00:00:05 Speaker 1: Well, hold on a minute, let's not get started quite yet. I got one more thing I want to tell you about. Thanks for listening to add so far. This is Janice but tell Us, co host of this podcast most of the time, and I want to tell you about the TRCP Annual Capital Conservation Awards Dinner sweep Steaks. It's going on right now. You can participate up until midnight September twenty nine, okay with The grand prize is for these sweep steaks is a two day trip for the winner and one guest to southwestern Michigan to hunt the famed Eastern Wild turkey with none other than Stephen Ronnella and myself. We did it last year. We had a crew that came in from Colorado, had a great time. They all killed mature times. I even snuck in a jake right there at the end. It's twenty five bucks for ten entries. Okay, it's cheap. Even if you don't win, you're supporting conservation, You're supporting t r c P, who is constantly working for all Americans to have a quality place two hunt and fish. Because it's super important, folks, So come on chip in at least do the minimum. You know, entry fee there to win, which, like I said, you get ten chances for twenty five bucks. You can go up from there. I can guarantee you it's gonna be a who There's gonna be some awesome stories told, lots of laughs, and good hunting is almost guaranteed. I promise I will work my ass off to get you on a big old gobbler there in southwest Michigan. It's super fun. So everybody please go to t RCP dot com and look for the annual Capital Conservation Awards Dinner sweep steaks and apply Help Conservation, help yourself get a chance to come hunt with Stephen myself. Thanks. Now met your gast This is me Eat podcast coming at you shirtless, severely bug bitten and in my case underwear listening to me EA podcast. You can't protect anything presented by first, like creating proven versatile hunting apparel from Marino bass layers to technical outerwear for every hunt. First like go farther, stay longer. So Crean, do you think you're big time engineer? Now? Now we just to fill in for each other. Here's the deal between I've started realizing between you and Phil is when you're gone. Feel kind of acts like he knows what you're all about. What's your job is all about? And now I see it's it's a reciprocated Well it was, you know, he kind of did like a little tutorial with me for the soundboard. You look like you're like your DJ and a wedding or something. Your seats higher, your seats higher, and everybody else. I'm on the least comfortable seat. It's a high stool, but I chose a lower of the high options we have. And you guys can send the comfortable poets. Oh, you're great up there. Thank you if you want. Man, we got ahold. This is like a this is a giant lip cancer convention. Well, I don't know. Like, so Taylor, we call you. Are you spitting that thing right now? No, I've got my mouth dropt from being out here. We just got out here. You're not gonna pack one in now. I was sending it right now. Are you gonna spit into that little deal? No, it's in there right now. Yeah, I just go up top with the pouches. That's why I switched to the pouches. So I can I can save h I can I can do it while the sound check. Yeah, we're yeah, I want I want to get into that upper deckers and all that, and Jared, we're gonna get We're gonna do intros. We're gonna end on Jared, he's gonna explain that little that little Halloween themed um spatune. They still called the spatune. Yeah, yeah, that's a portable spatuon. So you can tell you with you it's not one of them old brass one and it's got a big well let's just talk about right now. It's called what it's a mud jug, so it doesn't spill. Now, it doesn't spill. It's got a weight to bottom and uh, you know you take the punel right off with your two thumbs and wash it out. Women love them. I can imagine smell resistant. How many how many days can you chew before you have that thing full of spit? I mean it just depends on the dipper, I guess, but like me, probably two days. Can we describe what this is? Jared's on a podcast. Yeah, it's so I'm gonna go out of order. So what was that? So Taylor called the musician. You've been on the show before, but you're back because your album's coming out, and then we're gonna skip. We're getting a round of some other people and then um, Jared outlaws here. Yes, how the hell you describe yourself? Like, uh, just a guy, like a guy. I'm just a guy, like like a very very popular. Like you got into YouTube. We'll talk about all this. Yeah you got into YouTube, like doing funny stuff. Yeah yeah yeah, and then uh yeah doing outdoor, doing outdoor stuff like fishing and on. But then it seemed like for a while the only thing people cared about was what you got in your lip, and that was like kind of the start of me like a dip content pretty soon, like just making vidges about dip. They just they just do uh can you can you explain something real quick? Um? And then I want to get to this petune Taylor you Oh, my wife's going to thanks for those tickets very well. Is that sold out? It's been. We set it up ten days like prior to coming out here and sold out in a couple of days, which is nice. So and my neighbor likes that venue a lot. That's where we record. Let me tell you a little bit of local uh something. We record v O four our Netflix show at that same place. Really, they'll smell me in the circle and uh yeah, my wife's going to see I gotta I gotta live town. But my wife's gonna check you out. Anyhow, he was saying. Taylor Becaull was saying Jared that when he was seventeen, he used to watch your dip videos. I don't even know what the hell that means. I don't. He's like, I kind of know him because we used to watch his dip video and I used to have this routine. I would before my parents got home. I would scurry home, smuck a little grass, order pizza, and put in a dip and dip and watch his videos till my parents got home, and then I had to hide the dip can in the grass and then pizza would be going. Then we're saying, all you said is it's not the first time I've a ritual, man. Yeah, especially in the early days of like dipping. It's kind of like, I don't know something about it. Just it's like, I don't know, watching a hunting show while you get to kill something. It was I think it dipping as the thing, um not being not a dipper myself, I didn't think of dipping as a thing where you took in media about it. Now weed smoking is always been a right, right, Yeah, Like that's like a whole genre of there's like a music film right totally, it's got its whole thing, totally, the whole thing about it now it is like you think country musicians like they'd be dipping in stuff where it's like it's actually kind of on its way out in the industry. And I feel like one of the ones that's like I'm I ain't afraid to be a little man sometimes, you know what. I know what I'm saying, you're young enough to still be man. Yeah, okay, Jared, uh I got no question for you. Um one thing that I took interested me about you is, uh you did a couple of seasons commercial fishing in Alaska, like person or what. No. So, first year was setting it. So I went up there and um that's where I mean setting heating is basically all by hand. And the first year was in the cook inlet out of Keen Eye, and uh so that was that was brutal as far as um. I just remember the captain that I had, like when he was calling me, I was living in Florida at the time, and he would call me. He's like, are you strong. You gotta make sure you're strong, and uh I was like, yeah, I'm strong man. I've been to the gym like four times. And uh so I went up there and you know when I was I think I had just turned nineteen and um so first year was setting it and then I did a little bit of cod fishing and halibut fishing around there, and then second year went up for the cod was it traps pots? Yeah, and so baited and they just got like wings go out. Yeah, so you you you can beat them. And then they have like you can long line for him to kind of the same way you do halibit, Like you'll go out in your longline holibit and you can you know, rock cod or something like that off the bottom um. And then the second year went out and I was on a guild that boat in the barn Sea. So I was in out of Port Mooler, which is Gilnton for what salmon in the summers. So uh yeah, so you're I mean, you're you're catching everything from red silver's, pinks kings and uh like gilnuton in the estuaries. Yeah, and you're we would basically just run the Allusians and all the way up to like you know, we're uh where uh, what's the Deadliest Catches filmed in Dutch Harbor were like just south of that or just east of that and uh and you're kind of just throwing through the islands and just trying. How old were you when you were doing all that. I think I was. I turned twenty one on the barn Sea and I didn't even know it was my birthday. It was like, uh, I think that was my last year up there. Yeah, you were just like in the haze of daylight. Yeah, we were the salmon run hit. So my birthday is May and so the salmon run hit. Uh. The red started running like a couple of days before my birthday. And I think we went like I mean, I don't even know, I don't I can barely remember because we never slept. Like when you watch Deadliest Catch, it's no joke, like it's you just don't sleep. Especially music. Yeah. Yeah, so uh so I was up probably in that time for over two days straight. Um. And plus my I I had the shitty end of the stick because my captain had arthritis, real bad so he couldn't pick fish. Yeah, yeah, yeah, well this is this Yeah, this is my second year. Yeah, and uh so he had our throats real bad in his hand, so he couldn't pick fish. You know when you're when you're you're picking fish. I mean, it's a lot of work, and it's a it's a quarter mile long net and so your in it in on the hydraulic drum and you're you're just slowly picking fish out. And when it's the run, you've got ten thousand fish in the thing, you're pulling kings over and he's just standing there looking at you, like, go faster, faster. Are you sorting all those fish as you pull them off? Yeah, So we had like brailers in. We had like so on this I think they call him Bronco boats. But the so ever, you do all the work off the stern of the boat and the wheelhouse and everything's up front. It's not as big as the boats you see on you know, Deadly's catch. But um so the gill net is directly in the center on the on the back, and you know you you've got fish holes directly unto that. So we have the tops open sometimes like during the samon run. We would just be I'd be picking fish and and just throwing them on deck and then sorting them later, because you're just trying to get him in, get the net back in the water as fast possible. But you we're you making good money doing that? Uh? I didn't. I thought, you know, everybody kind of goes up there thinking it's kind of he goes out to get rich. When I was a graduate school, my roommate would go up and do uh he'd do the cannary runs. Yeah, yeah, yeah, but he come back with some decent money. Man. If I wouldn't do anything for months afterwards, well, if I worked for like Peter Pan or something the canaries up there, I would have made more money, which I would have hated that. I mean, at least when you're on that boat fishing, when you get you know, you get killer whales coming up and humpbacks and you get to see ball eagles all the time and stuff. Again. But but uh, yeah, the cannaries is rough, you know. Um, it's not like his adventurous Yeah. But I mean if we like the two years I was up there, the salmon runs didn't produce very well. Um, I kept trying to remember the years I was up there. I think it was two thousand, ten and eleven. Uh, two thou nine and ten maybe, and the sand and runs just weren't producing that well. And um that second year. I mean, when you're a fisherman up in Alaska, it's all about networking. It's all about who you know, the captains. You know. I had a job ready for me on a crab boat that winner, and uh. I came back home and I was like, yeah, I don't know, I'm gonna go back up. Man. My guy like, they don't guarantee you. They give you a percentage, you know, but it's uh from what I was here, and they're just like, you know, I mean, I'd rather go back to Yeah, so that what's up, Dirt? I have a dip in commercial fishing. Little story. Yeah, so I did a season per saneing, but I haven't I haven't reintroduced yet. I'm dirt. Yeah, you know what you're like famous now? Me and Chester working our asses off, making that boneapp video with Bradley on and then you get famous off and you weren't even there. There a spirit and actually I've had more people recognized me and Helena from that video. Then ye stuff. Yeah, me and Chester could have been saying good stuff about ourselves, right, but I'm like, oh, I'm the greatest man ever, you know, Brassle the bear whatever. I could have said crazy stuff, but stead we talked about how cool you were, and they made like a thing about how a cool yard. Now you're like famous to be a Chester just nothing. Well I'll share one now that I'm famous. When I see an opportunity, all oh, I let you guys, let people and they better put a graphics element in like that the Bona people did for you. Yeah, that was nice. It was really nice. Made me smile. Oh, super famous. I know, I feel different. No, I got I got nervous seeing you come in. My hands are shaken. Jester's dirt man in person. But no, this is you know, like you I'm the one set because you realize we souls. We're going to talk about this petune, this is DIEP related and I just want to make sure. So yeah, I did per saning out of Catchkan or near there, and uh, we sometimes do sets for the hatchery, and so we had a tender that would come up. We'd you know, we'd purse the net and then they'd come. We wouldn't put it on deck. We put the fish. The tender would suck the fish out of that is right, Yeah, for the hatchery because then they transformed when it goes to that. Yeah. But so one of the tender operators, this guy Justin, he'd he'd have a dip in, he'd be smoking and he'd be doing the sniff snuff. What's the term for that snuff? Yeah, you know, I mean like when you're doing like three tobacco products, the trife, that's the thing. So but so he's doing, he's doing he's kind of I mean, I was young and I was a cure, but I was like, that guy's definitely going overboard. A month later passes, they come back out. I said, where's Justin? And now they're the tender captain said he was in the hospital for internal bleeding. What's that called internal bleeding? I feel like ruptured something ruptured artery. No, No, he was in he was in the hospital because of it something like that. He'm a topin or something memorrhoids. So he was in the hospital dirt here because because of the overconsumption of nicotine products. Yeah, So the next time he comes out, he's in the hospital for overdoing it, you know. So they admitted him for like too much tobacco, yeah, which caused the internal bleeding. And so when he came like a month later, they're back out and he's back on the boats. Oh, good to see justin glad. You're good. He's smoking and chewing still, but he's not doing the sniff to that was his. But he cut back. He cut back one of the tective pieces he did. He did a thirty three percent reduction up the people up in Alaska, man, I mean, when you're talking about nicotine up there on fishing boats, it is insanity. Case explained to displaying the deal the mud joke. Yeah, I tell your story first. Yeah, it's about that. Well, we'll get to this by the end of the entire duration. Years ago, years ago, I was day and a flight attendant, and I remember we're out one of our first ever dates. Man, and uh, we're out shooting pool at a bar and like I went to have sipped my drink but it wasn't my drink. Yeah, yeah, and you know what, I just grinned and bared. I didn't say anything to her about it. Could tell what it was. Listen. Oh no, nothing, because I'm not like I don't that. I'm not that level of an aficionado. Man, I'm not like like, I'm not like I didn't. I've never been on the car. You should if they ever come out with another issue a dip aficionado, Jared should be on it. Ye see that one and only. Oh yeah, you're sitting next to him. You're sitting right next ptographs after the podcast. Yeah, that's the guy right thereado. Now I'm shaking. So oh I took it big gulp and that is just like dah didn't mention it, didn't spit it back up. I didn't mention it, just rode it out from I could take you to that barn, show you right thing of sitting now, that tease that up, because that solves that problem. I would never I mean, this is why it was created. You know, it's got a weighted bottom so it won't spill. Can I see a clean one? But yeah, so you have it's spat there, you know, and then you it's got a little tab on the side or you can put you and put your tongue on her deck guy and you can pop it up. But um, yeah, you here, it's not threaded, just a little na oh. I see, yeah, there you go. And so it's just like, you know, it looks like an old spittoon. But you know, you can do a whole bunch of custom stuff. So we didn't meet either. My jokes for y'all. That's great, man. Yeah, then you leave that around the house. You're not spilling it. If it tips over, it doesn't dump out. I was saying, I noticed that you guys generally like to. Like when I was growing up, people like to. They really prefer to do it into a mountain dew bottle. Yeah, yeah, do bottle. Yeah, And for some reason, nastar like to spit. So back in high school, we used to cut the tops off the mountain dew bottles. So you cut it like halfway up and then you flip it over and you put some tape on the tape here and do you wait at the bottom. No, I mean you could you can throw something to throw rocks in the bottom, sure, man, but yeah, that's what we used to do back in the day. So you sell this product, Yeah, those are my jokes. How do they how to folks find this? My joke? Dot com gets Drew and you r L and everything. Yeah that's awesome. Yeah all right, so also joined by Drew. Explain yourself. I'm Drew Laskey. So I'm Taylor McCall's manager. I worked with a couple of other artists to John Goulsby and Olivia Wolf and I'm just here to hang out and lets see what's going on is Uh he's a decent manager. Yeah great? Was that a week? Taylor? Yeah? I could Taylor tell everybody real quick, what's up with your album? I've been sitting on it. We recorded it in November, so I've been sitting on it for a little while. And we just got these vinyl and c D of graphic and everything, the full package in a couple of weeks ago. I think it's gonna be a big hit, man, I believe. So. I like this album, Thank you man. We listened like we listen to it so much it Uh, like I said, we broke it. Yeah, yeah. In our camper, we have a CD. That's a good problem to have in our camper, we have a CD player, and uh we only keep a couple of CDs in there. Totally totally and busted it. I keep bringing keep outtakes all the stuff that didn't make Exile on Main Street. That that's in there, and your thing, Yeah, Ben, the Latter Blues you got that one in there? Is that? Is that one of the tunes on What Didn't Make? It's What Didn't Make ex amazing. That's one of my favorite records. Um, and then we have a Typhoon album in there. Nice. Now we're back up to three. How did you do three sides to record? So it's got Drew? Can you explain that you might be better? Yeah? So basically it's saving money instead of split it off on the four sides and put it on three. You know, well, there's two records in this record. The issue was running too. We would have had to, like, there's so much like an intro and outros, my grandfather singing on here and U. Not too many people these days are putting nine minute songs on vinyl, and that creates you know, you need more, more records. So that was the most efficient way. You need to give out a record player with this something bitch, because no one's got a record player people. Yeah, I mean that's coming back in. That's coming back in and people are listening when they're selling vinyl at Walmart. People got a record player. Yeah, yeah, that's coming back around. Man. I'll tell you what if if I when I was just at my mom's house, we went to visit with my kids and everything. Once the you know, once it looked like the pandemic was over, went to for a minute, whatever that was, whatever that two weeks was. We went to visit my mom and man, she still got I don't know where it came from. I get like hundreds of scrap that I'm exaggerate, dozens of these all that stuff from that era. It's like Jay Giles band, arial Speedwagon, whenever the hell all that was happening. Totally, it's just a piece of I mean, it's like the front. It's to me, it's like it's everything. It's the art, it's how the list is in order, and uh obviously the music, but it's it's I don't know. The vinyl was like something. Instead of watching TV. I used to just get a new record and just cut the TV off, you know, blast of speakers and eat my dinner. And it was like a nice, i don't know, refreshing way to have an evening, you know what I mean. That's you kind of that's kind of a piece of that. You can sit down with someone and say, you know, let's listen to this thing all the way through rather than all we have the option to skip or like psychopath people that listen on shuffle. You know that's you know, you know you don't have that option. You gotta listed the way the artist wants it. So, uh, what what did you play black Powder Soul last time you're on the show. Was the first to hear it? Yeah? And what do you play this time? Hell's half Acre? Something figured out? I kind of just don't come in here with agenda, just kind of free form it. Remember when he had write that Diddy about Yanni? Yeah, I saw some comments on that side and that boy can't write no ditties challenge good blues musician bad did he write? Okay, I'm okay with that. You're you're like, your focus is Diddi's big, big time in the ditty's um And then Shasters here, Hey, everybody, Chester's here because he's he's here because he likes to be in on anything that has to do with tobacco. This is like a collection. I'm here. Yeah, I just like I was like, you know, who else likes to dip I would like to think it was like I like music, you know, I was like, you know who else likes bring Chester down? Oh, we gotta talk about a couple of quick things. So a lot of times when we cover off at the top of the show, we cover off on email, we call it mail, but it's email. But this is a special edition because this is stuff that actually came in the mail. So Crane, you'll appreciate this. So you know how we've talked a lot about the writer Duncan Gil Chris, the late Duncan Gil Chris. I always talking with a friend of mine was with Duncan when he died filming Big Horn Sheep. He said he just looked over and he was dead so much it was so surprising that my friend turned to him and said, Duncan, where did you go? Just the heart attack or yeah. So Duncan wrote these great books Hunt High and All about Bears, and I was we were talking on here about how there's they were self published and he didn't make many of them, so now they're super expensive. Like people sell his books like a thousand bucks, but with no no or nothing. This shows up in the mail a fresh copy of All About Bears from Australia. No note. I couldn't tell if I was supposed to sign it. It's just nothing. I think it was a I think it was like he's like, hey, I gotta copy that, and I know they're rare. Yeah, brand spiky knew all about bears from Australia. We gotta find out who. Yeah, yeah, well I gotta Isn't that interesting? Um? Thank you? Oh. Another guy wrote in like literally wrote he bought a print. This will go in the studio. It's a print of like the World's jackalopes. Yea from the world over passes around all the species of jackalope like creatures. Very nice gift you get in the bigger studio to hang all this stuff on this busy week. I just discovered I didn't know about like fifteen minutes ago, twenty minutes ago. I didn't know about any of this stuff. I didn't about this though, So yeah, you think of that Chester. I think if I get another tattoo, it might be one of these guys. Yeah, for sure. There's a scientific journal called Fisheries. I think it's called Fisheries right, Oh god, wow, is it called fisheries. I know it because it's always sitting on my brother. Uh has published in Fisheries and whatnot. Anyways, this article see this article right here. That that's a It's an article appearing in an issue of Fisheries, which is the scientific journal of the fisheries World. The article is called Goodbye to rough Fish Paradigm shift in the Conservation of Native Fishes fish. This is from a peer review journal. What's rough fish? Uh, it's a step up from what they used to be called, which is trash fish. So trash fish would be buffalo bourb it to some people. Some people call whitefish trash fish. Every kind of every kind of sucker, every kind of the dozens of sucker species gar like long nose, short nose alligator might at one time have all been what they called trash fish. But fishing game agencies even will still use like fish and game agencies never said trash fish. They would say rough fish. And this article is talking about a shift in public perception around trash fish. There's interesting. I'm getting the main point in minute here. Oh he's got who wants to take a look at that? Here, here's a litany, here's a rogues gallery of trash fish in this Oh wait, side note, we should uh for a new meat eater game. We should do a deck of cards for go fish. But right, remember when they invaded Iraq and they made that deck cards everybody were looking for. Yeah, yeah, we could make a deck cards of all the rough fish based off of that Iraq deck cards. Because the ace of spades was saddam thing. Oh you know, I was reading the ore day uh in Um and you know Inherent Vice, the Thomas Pinching novel. They made a movie with Joaquin Phoenix and stuff Inherent Vice. Anyways, in Inherent Vice, he was saying that what wild Bill Hickock. Everybody knows the dead Man's hand aces and eights, the fifth card. This book says that his fifth card was the seven hearts. No one knows that. But then I got to thinking and looked it up. And it's a widely debated issue. What was wild Bill's fifth card? Have you seen ballad of Buster Scrugs? You haven't seen that. When you watch it, you'll see Buster Scrugs is invited to join a card game and he wants his own hand dealt and they're like, you can play that hand and he looks and it's aces and eights and then set some down, says I don't want to play, but then still dies later that day, like just being just peering at aces and eights killed him. So who's got the road gallery? These are all rough fish. I'm getting to the point. Here was pike on there, pike mettle, oh, northern pike mental. The northern pike mental is a fish previously known as a squaw fish. But there in some areas. So this there's a graph and here about scientific research of fish. Where is this thing? Man? Oh, look at this. So I'm holding up a graph that shows how much fisher researched. Okay, And here up top, of course, the rainbow trout. There's a book about the rainbow trout called like the World's first synthetic fish. That's rainbow trout. Okay, and then it goes down of like, so these are game fishes the top, and it's just like a relative graph showing scientific research of fishes. Of the game fish is the most researched three, I'll do the most researched five fish, rainbow trout by like a long shot, and then kind of clump lumped together, chinook salmon, large mouth bass, atlantic salmon, and brook trout are all kind of like in second place for alec scientific resources to study. And then relative to that, it gets into rough fish non native and rough fish native um of rough fish escape ease. The ones that got into new waters. Lake whitefish gets the most research, and it gets about as much research as a soger. The least is the alligator gar. And then look at the piss ant amount of research that happens on all these species of fish here, So like basically of of zero interest to the scientific community to date would be such as short nosed gar, spotted soccer, golden red horse, gold eye, quillback carp sucker, sacramento pike, mental mooney, silver red horse, blue soccer, river, red horse, high finn, carp sucker, blacktail, red horse. How many of you in the in the room know some of those fish or all of them? Yeah? I mean, I mean good good eat like why not fish? No, But that's the whole you know, we Okay, everyone can go watch everyone can go watch episode one of Pardon My Plate with Steven Spencer about carp and I mean these are like culturated. That's why I'm bringing this up. Talk about our work in this article. Oh, they talk about the work of our company in this article. They mentioned it or that being like of being part of like part of a broader movement of of teaching people to have an appreciation for these native fishes that have been in your waterways since the beginning of At the end of the day, can't anyone make you know, can't these fish go well? And uh fish cake? Sure? Yeah, your fishcake recipe. I mean that video that Dirt got famous in Mountain Whitefish, that's trash fish. Yeah, you can do two things at once. You can find out about mountin Whitefish and find out how Dirt got famous about watching the same video, but just the whole trash fish thing or rough fish thing. So like, whose palette was it? Really just based on taste the thing? I mean, who because they feed on the bottom. Maybe some of them suckers. I think it's that, I get it. It's the it's the there's an excessive amount of bone almost universally is a lot of bone. But you can pickle it and dissolve the bone. Okay, let me put it this way. It would be that it takes the greatest amount of work the greatest amount of effort to yield and uh to yield a taste and dining experience acceptable to the average American palette. Yeah, but okay, we like peanut butter and jelly, and they would give that. That would not be a rough sumwich. That would not be a rough sandwich. Now, if you had a peanut butter, jelly and bone sandwich, that might be a rough sandwich. But it's just getting so that that's the paradigm shift is stop, Like what El was kidding? My dad knew all the game birds. Okay, he knew a couple of birds he hated, and every other bird on the planet was a tweetie bird. Hundreds of tweetie bird species. Two birds that he hated, and then like he like like robins and chicken eas he hated curls and blue jays. Then there's all the game birds and then there's tweety birds. That's basically how it went. Do you think it's a visual thing too? With the fish they like, rainbow trout just looks prettier than a carp No, I don't think it's visual. It's the processing, I don't think. So that's it for the mail bag that was that was that was all physical mail. Look at that physical mail and records in right. Okay, last thing, this is back to email, but it's kind of weirds. It's an internal email. One of the Corey Caulkins. If you email us, that's who reads the email. Among other things, he was out, I mean just he must have been out scouting or hunting this weekend, hunting. There's a bad drought here right now, he said. The picture of a water tank he found the greenest this the water and he looks like gatorade that level of green and in one tank because he's banking. He's thanking the drought on this. How thirsty it's making everything in one tank. He sent a photo of this are floating twenty four pine squirrels, two golfers, and two chicken eas floating in the tank, just trying to get water. Particularly that. I'll put that on Instagram. So if you go to at Steve Ronell on Instagram, you'll find just look for a bunch of dead stuff floating in some green water. You'll know you're looking at the right picture. That's something you have. The ranch I grew up on, for the first time ever, they had sheep die this year because of the heat and drought. Ever, it's five generations of families. It's been a dry or oh christ, I think they died from the water, just from drowned and drowning thirst, craze pine squirrels. Oh, last thing before we get to the before we get to the meat of it here, Uh, Doss Boat Season three is out Northeast. Episode one features our very own cal and Joel Sir Mellie fishing New Jersey stripers. So you can check that out. Now, how do they go for? I would just if you type in like if you if you go into Google and type in like doss Boat, it'll it'll pull you right up and you can watch it on our Meat Eaters YouTube channel or on our website. Ignore everything about Doss Boot. If it's a bunch of Germans in the submarine, that's not the right thing. If it's Germans in the sub it's the wrong video. If it's Americans in a boat, that's the right video. That's the best way to tell. And then Uh. Season ten drops on Netflix September, coming right up. A lot of dirts handywork on there. Oh, speaking of that, I was gonna tell you, I'll hit fifty episodes this season. I think you've done eisodes of Meat Eater, not counting like stars and sky stuff. Yeah, well I'm at forty six. New Mexico will be It's like fift wedding anniversary. I got a quick note for kid, quick note for kids in my home state, uh, Michigan. Right now, the DNR is paying seventy five bucks a bushel for red pine cones. So if you're a kid, well, I mean they'll pay adults too, but I don't think adults should be out hog enough. Do you know what I mean? It's like you know they're out there. I don't think they should be out there. I think you should be for kids to do seventy bucks per bushel. Red pine is on an off year this year, so producing less seed so there won't be enough seedlings in a few years to replant and transplant. In order to get paid for your bushels, you need to register with the d n R first, So if you're a kid, have your mom and dad help you register and collect red pine cones seventy five bucks a bushell. You remember they started paying that bounty on on Northern Pike Mentals and some guys are pulling six figures, six figures? How much has the guy put himself out of business because the next year he only made seventy k? Like he outfished, he bound bounty hunting for fish. How much is a bushel? Roughly? Volume wise, it's like four packs? Right? What's four packs or three packs or so? I can't remember, or maybe three bustels is a pack? Someone? This is easily solvable. Easily solvable. You're gonna get that. Nurses us pints and you can't. You can't pick them off the ground. You gotta pluck them from the tree. You have to bring your mynd dad in the ladder. It's getting more complicated for the kids in Michigan. Okay, Now back to Taylor. You got a new album coming out? To everybody about it? Um it is uh. It's when I moved to Nashville, I had feel like I had necessarily three years to kind of up from when I started there. I had seven songs and transpired into now having you know, about a hundred fifty or so, and then now it's uh, it got whittled down to how many twelve on this record? Plus grandpa plus my grandfather, So just your Grandpa makes a cameo on it. Yeah, so it's kind of a salute to him. So I was at a funeral and this came That song came on. I think my great grandmother like maybe four years ago or so, and uh, the lady, kind of family historian lady. I was like, it's like I gotta have this. Died my great grandmother. She was just old, real old, you know what I mean, old age and uh and uh, anyway, that came on and I was like, man, this is a cool Johnny Cash song. And I was like, wait, that's my grandfather and my mother singing harmonies. Uh, she's thirteen or fourteen and that and uh. I had that file of eight tracks that she sent me and the only one of my rand father was number four. And it took me like two years before I could even muster up to really listen to it. And so like halfway through the record, I was like, um, we got into drinking some tequila and wine and I showed the guy it's just h yeah, And I showed the producer Sean and uh, he started crying. I don't know if it was from the tequila wan, but he was like, this has got to be on here and I don't know. It's it's a I like to think in a lot of different unconventional ways. And to me it's like an outcast thing, like an old hip hop thing to put of a weird intro or that, you know. And a lot of people that have listened to this privately have gotten caught into the record because it's it reminds them of something maybe from like they something familiar, you know, with old country music. And I look at as a as a piece like the beginning in the end the old ship was on. It's kind of this, you know, you get dropped off by the boat and you get picked up at the end and in the middle is this like hellish sonic landscape that uh me and Sean made ourselves everything and uh Ben Alamant who played keys on like two songs. But other than that, we hunkered down for two weeks and made this and I couldn't have Uh. It's one of those things like I'm sure when you write a book, um, it's one of those things you can kind of have this master plan of how it's gonna maybe be your masterpiece, but when it kind of towards the end of the process, when you get out to the other side. Sometimes it can be more that you can never have realized. And to me, this is uh, it's really one of those that kind of happened like that, and I don't have just once you get that energy, the feeling you get from making this stuff, it's hard to put it down, you know. Uh you mentioned writing a book. I think a strategy for writing a book, Um, and I've done this is right at ending that you think is real good, and then try to write a book that would be good enough to have the ending. That's right, You're like, man, if I could deliver on that ending and the beginning good ending, ending and the beginning, but start with ending first, maybe yea, yeah, what And then what I'll do is I'll read all the easy parts and then I just kind of like, of course, first I don't do anything for a long time. Then I started writing the hard part. Yeah. Well, I feel like you learned so much, Like I didn't know half the things I knew before I started being a songwriter. It's one of those things you can use. I don't know. I was playing a wedding some some fans of mine. They were getting married and one of their Sisters is like kind of flew me up there in secret and I played for him, and uh, it's just one of those things. They were like they're taking me to the airport and you're like you're reading the Tipetan Book of the Dead. You know that's weird. But as a writer, the more you know not normal things you read, the better ideas and the broader perspective you have, you know what I mean, you have more to pull from or a bunch of useless stuff that uh, I don't know. When you have a few drinks, you can tell a couple of people. So when you start playing around the tour for the album, how will that go? We're starting uh end of October going to Texas with the producer Sean, So it would be my first time in Texas, step footing there and it's gonna be a great run of shows and um running and who so I've been this was the first project of electric guitar stuff. So I've been working the kinks uh with a gear part for like four or five dates before this run, and we're playing American of Fist September, so it'll be a good, good run. I like to do it in short spurts some kind of home body, and uh, I feel like I give everything I got when I make music. You know, it's uh, it's not a half ass thing. It really comes from here. So I have to kind of hit it hard and then rest, you know, my mind and body. I see what it means, see what it means to like want to live in a k forever sometimes, you know. So, do you still regard yourself as a fisherman or is that behind you know? No, it's not behind me. I just don't get to My headspace is kind of flipped right now with the aspect of getting this to a place to where I can, you know, really get to where I want to fish. I don't. I don't really fish much in Tennessee because I got spoiled out here, and uh, I'd rather put in the time and get to a place where I can go down to Patagonia or something rather than just stayed. Because you like fishing for trout, Yeah, if you listen, Tennessee's got care about trash fish. Tennessee's got way better fishing than this. They've got armadilla fish too, they float. That's that's a great fishing state. They've got some great fishing, but like right in Nashville, like um sport fishing. Yeah. The problem is those all those songwriters down there sure talk about it all damn time. Yeah, I mean it's but they I don't know, they haven't you know, been between the lakes, you know, up there in the Madison. It's like that's to me, you know, it's like using a shitty guitar to record a record with. It's like, I'd rather not record the record, you know what I mean. Keeping. The problem with Taylor's fishing right now is that he lives ten steps away from a recording studio. So that's Stevie ray Vant he cut his last record on And I've just been learning how to use the board and operate a system that is out of my league, and it's it's a beautiful thing to like, I don't know a lot of this musical journey has been like very spiritual in the sense of like too good to be true, ships always happening, And for a twenty four year old to have complete access of a studio that Stevie ray Vans sat there and touched the knobs and that was his last record. He would die a year later, and it was the most commercially successful record. It's like, um, I don't know. It's to me. When I had that studio this week, I was like, oh, man, I gotta go to Montana. It's like then when I'm here, it's like, I don't want to go back to Tennessee. So it's weird. It's a weird headspace, you know. So if if this launches your career and you get all famous, you still come on the show. I don't know, man, We're gonna be in Patagonia fishing a little bit, so we have to make it mover. I've already got some connections down there and been working on my Spanish. That's good. That's good. We already carried up this this weird deal that um you grew up watching, Yeah, Jared Outlaws, Dip Video Pack, Dip Spit. Yeah, okay. Jared explained how, like, yeah, I remember seeing the like a list of like early famous YouTube people and you were on it. Yeah, how I started back in two thousand and seven, Like YouTube basically really started in like two thousand and it's like the end of two thousand five, but it was still kind of like a weird video chat dating site kind of so yeah, a little bit, and you could do like video responses and things like that. So a little bit before I'm like, and I would I give me a little YouTube history. What was it? So it was like a like a video response dating site. It's kind of how like, well, I think what they did, I mean, I don't know, Well, they went to a million different things because they had this like broadcast yourself type of platform where it was like what what works? Because you know, Facebook was was starting to to to become bigger. My Space was already big at that time, so they're trying to Facebook was weird. It was like a way to vote, like who was good looking at me? Yeah, it was all just like vote up. Well, I mean you like scroll through all the girls at college and give them like a gay nay. Yeah. That shows you to kind of like as much as they act now like um, you know like oh we're helping the world. Yeah, it's like you're really see in the mentality of people, like and it makes people shallow, like you look at tender or something, but now they all act like they're like they're like diplomat. Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, So I mean it started as that and then you know you got um at the very very beginning. It was kind of just like people would upload like you know, they're like funniest home videos, you know, like a FV back in the day, So you'd see a lot of cat videos. You remember, like the Charlie bit my finger. Yeah, that was like that was like the YouTube's first like viral video. And like keyboard cat back in the day. It was like a cat playing a keyboard. Do you remember that Charlie bit my finger. They found that Osama bin Laden's hard drive on his computer was Charlie video that video. That's a that's a random fact for you right there. Man. I love that he was into that video. Wow huh. But anyways, did you have me Jared's videos? I wish that's funny. Well, yeah, so I started more How old were you then? I was? I was I was like fifteen No, I was sixteen, um when I first started. And like I said, like, were you trying to use it for dating? No? No, no, that was before that was like when they first started like two o five and um. And I was big. So when I was younger, I was big into acting and anything I could do, like to like just entertain people, Like no, matter if it was like like if my mom was like watching the news, I'd be like I could do that. I could do that. I'm gonna do it. So I would get be a newscast yeah whatever. It was like, I just wanted to entertain over to you, Dave, yeah, and so I would just uh, I would just kind of make these skits and sketches and things like that. But I remember I did one mostly comedy, Yeah, mostly comedy stuff. Because back in the day, like now you have what you call a vlog, which is like you just you know, you just feel in their use that term anymore. Yeah, yeah, they still use it. Um. I mean, I guess you just say video now, but like everybody's a vlog er now seems like they do it on their Instagram and all that. But back in the day, that's it wasn't even around yet. So the biggest things on YouTube were like or that they're started to become channels that would get bigger and get more subscribers, and like they would just start making sketches or skits. They were like two to three minutes long and kind of like uh, like an old sketch sketch comedy show that you would see on Comedy Central or something like that. It was like on YouTube, but you would get more of it because it was like normal people like us sitting in this room doing it, you know. And so when I first started, the most popular I think it was like Smash or this girl Lisa Nova, they had like twenty thousand subscribers and that was the most number. That was the biggest YouTuber in the world. And I couldn't even believe it. I was like, they could fill up an arena their audience. This is insane. And then you couldn't even make money on YouTube. They but these aren't like people who are in like total rednecks ship right, No, no, no, I was the only dude. Probably you're like, okay, we can keep telling the story. We'll get there. I mean there was there was not. There was probably like around a thousand people that like even made like actual content. I just did it because I like doing it, and I would just do whatever I wanted to do, even if you know, a hundred people would watch. And so then um, and then they like two thousand and uh. I don't know. Before that, I made like a hunting video and I had to dip in because I was dipping at the time, and like everybody, what were you, like, what was the hunting video? I can't even remember. It was something like and you were living where I was living in Colorado. I was. I went to high school in Colorado, right outside of Denver, and uh, and we were like hunting these fake dear in my front yard that we had like these little like statue dear. This is like a comedy, yeah, like a sketch video. Yeah, and uh and back at this, I mean this is before you could even really do editing. Like Windows Movie Maker had just come out and I had it on my uh at our computer, and so I would like try to like, you know, you would quit cut. That's about all you could do. There was no transitions or anything like that. So I try to try to do all the editing in camera before we would you know, post it and me and it took me. I made videos for years, like ever since I was a kid, but I just didn't know how to post it. Um. You know, you gotta like hook your camera. If I had one of those giant vhs like you put the whole VHS tape in the in the side, I had one of those, and uh, but but Yeah, I had to dip in and everybody was like, what are you dipping? Man? And I'm were you dipping at that time? Um? Probably Copenhagen when you were young. Yeah, I was sixteen. It's about the time I found it. I started watching his videos, also different Copenhagen. Yeah, I like the Copenhagen Winter Green and the straight That was my thing until you know, we started sound checking. You guys remember the Copenhagen black heartburn like every time? Yeah, yeah, they do that. They used to do it seasonally and now they kind of cut back on it. But the back in the day it was. It was around for a while. It was good. I think they came out with that two down six or something. I think one of my favorite videos from yours off the top of my head from back then, it's not like you were one, was the one where you caught that snapping turtle with the floating milk Joe. Yeah. Yeah, because I would I would do like I never attended to just do like videos on DIT No, you were doing activities. Yeah, I was just doing I was just filming whatever. But did you have early on, like in the old days, did you have a preference to do hunting and fishing stuff or did you like I did whatever? Like I did whatever, like I felt like and I'm I'm all over the place. So one day I'm like super into hunting and the next day I'm like super into my wife or something. So you guys are having a baby, Yeah we are. Yeah, yeah, we're having a baby coming soon. I saw on Instagram. What were you guys doing that? You were shooting something to find out what it was? Yeah, I took I had a deer target, and so I ripped one of the antlers off, like and we just put a buck or dough over it and we put a big old balloon, taped it to the year's target and both shot it. Well who rigged it up? Uh me? I think I think I just knew the answer. No, no, no, no, the balloon thing now with somebody else, somebody Yeah yeah, yeah, somebody got it. Uh my wife like drop it off like party America or something, and yeah, and they did. Yeah yeah, but we we had to take Yeah we did that with a cake one time and shooting nothing. Just yeah. They do whole They do everything, man, not just balloons. They need cakes and and you know all types of stuff that guy that had they had a gender See. When I first heard about a gender reveal party, I didn't know what it meant. My mind went to, um, like someone transitioning, That's what I thought it meant. It was like a party if you transition. I thought it was like when you Yeah, I like, it's like when you are like official, you officially and then you have a party, which would be great party. The guy I could imagine partying about that. But yeah, then I realized it's just about babies. But the guy that, uh, they had a gender reveal party, and they had like a tanner right target. They have blue smoke or pink smoke. Yeah, started a big gass forest fire. They just got a massive fine man restitution for the whole damn fire. You know, I couldn't. It's like where I live, it's just like out here man breaks of smoke everywhere. Can't like a match. What's the snapping turtle? Oh? Yeah? So I used to live in Kentucky and um, are you born? I was born in Florida. I lived in everywhere so um, from Florida to Alaska. Um, I've lived all over the place, but I lived in I would live in Kentucky for four or five years out of her sales, which is kind of where all the bourbon and stuff. Oh yeah, I love her sales. So I lived on like a three fifty acre farm out there, and we had to farm ponds and we had a whole bunch of snapping turtles in it. And this is before like nobody was making hunting stuff on YouTube. So I was doing just what I was doing every day, and I was like, well, I might as well just film it. And so I did a video called I can't even believe still on there, honestly, but it's called how to Clean a Snapping Petal. In the first ten sexes be shooting the head with the twenty two, and everybody's like, I thought this was how to clean a turtle? Ting like what is going on? And uh, people may yeah. So I was. I was probably twenty two maybe at that time, or twenty three, and and so I would just like, you know, back in the day, I didn't know what to do. There was no like, there was no avenue, so you just did whatever. So cleaning a snapping turtle or and it made some of your best probably stuff, you know what I mean. That's the way I look at my early stuff, it's like before you knew what you were, you know, It's like that's the unfiltered, you know, good stuff when you're throwing ship at the wall. You know. Hey, uh, when you were doing you weren't making any money early on from YouTube. Now you couldn't even make money on YouTube. I think I did YouTube for like five years before you could even make money before they turned that on. I think it was like two thousand ten or something when they when it came out, was saying that they were going to do it. Uh. I think I was in Alaska actually, and they announced that they were going to do this partner program where Google was going to run ads in your videos and you can make money. And it was like they kind of like remember the email I got about it, like you're entered because I already had like an audience, and so I was like what, oh my gosh, And then it got my mind like I never thought that I could, you know, do something like that as a job. I was like more of hoping that maybe somebody from Hollywood would see my video and shooting my head off a snapping turtle and would it be an Avengers five? Um? So yeah, I h they they just you know, two thousand tennishes. Whenever that you could start making money on it. And then then it like then everybody wanted to be a you know, a YouTuber, so and it got more it got more like business like then. That's whenever you started seeing it wasn't that it like the fun one away, but it was like it was really about community back in the day, like on YouTube, like you would you would have like twenty thirty different other channels that would watch you, and they would always like every time your video uploaded, they would they would comment like good vid, awesome vid man, you know, like all the video producers. Yeah, like other other people that you would know, because it was a really small community. And then once you know, you can started making money on it, everybody kind of turned it into like it was like a business almost, and you know it was like and I mean I did too. I I went with the times, but it was it's it was a complete change from what it used to be. And it's crazy that I've almost have been doing it fifteen years now. Do you still regard yourself that way, like as a YouTuber kind of because it's just like I mean, I'm not embarrassed by it. Some people are like, oh, yeah, I'm a YouTuber, I do like how to videos or whatever, but I mean it's what I do. Like what's your output as far as like how many? How many set in your head like, yeah, I used to I used to upload every day when you were watching. I used to upload every single day. I think I did it for two years straight, so like six eight videos or something in a row every single day. So if people are binging, they're always like they're looking for that next and that's that's hard. I mean it's hard. I mean, you live your life a whole completely different way. I was secluded out there in the nowhere, so it was like every day it was like something new, trying to create some type of new content for people. And that's whenever I kind of like, probably when you've found me, it's kind of when I started, uh, getting a little bit bigger and um just because you get you know, putting the work into it, because I mean, the biggest thing about doing YouTube is consistency and in the same type of thing. So now it's a little bit different where it's all about algorithms and stuff like that. Back in the day. It was kind of just like, well, if I find this guy, I'm just gonna keep watching it. So, you know, YouTube kind of puts things in front of your face, now if you're consistent. So and it was like, when you're doing all that early on, what percentage of your stuff was related to the outdoors? Uh's I don't know, probably se I mean everybody who pretty much. Um Like, even if it was like a video about dip, it wasn't just like me reviewing the dip. It was like it was like a variety show. Like it was like there was an intro, there was the Okay, I'm gonna crack the can, I'm gonna put it in, and then it's like then we're gonna go check in in the deer stand and I'm like hunting that day, and so like I lived a white tail hunt out of that farm, and so I'd give him like an update from the stand. All right, guys, what's up wearing the stand? I haven't seen chip? All right, let's go back. You know, just stupid crap like that that you watch nowadays and it's like, oh, that's been done twenty times, but you know, uh, that was it was kind of always outdoor type of base because it was kind of like my audience and that's how I grew up. So because I grew I was born in Florida and then I grew up in Branson, Missouri, so that's kind of where my dad was. My dad's just a builder and um, so we moved a lot when when I was a kid, and then I just after when I graduated high school, I just became a rambler and I was all over the place. So I moved like eight times and eight years or something like that. So that was all over the place. So the aspect of it being like um, like the tobacco and dipping, all that just came out because that's what people caught onto. Yeah, it was well, I was like I was a different myself, but I was always you know, especially like where I lived in Kentucky, tobacco farms were very prevalent. You know, you're driving through Kentucky, especially like eastern Kentucky, you see old male pouch barns and that Americana, Like it just gets me. I love lady loses spitting, you know what I mean. You got cleanex of stuff in there, and it's like she looks like an old little kitty cat. She's dipping, you know what I mean. It's probably in a bad movie too. Yeah. Yeah, but we love Eastern Kentucky. Um I uh so I just became like in love with like the Americana of it, the history of it and and uh and how it was made and all this kind of stuff, and then ended up, you know, coming out with my own give me uh hit me with like a crash course on tobacco history. Okay, real crash course. Um. Basically, uh, what was it when Christopher Columbus came to America at the West Indies? Yeah, and so you know what did he think? He was in China or something like that. Where where do you think he landed? India? Okay, Um, so he comes somewhere new Yeah, but he gets Yeah, so he gets into the it was the Caribbean, and um he meets the indigenous people. This is the first time. Um, they do a little trade. Basically, it's like here's some indigenous people give give Christopher Columbus and his crew fruits, vegetables and these brown leaves, and they understand what the fruits and vegetables are. They have that over in Europe, but there they look at these brown leaves and they're like, what the hell is this smells like crap, just throw it away. Second time they come back, they see the indigenous people smoking those brown leaves and then some of Christopher Columbus guy starts to try the stuff and they're like, what is this crazy? Right? Yeah, So so anyways, it was Christopher. It was basically Christopher clumb Is coming over here and uh and within a hundred years, I think it was by by six d. It was in every single country in the world within a hundred years. Yeah, and so um all over the place, and obviously here in America we had it's very prevalent. And so you know over in Virginia, Virginia was our main port for tobacco export. So when we would when back in the day before uh, like in in the seventeen hundreds, we had a m uh they would use Glasgow, Scotland because that was the shortest the shortest boat ride basically was from Virginia to Glasgow, Scotland, and so that's where that was kind of like their traveling corridor was between there and UM and Europe. Like was was everybody everybody was was into this tobacco thing. And and the indigenous people. The crazy thing was is they were already smoking it, they were already chewing it, they were already sniffing it. They were doing everything. And so when you know what the hell it looked like, Like, what did it look like before people started to cultivate it? What do you mean? And it's wild form? Where do you run into wild tobacco? Yeah, I don't know. I don't know about that. Um, I know that there are many different there are a number of different types or species of tobacco, tobacco plant, tobacco leaf. There's a bush here called tobacco brush. Huh, it's not tobacco. It's not tobacco. Okay, but I'm sure like places in Virginia and and Tobacco Road in North Carolina, that's a heavy spot. Yeah yeah, North Carolina, South Carolina, Kentucky. I like to see it in its wild state. Yeah. Yeah. We had a guy and to show up, like a guy that works on insects and plant evolution and whatnot. And he was talking about tracking down like what corn came from, you know, like a grass, it's like a American grass. Yeah. Yeah, it's really interesting. Actually you say that because I want to figure that out now. Um, and kind of like see it like girl, I could imagine like seeing it in the woods of Virginia, like like growing tobacco under oak tree or something. Yeah, it might not even be around anymore. Yeah, I don't know because the cold bars right like uh, the wild turkey that have you looked it up Chester? Well, it says it's native to southwestern United States, Mexico and parts of South America. I mean it goes back. Yeah, Messo America beyond six thousand years probably found it the same way they found cocoa leaves, walked through the woods shoot stuff man. Yeah. So um, but it was like it blew up all over the place. And I mean there was all different types of of use of it. Obviously, the smoking aspect of it was was very popular. Um. And then like I don't remember her name she was. I don't know if she was a queen or something. It wasn't like the Queen of England or something like that, but I think she was from Sweden. And tobacco crushing tobacco leaves up and then sniffing it was done by mostly women in the well no, because it was polite, Like why that because they didn't want to do I don't know, I don't know, but so I guess what they said is is it would cure headaches and so yeah, so uh so mostly women, especially in Sweden. The reason I say Sweden is because Sweden basically perfected the tobacco leaf when it came to moist snuff, not as far as smoking, but when it comes to like chewing it, dipping it. Nasal snuff, Sweden like killed it is native snuff, powdered like dried leaf, powdered snuffy. Yeah, general, what's that is that nasal snuff? Okay? So this is so and I brought some. So this is open that top one, Steve, what do you mean the top one just over the Yeah, that's that's that's what you called a catch liad. Oh yeah, catch your spent choosing there and it wasn't here. There's one Let into that box real quick. What do you say? I need to get it? So I want to talk at okay, I want to go with Krin's thing. So people snorted, Yeah, is it is it basically like dried? Yeah, it's dried. Yeah, you're doing cocaine. But it's a ground right you put it right here in your snuff box. That's what you call your snuff box. If you check this out, I got a message for the listeners. Yeah, take your arm, how do you describe this? Make your arms straight? Yeah, make your arms straight so your arm and your hand are straight and rigid. And then lift your thumb up so it's pointing at the ceiling, and then cock your right hand ever so counter clockwise, and you'll notice that the base of your thumb shows up a little dimple, a crater, like almost at the wrist. Yeah. So that's how you measure it out I call your snuff box. Yeah, okay, you put pulverized tobacco and riff it up your nose and so you don't snort it. You don't snort it, you sniff it. So it's just like just like that. So just brought some of that in that. That would have been great. But that's not popular that much anymore. No, it's not as popular now, but they still sell it. So um. That was yeah. And I mean you have the Swedes like you smell you smell his general there. This is a Swedish snooze that's made in sweet and now careful smelling this but just who where do you get that? Jered, because I got something from I can't tell if it smells a pneumonia or mint. Yeah, it's does it taste like it smells? Dude? It So this is a like a porta John Amazon jar. If you put a cockroach and Amazon jar and toss that, they're guaranteed. Yeah. So that so there's a lot of different types of tobacco. When I talk about Sweden, how they kind of perfected it, and then over back in America, it's like we you know it was discovered here, I said, sniff not yeah, cres Like if you give her like what happen when you give someone with sobby but tell him something different or something this christ so it's a little bit stronger. So this is do you taste the like, what's the purpose of that moment? That's got to be. So this is so that I'm telling you everybody over in Sweden because snooze is actually illegal right now and you're or in uh in the EU. So it's basically only like like Norway and and in Finland and Sweden it's legal. Uh, They're they're working on getting it back now because you know COVID and everything, people like you guys got to stop smoking then they and they're like, oh, well this is, you know, safer, so we'll look into it. Basically is what they're saying now. But Sweden perfected it as as this. This is snooze, So snooze. You don't have to spit like you can put this is a pouch. They call them portions over in Sweden. And so when you put this in and they usually put them upper deck they usually upper deck it, and upper deckers make a pecker better. So everybody, uh so you can do it at home and be bigger, bigger. Sorry, yeah, I Stu'm gonna stop doing that. And so you know, you throw one of these and your in your top lip. Now this has so Swedish snooze. There's a lot more nicktine than they have an American it's snuff over here. So this is like there's like twenty two milligrams and well are like three millie what's like a ship? What's in a cigarette? Just for the sake of comparing, I don't know exactly, but probably around that to three to six. So um so these are like that is like a that's like remember rememberhen you're a kid. Remember jolt cola. Oh yeah, it's like the goal and this is this is mid tier ammonia. Want again, but what was the booze? There's no way on the planet would I mean, is that or something ammonium like treating the leaf? Is it? What's its purpose? So the thing about this is your This is more about the nicktine. This just for addicts. This yeah, and now this is still tobacco. So there's all different types of stuff out there. You have like just Nicktine pouches now, which are huge. People do the zin and the and uh and v low and arms and things like that. Yeah, he's got one of them. It's got sweedish words on the back. Yeah. On the front it says thunder slip white dry thunder, and it's actually the right thunder. This one's actually this one's actually Odin's um, which is in here, which is and they have they have other ones called They have one called Siberia, probably because you know, it's a cold snooze and they because it feels cold in your lip, which is like fifty milligrams, Is that like something mentally, it's very mentally. They have different flavors. But but the I'm telling you the Swedes, like people over in Europe, they the nicotine level that they all do over there is way bigger than we have. I had no idea because now, like I feel like if you go to you know, in cities in South America, you kind of get a picture of what it used to be was smoking. You can imagine what it used to be like here in the fifties. Yeah, we're just like everybody is always smoking, right ye, And it catches you off guard because of how how much use is just dropped off right here in the US. Yeah, I mean, with there's so many different types of alternatives now vaping, there's like the kind of like was like supposed to be to sell everybody's it's like the devil now, man, I think big tobacco had something to do with that, you do a little bit, There's there's no way they didn't in my opinion, there's just no way. Like the research campaign, the people don't realize that basically, like tobacco ran the world for a long time and it still kind of does. Like I mean, when you're talking about the biggest business in America and the world in general, it's it's still tobacco, like they got people on and uh, they coming off like creative people like tobacco. Well, tobacco is I mean it's it's a stimulant, just like caffeineas and it's obviously you know tobacco as as natural nicotine in it. But it's um, it's a plant that everybody you know, loves to enjoy. Not everybody, but a lot of people love to enjoy. So you know what watching them outlaw Josie Whales and he's got like the rope. Yeah, that's twist tobacco and they take a chaw off tell is that that's say it's like a plug or a twist tobacco. But you know, chewing tobacco like Levi Garrett Redman, you know that Like it's in back. So it's basically that but dried together and they twist it together with molasses and they can the molasses kind of keeps it together well, and so it's like the actual plant the leaves no no, no, so they stripped the leaves. Um So like with with with American tobacco, like when you're talking about like cope and egg in and uh and and things in your dip um or or Levi, Garrett red Man, things like that. You know, you're gonna strip the leaves off the plant. Um, you're gonna put them in your You're basically going to clean them up. You're gonna hang him in a in a barn. You're gonna put sawdust under it. You're gonna light to sawdust, and you're gonna fire cure the tobacco makes it really dark leaf. Yeah, it's like a fire cure. Not all of them. Some of them are air dried, some of them. There's there's all different types of cures for for tobacco. Yeah, Like cigars are done a different way. Smokeless tobacco has done a different way sometimes like a dark dark, fire cured dip like smokes tobacco. Um, you get that darker taste in it. So it's like with fire. Yeah, it's smoke basically. Yeah. And so that you know, the biggest thing about like cigarettes comparing it to dip is when you light up a cigarette, you're burning the leaf. You're never burning a smokeless tobacco leaf. That's what it's called smokes tobacco. So when you're burning cigarette, you're I think it's something like six thousand chemicals you're releasing with one cigarette with dip. It's so minimum that they don't ever they don't ever even talk about it. It's so like there's there's no you know, um, the t s n A levels are completely different. T s n A is is like cancer causing chemicals that are in tobacco that tobacco just naturally has in it t sn A. T s n A levels and smokes tobacco were so low that they never talked about it. So like the American Cancer Society just came out with a paper a couple of years ago, and they used to have it all the time because big tobacco. There was like a war on tobacco for a long time because people are going to cancer from the cigarettes. You know, everybody smoked back in the sixties and seventies like crazy, but it wasn't like really put out there that it was bad for you. And then and then you know, in the nineties, when everything started getting a little bit more goody two shoes, everybody was like, Okay, yeah, this this this ain't good for you. I'm starting to cough up along now I've been smoking for twenty years. So it started to get a little bit, you know, people were taking it a little bit more serious. That's when smoke was tobacco got a little bit bigger. But then because it was made by some of the same big tobacco brands like Camel has their own and and Marbo they had very similar companies, they kind of pieced it together. But the American Cancer Society, they just came out with the thing a couple a couple of years ago. I think it was twenty nineteen. UM of the seventeen like leading causes of cancer and smokes. Tobacco wasn't even on a Cigarettes was on the top. There was like it was like a city and hepatitis and all this stuff. It wasn't even on there. Now I've talked, I've I've interviewed um a few doctors on this because I've been interested. You know, I've never had an issue. I take care of my teeth, but I've never had an issue. UM, I've seen gumer session and people. Never seen anybody or hurt anybody, like getting actual cancer from dip. You know, always if we always hear about people getting lip can I've always telling dirty's gonna get lip cancer. That's not true. No, that's just in TV. Yeah, yeah, I mean, I mean, I'm sure you know it might have happened. I don't know. I haven't heard it yet. But I've talked to this doctor. He's a I think he still is a professor at the University of Louisville. His names Dr Radu. He's wrote a book Is he in the Is he in the back pocket? A big tobacco might be? He might be, but he's but he's completely against cigarette companies, which is the which is crazy because most of the cigarette companies own these smokes tobacco companies. So I don't think so. But he wrote a book called How Smokeless Tobacco Can Save Your Life, and he basically just goes on about how like he's been researching this for like thirty years and he's never found that T S and A levels and smokeless tobacco if you're not lighting it. He's like, there's He's like, there's you have more of a like you have the same amount of hurting your body is putting sunflowers in your sunflower seeds. And the doctor told my dad, you know, you gotta quit here, try these pouches or whatever. So I was always doing the long cut and I was like, why you did those pouches? He was like, I never got it until it's like convenient, you know what I mean. I was in here, I've already had a couple of dips. But if I'm here, I got stuff all over my face, you know what I mean. It's like it's it's clean, and I get it. But though they put big old cancer warnings on the back of the dip, that's a crazy So here's so like, here's let me say, I want to say, I want to add one thing in. Yeah, smoke and killed all four of my grandparents. My grandpa, my maternal grandfather, smoked himself to death and took his wife down with him. And she needs smoke because she sat in the living room with him for fifty years watched the smoke. Cigarettes killed the both of them with lung cancer. And my old man had and he quit. He had quit, and he worked as assoff to quit, went to a hypnotist, tried everything. Eventually he made he gave ten to one odds to anyone that would do it that he could quit and and just made cash bets tend to one. Yeah, And that's how he quit because he was no way going to pay out all that money. But you can't second hand it. You can if you drink it. But I didn't do it. I didn't do like enough to get uh. I didn't do it enough, you know, I think like these guys were saying too with the My dentist said, no, this doesn't say anthing about cancer. Go ahead, dirt, that's this is not tobacco. Okay, okay, this is. But my dentist said, uh, I mean, I haven't been for a couple of years, but last time I went, and he said, if you move it around, He's like, what can cause lip cancer is the brasiveness, like you're saying with sunflower seeds, but if you're dipping and you're switching switching people get lip cancer, have a what you call the thumb pocket. Yea, they have a snuff box in their mouth. The brasiveness is where the cancer starts. But if you're moving it around. The dentist told me, I'm gonna go yeah. But when I'm super curious about, uh, are all the different ways that people cure create et cetera. Smokeless tobacco and then like regionally, like who choose what, who dips what? Like that whole kind of So in uh, in Sweden, like I was talking about, they have snooze, which they got that name from snuff over here um, and that's snort and tobacco. No, well so that's nasal snuff, but like this is still considered snuff. Like this stuff in your can. They call it everything, snuff, dip, chow, chaw ub, whatever. There's so many names for it, but but it's still all the same thing. You're just talking about smokeless tobacco. So over in Sweden they have what you call snooze um, which snooze in a long cut form and didn't bring any but it's it's like a very muddy texture, but it looks very similar to uh, to a long cut dip like this. And so what um what they do different than what American companies will do with theirs because American companies will will ferment theirs. Which boys are they're packing? You guys can't you guys can't be in this conversation. Which an alternative? We're gonna sample soon they're doing an alternative? So which one is that winter? That's good? Yeah, there's a lot of things I want to try. That bourbon one or that peach one. But so you guys do it. You guys do it tobacco alternatives right now. Yeah, so this is yeah, at the time, this is my company outlaw, but the um we're still talking about tobacco. So yeah, we haven't gotten into the alternative. So so, uh, what the Swedes do instead of fermenting the dip which in America they you know, you've ever seen like a picture of an old tobacco barn with the you know, tobacco leaves hand, Yeah, and there's smoke coming out from the sawdust and I don't know about that part. This is all new to me, the whole smoke in it thing. Yeah. Yeah, so it just kind of makes me take a smoke fish. Yeah. They they like cure the tobacco with smoke, So that's called fermenting. In Sweden. What they would do is they they it's called a past it's pasteurization method, so it's more of a steam cure, which they say, which that's just their method of doing it, which is a whole different way of of consuming it. But they sit like, with doing that method, you don't have to spit, it doesn't really juice up, just put in that sweetish, you just put the ammonia in there. Well, these boys done here doing alternatives and you're doing the ammonia. I just how many milligrams and nicotine will kill a man, and it said like sixty here, so let me get three. There's no way I've done. The most I've ever done I think was nearly nine. So I gotta I got a buddy. We call him fat Boy, and maybe you should. We got a vengeables five vegebles like man like dip man. It's like a special power. No man, a nicktine could kill freaking I would woof fans his ass. But the bad guy's hiding in the dip shd. You're going there. But yeah, some Swedish hat fields and yeah, that Siberia I was talking about earlier, which is like almost fifty MILLI my buddy, fat Boy, he goes. He's like, you won't do a full candidate, and so I was like, I'll do a full cannon. He's in your at one time. Yeah, And I looked up that stat you know, they're like, what's the nicktine overdose and it says like sixty And I was like, I've done way more than sixty. Be four so I just put the whole thing in my mouth and I kept it in for like four minutes. I did it on a video And did you have to use the restroom right away? After that? I never threw up? What did your body do? Like? Increased heart rate? Increased heart started sweating? Like really bad? Just what your candor? That's a little Yeah, what's wrong with the jug? Just you too good for the jug? You don't want to take someone else's jug. That's like, but how did you manipulate your can there for that? I just popped a hole in it? Yeah? Is that like an old dip triper? You were a wrestler in high school? Right? Did you guys dip to cut weight? I mean I didn't. Does that work? But yeah, people do. When I was a kid, man, they you in high school, the guys on the rassling team would put a garbage bag on the punch two holes will hold for their head and a hold for their arms. Put a garbage bag on. I could dip and run around like that. That's how I started differing. Spitting spitting and then wearing that garbage bag to sweat. I thought you and then you going to the fight. Then the fight you going to the fight, but never felt better, never felt better. Appetite suppressing, isn't it? You said, what appetite isn't an appetite suppressing? Yeah, yeah, it could be. Yeah, I can see that, but I think that's not the tobacco. I think that's a nick team. You're talking about taking that full? Can you guys remember the horse shoe there? Yeah? Yeah, yeah, I've seen him do many of those. Yeah you do, He's done the whole what's the most you've done? Like two cans? Probably, and you didn't you just have small mouth. I can't do that. But there's some people, man that they'll they'll just I mean back in the day on YouTube, I remember I would never do like the challenge type stuff, but like there was you know, remember the cinnamon challenge. This was way before that, and so everybody loved to do this cinnamon challenge. Cinnamon challenge when you just put a spoonful of cinnamon in your mouth and you try to hold it anyway down and then there's like some bottom, some ice water on yourself or something like that. The ice water challenge that was for that was for Yeah, there's a shoot, there's Oh speaking of confusing my sports stuff. Oh yeah, so my birthday is in February, but dirt has brought me a birthday present and it's a dude. Uh slam dunk slam dunking. There's all there's an athlete slam dunking in a basketball who says touchdown. I saw that. This is like a custom a custom shirt for me who's had a lot of problems with sports analogies. Doesn't stuff you want to do them, that's gonna mess. So when I got to make a reference to a sports player, I'll be like, uh, Ridge Perry, that's the only guy I can think of. You know are people now? I got Pete Alonzo, Yeah, I know him, so I like watching him play. Aren't all the tobacco companies for the most part, like Copenhagen, Grizzly Skull, Aren't they all owned by the same company. Uh so copenag his Skull, Um Red Seal, They're all own by the same company. It's all us Smokeless and they are owned by out Tria, which out Tria owns a bunch of day Bone. Everybody. Well, it's like the big like smoking company. Philip Morris, Yeah, they don't. They're not. They didn't throw down on dip Philip Morris. Yah that Philip Morris has dip. Yeah. Pretty much all the big like cigarette companies that you can think of, they didn't think to get into it. Yeah, and they're pretty much all owned like by somebody bigger that has a branch out of smokeless tobacco and cigarette tobacco. A lot of these companies will roll their cigarettes and make dip in the same manufacturing units. So do you rub elbows with them? Boys with outlaut dip? Uh? Like Philip I used to back in the day, I used to um. I used to be ambassador for a lot of people stokers. Was in a massador for copenag and I did a lot of stuff for Really, you were a chebacco Wars missing up Star Wars and chewing tobacco. We've already got our movie. Chebacco a good movie man like Star Wars tobacco. Yeah, chewbacco. It was like wullie guy that needs to get some do So. I had a buddy in high school that on the can of Copenhagen Winter Green And you can correct me if I'm wrong here, but I believe he was telling the truth. He said that was in our family's line, Waymond Copenhagen, and his last name was Wymon. That is that w e y Yeah, okay, interesting, yes, uh so Waymon George Wyman is his name. He's the one shout out to Nick Wyman, Nick, Whyman, I'm interested, that's cool, that's cool to South Carolina. He showed me on the can the w C. That's kind of like reading a dollar bill. You don't realize like, oh, that's on a dollar bill, and he's like, that's my grandfather somebody's initials. Yeah. Yeah. So when people look at like a copen egg and can it said, you know, most people would be like, there's like a WC on there. C W they see so that stands for Wayman's copening and which George Wyman was kind of like the first guy who's started doing it. My buddy Ronnie, who's who's bound on the show. Uh quite a few times over the years. He had He's got a lot of quotes. He's the one that introduced me to the idea that you should never wear a hat that has more personality than you do. Sound advice. So I should take your first light hat off. No, that's not a person there. His hat doesn't have more It's a awfully filthy hat. It matches the wear. Yeah, we don't wear a hat that has more personality than you do. I think it's kind of advice against like the wrong person getting the cowboy hat. Yeah, like I have no business. Yeah yeah, if you ever see me in a cowboy I would like you to ask me to remove it. Okay, but you rocked a beaver hat for sure. Oh I wear yeah, dude, I wear I wear a fur I wear a beaver fur hat because I grew up as a trapper. I got to your right to have a beaver hat. It's a northern you know, like northern symbol. Yeah, that's not more personality. No, No, I was like, I had no business in the stats, and uh Ronnie also said I can't. He said, both of these are one of these. He said, if your dad's your best friend, you ain't got any friends. Or he said, if your wife's your best friend, you ain't got any friends. I can't remember he either said both. I know he said one, but when me and my buddies talked about like, no, that's not what he said. He said. He might have said both. It might just be a thing. So he told me the difference betweens. Like he's like, he doesn't like smoker. He started, it's kind of weird he started smoking, but he didn't historically didn't like smokers because they don't they can't do anything right, he said the tour. A guy that dips probably has the work with his hands. Yeah, and like he always used to feel, there's nothing more useless than a smoker because he's got to do everything one hand all time. But a guy that dips probably works. And that's where you see most of it, especially in America at least construction. You know, yeah, that's about like who you know, rural urban divide, like what who's doing what? Who's doing what? Kind like is it regional? Is it? You know? Yeah? I think well definitely, like uh, smokeless tobacco like this, you know, this dip stuff here that's pretty much big all over here, like in America, that's about it. Over in Sweden and things like that, they'd have the portions like I gave you there, that's a that's just great. Yeah, and then you got they have loose snooze, which is very similar similar to this, but it's it's different like it's it's more of a tobacco taste than than we you know, like this one's this is one of our sweet tea flavors. So it's like we we can basically flavor whatever we want, and over there it's a lot different. But like this type of stuff here is is basically just in and it's not even in rural America anymore. A lot of people that used to be smokers and stuff here they're getting onto the nicotine patches like those zins and and things like that. But um, as far as there's smoking version of alternatives, yeah, what was that wild back American spirits which were but it doesn't have any like additives or yeah. And then they had the electronic cigarettes, which yeah, you're right, yeah, that's yeah, you're right. Yeah, I was thinking about that. Yeah, and then vape I guess considered that too, But it's just it's just a little bit different because there's no I mean, yeah, I guess it is the same. You know. That's a that's a that's a good correlation, like alternative tobacco or alternative tobacco tins dip being like when people had like e cigarettes and I to save the lungs, frock the guns that Steve did you ever did when you were working for ron No, dude. But here's the thing. Any of this I mean, oh yeah, I had no no, never seriously, so I've never took you took one of my schools in Arkansas at the campfire? How long did I have it? For? About five minutes maybe four? So Ronnie when I worked for him, they he That's when I found out about the snorts stuff and took a rip of that about blew my head off. That was also when the first time I tried horse meat. Ronnie had a can of ground up horse meat. I still had the bone chunks in it. Isn't Ronnie Chain smoking cigars now, So this is partly so we're like when I worked for Ronnie, that was like a whole education and like tobacco products again because he's a millwright. So all the guys that worked for him are all like a Lottam addicted to booze lotm addicted to dip. Ronnie he wasn't then he became because he got in like he started smoking cigars like a gentleman. He started getting like he like I can see that guys going the other direction, like a gentleman, he'd like smoke a cigar with the boys. The next thing you know, he's chained smoking him. Yeah. I think that is something through to your question. Current for me tobacco, when I got started into it was the camaraderie like co workers at the rancher, my uncles and dad. It's like you at the end of the day or at lunch, you'd like, I'll have a dip together. Yeah. Dirt was born on a cattle ranch, and he was saying that when when you got you could shoot parade, what the hell was it? I said that at headquarters they had the essentials at their store, so that we were like an hour from like a small last town, you know. But at at the ranch headquarters, you could you could just grab a box twenty two shows or Copenhagen snuffcannon. It would just be taking off your pay for that bullets. Yeah, that was the two things they had in the store. Yeah, that's my kind of store. Wait, so when you tried it around the campfire, did you go through the ritual vomit? No, because here's let me give my full tobacco history. Uh, my man smoked for a long time. So when my old man was in the war and oneth off the war, like in World War Two, they gave you cigarettes. Your sea ration would come with three cigarettes inside of it. They also he was staying, so he got queued up in North Africa, and then they went down to invade Italy at Anzio beach hat but they all just got rat holed away in North Africa while they're getting ready to do the to start doing all the beach invasions, and he got into a kind of a nasty business where they would take cartons. The North Africans wanted American cigarettes, so they would take cartons of cigarettes, take all the packs out, pack it full of sawdust to get the right haft, put two packs on the end, and sell them out of the trains because people are jones and so bad for American cigarettes. And you'd kind of hold it out, take the money and then hand them the thing. And you want to get into two packs and there's a carton. So he got into that racket, he used to explain to me, but worked very very hard to quit smoking, so he would have beaten my ass back. Okay, let me give you example how bad this dude. I should find this guy to write him a letter of apology. Our neighbors had some cousin or something got out of the Marine Corps come to live with him. His name was John. I'm not gonna give his last name, j O n no h. He was. He was a bad smoker and uh real bad smoker. Remember, ran around of cowboy boots. But anyways, around the time he started living there and smoking and everything, just coming out of the Marine Corps, we got onto smoking corn silks rolled up in newsprint, and we got caught smoking corn silks rolled up a new sprint out in the woods. And my old man promptly went over there and blamed the dude out of the Marine Corps for it and gave him an asked you and blame with this had nothing to do with it, right. So a lot of like like various like tobacco interactions. In fifth grade, we're making agricultural maps where you had to glue the agricultural product onto a map. Okay, so the Midwest glue some corn someone down there had for some reason, someone brought in tobacco and fifth grade me and Stanley Johnson ate a bunch of it. They had to call our moms I was. I was. I'm not kidding. I was, honest to God having hallucinations. I was unbelievably sick. How much did you guys eat? I don't remember how in fifth grade I took it out in the playground, trying to pretend that we knew that it was like a thing to do, that you're supposed to eat it, and we ate it out. Josie Way, I was spitting on his dog, and oh, yeah, we knew all that. Yeah, Buzzard's got the same as worms, like all that rolling around our heads and so sick. I was, honest to God hallucinating. So I think that those sets of experiences nothing to do with my dad conning Arabs out of that. But like all the other stuff, UM was never into it. Now. The one positive experience I've had with tobacco but I didn't do because I don't want to become I don't want to become an addict is uh Um. Down in New Mexico. One of my friends had like some kind and he pours bourbon and romans something I don't want to name him. Mike Rule, I think, opens the bag up and pour some booze in there. Bag opens his chewbag up dumps booze in it. Ye. Wait, Jared, do you have a bourbon or something flavored? Yeah, we got this yellow bland which is pineapple room smell that one. You crack it open, Steve. When I says pack, dip, spit and joy, Steve, will you try something with me? This is this isn't this is yeah, this is the pac of free. They're still nicetine in it, but there's no tobacco, huh, Steve. When I was guiding back in the day, some guy gave me a cigar speaking of like, I can't work with smoking this cuban cigar. And I was like eighteen, and I felt real bad if I didn't finish this thing. So I was rolling down the river with this cuban in my mouth, telling him the cast left, tell him the cast right, with this giant cuban, and he was. It was like a celebratory cigar for catching a big fish. About ten minutes in of rowing with the cigar in my mouth, ended up puking all over the christ You did yeah, And that that day I did yeah. And I had to switch to uh switch chewing, you know, after that, just because there's too much smoke so work working man, Yeah, for sure, too much. I got a really bad tobacco experience. We went to see Stepping Wolf, Commander Cody and Head East all in concert and had some King eddies. I remember everybody getting sick of puking off those king eddies, Like, what's what's a king eddie? Oh? Those like ones you get at the gas station. Ye, yeah, that's sick from that. Yeah. I celebrated my high school graduation with some cheap ass cigar and then I turned green, got real sick through up everywhere, and that was still smoked some cigars since But this what did you throw one in already? No? I didn't because I'm not sure if I want this Georgia piece. Yeah, I'll go yet, all right, I think are you afraid of puken? I mean, I'll probably leave it in for a short amount of time before I start to get dizzy. I'm really sensitive to nicotine. So keep keep walking me through how you got into this? Then, so you eventually wanted to quit? No, no, no, no, I never wanted to quit. Chesters trying to quit, well, chesters trying to quit, dirt quit quitting. Yeah, I got a big box. I hit here for you. We were in South America, and here here's how Dirt was gonna quit. We're in the jungle. Okay, I can see. I'm so abs pure to I don't I need a lesson of how to do this. Dirt brought to South America with him. He brought a kind of true he does not like, and it was gonna be how it was. This is his quit plan. What kind did you bring? I think? Yeah, I think it was like I was in no grizzly. Well it was grizzly, but like wintering green or something. Okay, broad a kind you didn't like. That's a that's a big one. Okay, wait I should pinch off a much smaller amount. I was gonna say. I told Steve this in Arkansas. If you don't, you're small of a dip. Do you end up swallowing it and get it? Do you ever know anybody that gets addicted to the alternative or is it always go the other direction? Well this has nicotine in it. What I'm saying, no one ever like didn't dip but then got alternatives and got hooked on alternative for sure. I think the Zans are a great example. Yeah, so like Zan's are a great example. Like you said, they're just it's just nicotine, salt and powder, just water and that's about it. In a in a pouch, starts on it. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. I know a handful of in my mind thinking about now, handful of women, women who never I'm messing this up. I can't even practice. I'm taking mind out. I'm scared. So you're doing it like the Swedish way. Now you got it in your palm. That's called bacon a prilla. Okay, so I'm doing that. Whatever you just said. It's a wrap song right there in a prilla. Already got my nose, got too scared. That's perfect, that's perfect. I'm not gonna okay. And then the upper lip or the lower lip, it doesn't really matter. Lower like like to one side. Put it just put it right, Steve like mouth that was, I'll start to hallucinate. Me and Stanley Johnson. We're back in fifth grade on the playground. Man, I was gonna have a while. I was hallucination. Just put it right to scar the side, right on your canine. My grandpa always called it wormed or like growing up as a shirtman, some coming. It's super fine. That was impossible that I got buzz that quick. Yeah, yeah, I swear I got a buzz. So we we got the same amount of nicktaine. It's in like coping. I he grizzly and this stuff you had killer vanniller. Do you like the flavor? Though? I love nice cream. I chewed up and eat it. Look good, looks No, this is a little kind of blue the whole day. And I should I should spit off in so I don't. Yeah, I mean like when you when you start to feel it, juice up. That's just spit it right and in the job. So it's not tobacco. No, it's not tobacco. What is this? This is our is our own blends. So a lot of other companies that are do uh alternatives. They use mint leaf, which is very similar, but mint leaf, if you flavor ment leaf, it just still tastes like mint. So they'll come out with like a bourbon mint leaf, but it's still just tastes like mint, and you don't want bourbon and mint mixed together. Some companies will use corn silk, which no flavor really gets into that. Yeah, it's just it's it's not they kind of just sit on the shelves in the gas station. Nobody really likes them, you know. And so we we used uh we basically sourced the world for years on trying to find the best leaf and we found a tea leaf that we love and um and that we are process of making. This is more we basically do more than tobacco companies will do with their dip with this. And like if you'll notice our dip, like when you have it in, it's it's got more robust flavor than a lot of tobaccos because you don't the tobacco is almost a little bitter when it comes to a dip, and so ours, like for instance, this root beer, we got one called Rambling root beer. I mean that thing just tastes like straight up like barks root beer, mug root beer. Um, so yeah, it's it's uh, it's doing really well. But the biggest thing is we just wanted to put something out there that didn't suck, because every tobacco alternative I ever tried was horrible. It was just like it made you. I mean, it probably helped you quit because you just didn't want to do it anymore, or you would just go right back to dipping grizzly or copening. So I ought until Dirt's quit and plan. Oh yeah, I went to South America with a bad kind he it like, and chewed the ship out of it. Well. His plan was since he didn't like it, he wouldn't burn through it, and once it was gone, he was gonna come back to America and never dip again. But he said he got back to America and went into a gas station first thing, and he said the tins were actually speaking to him. Yeah, I said, he said, they're they're calling to him. Yeah, so you're bad. Tobacco was grizzly Wittner Green? Yeah, I think it was. I can't remember, but yeah, that and it didn't. I didn't chew that much on that trip because I didn't have much. That's when I got back to the States, I was looking for it and Taylor, what do you like the grizzly winter green couches? Dirt, what's your old man like? Oh he's grizzly, So I said, Dirt's old man likes grizzly. And I said to Dirt, um, you don't choose grizzly. No, here, here, here's Dirt's quote. Dirt said, no, I got a good job. They called it a welfare bearyer, the welfare bearers what they used to go all of it. Now it's a lot better because back in the day, Grizzly used to be the cheap one, and now Grizzlies just as good as copening. Grizzly was trying to get onto Kodiak's group, right because Kodiak like Kodiak Bear and they're like, oh, we'll does go with the Kodiak had the stronger nicotine, didn't the long cut or what was the Kayak not Kyla. That's where I started. They had certain winter grain like a Kodiak. I remember working at a plastic plant and it was like a little bit stronger than a normal like Gusli or the Kodiak is they use a better tobacco. It's more premium tobacco than than what other companies used. The only reason I switched to the Grizzly, I like the Copenhagen was because they made to meet a better pouch than um. Grizzly made a better pouch than the Copenhagen was like a little white little cloth. But I mean personal preference there's something to Jerry you're saying about like the sweet the snooze is do you leave a like the generals? I have leave a weird aftertaste bitterness. Yeah, Um, I got one of my good buddies from way back logger. We all cheered Copenhagen in college and stuff, and then um he quit a big deal and I hadn't seen him for like five years, and who was krim got that front. I'm trying to like feel what's going on right now. If you're feeling the buzz, i'd recommend spitting it out already. I don't know if I felt a buzz or if I have if I was like having an adrenaline rush out of my fear he gave you the placebo dip. I'd like to know if that was true, because I could have had just a rush of like whatever childhood memories. I was a real deal. But so this is gonna puke this buddy for us. I'm still okay, but it's coming out. So I see I see him this, I see him a couple of months ago. Well I'm back. I got I got mixed up. So he quit, Like how you got kind of a camouflage Hawaiian shirt. This this is you know they got smoker's jackets. This is my dipping shirt. Yeah today I work. It's like a camel Hawaiian shirt. That's a great shirt. Breeze real well too. But um so Forest haven't seen him forever. We go have a beer somewhere and pulls out one of that one of your tins wanted. Oh really yeah, interested in the outlaw can. I hadn't seen it before. And this was before I knew we were going to be doing this. And he's like, yeah, I quit and I tried getting on generals but they tasted like like cap piss after a while. And now he's junior, he's hooked on your outlaw. So I mean it's and he's the type of dude who needs to chew like he's got six kids, gowns the log and company, like you gotta give yourself a break every once. So you feel that if someone has six children and owns a log, like they're just gonna have to chew. Well, I'm saying like nicotine is one of those one of those things in life, like it's a little reward. I think that says it's having a piece of cake in your pocket and when you run out, you know, it's kind of like that person he's like, hey man, you got any cake? You know, Yeah, that's a personal thing. I could relate to the um. I can relate because I used to have where I used to drink way too much. Like I used to get a lot of alcohol, but a lot of alcohol. If I wasn't out in the woods, I couldn't no way, Like I couldn't be home um and not drink. But if I was in the mountains, no desire to drink. But if I was home, I would get just a terrible thirst. And it wasn't until I had kids that I was able to stop drinking. Not stop, but like mostly stopped basically now like I only drinking out. It was like whatever, I'll just have a drink. Headaches right well. And I got where I started to feel guilty about being hungover, and I felt like my kids didn't ask to be born. But they wake up in the morning ready to go, and you have a hangover. It's like it's not their problem that they're there in awake in your house like you had them, so as then want to be like annoyed by them and have a hangover, but you you had that reward system before your kids, equivalent to like yeah, man, at night, like if I was writing or doing work and I got done, um, that was like the immediately finish up by am bor stiffy. Did you have anything in your process of writing that you did like a fix? Was you just clean headed? No? No, no, no, totally. All that stuff is alive. Man. But when we were studying, when I was like learning to be a writer and went to graduate school and everything with a lot of kids that want to be writers, we all looked up to. We all thought that the cool writers were the ones that supposy like we're like that, you know, like everybody has image of like the drunk you know Arles Bokowski. Yeah, like you're all wasted three in the morning. No man, ten am Monday morning, that's when you write. Like, uh No, I didn't know. I came to think that that was a total lie. I think that's that's maybe one out of a hundred. That's the way him in a way he didn't. I mean in the afternoons he would drink. Yeah, one out of a hundred writers, like I don't when people talk about like writing drunk, I just don't, like, I don't think that that's I don't I don't. I don't think that that's really a thing. Alcohol does not help my writing or my stage because you think stupid ship's funny exactly. But then Taylor, you quote you quoted Einstein to yeah, chew and chew, and yeah, what I so Einstein he thought of his greatest ideas well in the process of the motion of chewing. So he might not have been chewing tobacco, but he's probably chewing gum or something like that. And there's some kind of like firing mechanism of the process of chewing. So when I'm writing a song or something, it's like I have a dip in or this or that. But I mean some of his greatest ideas he was chewing something, which is interesting, you know funny My kids leverage that because when I was a little boy, uh back when we're eating that tobacco and whatnot, you couldn't have gum in school and you could wear a hat and uh now you can choot gum. Wow. Yeah, my kid, My wife just bought my kid a big old sack of some kind of like little lifesaver type things. He's going to bring down. He says he needs it for doing his math test. He man the son get good grades, making proud. Second, I had a my anthropology teacher in college, and Missoula would tell us if you're a smoker before a test. He encouraged people to go smoke a cigarette before they took the test. For some reason, he had some anthropological stimul Yeah, he had something dictaine. I mean, they've done studies on a word. It's you know, it's just like caffeine and stimulates brands. It stimulates you kind of. Even in Silicon Valley and stuff. People that are there, like New Tropics, they'll use nicotine, you know, like the little zins or like a nicotine tablet as a stimulant, you know what. But to me, it doesn't stimulate. I mean maybe after doing it too much, it doesn't. Your tolerance is probably real high. You still have that ammonium thing and just now took it out. But yeah, that's good. You got a buzz, I mean, pretty better than the grizzly. Yeah yeah, uh okay, so we're still gonna get what you when you canna do for us whatever you like. No, you had one in mine. He's hell's that now? But I don't know a's where as your guitar right there behind? Oh ship? Can I pick it up? What was the same? Put the put the mic to the forget it? Well, no, I don't know how to play anything. No, no, but we're gonna try. When I play a guitargo a you gotta start somewhere. But you're a writer, so why don't you play that in a company? Something that comes to mind, this is you're doing? Because all my saw long as I think over like, um, well, my kids, so anytime I wear a button up shirt with collars on it, my kids like, why do you look so fancy? Just so fancy? So I wrote a song about myself called big Dog? How did you get so fancy? Come on? Come on playing? You get so fancy? You know it's a big dog. How did you get so fancy? A little coming around the mountain? Which comes but Jared walked me through. How so how did you go from like um you YouTuber YouTuber to um tobacco magnate hopefully cover a dip aficionado saying that's funny. I did not know that. Um well, I just I mean I did so much stuff on dip, and I feel like I've basically learned more than anyone out there on on the process of this and actually making something good. So then we ended up starting out long became pretty much the big uh tobacco free dip out there. So so he's a tobacco free magnet. Yeah to bad. Yeah, tobacco free magnet. Yeah. Now, but I mean, I don't get me wrong, I still love tobacco. What's your favorite personal favorite out of anything? I mean, I'm sure you like out of your blends even maybe like a winter Green or like my favorite out of this one is I love the Sweet Tea because I like the is one real and got tobacco. Yeah, I got their question for you. Yeah, explain your new album Fishing Songs. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm a I'm a musician as well. The only thing I know how to play the G string. I reckon. That's all you did. Yeah, so I got enough to get you in trouble. But yeah, so I got an album. Well by the time this is out at the drop, but like you've seeing it on Instagram, you're Fishing Songs. Yeah. Yeah, so we we did it like a little EP called Fishing Songs. That. Um it's just I got hunting songs coming out in November, and uh so, yeah, I've been I've always been doing like comedy music, just writing stuff. I just enjoyed a lot just writing stuff. And um so I had this idea of like, man, I just like all these people that follow me, they love fishing and hunting, so might as well write songs about it. I just feel like there's not enough good fishing songs out there. So there really is not a lot of fishing songs. No, and if they are, they're very like manufactured by Nashville. And you know, I shouldn't say there's not a lot of fishing songs. There's not a lot of fishing songs that have made their way into the sort of in the dark nyably fishing whistle jump ran, Yeah, but that's not a fishing yea. There's this guy in the Wisconsin named spid Peeper. I don't know if he's playing. He's got some great fishing songs like I'm Gonna strap the canoe to Mini Van, I got my Cooman stole and a portable can the whole fishing song. That was a beautiful voice right there, Country boy can servive it's got a fishing line. And what's funny, you couldn't It was illegal in Michigan. You couldn't use a set line or a trot line in Michigan, so people didn't know what it was. But we had a trout and uh, I want to be hell billies. When I was a kid, they thought he said, um, we can skin a buck, we can run a trout line, because they didn't know what a trot line was, or they thought he was saying we can skin a buck, we can run a trap line, not knowing that he's actually saying we can skin a buck, we can run a trot line. Country boy Cancer Vive. I'll just play a little bit of this now, which let's see you got catfish fever, tree pounder. We've always ridge pounds, kiss my bass? K which one? Which one should I play? Play? You play tree pounder if you that's like limb lining it basically, Yuh, call my buddies and tell them to meet at first light. We're going fishing in the morning. It just feels right, man, that boat looking real nice. Can't wait to have a fight on the deck where I'm keeping that line tight. All my buddies, No I want to go pro. They always laugh and say, yeah, good luck, bro. It's kicking me y off, and I'm so sick at their scarfs. I'm catching fat girls gave me, but they keep breaking off. Once a cart officient was the size of a stark, had a brown color like a no rusty truck. No one believes me. It looks are deceived and you probably caught a tree. Why aren't you perceiving treat like a suree pounder? Baby walk out one of those. Dude, that's great man. Yeah, so we have to like two musicians here. Do you just feel like a competitive streak right now between two of you very similar material? It's the different different guys like like like like the fish and here you are there. It's a songwriter too. Oh yeah, well so's uh little Chester is like a fake songwriter. So let me tell the funny story about Chester. He didn't do any wrong. Chester got married and he serenaded his wife at his wedding with a song, and somehow it generated some confusion among the attendees and people came away thinking that Chester had written the song. Am I correct? That's correct? Who had actually written the song? Tyler? So I'm hearing all about Chester's new song. I'm like, I don't think so. But he didn't do anything to propagate the lie. He learned to listen to this kid learned to play here hand its guitar to Chester. Chester learned to play just in order to serenade his wife. Now that's a much more. That's a cute love story. Did you like a pick? Chester? Is this standard? Pull the micro over by Chester? Chester sings like a bird? Uh? Oh, boy, just do a quick advertisement right there, do a quickly Chester. He learned to do this in order to sing a song to his wife at his wedding. And that cute that's a romantic makes me want to date Chester. I always can't play when I'm in front of people, but you know, well, how did you play in front of your wife at the wedding? It's a cowboy and new h in South Texas. Oh this good one. His face was burned deep by the sun. Part history, part sage, part mesquite. It's there when poncho Via was young. Tell you a tale of the old days when the country was wild all around. See it under the stars of the Milky Way. Listen to the Kind Hotel and theo boo boo boo boo yao boo hoo you pooh boo you boo you poo bullo yao boo hoo you poo. Ladies and estor listen. So I wrote a song about Chester singing that song and goes it goes who yep poo yep Chester that He's like Chester sings who you poo? It goes Chester, something like that. I've heard some other versions, probably Jester goes who uh god man plays packed and in Dirt's got songs? Yep, yep, tell one of the names your songs, dirt, Oh, hobo song, Hobo song. That's a funny story. But another time you're telling an our time you bring your own instrument in yepkay, you can pass it over man, room full of talent now, oh real quick for you do your diddy joint. That's what they call it nowadays, jazz cigarette. No, not that, like don't like in rap you call song a joint. You didn't know this, yeah, like the joint? How do people go find you? Jared? I know where I find you? Where? Where can we can you find me? I find you? Jared Outlaw on Instagram? Oh yeah, yeah yeah on Instagram, Jared Outlaw on YouTube, tell where to find you on the YouTube, it's Outlaw, and then Outlaw out Doors. It's just YouTube dot com slash out Law, and then YouTube dot com slash out lot of doors. And then if you guys want some dip, outlawed deep dot com at it and you got a video where I like one where you walked everybody through your boot closet. Oh yeah, yeah yeah Outlaw merch dot com. If you want some outlaw boots, I got some roots you got down right now? Peel one of those off, Yeah, those are those are Outlaw. Get me some. Remember what I said about Remember I said about cowboy hats, dude, But I don't know if that extends the boot. Backwards Badass was my first song, Backwards Badass. Remember when that came out? That Yeah, did you got can you send me a set of these? Yeah? I got on, I got work boots, I got so you got comes crocks and those boots from Jasen. I want to square toe. Yeah, now dirt, if you saw me come strutting in the office these now you beat my ass? No, he rocked that in your tracks in your track pants? Yeah, long wear, I can wear my track pants. My neighbor calls me coach when he sees me in those pants. I'm gonna wear track pants and these boots, dude, No, no, you're tinkering ones that you and Jimmy have the song I wear that, yeah, my little thing. Yeah. The more the older I get, like if if I'm out about the more I tried it embarrassing my wife. But the more I try to look like a junkyard dog. My wife always trying to look nicer. I always trying to look worse. Have you have you rocked that? Uh the Hawaii look? You had the wet suit, in that wet suit, I do go out there in wet suit pants. No feel no compulsion to in any way look good. It's just like whatever that is is gone. It's like thirteen years of it does it to you. I don't know. I just like it's just gone. But I will wear these boots in my track pants. So yeah, yeah, now here's the deal though, um wid yeah, well these are d's. We have a wide and a work boot has a steel toe. No, I don't want that. I want square toll. Yeah it's still square toes, but I want to stay back. Was badass on it. I'll get you a wide what's what size are you, Levin? I got you. So that's how people find you. And but so you you run all. So the spatuns are on their own website. Yeah, that's mud Jug. That's that's not my company. That's it's not yours. It's a buddy's company. I used to Yeah, and so um so spatoons are. Yeah, you can get those at mud juke dot com. And we send a lot of mud jukes to the military too. So yeah, if you guys go over there, you can you have a you get a free mud jug basically with your purchase, so you can either get it or donated to the military so they don't get their army tanks and fighter jets all full of dip step exactly. Keeps keeps the military clean, keeps the terry clean, exactly. Okay, Taylor, you ready? Okay? Now, Taylor, would you ever do you think you're gonna have Chaster're open for you sometime we're playing Thursday? Not we gotta go out of time for work. Uh. I think that I really feel like, um, I'm not just saying this. Here's the way to put it where it won't just seem like because because because I like you, we're friends. It's a phenomenal album. Here's my proof. My wife, I can tell you something about her, feels zero obligation to you. What's that mean? Like we're friends, you've been on the show. She's not like, oh, that's cute, I'll go see him. She knows the album. We play in our camper all the time. And when she and she somehow independent of me, she didn't realize you're on the show right now. Well, this is a while ago. She knew that. She was like, can you call him to get me ticket? It's because he's I said, well, hey, he's in town, he's on the podcast. She wanted tickets to go see you. Wow, that's awesome. And hadn't even and this is before she even like put it all. She hadn't like assembled all the pieces in her head. She likes it. That's good, and she's not gonna go do something she doesn't want to do totally. Now. The cool thing about like music to me, it's like good songs like you show them to children or old people with old people and children like them. Usually that forces people in their middle ages to like stuff and it's like that's a good litmus test of like, I don't know, for some reason, children like my scary songs. You know, it's it's interesting. But get this guy. Yeah, I showed a few of my buddies some of your music. Man, everyone loves it. Oh, I think you should be. I don't know. I don't want like, I'm not wishing fame on you, like fame in and of itself as a value. But I do think that I hope people find out and and like, I hope more people find out for sure, for sure, they sure will. It's ain't quitting anytime soon. I got people that come up after shows like, please don't stop doing this. It's like, what else would I be doing? You know what I mean? A lot to quit? Mm hmm it's the song is called Hell's half Acre. H h Hell's half facre. It's a deep docle. You can't do nothing save my soul. Camp I forgiven when I fool what I've done, The thing left to so un wrong. So what's turned on the gas and strike up a match, Jump in the car and drive away fast leaven nothing but fire on the black top, food, blue white smoke, grassing in my review, got the hounds on my hues. You're blooding my track. And once you go to hell, boy can come back. Get the Easianna founding over bye, so stout the hammer roll and these all blue. I'm gonna shave my face. I'm gonna ditch my copper, down my sleeves, cover of desco close. My eyes are still in the scream on every night while store even, nothing but the fire on the black top, blue white smoke rising in myria. Got the hounds on my hues. You're putting my truth and what you or the game come back? She'll go st in my cousin the skillets of my whoa. The girl wants to hot lund in. But I can ride out with hopping of free train ye through the end of the line. Never be the thing close. My eyes are still here, the stream on every noight or out of still to leave nothing but the fire on the black top, the blue white smoke rising in myrio. Got the hounds on my eels, Your blood of my track. Whatt you go to bollgain right to supper hold than you have a set with this drink nice wet your whistle would my juice s

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