal tiger, and so I got to take a lot of tiger selfies in my camo. Uh. It's it's illegal. It's illegal to buy tigers, right. I made a note of that because of the Endangered Species Act. I'll have to find it. I want to make sure we get that part of it right. Uh. It was organized crime. After the Endangered Species Act, it said you can't buy, sell or barter and endangered species, which in terms of the Bengal tiger and others. They are endangered. Um, and so yeah, it's that's why it's so mind blowing that so many people have them, right, I mean they're obviously buying them. Yeah, probably a private ownership is not uh is not banned as of yet. And I know that's what the act that they were trying to push. That our friend Carol Baskin, who will hear a lot about, just trying to push the Big Cat Public Safety Act. They call that. It's in it's in Congress now. They call that urgently needed solution to the problem of big cats kept as pets and unsafe and abusive circumstances. They say, wild animals in prison and basements or backyards not only suffer mentally, but also pose a serious risk of safety to the surrounding community. That's kind of the thesis of the Big Cat Public Safety Act, that that our friend, everybody's friend now, Carol Baskin is pushing. Carol, alright, well, I have a serious I just want to say, her husband, Howard is definitely my friend. He's my favorite. I don't know, I like, if I had to rank my top ten, somewhere in my top ten favorite moments was when she was walking in the cat cemetery where every time a cat dies she makes it a little gray stuff and he just looks at her and goes, you're the mother Teresa of cats. Right before that, she's like going through this the gravestones of the cats, and then he starts being like, oh, yeah, that was a great cat she was. She's basically like, well, why don't you just tell him since you seem to know like everything about him. She was like, piss that he like an intro. Sorry. It calls back to their wedding photo where he's wearing like a cat outfit with a lee shawhere. Oh my god, I can't take I pass it it set Phil, I'm passing out. I can't take it. I think we should set this general scene as like, think we should set it up because people are listening probably have seen this or not. Do we just want to give a ship? I like, that's no way to get ahold of this. There's no way, all right, me just I have a list of questions that I'd like us to discuss, but prior to getting into the linear story of of Tire King, and we you know, we all feel so eloquently described what we're talking about. So if at this point you haven't seen it, uh, take a break. We'll see you in seven hours. Go watch it, and we're back. I hope you enjoyed that seven hours of pure, pure bliss at his tire king. Now that we're back, I have a question for the group here, and I'm gonna start with Phil. Uh, why are we, as humans, or at least the millions of humans that were profiled as as kind of the consumers of cat cub petting and zoos, Why are we so drawn to big cats? Phil? What is it about tigers, ligers, um and the like leopards and all these other things? Why are we drawn to this particular animal species? I mean I can only speak personally. I just there they they look almost they look so familiar yet so alien at the same time, because I feel like we have a lot of kind of you know, we're so used to saying domesticated cats everywhere because the cats been domesticated for you know, someone please probably knows this. I don't ben um, but like, but they're just so muscular and there the the patterns on on the on their hair and their fur are just just like um, they're just like you know, exotic to to to choose a word, and uh, they're they're just incredibly like attractive, charismatic animals. That's that's the way I guess the on the way I can put it. For four thousand years ago, ancient Egyptians may have been the first to domesticate cats. Um, you know, plentiful rodents probably drew wild feelines to human communities, and then four thousand years later from Joe exotic shows up just for Rex Shop. So Andy, do you want to try to answer that question? Why are we so drawn to big cats? Oh? I didn't know this was going to be a quiz um everything Phil said. But yeah, I just feel like that like a majestic and also like elusive, Like there aren't a lot then, like in the world and the wild, so it's like you don't ever, I mean, you don't have exposure to them. Maybe well even in the In the Dock the documentary and the guy what was his name? The guy that rit Rick Kirkman said, it's hard to explain the addiction to exotic animals. He mentioned in the In the Dock that was kind of like a feeling of power that there's like a feeling of facing danger and because of your proximity to this powerful animal that you somehow like get some of that power. And that may be why people are so drawn to big cats. I mean, these guys are making millions of dollars on petting cubs, taking photos with tiger cubs, um just to see them. In the case of big Cat Rescue, like, there's so much going on there. I think that that maybe one of the questions that Tiger King maybe was trying to answer but got off track at the murder and the math and the polygamist gave people like it, Uh, it got off track there, but it's trying to answer that question. So the secondary question for you, Seth is why are crazy people drawn to owning cats? Dude, I don't know, but literally every at least from from the series, every cat owner, like big cat owner in America is just fucking crazy. That's why I want to say, Ben you you say it gets off track there, but I think that's like part of it. Like it's these types of personalities that are attracted to these animals, and they're all like they're all super weird. I feel like having like those people having these cats gives them like power in a way where they had never had that before, just because they're super fucking weird people. Well, there's no way that. Essentially what this documentary mccoms you start to learn about its characters is a series of cults. There's three essentially three cults. I wrote down the type of cults that are that are there. This is a weird story of three three cults that are working in concert. You have a crazy animal rights lady named Carol who's attracted volunteers who work twelve hour days to get different colored T shirts. You have. That's it. That's all they get, and they even navy blue. They even mentioned they mentioned that like no holidays are not an option when you're volunteering at the Big I also love that she's like, I don't I honestly don't know anybody's name until they've been working here for like seven years. I don't understand. So you have that, right, that's the first cult. That cult, the kind of the center point of that call to the ethos of that cult is saving big cats by putting them in cages and and showing them to people. That's kind of what they do. And then selling merchandise. Now you have Joe Exotic, who has a methed out, misfit cult of of former gang members, former guys who he met on craigslist. People he picks up at fucking gas stations like he has. He has basically a school bus full of meth that he drives around Oklahoma and he picks up random and weird people and he marries some of them. Most of them are missing some kind of body part for some reason. One of the one guy, he's like, how did I lose my legs? Well, not not by tigers, a zip line accident. I remember hearing that and being like what or you're definitely thinking that whole first episode. Like this guy's like got eaten by tiger. He's like a tragic zip line accident. Uh. There's another guy who who is the zoo manager or zook keeper. The head keeper of the zoo found out found the job on craigslist, should you not? And it never managed an animal in his life. He looks like if Joe Dirt was on meth and he so he's there. So that's the second cult. In the third cult is an elephant riding douchebag name Bob Lava doc Antel who's kind of like, it's kind of like that Hugh Hefner of big cat owners. He's just somehow tricked all these young ladies into wearing leopard print skin tight pants and like posing with cats and making calendars and living in like roach infested horse stalls and in virgins, and then it makes appointments for boob jobs, gets makes them become vegetarians. Like this dude. He grows like a silver ponytail and he has like a faver saver and it's just it's just so disgusting. He comes out on an elephant in front of a Crowd's like, yeah, I've known this elephant all my life and we're both fat. Now, what is wrong with you? Anyway? He also says at one point in defense of his cult, everything is nice, everything is good, everything is beautiful, And anybody who tells you that is clearly uh is clearly into something left up, Like there's no doubt about it. There's no doubt about it. Uh So, Anyway, that's the three cults. So we are looking at here, and and they all kind of revolve around this idea of owning big cats and making money off the owning of them. Is Carol Baskin's case, she just makes money off making people think she's saving them, and the other two guys make just our only arguing that it's the proximity to the cats that allows people to have a relationship with them. And then doc Antel says, uh, eight zoos can be a real tool for education because it opens people's hearts and wallets. He says this, this is a person who says it opens people's hearts and wallets. Two tigers, so he so he can do worldwide conservation, which made which made my I had a brain hemorrhage right at that. What are you talking about? Man? Anyway, those are the three cults that are kind of collected here and and beyond that, I believe there to be three three levels to this story. And the story is over seven hours of kind of a cascading waterfall of just shocking moments that by the time you're it's over, you're drowning in this water that is filled with just ironies and it's just it's just you can't take it anymore. But anyway, there's three levels to this story. The first level is learning about the people in the culture. The first couple of episodes are kind of like learning about the people and the culture in which they live. The next couple of episodes are learning exactly how fucked up they all are, and then the third level details of the war between them for ultimate power in what is like a Star Wars like universe where they're all fighting for the throne of sorts whatever you would call it. Only one can be tiger, only one can be tiger king. Yes, uh, seth, Have I have I done well and kind of encapsulating what's going on here? Uh? No, one couldn't have done it better? Ben Um Okay, well that was perfect A couple of quotes I have. Uh nothing is cooler, sexier, or more significant than a tiger? Who said that? Annie? Oh? Who says the words significant? Probably not Joe Exotic? Maybe Doc? Doc? Doc? Was it? Doc? That's correct? Who says owning a tiger is all about? Look at me? Who? Who I got? Carol Baskin? That has been Carol, Carol Baskin? Uh? So that those are our characters there, They are like ancillary characters within each cult. Um so so? Uh? Phil, Yes, do you remember Philip? Do you remember how it is that Phil the filmmaker that the folks who made this filmmaker. The guy's name is Eric Good. Do you remember like how he got interested in telling this story? It was he was shooting he didn't say specifically what, but he was shooting something involving like reptiles. Am I right? He was shooting something in Florida like oh, people that owned snakes like Exhamt. Yeah. And then him guys like, hey, coming the back, you want to see what I've gotten my trailer? Yeah, it wasn't that there was a guy there buying snakes. Yeah, so there I was like, hey, check out what I got my van and I just bought This is my favorite, one of my favorite parts, top ten moment. This guy goes, hey, look at my van. Like this guy is the antipit, Like he is the Florida ban that you hear about in the news, just driving a van around and he opens the door to this van as into like opening the door to Narnia. Opens the door to this van, and in a cage in the van is a fucking snow leopard like I have panting to death. Yeah. I was like, isn't it too hot here for a snow leopard? He's like no, if they're born in Florida. They're good about What are you talking about that? That's not true at all, It's not even close. So that began the five year journey. Now this this filmmaker Eric is like, well I should look into this. Which good for him, because that's what I would have done. If somebody, some dude, some dude in a van was like, hey, check out my snow leopard, I probably would have looked into it. So he went on a five year journey to discover what it is is the big cat trade. And then he stumbled upon at some point the g W Exotic Animal Park in Oklahoma, and that was owned and started by a man named Joe Exotic. And I already kind of did a brief description of Joe Exotic. But I'll give Seth, I'll give you a chance to kind of just just talk a little bit about Joe. Just let it out. Oh man, where do I even start? Um? Joe Exotic. He he's got a mullet that's bleached blonde. Um, lots of piercings, tattoos. How old is he's like in his he in his early fifties when they start the documentary years old? Um, he's Oh he's Exotic is a great word for him. He's very exotic. He's a gun total um. I man, I don't even know how to describe this guy. He's physically he's he's gay. He he's a he's a hillbilly. Yeah, there's nothing wrong with that. He has a bowl cut and a mullet that's a bleached blond. Yeah, he does, he does. There's no Yeah, I really don't know how. Yeah, the word to describe. Let's take a brief a brief musical interlude while we think about how to describe use this one is my favorite, and we're back now. There's a lot of questions I have about about this. But yeah, Joe, Joe, Like if if you think of characters that might combine to make some already said a lot of this, but Joe, dirt Dog, the bounty hunter, Liberaci. Uh any any famous ice dancer we kind of fit here. Uh any famous animal handler that's like been on a late night TV show? All of those people. What was the Australian guy that got killed by the stingray? Steve? He gives Steve Irwin. He's in there somewhere. It's just like a gumbo of personality that's what meth Crystal. Yeah, every time you take a bite of this gumbo, you get a different flavor. I mean, you just don't know what you're gonna get with our man, Joe. That's that's really true throughout the entire thing is is now like he started his his exotic animal park after his brother died. I don't what did his brother die from. I don't have that on my notes, do you guys? Remember maybe I'm wrong about that, but someone died in his life, and uh, he was like, well, I gotta start up to make sure that they're not as just another statistic. I'm gonna start a zoo where I'm gonna save the tigers. And this is um. And from there it seemed like in the beginning, Joe Exotic had a good he had an idea that he was going to save cats and uh do do good bye this this great animal. In the beginning, it seemed like that's what he wanted to do. Um. Somewhere in there in the beginning, he comes a magician. I don't really have anything to say about I don't know what to say about that. He just becomes also a magician. Jock Ansel, Yeah, it looks kind of like, uh like he at this time, you got big mustache. Yeah, I can't even get let him in until later on. But I'm sorry, sorry, sorry, anyway, this he starts, this Zoos's gonna be a four hours absolutely, yeah, you gotta edit all the every time. I can't help, but curse. I'm sorry everyone, but I am just fired up and it comes out of me. So you're gonna have to deal with it. Joe exotic would would would approve of it. Of the language. Um so eventually, you know, like, here are some notes that I made, and i'd like you all just to kind of react to my notes. The headkeeper found the place on Craigslist and then a year later was running tiger shows. Uh you Phil, you got any here? That's just a fact. It must have a robust training program qualified. Yeah, well this is this is good. Goes back to your your recruitment story of how he just roamed Oklahoma with a bus full of math and just pulled on I mean, isn't it like classic cult leadership, like you find like disenfranchise people cause there nowhere else to go. This guy's gonna pay me eight bucks an hour to scoop up tiger ship that Zude whatever had zookeeper Dude, Like, fully, that was like what saved his life. I mean he was definitely fucked up, but like I mean messed up, but like that was like this what was the thing that saved his life? For sure? Because you saw on the end, once it's over, you're like, oh, no, is this guy like overdosing on drugs and just like but yeah, yeah, he totally seemed like he you cared about the tigers too, the only person that seemed like he really cared. Yeah, for sure. He had to pulled out a little folder full of like portraits of him and the tigers, and he was very this place. This documentary is very funny, but it goes goes some dark places and where they lived, like he would recruit that. There's one scene in the show where he goes to a gas station and like he's just like, hey, do you want to live Do you want to live in a trailer? You could work at a burger place and then you can kind of live in a trailer, and it's lad. He's like, yeah, sure, I'll live in a trailer. And then they showed the trailers. There's like four trailers. Yeah, there's four trailers, and then one dude's like laying on he just has a mattress with a sheet on it, and there's seventeen like big red Soda is all half drunk may Like what is that guy? Is that only drinks? Like why he should have a water Like it's hot in Oklahoma. They pull out one of the drawers on the dresser and a rat goes running. Yeah, and then Joe sounds like, you want to live in my trailer park? And this guy's allegedly like a millionaire. Meanwhile they live like they are. I mean, it's just like absolute, there's no other word Craigslist zookeepers like, yeah, I'm like a hundred and thirty dollars away one or four Saints and he goes and then yeah, I love my employees. They're saying that it's just like his cult is the worst cult. At least doc Antell's cult. They get like they get you know, fake breasts and such like yeah, no, um, Joe exotics cult, they get expired Walmart neat. Yeah. The one guy's like, well, you know, lobster tails. You ever had a lobster tail out of the back of a semi that's that's been two weeks old. Sitting out back of a Walmart that's Choice, Man, Choice, Like, what is wrong with you about that garbage can full of expired Walmart beating There's like a nasty juice that runs out of the bottom, and the guys like this was still frozen. Someone is another human being is filming you for a documentary? Why are you? Okay? I think we'll get to that, but I am blown away by how much access that this director got. Like even when Joe is like hiding from the fens, he's like still being filmed. Yeah. Like but they're all like crazy egomaniacs that they just don't care. They're just like I mean, they're like sociopaths, not even egomaniacs, are just like, yes, this is my moment film me saying I'm going to murder this woman. Well, what's the only Yeah, the only thing they care about, and they say this is document The only thing Joe excited cares about is getting famous. So if that's the end game, he doesn't think about, Like, he doesn't think about anything else. And obviously, as well as we'll get to in the story, he's not a rational thinker per se. He doesn't. Uh. What we'll say is think before he talks. Um. I'm not sure if that makes him a right brain thinker or a left brain thinker. Probably more like a no, no brain thinker, just kind of lets it fly, which I really do enjoy. Um, let's get let's get to another detail. Um, Joe. You know, Joe is the king of the Misfits. As we've said, Um, he has a gift shop on the Zoo. And in the gift shop I made a few notes of what he sells there. He sells Tiger King barbecue sauce. Uh, he said, I sail Tiger King sex labe for girls and guys. Uh, something worse like or something sexy gel or something sexy jail. You can put it in your hair, all on your genitals. That's fine either way. And then he goes, he goes. He says, he says, you know, the bestseller in here is a Tiger King underwear. And then the documentary Eric Goods says, oh, do you ever wear the underwear? He said, Uh, No, I don't wear underwear. Free ball and I've always free balling And can you just imagine being that dude? Like the whole time I'm seeing being like the guy like the ship he is seeing out. Once you find out he puts a padlock on his dick piercing, it's no surprise I's freeing hanging up in his bedroom on the wall, which one will I put on there today? Also are all of his husbands, don't we feel like they're not very like evenly matched? Yeah, so that's my next note about about his husband. Now, So if you go back to Joe's early life now, and here's another thread that you'll find with all these people, they're all they all have been a used so severely as children, like as young adults are children. Joe Exotic tells a sad story of when he told his parents he was homosexual. His father made him shake his mother's hand or shake their hand and say he would never uh, they would never be able to go to his wedding. I can't remember what the dad's hand. Promised his dad in front of his mom that he wouldn't funeral funeral, So and later on those parents are brought back in his sympathetic figures, which I blows my mind, Like what the mom's talking. She's like, I love my son, He's the best and the dad just sits there silent, just to say a word. Um. But then so like this is what happens, is Joe exotic. He he is rejected by his family and so he uh drives his car off a bridge and breaks his back or breaks it, you know, is it's horribly injured. And end goes down to Florida for rehab and is introduced to these animals by someone while he's rehabing down there, and then uh, he falls in love with those animals. Like fast forward to when we meet him in the documentary. He has two seven tigers and it's is spending almost a million dollars a year just to feed him, like three quarters of a million bucks a year just to feed these damn things. Um. And like that juxtaposition is clear. But then you have Carol Baskin, who I believe it's hard to even to say that she was gang raped as a young girl and and tells that story again to your point, feel like these documentarians got the access of all acts of like they let everything fly and it becomes this like tragic tale of the weirdest thing you've ever seen. But all these people, all these people that are cult leaders are have are damaged in some way, and it's they made it's made obvious in the in the in the documentary, Yeah, I feel like Carol and Joe had like opposite storylines, Like one started like trying to save tigers and by the end was just like a murderer and just like only out for himself. And then the other one, Carol started out a murderer tiger tiger by your breeder for selfish reasons. And then I feel like at some point after she killed her husband, she was like, shit, I gotta like get right, like I can't, like you know what I mean. Like she went like full like straight edge, like everything's great, I'm saving the tigers. We're gonna get to Carol, because I think she she basically she was like somebody who was being interviewed by the police that just admits to their crimes without actually admitting to her crimes. At one point, she was like, if I would have murdered that person, I would have covered them in fish oil or whatever, sardine oil, Like, oh, is that how you would have done it? Had you done it? One of one of the best shots is like She's like, and then they started coming up with this theory that I fed my husband to the tigers, which is just crazy, like that's like when she laughs after she says that were my husband and I were, well, like did it she did it? She didn't. So so we have so we have these tragic figures that are just insane. Um and we know that the best selling. So if anybody out anybody out there, has a a jar of Tiger King barbecue sauce, I'd love to. I'd love for you to send that over to the th T headquarters so we can or if you if anyone has been to the g W is that what it's called g W zoo or what yep, the g tell us about your experience, if you've been there, or you've met this person, or you have had if you have tasted the Tiger King barbecue sauce, I would love love to if you've looped yourself up with the uh tiger any of that, any of his underwear? Yes, any of that? Um. So we already went to the workers. They're part of this cult. They're all misfits. They're all either out of jail or at the end of the rope they record. They recruited by Joe Exotic. They make a hundred thirty thirty eight dollars per week. They eat Walmart expired food. Uh, they live in squalor, and they work ungodly hours to kind of prop up Joe Exotic streme of owning the world. He's he's a true sociopath. And then you get to the animals at Joe Exotics. Do you remember Annie, how much money they make in the first twelve weeks of a cub's life. I don't remember them out, but I remember like after like some age, like very young age, or like we can't make money on them anymore. Yeah, So the first twelve weeks when they do cub petting people what's cub petting? Essentially, people come in and pet cubs to pay a fee to pett a club and get a picture with the cub. Obviously, if you know animals, you know that ain't good for an animal. That much human contact just isn't good for so many reasons. One of those reasons is, um, they're big tigers. They become big tigers eventually and can rip your arm off, which is what happens to one of the suit keepers in the show. But in the first twelve weeks of the club's life. That cub can be worth a hundred thousand dollars to Joe and you're talking, you know, he's breeding these things and at one point he says he has two seven of them. Um, so it's a it's a large business for him. Um. But are my favorite character of all And we're gonna rank our favorite characters at the end of this, but my favorite character of all is is Joe Exotics husband John Finley. And I gotta give props to the documentarians here. They interviewed this man with his shirt off the whole time, because like, I love that this genius, genius genius, I mean, has the tattoos of just like, uh, you know, he has a tattoo below his belly button that says property of Joe Exotic, among other tattoos. He has like a tattoo on his arm that says like hey Joe or something like that. I wonder, I wonder if that was his decision to get that tattoo. I wonder if anything was his decision. That's a good question. Ben. He was only there for the meth, which became clear at the very end. Yeah, And they basically just said that, like they're like, well, you know, why doesn't he have many teeth. I love how they explained why he didn't have teeth. Yeah, the math, They're like, well, it's it's it's not because a dental hygiene, a meth tangent about like how a lot of these guys were there because they were getting meth and they're a lot of drugs involved. And then just like cut to John Finley, who was like silent smiling. Okay. That's one thing I wanted to say is the the editing and this entire documentary was in edible. It and like just that, like the it's like if you painted the Mona Lisa were able to see the brush strokes like a shirtless a shirtless John Finley just popping up throughout the whole seven hours, just randomly to say ship that makes no sense most of the time. One time they show him like making a pork butt or something and I for what I but it's still beautiful. Most of the time they're like, did you love Joe? He's like, while I was there with him, that's that's That's one thing I love about the end of this documentary is like both of his husbands are like, well they preferred women but math. So yeah, they're like, tell us you about your relationship. I was such he opened my heart to love. It's like he had been trained, like these guys have been his second husband. When he first came on, like came on at the zoo, Joe was like, are you gay? And he was like no. And then he was like, well, when you watch porn, do you like seeing the big the big wonder, the more one. He's like, wow, the I guess the big one. And he's like, well, you're gay. Then that's how that works. Let's get married married a three way Matt wedding ceremony. And this this is where it's at this point. And if I could say this and somehow sound sane, it's at this point where it takes a turn for maccab it just takes it becomes it becomes a satire of itself, and like an onion, you just peel back the layers and it just keeps getting making it keeps making you cry for number one, but it keeps like it just keeps getting weirder and weirder and weirder and weirder, and you're never gonna get to the end of it. It's always like we just I don't think we know all the things that went on. I think we just got like the base layer of weirdness because we certainly didn't get to watch these guys smoking meth and do whatever they did when the cameras weren't on the footage burned up in the freaking alligator barn fire. Ye so yeah, yeah, yeah, so okay, so we're we gotta get it's gonna be five hours long. But so yeah, so that's a major plot hole. I'm like, come from up. Yeah, Yes, that's the huge question here, but a big, big thing just to to to further describe I think we just got toa further describe Joe Exotic. Then we'll get onto the other happenings of the film. Joe Exotic is a musician slash singer, but not really. He has you've already heard a few of his His big debuts into that world, which you know in general are I saw a tiger here, Kitty Kitty here, Kitty kitty, and I got about that one yet. We'll get to Carol Baskin in a minute, who haven't even really touched Um. I knew it was gonna go like this. I knew this is gonna be ten hours long. Um. Yeah, so he is a musician. But if you look at the videos which they show in the documentary, he neither plays the guitar. He has like one chord that is not the music that they're actually playing in the video. He plays one chord. He's not really even strumming the guitar, which makes no sense. And he is not he's either they've either digitally mastered his voice to make it unrecognizable or it's not even him at all. So you can you can, if you've got like an ear for it, you can tell if something has been auto tuned or or something that was not auto tune that is a different man's voice. Yeah, that's definitely. I'll defer to you, Phil, I'll defer to you in regards to like, that's not even him at all. It's not it's not even close. It doesn't sound he sings. They do this deliberately about halfway through the documentary, where he's driving in his truck. He's like, I love to jab in my truck and listen to myself thing, and then he starts to sing his own song and it sounds nothing like the voice that's on the radio. And this, and he is not self aware enough to know someone's filming him out himself for fraudulent music videos, or when he breaks into song at his second husband's funeral and it doesn't sound anything like no, I mean it's it would be like if if like if Garth Brooks, if Gilbert Godfrey was like I sing like Garth bro Yeah. No, oh no, I was just yelling at the TV. No, that's not true, you liar. I literally didn't. I just wrote a note on my phone. I was like, Wow, he's a really good singer. Now he and but now I see what you're they're saying. It's definitely not Yeah. At first, I was like, you know, it's not that bad. It's not him. Just definitely know. If I heard this on like country radio, I'd just be like, yeah, it sounds about right. Yeah. One of his songs, when you've heard, is called ass all the Tagger, and he's just like strumming. He's like, it's all the hunters to lay down their guns. And there comes John Finley with a shirt with a shirt on, this time toothless, holding an Air fifteen with a scope up to his eyeball, like you know, like somehow hunters are hunting cage tigers with air fifteen. So it's some other alternate universe that Joe Exotic has created. That's That's the thing I hate about. That's the thing I hate is when I'm I'm walking through the one through the woods and I see a guy holding the rifle up to his face and hunting tigers in America, it's a problem, it's a huge problem. But the meth community is big on hunting cage tigers with a fifteens. It actually might have been an a K forty seven. I can't remember the actual Actually, it definitely had pink camo, regardless of what kind of gun it was. I mean, he expressed his love for pink camo. Yeah. When when when a homosexual, polygamist zoo president is hunting tigers in the wild with an air of fifteen? We know, you know, this is a real depiction of a cultural you know, the cultural lineage in America of the big cat industry who ran for president. Yeah, yeah, we're not even I don't even know if we're gonna get to that. We're gonna keep going, We're gonna keep going. But but at one point, you know, Joe Exotic has an internet show that he's been doing by the time the documentary starts for a decade. Uh. And Rick Kirkman, who was a filmmaker and a reporter who's there to produce a reality show. He was he was one of my favorite characters in the documentary producer for sure, but still I feel like he was telling it like it was when they when they interviewed him the first the first like the only producer for that show, Like he could that no normal person could would have done that, Like he was the most normal person to be like other than the campaign manager to be in the whole thing. So Joe Exotic has this, He's got the the GW Exotic Cat Museum or whatever it is, and he um has an internet show that he goes on for ten years. It's just him with a green screen just saying random things. And the document the producer Rick Kirkman says he never had more than eight people watching it live through the ten years that he did it, which is another just great little thing about this guy. This guy will Joe Exotic would wants to be famous no matter what, and there's no no outside force that can convince him otherwise, Unlike if I had if I was eight years into a live internet stream and eight people were watching it, I might second think the state years in my life. But not. Joe isodic. He's keeps chugging forward, and so much so that near the near his demise, he decides to run for president and in the most shocking of turns, gets a spot like gets talked about on the What is It The HBO Show last week tonight with John Oliver, and I like, I don't somebody can take over here for a minute, because I'm just I gotta take a break and have a drink of white clone. What happens in the campaign seth oh, Well, I don't remember a whole lot about the presidential campaign, but I like the governor campaign of Oklahoma. Yeah. Well, the presidential campaign falls apart very quickly because he has no money and no support, and so he's like, well, I can either wait four years to run for president again, or I can wait two years and run for governor of Oklahoma. Uh as a as a libertarian, which is campaign manager is like, he didn't even know what a libertarian was, but he was like the campaign manager is one of the best characters. I think the best the best, the only normal person on the whole thing. Yeah, we have to we have to round out Joe Exotic by saying he's he's a crazy person to the extent where he shoots guns everywhere he goes. He's always carrying around a gun. He's always shooting Tanner, right, and he's always talking about this lady named Carol Baskins, a bask Baskin, who's his mortal enemy throughout the whole thing. Like I said, there's three levels of the show. And you get to learn who these people are, and then you get to learn their culture, and then you learn their feud, and then you and then it goes on and on. There's the layers. Carol Baskin, Uh, maybe is the worst of all of them, only because she's as crazy as Joe Exotic human. Yeah, but if you're gonna if you're gonna take just imagine if you're gonna take a crazy person and split them into and then you would say to the one one half of the crazy person, you're a liberal animal rights activists, and you would put them in a corner, and you would take the other half of the crazy person and you would say, you are you happen to be gay, but you're you're a right wing gun tote and redneck and put them in the other corner. They're the same person, just split into two and delivered in two different narratives. I mean it is like that is a part of this show. It's the Carol is the ego. See here's the thing. I listen, I almost agree with you. I do not like Carol basking is obviously a creep of a human being, but only one of those people almost definitely hired someone to murder the other one. So yeah, Carol, just straight listen. Okay, you guys, you guys are are are show in your hand. But I wanted I wanted to have it hold a whole discussion of whether or not we think Carol actually murdered her husband. We got at least we got at least six hours till midnight, so we can keep going. Is that where we're cutting it off? Yeah? Midnight cut off, cutting off. Yeah, that's what I get divorced. So like, what what there? There's so many parts here, But you're you're right, Phil, there's there's a different They like having exude different personalities. I think Carol is more cunning, smarter, more organized, than Joe, and that's kind of the only difference. They're both bombastic. They both are absolutely insane. If I got to see another clip of Carol Baskin riding a bike, uh, just like a serial killer riding around like American Psycho slow motion, riding a bike with a basket on the front, just like she's riding to like massacre people, and I was like, I got to see another clip of her, just walk at this riding a bike like this. It's awful. So that's her, right, But then you know, here's another clip of like, you know, a sex doll with Tanner right between its legs, and Joe exotic and is too uh eighteen year old husbands with no teeth are like shooting, and when he shoots the Carol Baskin, uh, like doll in the studio, in the studio, in the studio. But what's more disturbing and maybe overlooked this he puts Tanner right in the crotch of some sort of doll and then proceeds to film himself shooting at it to blow it up in a swamp somewhere in Oklahoma. Anyway, Carol Baskin is like, you know, she she's just like the devil and the angel on his shoulder, and they're like they are they're really it's really the story of the two of them. And she's an animal rights activist that wants to end all private ownership in the captivity of cats, and her husband what's her husband's name, Howard Howard, another great character in this calls her the mother Trees of cats, as we mentioned, but well, she thinks what sets her zoo apart from uh, from her animal sanctuary, she calls her hers is a set of cages, a set of fences and cages keeping animals enclosed and so they can't get out. She thinks her animal sanctuary is juxtaposed to another set of cages in Oklahoma run by Joe Exotic, where animals can't get out because she's putting them in there to save them from Joe until they die. And uh, she's just she's as flamboyant as Joe. She dresses a cat prince, she has cat luggage, she has cats all over her house. She would snort cats off a table if that was possible. She is a crazy like at one point she's like, well, I I couldn't have I didn't have any friends as a out. So I when I got old enough and I've met these tigers, I was like, these tigers can be my friends. Yeah, she is. She is a therapy session, just encapsulated in this documentary. She it just she has an army of trainees that work for free. Like we said earlier, there they get different colored shirts based on how long they've worked for free. She calls them interns. They were crazy hours, they miss holidays with their families. They seem brainwashed. I don't know what they think. They're saving these cats, and in fact, you know, it comes out within the documentary that most of the some of the cats weren't were born there, that aren't even rescued. The whole idea is that she's rescuing cats from other people like Doc Cantel and Joe Exotic and then putting them in uh in cages again and then eventually like giving them to other sanctuaries. Um, that part is the craziest part. But I would like you guys all to comment on. We'll start with you Annie. I feel like she just all she does is say things about other people that are true about herself the whole time. Yeah, I mean, she's exactly, Like she's exactly the same as Joe Exotic in my opinion, but this, like her demeanor is different and she's like mare calculated with what she's doing. And also the way they edited this is like they edited Joe and it's all like choppy and like high energy, and then her ship is all like tranquil music, slow motion hair blowing. But it's the same thing, like there's tigers in cages eating freaking raw meat, like it's the same. And so Peter has investigated her, and twoousand eleven they investigated Big Cat Rescue for not having like a breeding cat's number one, which they admit are at this um. Not all of the cats at the sanctuary had been rescued, and Peter was calling for them to stop these live tours. So because Carol Baskin is charging ungodly amounts of money for people to take tours of this place, they don't touch the animals like they do with Joe exact place, but they are still in close proximity to them, which stresses them out. And she has a gift shop where people can buy and make money, just like the gift shop in Joe Exotics place. Um, I'm not sure, if they sell sex loube there, I would say probably not they should, but I would buy Carol Baskin sex lube. I'm gonna If I'm gonna buy anyone sex loubs, it would be docks docks stuff. Yeah, we definitely know where your loyalty lies. Annie. So that's Carol Baskin. To tell her story, we'll have to do it shorter than we told Joe Exotics. But she uh had a lot of troubles as a kid, had a husband left. Well, somebody helped me out here. That's the craziest story. Baby. Oh my god. The gun, the gun in the passenger seat. Did you forget this, Phil? Give it to me, to give this one to me. This is maybe the craziest one of all what Phil? Okay? So this guy I don't even remember his name, was it John? It doesn't. I think it's this guy Don, married with the family. He's known to be a womanizer, is his He's driving around at night and sees a Yeah, multimillionaire sees a crying teenager walking down the street. And let's just briefly stop for a minute, just repeat what you just said. A millionaire's driving around sees a teenage girl crying, stops and then what happens now that just that right there, tries to convince her to get into the car because she needs some company obviously, and uh, she says no, keeps walking. He keeps driving along with her, says she keeps in now, and then he turns around like kind of loops around and stops again. He's like, hey, check out that on I just put in the passenger seat like he put a gun. Listen, listen, lady, get in the car. Pick up that gun and pointed at me while I drive. So you know that I won't do anything to you. I'm just here to I'm just here to you for you to have. I'm a shoulder to cry on. And then it cuts to her being like, so I got in the car and I and I spent the night with him. That night, she spent the night with them. They she drives around and he talks while she holds a gun on them, and then they have sex, and then and then they get married, thank god. And then and then she kills him for leading for legal reasons. I'm going to say allegedly, but continue, it's clear she has no lawyers listening to this are the things that I've done throughout the show. There's no lawyers here. That's why. That's why I'm saying asale. There's no one's defending us. I could be I am. I am three claws deep, and I've drank all my whiskey. I'm flying high. At this point, I can't, So we gotta, we gotta touch on. She killed her husband that was days away from leaving her, taking all of his all of his money away from her. Don Lewis's ex wife is also one of my favorite characters because she looks like one of the Golden girls. She looks younger than her daughters, and she just like that was incredible. She just yeah, she's just so. She hasn't aged a day. They talk about Don Lewis, they're like, yeah, his daughters even like, yeah, he liked to cheat on our mom's that's something that he did. If he had a flaw, it was that he cheated on our mother every day. And he talks about their father like that. You know, he was a horrible per person. So he leaves his wife and kids to go be with Carol Baskin. After this gun hole, I don't even know what's going he's holding guns on people. There's no way to describe this. Then they get married, and it's somewhere along the way they start buying cats, and it's like, of course they did, because they're crazy. Let's start buying cats and they have a cat sanctuary. I think it was originally called, like do you guys remember what it was originally called, like Cats of the Earth or some thing. Uh, they start arguing about, you know, don Lewis is a millionaire's a businessman, he's a Lasaria Alexario. He likes to cheat on all the women he's with and he so he is arguing with Carol about, hey, I'd like to breathe these cats. Carol would like to um not breathe them and like save them, and so they have this argument. Somewhere along the way, Donnie Lewis starts going down to Costa Rica and he gets himself a girlfriend in Costa Rica. She seemed to get girlfriends everywhere he went, and then and then eventually he's dead. He was in Costa Rica. She would she would new to all the all the cats so he couldn't breathe them. And so eventually, uh, he is dead and she kills him allegedly, Uh, she did it. And so he's he's been telling, he's been telling, he's been telling his friends, and he's like, listen, I'm gonna leave my wife. I'm gonna tell her I'm gonna leave her, and I'm taking all my money. She's not getting any of it. Files a restraining order against us for making death threats, which doesn't get upheld in court. So they find his van at the airport and and they're like, listen to this guy was actually gonna like skip down to like was it Cuba he was going or Costa Rica? Okay, and he he wanted to like sneak away. He wouldn't just like leave his van unlocked at the airport like he would he would have done something else. And uh yeah, So clearly like something happened. He didn't just disappear. And multiple he had multiple airplanes that he owned. Yeah, she couldn't keep track of how many air never said that like one of his airplanes were missing. Yeah. I though about too, I'm like, what this missing airplane? But she was like, I don't know how many had who knows? I don't know. Later I don't know. Later on we're talking about Joe Exo. She's like, uh, Joe Exoda got attacked by a tiger, and he thought that his people in his midst had like put oil on his shoes that tigers Like. She says, well, if you're going to kill somebody, you would definitely just put sardine oil on on their shoes. It's like O. J. Simpson wrote a book, like if I did it, Like, that's Carol Basket. Yeah, if the glove fits, Yeah, if the glove fits, and it fits in this case, it's so anyway, Carol baskin is is allegedly kills Don Lewis and feeds him to his tigers. This is a big rumor. And and then or puts them in the septic or puts him under the septic tank or whatever. No matter what, he's he's gone. She gets his money, she gets nine of his estate. He's raids the office, like his will raids the office, creates a will, includes in the will in case of death or disappearance or disappearance in the will. She wrote the new will, uh, and was like, I've never seen anything. No one ever writes or disappearance in their will, so obviously yeah, yeah, it's like I died by podcasts electrocution, Like, oh, that's weird. That's weird. It feels like all my money. Uh so yeah, Anyway, she gets rich and then uses this money to like lord over all these other people throughout the documentary. So that's Carol Baskin. I mean, she's an animal rights activist who keeps animals in cages and profits off a T shirts. And she has made a note about this, because this, I think is the most telling part of the documentary in terms of the first question I asked, why do people love cats so much? Carol basking at the time had two million views on her YouTube page for Big Cat Rescue, had like millions of followers on Facebook, and that just goes to show like the power of these cats. This is a an insane person who was going to lobby Congress about the Big Cat Safety Act and is essentially a social media superstar based on what I don't know, creepily riding a bike around like I'm not really sure, I'm not really sure what what happened there. So that we're gonna leave her where she is. That's that's her character. Now we gotta go to Doc Ansel for old Doc Beach Beach, South Carolina. Yeah, he this war over the animal rights includes like the godfather of uh big cats news, And that's dock Antel. What's his what's he make? People call him Bogdava or something like that. Well, that's his like legal first name, isn't it? And that means like that means like lord, lord of all creatures or something like. I don't want to make that real because it's because he's he has the myrtle beach zoo burtleb safari and he has again we've already talked about his cult. I just wrote down, uh actually and describing him in my notes, I wrote a lot of curse words. I'll skip over those. Uh. I wrote a guy that rides around on elephants, has multiple wives, and basically runs a cult. He thinks that showing animals to people up close opens their hearts. And while it's two tigers, they use money for the worldwide conservation. He's got a cadre of ladies who changed their names who come to live with him. Young ladies who come to live with him. They changed their names, They become vegetarians, they get breast implants and essentially go crazy and work like sixteen hour days and living as we said earlier in the podcast, they live in like roach infested horse horse like and and he has like he does sexy cat social media posts and calendars. And here's another guy that just just making money on everything cats. And he also did a bunch of Hollywood movies in the nineties and kind of gained some fame throughout that. Um he has early on he looks like a douche bag Yanni with his mustache, not Yannice, but like Yanni the not not not the lot via Eagle. We're not talking, We're talking about Yanni the musician. Yeah, so Yanni he's got and then he later in his life he he grows like a ponytail. Oh yeah, he was. He was tipping this like textbook cult stuff with this guy, Like he looks from Penn and Teller kind of yes, oh yeah, for sure. He's got the soul, the blonde soul patch yeah, like yeah and and uh and like in a Vegas on stage show. Yeah. So one of my favorite things about this guy, like when I'm going back to how the editing of this documentary was great, is that this guy when he brings the directors of this documentary into his house and his property. He just just just takes over. He just he's setting up the shots. He's telling them what he wants them to do, telling them his his ideas of how he was like the door, and I thought to myself, Steven Ronella would never do this, pretend to welcome his His whole demeanor changes when he's he's when the cameras are quote unquote rolling there, and like when he's just talking to the filmmakers, he's just like a total asshole when he's talking to the filmmakers, But then when it's rolling, he's like, oh, hi, it's me doc Anteli. Kind of welcome to my safari. And just like every other cult leader, like all his women have houses and they're all like, oh, Sherry lives there, but I made her change her name to Bala and you're like, come on, come on, China, California. So like, so the relationship here, this is the triumvirant of cults. The relationship here is that Joe Exotic idolizes doc Ansel and he sends people up. He sends his employees crackhead methodics to go and like stay there and study how he does it. Study the marketing of it, studying how to make a profitable enterprise basically at some point, so doc really is just that he doesn't really isn't really involved in anything. He becomes a commentator on the whole affair at the end when we get into the war between Carol and Joe and where the filmmaker, where the producer, right, uh, Richard Kirkman comes in. Well, it's it's, it's, it's it's at the like the last tech still the documentary. It's you find out that his his property was rated by the FEDS and in December of twenty nineteens, which is you know, super recent. Yeah no, And he's like, yeah, they think he euthanizes a lot of cubs and as like a gas chamber. I think it is. He even said, once the tigers become a certain age, they just become like an expense. Yeah they do, you know, yeah they do. Yeah. We said it's a twelve week thing. They can make money off of them, and then they become ridiculous dispense. I remember, you know, going back to my time in Texas, asking that the guy whose place I was turkey hunting, like, how do you afford a tiger man? What's up with that? Anybody's is like, well, they're very cheap to buy. It's just to feed them and the veterinarian bills. You know, it could be a million dollars a year just for those things. So it's it's not that you know, buying them as an issue, it's the it's the upkeep is the issue. There. There are two thousand dollars, that's like less than like a lot of dogs. Like that's like an iPhone. That's like an iPhone, you know, uh so similar. But so yeah, I mean that's so those are like, those are the characters. Those are the people that are kind of like at the center of what is a triumvirate of um cults all around this very powerful attraction to exotic tigers. Now we I think we've kind of worked through the first two layers. The third layer of this is the war between Carol and Joe. Did I miss anything? Are we are we like close to getting to the end of this? Yeah, I think we're pretty close. We've got we've got very eccentric personalities who own big cats and are exploiting them in different ways and are trying to just kind of yeah, when this this like fake battle they have going in their minds of exactly who was the tiger king slash queen. Uh so this it's it all kind of it kind of kicks off when our boy Joe Exotic, who at this point, let me let me just go, let me take well, I don't know where to go here. Let me just say, let me just pause for a moment and say that Travis Mouldenado, this is Travis, right, Travis Mouldenando yea his his second husband and second husband and the trio. I can see a lot of people being these three U guys that their wedding for Halloween. They're wearing like shiny pink button up shirts and cowboy hats are going to be I can see that being a big Can we please? Can we please do that? I just think it to be Carol, Carol, Okay, well I think we have to commit to this now. I want to be John Finley. Okay. I think I think I'm Travis because Seth's got the most the Joe Exotic. Yeah, I'm seeing that. I think that's probably right. I think that's probably I gotta be Joe Exotic. Yes, you gotta be exotic. The mullet now. So essentially, these are two straight men that Joe exotic has pulled into his world, given him a place to live, given them cars, giving them meth, and kind of like turn them into I don't know what. I'm not even sure how to describe their relations, but essentially they're all three getting married and they're wearing like bright pink button up shirts just they just like I just can't describe what they look like. They look like and they have cut this like pink cake. The whole affair seems weird. Nobody seems to be into it. Yeah, it feels very forced, where like he might be the only person into it and everyone else is they're kind of like, oh no, like should we stop this? I guess it becomes it becomes clear just a little bit later that John Finley is like not at all into this, Like he is not stoked about Travis being here. Yeah, so yeah, everything every commentary from the two husbands, John and Travis, they always hedge everything. Um, they're like, you know, I'm very happy with Joe, like whatever Joe told them to say, and then they get into like you know, how do you feel like good? That's that's about all they can do. So it's the strangest, most awkward, most obvious situation where this guy has used his power and kind of his the flare that he lives with and the things he can give these people to bring them in. He calls him husbands, but they could have just been members of the cult just as just as easily they come in. Travis. Travis's story is the saddest of all of them. They they're these these guys are all on drugs, They're all wielding guns, They're all doing things no one would approve of, you know, in in guns safety class. Um. It just is a crazy environment, it seems. And so I don't know who wants who wants to take on telling of of I don't want to tell the story, but I will just say, like you, basically, I feel like that the show starts right when Travis shows up, almost and you can just see the like deterioration and like how much he changes over whatever four or five years, Like it's like a different human being, just like all the drugs. I mean, I don't know what else are doing, but you're just like, oh no, what's going on with this Travis? He kind of shows up and then they like introduce his character, and they kind of like disappears for a while. Yeah, like they don't really show much of him, and then then they like bring out the whole drug problem and well like slowly becomes unhinged, and then you see more and more of him, like just shooting, Like he's really into like pointing his gun at ship shooting stuff. He's the one I think that shoots the Carol Baskin blow up doll in the crotch. Maybe. Yeah, he's definitely like the most excited about shooting about just like blowing ship up. He's just he's he's really just there for the thrills. Like he's he's there to get high and have a good time. Yes, And he's just he says, he's like didn't have a life before this. He's kind of drawn into this world as as a way to kind of have a life and have things he never had before and have acceptance and love whatever version of that that's there. And like, there there are many you know, we laugh, we joke, but there are many of like just very tragic moments in this and this is very much wonder Woman's like a young man who just is lost and thinks he's found within this group of people. But it only gets further lost, only gets you know, out there further by taking drugs and and be in this relationship. And I will say too, like when they go through the whole funeral thing at the end. Um, his mom is clearly math head. Math head. Yeah for sure, he probably did not have a great upbringing. No, and like he cleared he says that at one point. And eventually he's sitting in you know, Joe's campaign manager. What's that guy? Anybody have his name on hand? Uh? Got it right here. Um, there's so many characters in this this manage. Joshua Dial, Joshua Dial. He so he's like the only one of the only sane ones. He's somehow stumbled into this as a as a what seems to be like like his life. Yeah, he sees as some leinit list as like a forward thinking campaign manager with nothing else, no other jobs, and took this thing. So he's the narrator of Travis's death. Travis is waving around a pistol. I can't remember the making model, but I think it is mentioned within the show. Yeah, I think it's a it's a Ruger specifically, is trying to like convince the campaign manager. He's like, it's fine, Like there's not a bullet. There's like I don't have a clip in it, and there can't be a bullet in the chamber. Yeah, Like that the whole thing, like saying the word clip and like the whole description of firearms as somebody like who knows that the nomenclature. I'm like, oh no, if you're saying like there's no clip in it, and so it's okay, Like, well, that's not right. That's that's that's not right at all. Um So eventually is wielding a gun around jokingly. I feel like, tell me if I get the strong jokingly puts it to its head to prove it's not loaded, and pulls the trigger and shoots himself in the head and ties And there's security camera footage, yes, all of him killing himself, but it's like he's just off camera. Yeah you see the reaction, you see that, You see the muzzle, Yeah, you see the muzzle flash. And Joshua, Yeah, Joshua is never going to be the same. He clearly like throughout the throughout the whole seven hours, like degree like deteriorates throughout the seven hours and he comes out in the end, it's just like a bearded uh vagrant, like he just can't He just doesn't know what to do with his life now. And he had totally had like Stockholm syndrome because after that happened, Like before that happened, he was like, these bitches are crazy, get me the hell out of here. And then that happened in and he was like, felt so bad for Joe Exotic being alone because I think the other husband had left him too by that point for a woman that he got pregnant. But he was just like I couldn't leave him, and so we just stayed. You just stayed. There's no more campaign over presidential governor the campaign, so he just stays. But yeah, there's something weird that draws people to this that I don't know. So that's that's the saddest part of it, that this this young man that dies and then at the funeral it gets weird. Joe Exotic sings, makes it all about him, makes it a performance like he kind of always does. That's where the point of the documentary where you just gotta like feel everybody's exhaustion with Joe Exotic, Like you start to feel the palpable, just like this is getting old, This is not going to end well, Like this guy's losing it a little bit at this point. Right, Um, so where do we go next? Phil help me out here? Oh? He gone? Oh Phil gone, I think I think we should go to Uh is it too soon to go to the Vegas guy? No, that's what happens next. It's like that all happens and then kind of simultaneously, maybe the timeline is unclear, really like kind of jumped back and forth a lot. So ye, going to the Jeff Low, the Jeff Low. Yeah, So what happens is this is maybe the dumbest part of it. Joe Exotic feels like that the power of Google is helping Carol Baskin so much, because when you google big cat Rescue, you come up with big cat rescue. You can't. I'm listening to this, I'm like, well, you can't have that if you google. If you google a thing, you can't get the thing. And so and so he the sides to create Big Cat Rescue Entertainment, which is kind of his live touring show. And at this point, this is when he opens a window for and you know, this is when he's like shooting uh sex dolls that are dressed like Carol. He's he's just lying off the handle. And he Um creates Big Cat Rescue Entertainment, which is clearly a ruse, as some of the characters say to, you know, kind of steal the digital thunder from the actual Big Cat Rescue and our our buddy Howard. It's kind of feel like the mastermind of suing Joe Exotic Forement for infringement. They sue him, they win, and they go about collecting I think a million or two million dollar restitution of some kind. And this is where Joe exactly starts to slide into what eventually becomes the end of his his whole story, and he starts to get desperate, and he doesn't have any money. They're coming after him for all his possessions. They're trying to take everything he has, are trying to force him to stop pat cub petting and selling and breeding tigers. And incomes Jeff Low, and I will let Annie describe this person, Oh god, um like physically or just just freewheeling. We're we're two hours in. Just just let it okay. Jeff Low is another like big cat fanatic, but his kind of like deal is that he's really into like um Las Vegas strippers, clubs and like threesomes or just like group sex type things is what it seems like. He like he goes and has a party at like a hotel room in Vegas, and um tots a baby like tiger in via like a rolling suitcase and then brings it into a room and then let's like people cuddle it. He looks insane. He's like a silver hair and he wears a do rag under white guy do rag or some kind of banana under like a like a very large hat. And then he wears like that what's that ship that's like um oh, I can't remember the name of his may like faded ripped jeans. Jeans have so many holes in them. You're like, dude, you gonna be cold, like like you might as well just be wearing shorts. Man like he he just dresses like a teenager that's never had a mirror in front of Like he total scumbags. And he's like description or his like title there is whatever, like job description on the lower third is like businessman of business. I have a man of business, yes, And so he comes in as an investor quote unquote, and he starts to you know, rain chaos down on the GW Exotic Zoo Menagerie meth House. He he comes in and because Joe can't really if he owns anything, Carol will take it. If anything is owned in his name, Carol will just take it as part of the lawsuit. So he gives ownership a the zoo, the entire thing to Jeff Low after a whole bunch of things happened that to kind of buddy them up to each other. So we actually, for for the purposes of not giving it to Carol, gives it to Jeff. And that's where the whole the end begins right there, when he gives it to Jeff. I mean, if you look at that guy, I'm like, I wouldn't give that guy a ride to the airport, let alone, let alone my life's work. But that's such as Joe Exotic, he's losing his mind at this point, his husband has shot himself on the head accidentally. He's losing his mind if it wasn't already lost, and he's kind of he's got this cohort that is what is clearly just kind of setting him up to take his wealth. I think where we are, Yeah, it's I think it's pretty clear. And every once in a while Doc Antel pops up and just like gives a nugget of wisdom from my point of view, Like this story was honestly one of the filmmaking choices I didn't love where they just kept cutting the duck antle things. They're just to establish that like all these people were fucking crazy. It was. But the thing is is that like we all knew that he was fucking crazy, So it was like, how could he be the voice of how can he be the voice of reason? Like the omniscient narrator popping up going like, hey, guys, here's what I think. You wrote an elephant to the party. You're not welcome, go away. Never mind, I take it back. It was brilliant. It was brilliant satire. Almost You're like, I don't like, why am I listening to this person. He's like, you know, let me bring some levity to the affair here, I am. Let me stroke my ponytail a few times. I'm gonna go bathe my elephant in the river. Now watch, like what's he doing with his elephants? Like it takes the elephant to the river to bathe, and there's like a pontoon boat going by, and he's like, she's just in a river in Oklahoma or Myrtle beach or where he's like a myrtle beach just bathing an elephant, Like what is going on? And he is somehow the omniscient narror to come to tell us, like, yeah, I'll tell you what the real story is, folks, Like he's like Blue from the Jungle Book is coming. Yeah, I don't know. At this point, he serves no purpose other than the one you've you stayed at Phil, Like he just comes in and just says random shit, uh, for no reason, which I enjoy I like, I hated him so much every time he came on camera. Um, so where are we I He's got my brain is a race now? So Jeff shows up. He's there basically to steal the business, but he comes in to bail out Joe Exotic from his like lawsuit with Carole Baskin. Yeah, and we must say this, we talked about the whole like the presidential and government campaigns too soon, because this is when he starts running for governor and steals money from the zoo to pay for his pain, which I feel which I feel like should be okay, and he was using that money for campaign like bullshit, like condoms with his face. Yeah, so Travis, his husband is dead, His other husband runs off with a female co worker and has a baby, and that there's another guy comes like somehow two months later he marries another man. He meets another man on the internet, eighteen year old man on the internet, not even a man child another child he meets on the internet and like goes camp on campaign like whistle stop campaign towards and limos around somewhere in Oklahoma. And then it's it's like if you were on an acid trip that took too long. At this point, you're just like, well, when's this gonna be over? And when can I get off the ride? Because there's too many loop the loops and I'm be getting do we have to do another loop to loop because I've been through seventeen of them and he's going around. He doesn't he doesn't win the campaign. Sadly, Uh, it comes in third place, comes in third place, which I even that even that there was anybody beneath him in the voting is a shock to me. But he comes in the like of the vote of the vote, that's kind of a lot. Yeah, I mean that's amazing. That's more than eight percent of the vote, which is a lot. There's man, all right, Well, moving moving on as we get to kind of like where things start to fall apart. For for Joe Exotic at this point, he's crazy, fully on, just crazy. Jeff Low is brought in another basically serial killer to help manage the zoo because they can't find any other normal people and the way they keep describing how will come to work there, and it's increasingly crazy and guys like, well, you know, I used to be a felon and Jeff Low called me up and said you want to work at a zoo and I was like, well, better than going to jail. And then he just like it was running the whole thing. Alan, Yeah, I'm gonna start a company where I'm just like, what did you do? What did you do? Kill someone with a minivan? All right, you're the head accountant. I'm a really big fan of that. That tear drop tattoo, You've got it look stylish for me? What's that tear drop tattoo mean? Did the detattoo artist Trip and fall onto your face. Oh no, you murdered a guy. Well, you're running the zoo to take care of animals. Yeah, so Jeff Low. Jeff Low takes the zoo from Joe Exotic, which you know this is an obvious piece of the story, like that, there's no way that he's not going to do that. He basically says like, uh, the Feds are after you. There. The FEDS are working with uh the crazy tear drop tattoo guy. They're also at some point, Uh, there's a strip club owner named Seth. Help me out with a strip club guy, James Garrison and at some point maybe the best the best scene of this is my favorite sequence. It's like a ten minute sequence in the documentary when they turned into like they turned into like Oceans eleven where this guy becomes like an FBI informant and he's like so proud of what he's doing. He's like, I owned a lever and I've created a bunch of fake credit cards and I needed a way to get out of it. So I started ratting to the FBI, and I was like, you want to get Jo Exotic, I'll help I. And then it's like cut too, SloMo like wind in his hair walking by. And then and then the phone call between Jeff Low and uh, tear Drop Tattoo guy is well, maybe my favorite part where they they're like, well, what's this all mean? Man, Well, I'll tell you if we can, if we can give the Feds, Joe Exotic will be free ourselves. He's like, well what's that mean, Jeff? He's like, well, that means you tell a story in which there's a criminal and his name is Joe Exotic. That's basically they just set each other up like for the end result. And in all of this, in all of this, the man who loses is Joe Exotic because uh, he has said out loud many times that he would like to kill Carol Baskin and um sets off tear Drop Tattoo to go and do it. And do you do we all believe that that actually happened or are fabric I think it happened. He used the money from the Thanksgiving freaking dinner that was like supposed to probably support cats whatever he has a pot left. I want to thank my community for coming to the ship to the Thanksgiving dinner. Everybody put ten dollars in the kill Carol basketball, like fake crying. He was like, my family is dead. Have the stuff in first, but before you do, put a tender would bill on the bowl in order to pay someone to kill Carol basket And let's let's let's take an hour to talk about this point. We missed that that Joe Exotic burned down his own studio, uh, because he didn't want the footage from the reality show to come out pretty much incriminating and in many different things that showing who he really was. So he burned down the studio, burned down the studio with alligators in it. Why the why the alligators were in the same building as a studio, I have no idea. That was my favorite part is that there was even a sign on the building that was like, welcome to the Joe Exotic TV Studio and alligator alligator alligator room. That's my fair. He's like, they got my they got my alligators and my footage. I'm like, well, oh, you should have put those things in separate buildings. What are you talking about? Just had also alligators sanctuary. Yeah, here's here's the server and here's the alligator room. Yeah, it's like they they got my collection of buffalo and my collection are rare scooters from like, why are those two things in the same place? No wonder. Anyway, there's a lot of reasons why we feel like Joe Exotic burned down to everybody agree that we feel like Joe Exoch burned down his own building. Absolutely, he had that conversation, He had that videotaped conversation with his lawyer, and the lawyers like you know what you need to do? Right? Yeah, He's like yep and walked out. Yeah, you know what I need to do is burned down my studio Alligator Sanctuary. Uh. So that there, the Kirkman producer has been filming a documentary all this time, and he's got all this incriminating footage of Joe, and he's got a contract that says I basically owned you. I own your internet show. And this freaks out the lawyer and freaks out Joe Exotic. So Joe basically sets up a deal where he goes and burns it down and then goes on TV like I don't know who burned down my Alligator studio exhibit and I'm I'm in ruin, and then convinces all these people to help him rebuild and then take for free basically yeah, then shaves off a little money from the rebuild to pay tear Drop Tattoo to go kill Carol Baskin, which uh in a like a financially shrewd move. Nonetheless, he uh, this is the end of this is basically the end of Joe Exotic Right paid him three thousand dollars. So I don't I don't know where we go from here, but basically the FEDS catch up to this and easily, um take control of it because none of these people know what they're doing. Um, Phil, I'll let you kind of take us to to where we're gonna get to an end here. What do we need to say now? Well, I mean it's essentially Jeff Low and the strip club owner which I've already forgotten his name, even though we've already gone gone over it. Okay, they kind of team up to listen, let's throw let's throw Joe under the bus to make sure that that I don't get in trouble for beating my wife and you don't get in trouble for owning on the legal lemur and and stealing a hummer and creating a legal credit cards like uh, and so the you know, they get enough, they they they get Alan the tear drop man to kind of tell the the FEDS that like he's like, yeah, Joe gave me three thousand bucks. And I just I didn't go to Florida like I said I would. I ran away somewhere else. So Joe goes to prison and there and they're that free. Like none of them, at least for the time being, are kind of Scott free. Jeff Low is still presumably opening trying to open his new zoo, even though the documentary makes it clear that it thinks that he's just as guilty as Joe. There's a whole sequence where where I mean there's multiple witnesses that say that Jeff Low was was like helping Joe try to murder murder Carol. He's like looking up Google maps trying to see where she rides her bike during the day so that they can ambush her to to kill her. But Jeff, because he he cooperated with the FBI, is is you know, he's free. He's he's just he's he's opening a new zoo and uh and yeah, he's we find out that he's having a child with his wife, Lauren, and uh, and he has one of the one of the skeeviest sequences in the documentary. He's he's clearly he's clearly not not excited at all to be having a child. And he's like, as soon as Lauren has his baby, she's getting back in the gym, and I'm gonna screw our new nanny. Yeah. I've never seen anybody like tender a nanny before, but this is what this guy's doing. Like, you gotta tip your hat to the documentarians here, because they got These people are crazy. Who knows what they would say or not say, but somehow he got them to say all the perfect things. I mean, I just can't imagine me coming to someone saying I'm filming a documentary and then you know, Jeff low is showing pictures of the nannies he hopes to have sex with it. Just it just seems so outlandish, some of the stuff they got on camera. I guess can't imagine. I don't know what to do with it. And I don't know if we want to talk about the end yet, but yeah, we should get there. We should get to the end. At the end, John, that John Rinky guy that lost his legs, he's like, why isn't Jeff getting in trouble? And he calls the FBI and they tell him that, like this whole thing is far from over. Yeah, yeah, but it's all getting shut down or shut down. Yeah. I don't there's no way to know how to end this story. But I feel like Joe Joe. I mean, it's let's say, say Joe exout goes to jail. Of course, yes, Uh, there's a million things that he's done and not done to to to I would say, land himself in this situation he's in Uh, he's the one that goes to jail, which which it's kind of ironic, right, And we said in the very beginning, like he comments at the end of how weird it is and horrible it is and what life in a cage is like, which I feel like brings it home in a poetic way that this is just all of this is a commentary on you know, the type of person that would uh take on an endeavor like this and what you know, kind of the insanity that they have to hold. And then this one man who comes emblematic of the whole culture, the whole story. He's in a cage. Once out of the cage um and at the same time, all these animals that propped him up for so long remain there Like that to me, is the ending. Do you guys feel like there's other things, endings, other versions of the narrative that need to be addressed Seth No, I think that covers it. And I mean I feel like it's only a matter of time before Jeff Low goes to jail for something or other. Yeah, I don't know that. I don't like love the ending of this. I just feel like the um the sad part is there's like kind of no justice for all these animals in captivity, and that's I mean, they they try to make that point at the end of the documentary, like literally the last two minutes. Quickly it becomes just like they're like, Okay, you've watched this documentary for the last seven episodes, but don't forget about the tigers. And they kind of they give you statistics and and they honestly like this this part kind of was like heartbreaking to me. They show some really old footage of Joe Exotic where he seems like a completely different person, where it's like when he first opened the zoo and he's talking like he his mind is in a completely different place. He honestly, I mean maybe I'm maybe I'm naive, but he seems it seems like his heart's in the right spot where he's like he's honestly trying to like do good for the Tigres, whether or not it's like the right way of going. But like he uh, I mean, they he becomes a different person just he's he's like warped by the fame and the money throughout the document that that the documentary and they kind of they the big kind of period at the end of the dock is like, don't forget about these animals. Um, like there's more in captivity in America alone than there are in the wild. And uh, you know, I don't know. I thought it was poignant. I I kind of there was a part of me that was hoping that it would still come back around to Carol and it would be like and actually Carol did murder but that but that never happened. Um, but I don't know it was I mean, it was entertaining a list of questions that I have here and I've kind of looked at like that we have that they are left unanswered Um, we already covered a lot of them. Is this really Joe? We can just answer yes or no. Is this really Joe singing voice? Yes? Absolutely not, absolutely not. Is Jeff Low going to jail? Yes? Yes? Yeah. Uh. Did Joe really think he would become governor? Yes? For sure. Yeah. I think president was maybe a stretch, but I think he really thought that he had a chance for governor. Did carol Killer husband? Absolutely? Probably, allegedly probably. Would each of you take a picture with a baby tiger? No? No, not not the tigers? Yeah? Would you let me film you SlowMo jet ski? Uh? What's up with Howard Carol's husband? Yeah? Is he like a lawyer? Like? What's his deal? I have no idea. I got a noise of ship out of me. Yeah. He was just kind of a weird antagonist in the whole thing. So I just wrote down, like, what's up with Howard? Why? Um? You know, clearly he clearly has like no authority in his relationship, so I think he just tries to take it out. He tries to take it out on Joe Exotic Big Time Beta. What what about all the other animals at the zoo? What happens with the bears? And the wolves and all the other things that that that are kind of like side pieces to the tiger. I don't know. Hopefully they go to a good home. Okay, last last question that we need to answer. Who do the which character are you on BuzzFeed? And we do that too, We can do that too. What makes Carol better than Joe? I think she grew a conscious eventually, so now she's trying to do the right thing, not breeding baby tigers anymore. Like she's not raising tigers. I don't know. And this is listen, this is where this let me just I kind of am prepared to do this thing. This is where this becomes analogous to this podcast and kind of like what happens within the animal rights world. Everybody kind of has their their angle or their view on wildlife or their view on animals. Everybody cares about them in their own way. Yeah, I got you. I think. I mean, just to bring it back around, I think it all comes down to whether or not you think Carol is a is a murderer, because I think I think we can't agree that her motivations as far as like big cats go, it's it's it's not I feel we think it's like mostly selfish. She she operates under the guys that she's saving these cats, and she claims that she obtains most of these cats from places where they would have otherwise been euthanized or or um uh you know, taken advantage of and so she keeps because they can't just be introduced back into the wild. She gives them a quote unquote like happy life until they die. Um. It's so it kind of depends on whether or not we believe her story and we think that and if we if we think that she killed her husband or not, because otherwise I think we can agree, like personality wise and ego wise that she's pretty similar to Doc Antel and Joe Exotic. I mean, she is still profiting and not paying her workers, and uh, you know, I guess you could make the argument that like, well, you know, she needs to keep the lights on, so you know, she's got a profit in some way, but she's still operating a zoo and uh, you know, I don't know. I think I would argue that she is slightly better than than than Joe and Doc, but that's just that's you know, I feel like we're kind of splitting hairs here. Well, that's the question. It's Carol better than Joe, So Seth, give it, give it to us. I don't think I I developed a strong like hatred for that woman throughout the whole series. I just she's just a slime ball dress up with her for Halloween. Yeah. I just think she's doing all the same ship that Joe is. You know. I think she's definitely covering covering up her husband's death. Um, I think she's doing like as far as the cats, I think she's doing the same thing. She's profiting. She using the cats to make money. Um, it wouldn't surprise me if she's actually breeding them in some sort of way where she was like totally against that, which they didn't they show like in her early early life with these cats, she was breathing them, Oh for sure. Yeah. Yeah, they had traces a lot back to Don Lewis. But yeah, for sure, she definitely did that. Yeah. I don't think she's any better than Joe Ane in my opinion, what the same question, same question. Yeah, I agree with Seth. I think she's just as bad. Like okay, yeah, I mean, yeah, I obviously agree. I think like I said, I think it shows a lot about our intentions. Everybody on the like everybody in the outside, is expressing value for these animals, and and they're doing what they're doing behind closed doors to make sure that they profit and get what they get what they want from the situation. And each of them has created a narrative to kind of shield their intentions, even though their intentions kind of change over time. Like Phil said in opposite directions, that changes over time, but they're both kind of corrupted by, you know, their own wants and desires um in different ways. So you know, I won't go too deep on it, because this is the craziest thing that ever was created. Uh, And it's like so I guess we'll close by. I'll close by saying on my own, my own thing, like I think, coronavirus, pandemic, tiger king, all of it like that there would it wouldn't have been this popular in any other setting. Like it just hit it at a time where we were thirsty for distraction, thirsty for people crazier than us, and like just thirsty for Ah. This exactly this, even though you can't really define what it is. I agree, I don't. I wonder if it was supposed to drop at a different time and they're like, Oh, everyone's at home right now, Like now is the time to drop this ship on Netflix? I have no I hope they're that smart, but I mean they're they're there. Just is this just is a moment in time. And when I think back to the quarantine and the pandemic, I will just I will think of Tiger King and I don't I don't know what that means, and it's very confusing and I feel silly, but that's true. Well, I mean, here's the I mean, Joe Exotic wanted nothing more than to be a celebrity, and I feel like he's more because of this global pandemic. He's going to be more famous than never. Sure, he's it's very possible, probable he's going to die in prison. But you know, uh, is this what he wanted all along? I don't know it would be. That's an open question. Well, thank you everyone for for being a part of whatever this was. And I hope there's a season two. I really do. I feel I feel like there's more of the story. There's a layer of this story that we just didn't see that we should have seen. So let's cross our fingers but thank you everyone, and we will see you next week. Bye bye. So that's it. That's all Philip. I am worn out, buddy, worn out. I'm not sure what to say other than I'm glad we did that. Yes, I this. I think this was needed, this after after two weeks of quarantine casts and just two weeks of quarantine. And if you're working or in quarantine, I hope you enjoyed, if you enjoyed these last two weeks. Ben Ben worked his ass up putting it together, and I think this is a good capper for the last two weeks. We've got one more week of the quarantine cast coming up, but this is a good this is a fun episode. Yes, I have enjoyed doing the work. I've enjoyed kind of corresponding with all of you out there. Um. I've enjoyed telling hunting stories with my good friends and colleagues. I've enjoyed all of it. Um. And when I could say that that everybody needs a distraction, like, hopefully this can be your distraction and it's also mine and I think fils as well, so because we can do this. But I think exactly what Phil said is true. The Tiger teen documentary the whole story, the wildness of it, the layers to it. All of that brings to the four that we all need some catharsist during this time, and I'm glad hopefully this podcast helps. Hopefully that seven hours of document documentary work UM by Eric Good and his crew helps. UM. It's all just about let's let's remove ourselves from from whatever stress and anxiety we have and enjoy what is a uniquely American and a wild as hell story. And that's uh so. Thank you to everybody involved in making the documentary, Thanks to seth Annie and of course you feel for being a part of it. And we will see you next week for the final five days of the Quarantine cast here at th HC. Thank you all again, have a good weekend, go outside, don't watch any more. Documentaries by The Hunting Collective with Ben O'Brien is a part of the Meat Eater podcast network. It is produced by Karne Schneider and engineered by Phil Taylor. You can find it on iTunes, Stitcher, Spotify, the meat Eater dot Com, or inn where podcasts are downloadable Wherever you listen, leave a five star review and subscribe. H

Save this episode