00:00:08 Speaker 1: This is me eat your podcast coming at you shirtless, severely, vot bitten, and in my case, underwear lidcast. You can't predict anything. I'm just gonna come right out and say it right from the get go. This is the worst. This is the worst episode. This will be the worst episode of this show we've ever made. Because this is gonna be like remember when you were a kid and you turn on TV and there'll be they'll be like, I think they still do this though. There's like a channel where everyone in the channel is selling something QVC. This is like watching Yes, this is like watching that. This is like watching an infomercial. I'm just gonna come flat out and say it. But there's some special parts to it. Right now, here's the deal. Well, if even a small dinky dinky, a small percentage of the people that will listen to this show, if a small percentage, almost like a single digit percentage, is that right of the people that will listen to this show would go on to Amazon right now and get thirty five bucks and go by the Meat Eater Fishing Game Cookbook, whose subtitle is Recipes and Techniques for Every Hunter and Angler, which is available for its launches. It's like coming out November twenty. If a small fraction of people will listen to this, would go do it. It It would do me such a huge favor and I would like be really happy. It would be like my life goal would have been achieved and I would never work again. Has two because it's Christmas time? So how many pages are in that? But we actually brought an actual salesman who's never man how many units, Matt Cook? How many units of things have you sold in your life? Not as many as I could sell this book? Well, you're feeling that guy. He's never touched the book. He's a professional salesman, well trained, has never touched the book. But we brought him in just to work up a sales pitch to sell it. He's working on it right now. But just quick, how many pages I'm gonnaty pages covering processing of so like how to cut up, how to cook over a hundred original recipes and processing in recipe and cooking and fixing and substitution information for everything that it's broken down like this. And I'm gonna talk about this mother stuff for a while. I'm just gonna keep returning to this day. M booked to try to talk people into just doing me a humongous favor and going and buying it. Now, um, it's broken up into big game, so like you know, mostly like antler and horn being gay, but also pigs and bears, and then small game, which is like third small games, so hairs, rabbit, squirrels, and then upland birds, waterfowl, freshwater fish, saltwater fish, shellfish and crustaceans and reptiles and amphibians all about. Have you ever seen a more beautiful pictorial of how to butcher, snap and turtle? No, I've never seen a Reptiles and Amphibians chapter. Uh No, it's beautiful. That's because most cookbooks suck. I got you know you haven't heard this. I was gonna say, I was gonna make everyone here pretend that I didn't tell him. You guys are good at lying, right, Okay, so lie for men it. But Matt wasn't here, So let me ask you this. A guy wrote in the this is interesting, speaking of wild game. His freezer. He had his freezer went to put on him, and it should have gone to put on him. So he calls his insurance agent and he wants to make a claim. On having lost all his wild game. So he calls his insurance agment agent and the guy says, I've been in this business for a decade and no one's ever asked me about how to handle a claim on having lost wild game, like what the value of it is. So this guy goes to the state office and comeback, comes back with this the Farm Bureau of the State of Mississippi had come up with this formula years ago. Lack of formula that since there's no comparable market value for wild game, the only monetary replacement you can get when you make a claim on losing your wild game is the cost of processing. If you processed your own wild game, your odd luck. So when you lose a freezer, you lose a whole held because your freezer goes to ship. Your insurance might own might compensate you, but limited to what you paid to have it processed, is the only value they all assigned to it. And this guy just dropped like an invoice that said I paid my wife a thousand dollars to process. You know, I don't know how how deep they did, but it's really interesting. Man. He's like to do the road and his talking about how you know. So, you know, we've talked this a thousand times, but the you know, wild game resources in this country were depleted horribly. Deer, turkey's waterfowl past your pigeon driven to extinction, Buffalo nearly driven to extinction by market hunters. So people that shot game and sold it into commercial markets, um, and it made a living doing it. And one of the one of the many things we had to do to save American wildlife was end the selling of wild game. We've up. Well, this is a bunch too. Like the other night, I was in a situation where I was almost forced to go eat pen raised elk. So if you see elk on a restaurant menu, it's not real elk. It's the elk raised up on a you know, it's the elk raised up on a on a farmer ranch. Right, It's not what you can't sell wild game. So he's saying that this is one downside of that system is you can't get your you can't get properly compensated. What if you shot the elk on a ten dollar you know, paid guided trip, could you turn that in to the insurance company. I certainly would try. Well, all I can tell you. And this is just anecdotal because this is just one mug from Mississippi. But that's what he had happened to him, and that's what he found when he researched it. Now, maybe if you have some hard hitting lawyers or something. But I would tend to doubt it, man tendant doubt because there you're paying for the experience. But you would, You're right, be honest, you'd have a you'd have an invoice, you'd have you know, a credit card statement that was the dollars that generated that. But I certainly think people should try. I think maybe one agent to another may be able to slip one through. Yeah, they'd be worth a try. Here's another thing we're talking about, swamp rabbits, the cottontail rabbits would when a contail rabbit ships in the woods, he doesn't seem to pay a whole lot of tention where he goes. Um, he just goes, what are you cool on swamp rabbits? That swamp rabbit is? I absolutely do not know what it's still validus aquaticus Okay, the Latin name, yep, Now I'm familiar. Do you do you know? Do you know? Got it? Now? If you go by Latin, I'm good. Do you know that rabbits aren't rodents? Matt, I did know that rabbits were not rodents. The lega morphs, they're a laga morphs. Absolutely. So. The swamp rabbit is just a souped up cotton tail okay, five six pound cotton tail who will jump in the Mississippi River and swim across in order to evade a hunting beetle. It is a indigenous to the South swamp rabbits. We don't have them. Yeah, they're yeah, but but you know not they can go into the deep South. But they're also found in the in the border country. We've been debating a lot about what is the South, you know and them, But they're in Kentucky, Okay, Okay, which is the South. But some people feel like it's nudge and edging towards the north. One time, Lincoln, I think, sat in Ohio and yelled across the river at at Kentucky, mad at them about Southern issues. But so, uh, cottentil normal contail rabbit, eastern cottentail, mountain cotton tail. He just ships wherever he wants, right. They don't have any rhyme or reason to it. But a swamp rabbit has uh fidelity to his latrine, and Janice has seen this. Back me up. A guy was pointing out, I was talking about this, puzzling over it, you know. I was saying, like, when they were in their environs where they live, it's very flax. They live on the floodplain, and I thought, maybe he gets a log he likes to go on. He defecates on the log, and it just makes it higher and higher up because a llama, who also has fidelity to his latrine will defecate and build up such amount of pellets that he uses as a lookout like a crow's nest. Fell a fella rode in, and he was saying that he doesn't really know about this idea that rabbits defecate on a log with the intent of building up with lop mound that they can sit on. He says that may be true, but he also points out that it's necessary for cotton tales to eat their own poop. It's called capra faggie. And he wonders about if it's not in the in these uh, these environs that are prone to flooding, that if it's not just a good way for him to store his Why are they eating I don't say that very often. Why are they eating their own ship? You know, it has something to do with UM, has something to do with their digestive track. Maybe Yanni can look that up. A lot of times he'll ask him looks up up and then by the end of the show he'll find it. So I have a sales idea, because Dancer doesn't have anything to add to the you could domesticate swap rabbits so that, you know, like a cat, it would ship in the same place in your house versus a cotton tail which would shoot all over the house. Yeah, there's a there's a there's a business opportunity there. I like the way you're thinking. UM, guy wrote in this this is interesting, Guy writes, And we're talking recently about um the sort of existential crisis that unters in New Zealand and Australia are facing right now. Where hunters in New Zealand Australia are predominantly hunting. You know, there's like kangaroo hunting there for commercial markets like your recreational hunters. In Australian news, hunting non natives and they will often ah, they will often justify their pursuits by explaining how they're helping to control And if you go on social media and you watch, you'll see Australian hunters, you know, talking about this like man, you know, to say the natives, we gotta do all this hunting um. But then what happened. The reason we were talking about this recently is because in New Zealand, the government who does a lot of coaling, they do a lot of control work on some of these more abundant non native ungulates. Uh, they do a lot of control work on them, and they're talking about up in the control work and getting rid of them, and it's making the hunters they're real easy. And I was pointing out how it's hard because you're sort of justifying your activity by saying we're helping to control nonnatives. But then when the government decides just to do a totally eradication, the hunters getting nervous because they want some and so you're left with where your rhetorical strategy right, the thing you use to justify your activities becomes null and void. And the guy actually wrote in from Australia and he was saying that. He says, it does put us in a funny position because we're, like he says, quote, we are left exposed to the harsh reality of not just saying that we want them here so we can hunt them. You mean about that, Johnnie, I'm glad that he wrote in and accepted that, just admitted it. This tricky man, I wouldn't like, but we've been saying and I think all along it's sort of it's been allows the argument why you you hunt, and it just allows you justification for hunting. Really, yeah, you can't act like yeah if if I think a lot of people do it in a lot of different ways. People struggle with you know, there's a lot of it's it's complicated, right If someone said, hey, man, why do you like to go to baseball games? You're not gonna have like, oh, a reason. It's a whole bunch of reasons, going back to how you brought up and what it makes you think of and time with family, like hot buttered popcorn. I mean, right on all manner things. This this is huge package of things. But I think hunters a lot of times getting a thing or they try to narrow it down or like oh, if we didn't hunt, the deer would overtake us and kill us all or whatever. And um, when you get into this like where it's justified by we're you just saying like, oh, no, I just do it for population control. And then someone says, oh, you know, don't worry about bro will take care of it. The government will do it. Then you're like, then you gotta be like, man, I wish I'll have set something different. Another guy rolled in about uh. He says, a good way to have chew, a good way to dip. He likes to mix. He mixes hubba bubba yeah with red man m I've heard of that that we consulted with dirt on that. That's who he's writing in about. And he says, the question is where do you get first cancer diabetes? That's a strange mix. Another guy rolled in. He's like, man, you guys are always arguing about Tony Sees an old Bay Steve being a Tony Sees man, and you're only being an old bayman. And he's like, what about Mrs dash Big Mrs dash fan good. It has its place, but it's not like the other two. He thinks it's real good to take like fish Filet's and put some Mrs Dash on it and wrap the fish up and illuminum foil and cook it. He likes to take pickerel, acreel. You're wrapping tinfoil, put some butter in some Mrs Dash on there. He says, your Florida, How good it is? He doesn't put anything else on his fish? Isn't Mrs Dash Like, Uh, it's across the country, right, and it isn't Old Bay and Tony Sea is kind of just Maryland and like, no, dude, Tony seasons everywhere. Man, I got on the Tony I got, I got on it. I got on a Tony seas. I got on a Tony season Michigan's Upper Peninsula. What you can't get farther away from the Bayou country and still be in the country. I've been well Alaska, I've been lying to for a while. Then we used to call it Tony Sees Uncle Tom's for some reason. I have no idea why, huh no, Uncle Tom's cabin Yeah, it was like some kind of short cut. But I still don't understand how you'd come up with Uncle Tom's. Someone must have been reading Uncle Tom's cabin. Um. We've been having a lot of talk about how good how well dogs can smell. And a guy rode in, and he's a police officer and he's a canine handler. He was trained for two years to work with canines. He worked with a German a half German Shepherd, half Belgian Melani Melanois And we know this m A L I N O I s anyways, some kind of souped up mutt. And dog's name was Kane, and he was a dual purpose dog, meaning he was a narcotic detective dog and suspect apprehension. Oh yeah, that's a mean looking dude right there. That that's like the guy that in movies when a police dog chomps on the bad guy's arm. That's the melanoir. Yeah, well, you know what he's saying about this dog he's talking about he's talking about he just only reason he wrote in he because we were struggling to explain like how well a squirrel dog can smell it? How can a squirrel dog do such a good job of smelling worlds? And he just brings up away that it was explained to him one He says, it was explained to me in training the dogs can smell up to fifty thousand times better than we do, which is like hard to right, it's still hard. But because he's like, there's a good anecdote. W's this thing called the cake theory. So let's say your mom bakes a cake and you walk in the house. You can you walk in the house and you take in the smell and you're like, oh, someone made a cake. Like that's the smell you get. He's just a good way to think about it would be that the dog walks in the house and he goes, oh, eggs, flour, milk, salt, sugar. And that's how he feels that they're a way to distinguish their abilities from our own. Um. Another guy rolled in, and here's here's a guy. He's kind of established his credentials. Remember. Can you recap the Andrew McLean story, the famous skier? Mm hmm, I believe I can. He was caught, uh explain like who he isn't what he does and whatnot? He Um, it was Andrew McLean, Right, Yeah, I don't want to mix him up with other some other famous skier, but he uh, he's like a Utah backcountry skier known for pioneering. I think some lines in the wash Sage and writing a like a ski guide book for skiing the wash sage is how you say that m always said it a little bit dinky bit wrong. Well I'm sure I'm in out of that all the time. Go ahead. Um. Anyways, he was caught on trail camera stealing a trail camera and a tree stand or two maybe even the guy had the hunter for some reason had like a double camera set and um, and they only saw one camera and took it in the tree stand, and the other camera caught them in the act of doing it. Just yeah, stealing it, stealing. Well, this guy writes in he's kind of like setting up his credentials. He opens up. He opens up by saying, I'm just headed out to film a dinosaur digging project for nat GEO. So he's like laying He's like, you know what I mean. He doesn't say like why that matters, but he throws it out there because he's wanting to right, he's wanting to paint a pick. He's like build up his street cred he's building up some crabs. So your soul be like, man, well, you guys are camera guys. When you hear that he's going to filming a dino digging thing. Are you thinking, like this guy's top shelf depends on what branching that g O it is. Man, It's like there's a couple of different ones. So so you hear that and you don't automatically think that you're because I'm gonna get into a negative about this, because we're gonna get into a negative about this guy. Um he he he. So he sets up his his credentials by saying he's he's he's a niejair Um which is in Africa, and he's heading out to film a dino digging project for that GEO. And he says, I get why McLean did it. And he talks about he just started bow hunting this season, and he talks about how hunters litter a lot and a lot of times you'll find where hunters leave little stashes out in the woods and a lot of garbage out in the woods and our tattered sleeping bag and old tarp and no, no, no no, an unusable m R s and doesn't like it. Hunters are real dirt bag woods trashers, um. And he goes on to say that. He goes on to propose the idea that McLean was simply cleaning up the woods by stealing a tree stand and a trail camera, which is an indefensible position to take. There's a big difference between garbage left out in the woods and someone's legally placed tree stand in trail camera. You don't want to add that here here the lovely voice with Mark Kenyon. Yeah, you could take that a bunch of you'd say, like, your your car is like a hunk of metal just sitting out there, So I'm gonna steal that to clean this place up. Cleaning up some new truck I found out in the woods. I think the more interesting thing is the tactic that the hunter who has stuff stolen. I think the tactic he used was something that more people should use in the white tail world. And I do know some people have talked about I've got a friend who who was trying this. But it's a great way to uh if we get the word out that enough people are doing that. I think a lot of trail camera thieves we'll think twice to do the double camera because I might be getting picture we we were looking at. We had a dude showing us a bunch of trail cameras on his Uh, we were muled your hunting Colorado ran into a fella remember this, Johnny, And he was showing us a bunch of trail camp pictures of various elk and mule deer and whatnot, and they all were taken at a downward angle, you right, And I was like, what the yeah? I was like, what's going on with this? He said, Trail camera theft is so bad in New Mexico that he now places his trail cameras up high up in trees, angled down. People don't notice them. Doesn't the cameras that send the pictures to the internet, you know, deter some of the stealing. I mean, you'd get a picture when someone goes to steal your camera. Has that curbed the theft? The direct transmit? I think that the percentage of trail cameras out there that have that feature is still so small that but yes, I think that it's getting to the point that more and more people will worry about that. I actually actually gone to the um to the point where I place no trespassing signs that I will specifically say property. I'll write and market property patrolled with with cellular cameras that kind of thing where there's some serious issues of trespassing. So they said, oh yeah, so that I can't see the camera, pature's gonna be sent right away. That's a heck of a deterrent. And it's true or not true, it's true. Okay, Um, you know this is take this with, take this with. I'm gonna say something in uh, keep in mind that I'm the well I'm gonna I'll just come out and say it if I could, if I was the command master of the universe, I would get rid of trail cameras. But I would also get rid of the Internet. And I use the Internet, and in fact, this is like an internet based digital radio program, so it's like I'm comfortable using it. But if I was commander of the universe and I could make it go away, I would make it go away, and I would make trail cameras go away. Even though I will use trail cameras, I would like I wish they hadn't been invented. I understand that position, and I understand both sides. But one, I love trail camp pictures. I post them all the time on social media because it's like cool. I like how they've rewritten some of our understanding of wildlife distribution. And I love it and like you learn from it, but there's just something about it is like, uh, I only don't like them when I run into one. I like my friends a lot, I just don't like other people's. And I think that a lot of people are getting a little bit wigged out with the fact that there's like surveillance in the hills. Now I get that. I do think it. Also there's something to be said about and I've kind of battled this a little bit myself, the fact that takes a little bit of a mystery away. There's something to be said about going out into the woods and not knowing what might show up. Yeah later tonight. Now it's well, it's gonna be this buck, this buck, or that buck, and there's never a surprise. Dude, the buck I saw this morning, I was trying to figure out what one it was when the trail. So so yeah, you're like you're sitting out there and you feel like you're like waiting for a friend when you're out in the woods. Now, man, I know he comes here. It's like, oh, there's one guy and the other guy. Yeah, I kind of like I don't like it, but that's not what I don't like about. I don't like being out and and all of a sudden realizing there's like some guy's trail camera sitting. Why not confine him to private? You know? You know what's cool? It was cool, but it went away like Montana for a couple of years. It had to be that when Big game season opened, you had to pull him. That just changed this past year. Then they made it go back the other way again. Something. It's just gonna get too ridiculous because that the technology gets better and like people are just able to like live stream. It's just I don't know, man, it's just like it just is. It's just too much. It used to be so much. Some kind of limits, some kind of regulation, we limit all kinds of stuff. Yeah, we need to have that, That's what I'm saying. I think you can't use a red dot, you can't use you can't use a red dot site on your boat. It's like all kinds of stuff with them. The regulation I would like to see put on trail cameras has to do with cell cameras, because that's where I see this line being crossed with some line of ethics and everyone else. Everyone's gonna have their own opinion on this um. But I find where it gets real weird for me is when you get a picture now that's happening right now, and you can make a hunting decision right now based off for real time data, that seems to to go over the line for me personally, I wish there was like a fair chase mode that you could turn on your trail camera, or maybe there'd be a loss someday that requires this that requires a twenty four hour delay before anything gets sent, so there's no real time. You're not gonna see what's happening right now. You can get the benefits of a cell camera, that being it gets transmitted to your computer phone so that if you live miles away or whatever, you can still get your pictures, or if you don't want to have to go in there every two weeks and put your sent all over the place. But this at least keeps you from abusing that technology. At least I think it's abuse if you see a picture on your phone right now and go stalking in there and shoot that buck. That's like for me, that's that's why you need to when you're gonna do stuff like this. Usually the fishing game agencies try to get out ahead of it before it becomes standard accepted practice, Like how people were so aggressive around regulating the use of drones before before drones became super widespread and has so much common use. Because then it's hard because there's like a resistance built up, and I just haven't seen anywhere doing like that kind of leadership. I'm looking like, where is this going Where you can be out in the woods. You know, you're you go out plant twenty cameras that are all giving you a live feed of what's going on, and you got them in all your elk meadows, or you got them in all your you got a camera on all your duck ponds that you like to go jump shoot, and you got a live stream on your phone. I mean, we're like, you could do this right now, and you're like, oh, let's go hit that pond, jump that pond. They're on the they're on the whatever end of the pond, So let's make sure you approach from that end. Because there's a lot of states and I think more should get on board of banned two way communications to like coordinate the taking a game it's just it's just someone's gonna have to get out ahead of it. I feel like it's definitely my property has is influenced. You know how we look at it when game move it's domestified, or maybe it shouldn't have, you know, domestified if you know there's animal activity in the middle of the day. You know, we've never been in a position where you know, let's go on, that buck is on that spot at this particular time. But overall movement, you know, or you look and see you know they moved overnight because there's a full moon and you probably will have a slow morning. It hasn't equated to success in particular. Um it has definitely reduced trespassing because you only have to catch someone, you know, ten minutes after they've been there. Not only I think you're a freak for monitoring, but if you go there and show them a picture of them on your property within a few minutes, it prevents the word gets out, prevents a lot of trespassing. I'm sure there's a lot of positives, but just it's something. It just it's something that concerns me and I think it's gonna become more of an issue as a technology gets better. Mark kennyon Wired Hunt. Yep, so you think you're wired to hunt? Let me ask you this. This This is how the email started. Someone said that I'm saying that this is a great question. Guy rights in. My dad and I have been hunting on a large property next door to their house, almost a thousand acres for all of our lives. Three years ago, the founder of a chip company, I don't wanna name the chip company. The founder of a chip company bought the land and he puts a fence up around it for the purpose of keeping his cattle from roaming off the property. But it's a nice, big decorative fence. He puts an eight foot wood fence around the perimeter of the whole property, eight foot tall wood fence, he says, to keep his cattle in. The guy still allowed to hunt it. But he's always been uneasy with the idea of hunting high fence. So here is he's always hunted a property. All of a sudden it becomes fenced. They go in there last year on opening weekend. They both get to get a deer, and then they got and they agreed not to hunt anymore. They just can't decide he says, he still goes in there to trap. He goes in there too, small game hunt, but he feels weird hunting ducks, hunting deer on it knowing that the deer are stuck in there and can't get out. Wow, that is a tough one. That is a tough scenario. Can anyone put a eight foot decorative fence around their property where where you're basically you have captive wildlife vatizing He doesn't stay with stadies, and I wouldn't be surprised any property if you know there's wildlife. Can you build a decorative fence around your property knowing that it's going to capture wildlife on the inside. When people of fence, when people do high fence things on high fence stuff in Texas, Yeah, you don't need to kick all the deer off and then build defense. It's not Is that regulated by stay wildlife? I don't I don't know what the permitting system is. I don't know. He doesn't say where he is. I'm more interested not to see if the guy's being if the guy, I'm not really interested in the dude. I mean, it's interesting. I'd love to know if the dude is like a breaking law, not just but I'm more interested in the idea of it. So here is he hunts and all of a sudden, it's fence as you go get a new spot. That's a really, really tough question, man. I feel like if that happened to me, I don't know, man, it would be real hard to go and like walk away from your spot. I understand why. I think I would feel dirty. I would feel at least for for for me, I would start to have weird questions about it. Because of that point he brought up, like, all of a sudden, now you're hunting a high fence property and all the things that means possibly the thing is a thousand acres is big. It's big. But then we talked about the reduction of mystery. You're never gonna get a surprise deer on there again. You're never going to have the risk of someone else getting that dear or that dear disappearing or there. Yeah, it's still a challenge, of course, there's still gonna be a lot of work probably has to go into it, but it's different different. It would be diminished, it would be diminished, and I would probably do the same thing he did think it's so hard. I just don't. It's never gonna have to come up again. He's gonna be the only guy ever in the history of our country to have to wrestle with this. Like, I feel sorry for the guy he's got to wrestle with him. But I don't know if like us talking about it is going to help anybody else. So you just don't see it being an issue. Yeah, I mean, I think you just had to go in there and see how it feels, and like I would just say, look, keep hunting it until you're like, okay that that was so easy and do because of the decoratifense And I'm quitting, you know, I gotta add here that I am the one that I use the word decorative. He doesn't use the word decorative. But no, no, what wooden fence is not a practical fence. There's cheaper ways of doing it. There's an incredible amount of money spending on a thousand acre fence. That's yeah, what's the typical high fence? They're high, just like woven wire. Yeah, yeah, I think height ridge pounder. You got nothing to say about that, probably, dude, I got an opinion. He's got to hang it up, dude, he's got he's gotta just give that spot up. There's no question really my mind. Yeah, it's not easy for me. Man. No, there's a fence there, Dude, I don't know. I feel like I might. I'd probably still be I'd probably still poke around in your No, No, you can poke around all you want. I just be like, I don't know. Maybe he didn't fence the whole thing. Would you be like, would you be like him and hanging up just big game, or would you say, yeah, the rabbits are high fence. Now, the squirrels are high fence. There's no such thing as a high fence. Score. Yeah, because the squirrels can. That's that's rabbits. I don't real that's up to him. But yeah, man, he's got a quit. Do you know a guy wrote into you. The guy wrote into me about what the gray rabbit? What? What was he got to say? He says, you should have done candle light dinner high to the grayness. Matt is very very smart. Okay, one more, one more, one more real zinger, real zinger. Um, don't go get you're supposed to be pushing the cook I'm coming around to them. Give him Matt time to work up a sales pitch. Then I want to talk about the cookbook. I have a question real quick about the dog and the smell. I don't know the answer, but okay, let me ask this question. I was pheasant hunting last year and it was September and it was hot, and our guide said that one of the issues the dog was having was your analogy that he is chilly. That the dog can smell all of the spices, that beef and everything, and that it was um. If it's old, doubt it's not as hard on the dog. The dog can find pheasants easier, but when it's hot, they can smell every ingredient. You know, they smell that the plants, you know, they can smell other animals, rabbits. Have any of you heard that that heat. I feel like I've heard that. My buddy Ronnie Bam would absolutely have a lot to say about that. So we'll have to return to that, okay. I had heard dryness versus moisture, so like a moist situation, they'll be able to smell more. And I heard this in the context of of tracking deer, So tracking a wounded deer or hit deer. Actually tracking on a rainy day is better than a bone dry day. Similar. There he was saying, you know, when it was cold, and he didn't say if there are snow or not, that the dog could identify a pheasant scent much easier if it's cold, because it's it's a singular scent first, is overwhelmed by all of the scents when it's warm. I'm trying. I'm tracking what you're saying, and I can't remember. I know that I heard when I was running dry ground lions with someone one time, with a feller by the name of Floyd. We were tracking mountain lions with dogs, and I remember he had a lot of opinions about the climatic conditions and its effect on a dog's nose and its ability to cold trail and hot trail. I just can't remember what, you know, like what was what was good and what was bad. I remember that he had a lot of thoughts about it. Did you see the mass running that acts? We liked a whole lot, Johnnie, No, I see it now, Yeah, that's the Alaska acts, man, it's the old well, what's the name of the model? That's that's what one of the nicest mass produced acts I've ever laid my laid a hand on. Man, I'm not trying to bought you up because you're gonna give a sales pitch of this book. Okay, here's one more real zinger, real zinger for everybody. This is This is more of a zinger than the zinger from a minute ago. He goes on to say how he hates hunting shows that's cool. And he goes down to say, um, lots of reasons. Um. He goes on to say how how he's heard me mention that if you took away the food or you took away the fun, I would lose interest in hunting, Like it's a package of things that that all need to be there for me to love it like I do. Um. And he goes on to say he needs my opinion on something. He works with a fella who he generally likes. We get along just fine. And he goes to say this, the dude is this. This is why almost more of this is true. I feel like it must be true. The guy is a vegetarian okay, but not one of those annoying ones that throws it in your face. But here's the way it gets weird. He's a vegetarian. Buddy hunts. He likes to hunt deer and turkeys, but doesn't believe in eating them. What he just donates it all to a food bank. And the guy saying, I cannot wrap my head around this, and he um says, no one buys a pair of pants from J. C. Penny just to take him down to the Salvation Army and drop him off. It's fantastic. It's now there probably are a few charitable folks buy clothes and that donate them. It's a good question, man, like you won't eat it, but you'll like to shoot it. I've always like it's another one of those things that it's just one of those things I see both sides of. I can't really work up a good opinion about it. The fact that he's a vegetarian has nothing to do with it, because I feel like I know dudes, they're uh full long carnivores that do the same thing. Yeah, but it makes it kind of even more zingy, like the he's a vegetarian, right, sure, a little bit, but I think we take a step back. It's it's like the same wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong you're saying, Remember, um, happy days. One finds he was wrong, he couldn't stay wrong. He'd be like I was. He couldn't bring himself to say it. I know people. I know people though, who will shoot a deer purposefully to donate it, and they view that as like a way to give back, so they do. They also shoot a few for their own freezer. Yeah, but why do to just give money to the food bank. It's a different way to go about it. And maybe, I don't know, maybe part of it because they enjoy the hunting aspect of it. So to your point, there's food, there's fun, and then also there's the management perspective too. They might need to be taking some management deer off of farm or something like that, so that might be part of it. But I'm just devil's advocate man. Yeah, yeah, but but I think that the interesting thing is, though, if this guy is fundamentally opposed to the eating of meat, so what if his So many people I imagine would advocate for the vegetarian or vegan lifestuff because they don't want an animal's life to be taken or blood on their hands maybe or something like that. This guy obviously doesn't care about that. He's not that guy, So then what's what's his angle? I don't know. We plant based diet, so it's a health thing for him. I do know. And then if again, man just like playing Devil's advocates, I cause I can see both sides of it to a crippling degree, but I do know. And then wonder if you don't want Like, let's say you're in a situation where, yeah, you don't want it, I want to just let someone who wants it get it. Why not like leave it for someone that wants it. I get though I have a hard time. I I can't justify killing animal unless I'm actually going to personally eat it, So I would have a hard time doing that. But I also can understand people that do. I mean, I there's something to be said about helping other people with food. It's a food acquisition process. Um. I know a lot of guys that maybe will keep a little bit and then share the rest, and I certainly I share a significant portion events and sometimes too, like I'll a surplus and I'll share that, And I guess like it's there's some where's the line where it becomes questionable. That's why I'm thinking about this because I'm kind of like the worst kind of person. We're I'll share it with people who are I'll share with people who are, relative to the population in general, quite wealthy. And I think that that's just great, right, But then when someone shoots a deer just brings it down to food bank, I'm like, what's that all about? But I'm like, well, man, I'm giving it to like I give game et a rich people. It's like, why not go, like, you know, it wouldn't be a lot better to go give it to the needy, especially if you're gonna pick up the processing fee. What what if someone was like one of your buddies. It was like, man, it's last week Elk season, I'm not gonna be able to get out. You have a few free days, you think you could, and you had it. You had like a cow tag or something, my own cow tag, your own cow tag, and your freezer was full. You didn't play it on filling that cow tag because your freezer is full and if you were to shoot another one, you would have way too much for the year. Is it a good friend? It could be whoever, But someone's like for good Someone's like Steve, I'm not gonna get out anymore. Yes, you think you're a good friend, you can burn that cow tag for me. Yeah, for a good friend, I would do that. Okay, But you're right, and I'm just the kind of worst kind of person where I wouldn't be like, you know what, I'm gonna do it and pay the processing and drop it off at the food bank because I'm suspicious to that for a weird reason that doesn't make any sense. It's making me feel a little embarrassed that I feel this way. What's it's because the food banks like the easy way out, Like I know I I know of people that would shoot shop and just take it to the food bank because they don't want to deal with it. Dance Okay, Yeah, you're you're helping me articulate my perspective on it, because, like I bring a lot, you have a lot of assumptions, so in some way you're kind of looking at it like um in some way you're kind of looking at it like you're sort of reading into their motivations. Because let's say you met a guy who's a volunteer at the food bank and he's like, man, I volunteer for ten years the food bank, and I'm telling you it's really hard, like the protein is hard to come by, and when we get the venicon in, people love it and it like makes their day and it's such a nice thing we're able to do at the food bank. And once I had that experience, I really started just like, you know, I'd get to do here for me, but I really would just keep hunting because I love to support my local food bank. That dude, I don't want to give him a big old hug, but if it's the kind of thing at one time, let me give you the first time I ever hunting Texas, I was hunting with a guy and it was like a my old girlfriend's dad had a dentist body or something like that, and he caught winto the fact I'd like to go hunt, and he took me out hunting down my Waco, Texas and I got a buck, and um, he comes and it comes around to pick me up where I was hunting at my blind and comes around and sees the deer and it just says, ah, maybe I can get j J to take this that perspective where he was like inconvenienced by the idea of having to deal with a deer in its meat is something that I like. I see that and I think about that being like a little bit offensive to me. I have a question for you. So I have guests come and hunt, and they know that I donate the meat to my inner city employees, but they they have no intention of taking it. They know I have an outlet for it. Does that it's still why do they want to kill it? Do they really care about your employees that much? If so, No, that's that's my question is I don't feel great about it. I have an outlet. They know that I have people that are in need and very much want the protein, and that the deer will not be wasted. UM. I think a lot of it's the you know, deer camp experience and sitting around and and eating and drinking. But then they know that there's an outlet for the protein. Um. It obviously benefits someone, they know it. But I feel a little bit uncomfortable when they feel good about themselves that you know, they're hunting and they feel that there's some altruistic outlet for it. It's that's just not the way hunting should be. It should be you know obviously that that they have every intention of consuming the animal themselves. So I feel like I set up an environment sometimes that I'm a little conflicted. But you know what, when I'm up at my fish shack in Alaska and we're stacking up salmon and hall of it, I'm I already know. I already know that I'm going to give a bunch of it to my neighbors who are hardly needy, not even kind of sort of needing. So if I came to your fish shack with the intention of fishing, knowing that I'm not taking it, that you're going to give it to your let's to your neighbors that are not needing, does that change it? If? Okay, here's what we're getting into the nitty gritty. This is interesting. Let's say you're at my fish shack and you said to me, you know what, dude, funny thing. Oh, we've we've been stacking up sam and halibot. I don't eat fish. I'm gonna give this all to my neighbors. I would say, you can't take any home with you. If you said, dude, I love eating fish, definitely playing and eating fish. And you know what else, I'm excited about sharing some of my neighbors. I'd be like all right, bro, let's load your cooler up. It's just like it doesn't make any sense. But yeah, it's like, um, it's not buying, it's not binary for me. It's like it's like it's just different. Man. It's like because I need to know the more, Like I need to be comfortable with the motivation, and I need to be like like when you see the fish come up out of the depths, like when you see the hall of it come up out of the depths, Like I need to know what you're looking at. I need to like what you see. Of course it's a fish, but what do you see of the fish? And that's important to me? And and and and so you're looking for your looking for like clues is like what does this person see when he sees a fish? It feels a little bit you know. I've had people that I have not asked back because they felt a little bit more like they were into killing. And I'm the outlet for the ORO team, you know, so I didn't feel like they were truly bought into the hunting experience. Um So although they know there's um, you know, a charitable element to it, I just don't feel like they there they have skin in the game. You know what you can do if you were a real prick, if you got a guy like this, take him he gets the elk or gets a deer, you'd be like, you know what, man, I don't feel like messing with this. Let's just take the head and split And if he says, yeah, you're right, then you don't how to fight him back. You score him immediately to the edge of the property. It's a good litmus test. I got a buddy who might be uh, throw an even different direction into it or different layer. Rather. He loves to hunt, hates killing like eats it, eat eats meat, but doesn't really like he'd be fine with donating. Like he's the type of dude who would if he knew if he was on a deer hunt and everybody's like, we're gonna donate all these deer, he would love it because he would get the aspect of hunting, he'd feel better about the killing, and he wouldn't have to deal with it. Yeah, but he doesn't. He like hates killing ship, but he also like doesn't really want to deal with so what does He needs to find something? And it's so weird. He loves duck hunting because he likes the the like an ammidity of when you're hunting with like a bunch of dudes and a bunch of ducks come in because you're like everybody's shooting, You're like, I don't really know who shot what, you know what I mean. But he also loves he likes the idea and goes deer and turkey hunting. My father described that about being in World War Two where he said, uh, he was in a situation once where he like very definitely needed to kill something, like he killed someone, was like very obvious that he killed a person, and that weighed on him. But all the time you spend where everybody's just shooting and all the stuff, you never need to He taught about that. He says, you don't know. And then it came a point where he he killed a person with a hand grenade whoa and um was certain did it happened? And he says, and that's the thing I think about, not just like mordering someplace and everyone shooting and just mayhem and you know, but the minute you go like, oh man, that was my action, that's the one that stuck with him. That's heavy and if I remember right too. He was telling me he thought the person was drunk, but then another relative of mine heard the story. He didn't hear that part. He thought they were drunk, a person was drunk and maybe lost. Weird man at night in the dark. Yeah, he never forgave the Germans. Have I talked about this? Yes? He did. Yeah, I never forgave him. Do you work up a good pitch for that book? Absolutely? Okay. I think that the Meat Eater book needs to be tied in with a guy's ability to get women. I think that I think it, and you went you went to business school. It can expose him to his lady friend that he's sensitive, that he knows how to uh you know. It could open up the idea that he gets to hunt more. Um, as long as he brings, you know, a good meal and a bottle of wine to the dinner table. Um. I think you could do some type of promotion where if a guy does meet a woman, he has to buy five more cookbooks. So um, I would I would definitely take this on as my number one product. I love What was your backup sales pitch? Um? My backup sales pitch would be and get a the women to buy it for their man. Okay, it's not gonna it's not gonna lead. Um. It makes the woman appear to be sensitive and cares about her man and what he likes to do on the side, and it's something that they could do together. I think that uh, gall and a guy could definitely uh create a new life together with a meatia or cookbook. Good man, I think we've got a kind of a matchmaker going male female female male. Great job, Matt, I hate that, great job. Think he's right. I don't think your bullshit us. Oh no, there's no question. I actually intend to do it. I've been married twenty six years, so I'll let you know how it goes. Uh So, just I want a little bit about the book for real, not even of course it's for real, but I really do need people to go buy the book. And you're not gonna like it's a beautiful book, right, honest? Yes, how long have you been working on this book? When do we go to Wyoming and crating those beavers? Oh that was like two thousand and sixteen, Now we're working on it. Before then, not much that was that was spring, So yeah, probably not imagine how much work. This was two and a half years because that was the first thing we started to try to collect, because we realized it would be hard, and we were uniquely suited to make the book because we wanted to start collecting processing photos um and collect processing photos of things that people wouldn't weren't going to be likely to be able to go and get all of a sudden. So we have processing photos in the book of like how to process, how to cut up and process things ranging from wild pig, wait till dear my ma he mahi, crabs, turtle, turtle. We had pictures of the beaver, but it didn't make it, no, but the beaver tail recipe is in there. How to process for I mean, yeah, I'm not even kind of like scratching the surface yet. How to process, cleaning process bullfrogs, how to cleaning process squirrels, how to cleaning process rabbits. A thousand ways to cut game birds meaning how dispatch cockbirds, how to cut them in half, breast them, plucking them skinless, boneless brass. All of this information is in the book. Hit that book over here, man, you're just admiring the beautiful pictures. Oh man, I love it. That's definitely what everybody does the first time they open it and skim through it. Everybody sort of looks the pictures and skims over the words. So we started collecting all these processing photos and in the meantime, like dirt Myth has tons of photographs in here because he took a lot of what we in the working on it. We would call them the lifestylers. So there's a lot of like lifestyle or pictures in here. Another section that we put in here, um and everything. So like early when I mentioned how it's laid out, where it's laid out into these chapters where it goes big games, small game, water foul upland birds, freshwater fish, saltwater fish, reptiles and amphibian shellfish and crustaceans, and there's like an extra thing called basic and not so basic, sauces, sides, sauces sides, and accompaniments. And each chapter was broken out with like an introduction of what's going on. It kind of gives like general thoughts about the thing, all kinds of beautiful pictures, and then we have this section that we worked on a fair bit called the Nature of the Beast, And what I try to capture in the book and explain to people is that I don't generally think that. Well, let me put this way. Sometimes like you'll you'll go online will put up a thing where it's like a recipe for an elk hert, and someone will say, oh, do you have a recipe for a moose heart? And kind of an operating thesis in this wild Game book is that that the species of the animal that we're talking about when it comes to say, horned and antlered game, that the species of the animal does not matter as much as the cut. Do we talk about this on a recent podcast episode? Yeah, I'm I don't know about recent. I'm sure that we've covered it at some point. But meaning a shank recipe when it comes to horned and antlered game, say, and in the case of shanks, also black bears and wild pigs, that a shank recipe is a shank recipe doesn't matter if you have a shank from an antelope, a mule, deer, a white tail, just doesn't matter. It's like cooking shank is cooking shank. So I try to get away from these like cookbooks, these wild game cookbooks and that and I own many to break it out, or like here's the antelope recipes, here's the white tail recipes, here's the mule to elk recipes. Because it's just like this is a much better way to approach wild game. However, there are like exceptions, and so each chapter has this section called the Nature of the Beast, where it's kind of like tasting notes on all the different varieties, sort of like general best practices and guidelines. So for the big game nature of the beasts, it's sort of like a general breakdown, like what are what are American prong horner analope, like, like, what are they known for? What are some of the things you can expect from the meat on them? Same with black bear, caribou, elk, moose, mule de your white tailed deer, wild pigs, like like generally, what are best practices for handling them? And what are the exceptions? And what it's meant to be is it's meant to serve as a thing to help guide you through substitutions. If you live in the stern the US and you only hunt white tailers, you might be like, what does it do me? Because I'm just dealing with white tails anyways. But keep in mind that we do the same thing, the same nature of the beast thing for freshwater fish, where we talk about all your all of your varieties of freshwater fish, your panfish, the different bass species, northerns picke roll smell, salmon, trout, you name it, all of the guidelines on like best practices for handling the fish and how to figure out substitutions. So when you're on something and you're looking, this guy's got like, oh, here's a great walleye recipe, say, well, I don't fish walleye. How do you make sense of the fish that you do have in order to be able to use them in generally cooking, um, and generally cooking and using substitutions, Because I think that in a wild game cooking, it's like really important to get away from this idea that there is such a thing as a walleye recipe. There's really not. I would say, there's a recipe for mild, white, flaky freshwater fish, for sure, And so how do I help you make sense of that? Um. Gambrel skinning, So how to skin animal on a gambrel? How to do it on the ground, So like a detailed piece about how to go ahead and like break down big giant animals laying on the ground. Um. And then we put all these other kind of like little micro sections in here where we have a thing about the big buck myth. So there's a lot of like even wild game cooks always push this idea that's like young animals are really good to eat and big bucks are no good eats. So we kind of like put that to test and talk a little bit about that. We have sections on evidence of sex requirements, sections on what want and waste means, sections on chronic waste and disease. How to completely bone out, Um, you know, how to how to tabletop bone out a white tail deer, and what cuts you want to wind up with. So when you're working on your white tail deer and you want to plan out where you have a variety of meals you can eat throughout the year, how to like cut your white tailed deer up, what you should do, like different ways of approaching the front legs, boning them out for burger, using them, cutting it for osabuco, cutting it for blade ross. I don't know. Jump in here. If you need to ribs whole ribs not whole ribs, I don't know. I was gonna say that, uh, And I'm sure most cookbooks do this, most authors of cookbooks do this. But I was impressed with how christ how did you say your last um who put more? Who put more op into this book than anybody else? Yes, yeah, we definitely owe her a lot of credit. But she made sure that every recipe in there was like not only checked and vetted, but probably three, four, sometimes six times over by professional chefs and sometimes by two and three professional chefs. And then she would say, you know what, I'm not quite ad on. You know that t smokes duck brass recipe, which so far is like one of my favorites. It was a real eye opener for me because I got to try it because she asked me to try it to make sure the timing was right to get it to the temp. And if you've never tried it, it's smoked, but it's something you just do at home with like you basically make your own mini smoker. Was by just lining a pain with lunium foil and putting lid on it. Sweet recipe, and Uh, I tried it and I was like, yeah, it was spot on, you know whatever. It was eight or ten minutes of smoking and it was spot on. So um, I was just impressed how much emphasis she put into that, really vetting the recipes and making sure that they were just like super dialed in. Yeah, we knew. I've known Krista Ruaine for years because the production company, zero point zero Production is always produced Meat Eat or the TV show. Um, well yeah, they like like Yanni is the producer of the show. We work on it. I work on writing, hosting, conceptualizing, Yanni conceptualizing and producing. But the company that's done on her and it handles all the post production things at zero point zero Production, and Christa does other stuff with them because they do a lot of food content. And Christa is oversaw the creation of the book and took a lot of like and you know, and she's worked for quite a number of famous, you know, celebrity chefs and and other uh you know, high end restaurant chefs and took a lot of those best practices make sure. And so we ran it through where she has a team of recipe testers that we would run all the stuff through. And she was also really good about making sure that that in going through it, that we had recipes that accounted for everything. So we have like how to make scotch eggs from the big game section, how to make scotch eggs, different ways of handling liver, weighs to handle marrow bones, weighs to handle raw venison, uh tongue, and then like general things like how to roast a hunk of meat to perfect and is one of the recipes in here where it's like rather than just giving a recipe, it's like how like how to do it, like like a technique for how to make perfect roast all the time. And then loin and then we make sure to have like particular things so like wild hog dishes, and then a bunch of bulk wild game sausages and a pictorial explanation of how to stuff and make your own sausages. How to do burger like general best practices and how to handle big game burger when it comes to cutting with fat or not, and how to go about doing all that by yourself. Um, all kinds of preparations for ground meat, ways of making pick meat for tacos, how to handle bone and ribs off antler, big game. More recipes on how to cook shanks and asabuco, how to can meet. Yeah, I needed that one. It did a bunch of jerky stuff, jer stuff. I came out out of that no feeling like that. Rab packs is the way to go. Yeah, Rob pack can me when I was a little boy. When you can meet, you always browned. At first, it just seems like the logical thing to deal. Putting a bunch of rotten meat in your glass jar and then sticking into a pressure cooker doesn't seem like the logical thing to do, But when you do both of them side by side, you end up with a better product by doing it that way. The thing that you found when you were working on it, um, that I thought was interesting is when you brown it, it firms Yeah, it firms up, and so it doesn't pack is tight. But my mom candle a lot of venison man, and um, yeah, you brown in the cubes and they firm up, and then you get that you wind up with a lot of aerospace and you got a top of with liquid. But when you wet pack, it's just meat mhm. And I realized I think that you're like, by doing the browning, a lot of that flavor was being left in the pan and the juices were being left in the pan and maybe evaporating, where when you just put the raw into the can, it can't go anywhere. All in there. We had when I was a kid, we had my mom had a canning room. It was like the laundry room, but the hallway that led to the laund room was called the canning room. And my dad had built wooden shelves and it was lined with canned venison and all the stuff that came out of our garden, and my mom would go to the farmer's market and can all that and it was like you're walking down a corridor of canning jars. That was old day stuff. Man. I used to think it was cool. Another thing that people like about the book is if you watch media or the TV show, there's certain recipes that really hit us hard. Like, for instance, we did a hog trap and Rest episode down in Texas. In the end the end of the show, we took our pigs to a guy that processes wild hogs. Clayton Saunders was his name, and Divine Texas and he made the best wild pig shoulder I ever had in my life and had like that special sop that he learned from someone. Was it his daddy taught him how to make the sop or some crazy thing like that. I can't remember, but I use it all the time. That stop is good stuff. And then when you're done stopping with it, you just add a little more catch up and reduce it a little bit and it makes the finest barbecue. So so there are certain recipes in here that you might know from the show that we went and dialed in and tested and make sure they got it right. And those recipes are in here, like that's called the South Texas wild hog shoulder. And then just how to smoke finally, like and this is one of the ones that took a lot of testing to get it where it would work for anyone, is how to take a whole deer leg so you kill you know, you kill a white tail, take it back leg? How to brine and smoke a hole deer leg? And I think that we eventually hit on probably a pretty failsafe way of doing it, the key being you need to brine it way longer than you think do. But it was one we did and did and did and finally got where I am like very confident that any Joe Schmock, even rich founder, Yeah, you're not even candle. You're not gonna get a gray beer. Like. But when we did it with that sick of beer recently, it came out perfect. I think it's dialed now so now here here like take for instance here, you know, I wish I had one of those numbers called now one. Anywhere books are sold, you're going you go on Amazon right now, to pause right now and go on Amazon and then you just go. Once you get it done, just go about your day, turn off the go, listen to something else. But I'm just gonna so bear with me. So we opened up. I opened up the small game section, and we have our Nature of the Beast stuff. So we talked all about the different kinds of squirrels, gray squirrels, fox squirrels, pine squirrels. Right, black face, gray face, explain all that get into rabbits. You're talking about Eastern cotton tails, swamp rabbits, mountain cotton tails, snowsh your hair is jack rabbits. What's all up with those? Then the aquatic rodent sections, so like tasting notes on muskrats, beavers, tasting notes on the rogue outliers like raccoon, porcupine possum and then get into different ways of skinning, so like pants and legs or shirts and pants method of skin in for cotton tails. Yanni has a beautiful demonstration of how to tail skin turned out really nice tailskin and squirrels done very well. You can get a good look at the of the Latvian power ring in this section how to part during and I went out and shot that squirrel together? How to uh, how to part out like best practices and partying out rabbits and squirrels and the serving sized portions. And then how to make buffalo wild wings or buffalo hot wings, which are called we call him and here buffalo hot legs. How to take squirrel and rabbit and make a thinking man's wild wing hot wing? What do you call them? People? It's a great photograph for that one too. Yeah, the old school lunch tray. You got your blue cheese, you got your celery sticks, your carrot sticks, you got a can of soda pop, a big plate of squirrel hot legs, buffalo hot legs its beer. Yeah, probably like a single hop, I think, um. Yeah. So how to make inside matt inside jug How to make buffalo wings with squirrel and rabbit, and it is like, like, I think that is a great have you had it? Mark? Can I make you something this week? We already got three squirrels. Um, I will make you some of that sounds really good. Here's one that not a lot of that you might like the pictures for, even though a lot of guys aren't likely to make it, is how to fire roast a beaver tail and kind the story of how that came to be a thing from the Mountain Man era. How to roast beaver tail and get the fat out of it. Here's another. There's another thing like if you watch the Media TV show and we go down to do a small game episode with Kevin Murphy, we have Kevin Murphy's recipe in Kevin Murphy's word, Kentucky style squirrel gravery with cat heead biscuits, straight from Kevin Murphy, all about how to make cat heead biscuits. Then you're going to rabbit curry, gumbo, barbecue, smoked beaver sandwiches rabbit or squirrel and creamy mustard sauce. Catch a tory. Then we go into waterfowl and we got the same thing. We got the tasting notes and then the different processing things. So all explaining all about like dabbling ducks, how to handle and think about teal, wood ducks, mallards, pintails, black ducks, widge and goad walls, shovelers, how to think about your divers. Where you got your your kind of high end divers like canvasbacks, redheads, ring neck ducks and scott scoterers, and you got your lower end divers like afful heads and golden eyes. Then you got your lolo in organzers. Like what can you do with these things? How best to handle them? To wind up with passable stuff? Then all kinds of thoughts on geese Canada, geese, white front snows cranes, like what these different things mean? A big breakdown on all how to use all manner of guts from everything you hunt, with a big section on bird giblets, So how to do gizzard's hearts, livers from all your water fouling upland game birds, how to clean your gizzards out? How to d tendon Like if you're ever eating a duck and you wind up with how the back legs, there's so many tendants almost makes it like not worthwhile. Oh there's laughing powering there y'all need demonstrated at how to how to cut a duck's leg and pull the foot so you pull all the tendons out of the back leg and you want with a much better product. How to burn off pin hairs with a blowtorch. When you're doing it my special way of cutting mallard ducks, you wind up with a boneless breast and in bone in leg, bone in thigh, and drumstick, which is a genius way of doing it. Handling geese. How to make a waterfowl liver patte, skewered and grilled duck hearts which can be substituted with turkey hearts, goose hearts, and explanations all that kind of stuff. Duc nachos, wild goose pastrami, soy sauce, duck ginger, scallion oil tea smoke, duck braised waterfoul seared goose. How to make duck Ravioli's. Should I go on, You're just making it really hungry. It is dinner at time, we haven't even dinner yet, and this is really getting to tell me. Um, yeah, that's all. Like I said, I told you up front was the worst episode of the podcast. Everybody's one I just had to do because I just want people to know about the fact that we put a lot of work and a lot of time, and tons of people worked on it. And it's like the I feel that it is the It's like the Magnum Opus. Man, It's like the Great Compendium of wild Game Cooking, Ultimate Stocking Stuffer, Big Stocking combined with berry white and a bottle of wine. I'm telling you, you'll sell like hotcakes. Yeah. And and I was just doing that really annoying run through what's in there, but I didn't even begin to scratch the surface because we hadn't gotten in all the fishing parts and hadn't gotten into a lot of the hunting parts. Do you envision that maybe a hundred years from now, someone might come upon this old cookbook and look at it and be inspired to go out and try to find all the ingredients necessary to recreate these recipes. It would be such a could that possibly happen? Dude? That would be like if in a hundred years someone wanted to make a movie. Um, it would be a great movie. Yeah, that someone would do with that what I did with the scopier. You really need to buy three copies. One is the present and you really need to have to for yourself because it is coffee table worthy. It's totally worthy of just having a clean coffee coffee table copy to flip through as you're a coffee and and then yeah, the one that's gonna go right next to the joy of cooking in the pantry get all scuffed up, dirty, Yeah, covered in blood and grease. It's a big hardcover book with the dust with the dust jacket, and on the front is a really beautiful picture of game ribs and a moose antler um. That's all man. It's like a lot of times at the end of these shows, I'll talk about how you can really do us a good turn or do us a real solid by going onto the Apple Store and clicking the right most star to give us a five star rating. I'll talk about that kind of stuff, or to go to the meat eater dot com in and get our newsletter, which is very helpful to me if people go and do that. But this is the greatest uh favor I could ever ask of listeners of the show. As you go and in in in order the cookbook. Now, that's all man. You got any concluding thoughts. Honest, do you think we're screwing people by having an episode like this? No, not at all, because I've been paying attention to the the old time the clock here, and uh, I feel like they got a very entertaining forty minutes before you ever even jumped into selling the cookbook. So we did them right in a hundred and forty some episodes, and there's one episode that's all about people just need to do me a huge favorite. So if you do one and one forty, that's not that bad, not that bad at all. No, if you're gonna complain about this one, then you just you're like the worst kind of freeloader out there. That's right, I do. It's kind of a concluding thought. But do I really want to tell you less people think that I'm just really not doing my job. I want to tell you about why rabbits eat their own posies. Yeah, this is straight from this is written recently by an intern at the McGill Office for Science and Society. Rabbits are forging herbivores, eating mostly grass and weeds, but this fibrous cellulose rich diet isn't the easiest type to digest and by the time dinner has made it through their intestines, it still contains many of the nutrients rabbits need. Rabbits and hair's beat this problem with a special kind of digestion called hindgut fermentation. And short they eat their own poop and digested a second time. Um. They actually make two different kinds of droppings, little black round ones, which is probably the ones we're most often seeing, and then a softer black one known as second tropes that are eaten. And this process is known as you said it earlier, Say it again, I don't. Yeah, coprophagi and functions the same cows or out deer chewing their cud. So and it's and it's not only is important because they're getting that kind of second harvest, you remember that joke, but it keeps their digestive system flowing smoothly, so they have to do it. I used to know a good joke about a man who has made to eat uh another man's feces, and I always like the punch line. The punch line was I had lunch with him two weeks ago. Monday, Mark, you got to concluding thoughts by the book, and you know not to ask too much. But if you like it, I imagine you'd appreciate a review on Amazon. Yeah, that or by two Mark Kenny from Wire to Hunt, thanks for joining us. You didn't get that. You didn't get to lay a lot, a whole lot of white tail wisdom on us. No, hopefully we'll have another chance. I'm hoping we have no chance. So we have some white tailed adventures today, and we'll have more tomorrow and the next day. And you had what he called his number one best day of deer hunting ever today. We should tease that. Listen to a future episode to find out what happened Ridge Pounder by the book? Man's it just by it? By a couple of copies? Do you think they should do it just because I'm begging it? Like? Is it that? Like? No, they should do it because if they actually are like into any of this stuff, it'll be a game changer. I do think it would be different if you spend a whole podcast talking about why they should buy the book, but the book was actually lousy, then you could say, all right, this is pretty rough. The fact that you're doing them a favor by telling them about the best wild game clickbook out there. You know what I'm gonna do. It's too late for anyone to be helpful. But I'm gonna call this episode begging and pleading so that people don't get the wrong impression about what the episode is. But then they'll they won't know it'll be helpful still, or you could call doing you a favor. No, I think I'm gonna call it. Yeah, you know what. I like that better. I'm gonna call it doing you a favor. It's a good idea. Mark. I was gonna call it begging and pleading, which is so pathetic. Yeah, you gotta come from from position of strength. Steve Seth Morris, Thanksgivings coming, Oh yeah, and talk about Thanksgiving. There's a shiploaded recipes in there that would be fitting. Oh dude, do you mind take it away? Okay, my brother knows the chef and the chef. It's a long story. My brother hangs out with a chef who doesn't hunt, but my brother would present him with wild turkeys, and the chef, over time, to my brother's estimation, perfected the art of making a Thanksgiving turkey with a wild turkey, which is no mean tap, no small taps. He perfected it where my brother says it is not just the best wild turkey, but the best turkey it exists. It's cooked by this man named Shannon, and he allowed us to use his recipe, so this is the first time it's ever been printed. Wow, and worked with us to go through the process. And then we've beautifully photographed this thing. But this man's creation of the perfect whole roasted wild turkey, it's in there in there that that's one reason alone, just to buy the damn thing. So go on Thanksgiving, Thanksgivings coming, Christmas is coming, Valentine's Valentine's Memorial Day, you know. And if if you don't even like to cook at all, but you like appreciate really fine photography, just by the damn book, or if you shoot deer and bring him to a food bank, you should bring that book down to the food bank to drop it out by the book and donate to the food bank. Matt concluding thought, Yeah, first of all, I don't think this podcast has been a commercial. I think it's reinforcing people's passion for um, everything that you guys are about. This guy's get reinforcing your passion. Thanks Matt, Thank you. All right, guys, um, thank you for bearing with me as I present to you The Meat Eater, Fish and Game Cookbook, Recipes and techniques for every hunter and angler. Buy one now, or hell, buy two. Have a good night.