00:00:00 Speaker 1: Hey, this is Tyler Jones and you're listening to the Element podcast. What's happening all my woods people? It's a beautiful, warm and muggy day here in Texas and I am rolling down the road in the vehicle with everybody's favorite co host, Casey Smith. What's happening, dude? I just checked the temperature in my vehicle and it says ninety five. Today is supposed to be a cold front day, and I suppose if it doesn't get any warmer than that, it is a cold frinday. Man. That's ah, that's a rough goal about it, if you have to call that a gold front. You know, earlier, when you called me and you're like, how'd your run go? I was like, yes, I you know, I mean that didn't feel like good. I feel like I'm run pretty fast, but I was more tired than usual and everything. And really, when I got back in and got ready to shower up, dude, my clothes were soaking wet, and I realize how much, how like much I actually sweated on my run. Yeah, I'm pretty much gonna go home and just smash cookies. I think I'm not gonna do that, but I'm gonna. I I sweated a ton this morning too, I got out. But what was cool was like, there was a really stiff breeze this morning where I was at, so my I was like that. Where we live, quite honestly, the whole like um perspiration and evaporation thing doesn't really work very well because there's not a lot of evaporation that goes on because the humidity is always so heavy. But if you get a breeze going across that perspiration. Yeah. So speaking of you know, the region of where we live, there's a lot of different regions, especially in the South, that have these similarities and then also these differences, especially when we're talking about white tails and the rut and all these different areas and pockets where there's a rut from August to February or whatever. And uh, we have a guy that's gonna talk a lot about that rut, uh some of the areas that he hunts more towards the east um, and that is Will Brantley. He's the hunting editor for Filling Streaming Outdoor Life. Cool guy Southern accent, which we like, and uh we can I mean, we really just like it because we can actually understand it most time, and you can understand us. I still enjoy our Montana friends and stuff. You know, it's just like sometimes I'm like yeah, and I just laugh because I don't know what they said, you know. But anyway, right now we're heading out to do some fun stuff. Oh yeah, to touch on it, just to touch Yeah. Yeah, we're gonna go chick uh well, one or two of your trail cameras. I don't really know how many, but on your Walmart property, right yeah, yeah, probably just one, but if it's not too chigger you're looking out there, we might check the other one. So can you tell me, like what tips and tactics you use to like decide if a place is chiggery the amount of behavior over one foot tall, Yeah, that's chuggery. Yeah, or coastal Bermuda so uh yeah, it's it's really just if it's cattle feed and it's heavy and it's over a foot tall. So chiggery and chickory are two different things. They are, yep, ones of white till or ones of you know, actually a wild game feed and the other one is a domesticated feed. I believe that's one with the g and it. Yeah. So anyway, Yeah, we're gonna check this camera at this permission property. And if you've followed along closely, you've probably seen a couple of videos that I posted from this property, the initial rundown that we had there, and then uh, I went and re up the bait sites with some uh salt blocks recently because some of the traveler are gonna be doing here and there and in and out kind of throughout this month, and uh, we're gonna go out there and check this game camera. There's two of them out there. We're gonna check at least one. And it has been out there for four or five days? Maybe how is that it five would be the most I thought you. I thought it had been like over a week. I think Wednesday or something might have been the last day I put it out here. So yeah, we're getting our podcast done earlier this week. So yeah. But yeah, so I'm I'm excited about this because we did have a pretty large visitor at some point in the last couple of weeks, and I'm interested to see if he's showing back up. We we did. Uh we did actually a kind of a deer drive after uh you got a new property to look at recently, and uh, we actually I don't know if I texted you this or not, but I meant to. I learned a lot on that deer drive. I feel like it's another piece of the puzzle. And I'm starting to kind of notice from that video of my Sweat Equity property that deer that we got in the background just filming going down the road. Neither us had any any idea of that deer was there. It was so funny, man, I told you I was. When I was editing that video, I literally by myself busted out laughing because I'm sitting there talking and I'm like, yeah, we saw some deer and then there's a deer behind me on the road, on the side of the road it as we're driving, you know. So anyway, if you haven't seen that video, it's pretty neat. Casey found some pretty interesting stuff on that property. And we just hope that by good graces and that uh just being easy to deal with, that we continue to have access to that property and maybe hunt some deer or a deer there or that he does at least. And so anyway, we're excited about that. But one thing, I mean, I wanted to say something about this because, um, a lot of our podcasts are with such great biologists and people that are just such great teachers that I go back and listen to them, and I try to because there's you know, when I'm thinking of the next question and trying to be prepared for y'all, uh so that it doesn't get awkward. Um, a lot of times I miss things that they're saying, you know what I mean, And I just want to go through, reiterate, let them teach me again and see what I can learn, to always learn stuff. But Carl Miller last week I was thinking about this. I'm like, man, I can appreciate this so much because how many times have you listened to a podcast or some kind of video where there's a guy who's a biologist or a researcher or scientist of some sort and he just won't speak to anything in like yes, well not necessarily that, but like he won't speak to anything even in like, uh, well, I think that this is maybe the way that it is. It's always like, well it could be this way or that way, you know, and it's like, uh, it's like I think, you know, like they don't want to make a definitive answer. And I can appreciate Carl Miller because of his ability to go you know, that's a tough question because I've never been inside of Deer's head. But here's what I think. And like that, like because if you don't get that here's what I think, then you don't have any I mean, there's nothing there, you know what I'm saying. And I really appreciated that a by you know, a man such as him with so much research and expertise can say, I don't know for sure, but here's the way I would think that it happens, and it makes a lot of sense, and it starts to give you the ability to have discretion and think about you know that that could be the way it is or maybe that's a dumb point. You know, most of the time with him, it's not a dumb point pretty much all the time. Yeah, that was a pretty sweet interview, man. And uh, I'm just very glad that, uh we're able to meet up with Carl and kind of put a you know, a face with a voice and stuff with the key m a banquet and uh, man, there's a deer rut there. Wait, Oh my goodness, what are you doing it might be the same one that's on the video. It might be speaking of qt M there and you've been managed up pretty good, right. But yeah, so like you know, you get these you get on one side of spectrum, you have these biologists that won't say anything. You know, other side of the spectrum you have like these like public land gurus sometimes that like just think or whoever. It might be like deer hunting gurus that just think. They talk in definitive terms all the time and that drives me crazy and it's like man um, that may not actually be the way it happens, and not to mention, like, I live miles from you, so it's probably gonna be a little different. So anyway, I I can appreciate that like whole Like, well, I'm not sure, but this is the way I think, and I think we try to do that. We've kind of talked about that and your best too. Sometimes we just uh just don't say a lot because they don't want to come off like idiots exactly, especially around guys like dark. Anyway, Um, yeah, I I was really glad to have him, But we mustn't forget we have a giveaway that we're doing right now and it's coming up on the end. Here, we're gonna pick a winter soon. What are we looking at? Okay, So we have the two on X premium memberships that were giving away and it's pretty uch been for the whole month of August. So August which will be the podcast while we are uh well, we'll be just fresh back off of our trip to bows and with the TRCP, So August will be the day we release that podcast. And now us the two winners of those two on X Premium memberships. So um, if you haven't yet, guys, be sure and go leave us a five star review and say something in the review. Otherwise we don't know who you are because your name is not listed. And uh that's how we're gonna announce who the winners are. So you gotta listen to podcast on the third and whatever user name you put on your review will pick two of those out of however many of there are, and you'll be the winners. And by the way, those reviews are awesome. How cool are they? Yeah? That's cool. There's been some funny stuff on there. There's been some really uplifting stuff like man, I I've read every one of them and I really enjoy it. Thank you guys for all of that. I mean means a lot. And uh, the positive spirit kind of keeps us feeling good, you know, here in the dog days of summer and ready to go into the into the falling winner and do some do some deer hunting man, and and uh, just hopefully connect with you guys. We we enjoy the messages on our social platforms and stuff in the back and forth we get from you guys and the different perspectives from around the country. Man. We just enjoy learning about what you guys are seeing out there and that kind of thing too. And so thanks for the reviews. And um, I guess we're here. So it's about time for us to go into the woods and get a camera and we might send this podcast in with Will Brantley. How do you what do you think about? That sounds good? Let's do it so on the phone now, I have Will Brantley. He's the hunting editor of Field and Stream and Outdoor Life. Will. How's August going for you? Man? Oh that's going pretty good, guys. I'm uh, you know, kind of running crazy a little bit with deer season just around the corner and magazine deadlines and such as that. But a matter of fact, there's a very morning, um, a little bit late being able to call in here. Um, just because of you know, sort of unique problems. I guess that rednext havel this time of year, you know what I mean. So I just back up yesterday afternoon. Um, A man a couple of little small pieces of family ground that we have here in western Kentucky. And there the two pieces are about an hour and a half away from each other, and I meant to be done with my food plots on one of them and have my tractor here at the house by yesterday afternoon. Um, with everything in the ground, we've got some rain in the forecast, and angel looking good. And uh, just due to some technical tractor difficulties that you run into doing projects like that, ended up getting home well after dark last night. And um, I'm supposed to take my son to daycare this morning. My wife's a teacher, so she's up and out the door early. And I told her, I said, on yesterday I need just a little sleep. I ever muscle I have is hurting. So she said, no problem, I'll get up and take him to daycare. So she took him to daycare this morning, and then in her scramble to get out the door, um, she called me. She said, gosh, I forgot my lunch there at the house. Can you bring it into town? And so weeah, I hung bringing down town here. A little later, I had to come in and pick up some scope rings for a couple of rifles and scopes that I'm doing a test on this week. And I thought I had the rings here to fit them, and I didn't, And uh got to b S and at the gun shot for a while, and then remembered I had this interview and was on my way back, and gush, I had forgotten to bring my wife her luck. So so that was the crisis that I had hated to be late for the call, but she needed lunch. But anyway, she she got something from the school cafeterias. So life will go on. That's good. That's good you Uh you forgot the most important thing of the day, I think. Yeah, yeah, so it's nothing, nothing like getting all that done before noon on a Monday. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, there you go. Ma. Well, so what's your wife teach? She teaches, um, excuse me, she teaches third grade? She she does this this year. Excuse me, sorry about that. Um. She has previously taught oh gosh, everything from kindergarten to fifth grade. She's been a teacher for um since we've been married almost. So I got you, Yeah, I got teachers. That running my family pretty heavy. I have my my mom's mom, uh, well, my mom's grandmother actually taught for uh over thirty years, I think closer to thirty five years. My mom has taught for over thirty years. And my wife as in her sixth year, I believe, and her teacher and I heard both of her parents were teachers as well. So runs pretty heavy. And in my family, I have a heart for teachers, that's for sure. I know they they are the leaders of And we talked about this is one thing we talked about hunting media a lot, is uh, you know, uh, hunting numbers obviously they've been on the decline. Who talked about it a lot, but you know, um, more importantly, just human beings being educated in that kind of thing. You know, that's that's up, that's in the hands of all of our teachers, and about their leadership. You know, well it's it's funny, um, you know, And I'm sure some of the schools were your family works in East Texas are pretty similar to the schools around here. Um. You know, Michelle has uh she's taught a variety of different subjects, but but at heart, she's kind of a science n and uh and and definitely a biology know. And she's a huge hunter. M she she hunts as much as I did. She hunt more than I do, give them the chance, but she has you know, man dear racks and euromounts and turkey fans and alligator heads and bobcats, just all kinds of stuff in her classroom and uh, just without exception. You know, even kids who uh you know who who haven't grown up around that stuff, they're fascinated to come down there and just look at it and talk about it. And you know, and and because of Michelle's hunting background, uh, she she didn't have to talk about any of that stuff in the in the hunting contact. It's just you know, she's been out in the woods all her life and she understands things about all of those things that those kids are looking at. And it's just a it's just a good connection. Um. I think it's helped make her a really good educator, and I know a lot of kids have remembered it every years. Yeah, so y'all are in Kentucky or we are? Kay, Yeah, we're near Murray, Kentucky. Um, right on the Tennessee line. Okay, Well I've been probably pretty closely there once in my life. I can't remember where we were headed, but I know we were around Tennessee Kentucky line. So yeah, I probably can see that in my mind a little bit what your area looks like, and it's it's actually probably pretty similar to a lot of stuff we have here. Um as far as just I don't know, you guys may have some bigger river systems than where we are here in Northeast Texas. But that's interesting. So scaling one to ten, I know, it's got to be hot where you're at, or has been at least throughout the summer. How idit are you for cooler temps and deer season? Well, deer season doesn't necessarily mean cooler tenths here. We always opened the first Saturday in September, and that will be September one this year, I believe, um, And so it is traditionally pretty damn hot um for the first month and a half of deer season here and uh, you know, but it's it's also the part of deer season that if I were to pick two weeks of the season to hunt, it would be the first week of September, in the first week in November, um, at least around here. If I get a little bit farther south into Tennessee, that kind of changes up a little bit. But around here, first first week in September, uh is one of my favorite times to hunt. Um. You know, not only are the are the deer still on the summer patterns. A lot of them are still in velvet. They're in they're in big bachelor groups, and they're real visible, you know, they're real predictable. A man, there's just so much anticipation leading up to all of that. Yeah, the uh you know, the food plot prep work and the trail cam work and just shooting your bow in the yard in the evening and having a cold beer while you're doing it and all that stuff. I mean, it's just I don't know, it's just you can just kind of cut that excitement with a knife, you know what I mean. It's just a neat time of the year, even though it is hot so now, uh, am I ready for it to cool off? Oh? Yeah, for sure. Um, it's sort of starting about the fourth of July. I hadn't I filled the summer. I'm ready for to get cool again. That uh, that won't be for a little while yet. But we did have we did have a big cold front come through here, and it's supposed to be really pretty here this week. We're gonna be filming some squirrel hunting videos over the next few days, and we're supposed to get some nights that are down down the Hilf. It's just almost unheard over this time of year. But um, right now where you all are at, Yeah, yeah, we opened, Uh we opened the third Saturday in August, so that's cool. So yeah, they're they're doing their thing to there. We've got a big bumper hickory nut cross this year and they're they're getting after you know. I've been noticing the hickory nuts in my yard are doing pretty good too. I think that's the only mass croff it's decent this year where we're at. But I'm gonna ask this for Tyler since he probably uh is too ashame to ask it because he asks it all the time. To people, how are the fleas on your squirrels in the summertime? Up there? The fleas and the squirrels summertime, Do you have any issues fleas? I can't say that I've ever really noticed the fleas a whole lot um our our thing with squirrel hunt, really with just walking in the woods in general this time of year. Are the are the larval ticks? Um, we have a big tip problem around here, and and we uh uh gosh, unless your clothes are all treated down with prometro and and you're wearing knee boots, I mean, if you walk into the end of the dead leaf matter in the wood, you can just about count on, you know, a few hundreds of those suckers on your pants. So, m I've grown up around them, and uh, you know, I've never really thought much about it. And just the ticks bray is kind of a you know, just a natural thing. Again not a natural thing, but just something I've always done. But the guy that's coming down here to hunt with me this week, I kind of gave them the heads up, and um, you know, it's not something he's growing up around. He's like, man, you know, he was kind of stressing about it a little bit. Tell somebody they might have a thousand ticks on their legs. My goodness, Yeah, we have a few ticks around two. It's just not my favorite part of the whole deal. And that's really I guess if you could say that there's a benefit to us not having earlier, dear season, it's that that we don't have to deal with, you know, those seed ticks very much. But you know, it's kind of one of the things I noticed a lot about and that's kind of what we want to talk to you about. You know, just like hunting in the South. You know, we have a lot of states and a lot of areas that call themselves the South, and uh, there's a lot of similarities, you know, throughout these southern latitudes, but there's you know, quite a few discrepancies as well. Uh. And it sounds like you have some pretty good experience, you know, throughout a lot of places. So if you could describe the Southern rut in one word, what would that word be? Oh? And one word or conglomeration? A phrase? Yeah, I can describe it in a phrase. Um, more predictable than most would believe. Okay, all right, explain well, you know. And I'll start that out by by addressing something you just said. Um, depending on where you are in the latitude. You know, of course I'm in western Kentucky. Um. You ask anybody around here, uh, if Kentucky is part of the South, say, hell yeah, that's you know, it's the way we talk. And and uh you know, historically speaking, yes, technically, but um, you know it if you want to really break it down, it you know, it wasn't a Confederate state. It was a neutral state and all that. So there's always, uh, you know, a little source of contention there on whether Kentucky is truly a part of the South. Um, you know. And and geographically speaking, uh, you know, I've I've of course grown up hunting around here, and um you know, and and I've also hunted a lot farther south. You know, you start getting into the you know, down around southern Tennessee and northern Mississippi and things like that, and there is a geographical difference, you know. So around here, I would say our rut timing is a little more typical Midwest. Um, fairly predictable. And I mean we have a pretty good herd structure around here. Um, you know, we we did have a lot of deer, but you know, year in year out, that first week in November, they're gonna be you know, you can then chasing and um doing all the things we like to see bucks do. And the you know, the lockdown is gonna be about the middle of November. There's gonna be peak breeding and then the end of it you're gonna see another little spurt of activity and then don't don't be a little secondary rut uh activity in December. But for the most part, ours is kind of a Midwestern rut timing. Now you get just a few miles south of here to some of the places that I hunt in Tennessee. Um, you you do start when I say it's predictable. Um, you know that just a hunt in some of those areas, you don't see a lot of difference in the herd structure. Um. You know, probably the deer aren't as big on average, but uh, I don't know. The numbers seem to be about the same. And um, although the topography kind of changes, that food sources are still about the same. There's still a lot of road crops. People are doing food plots. There's kind of the same mass sources that gradually change the farther south you go. But it just kind of seems like you're rut timing in general. Goes of just a few days later the little farther south that you go and uh and and down into you know, down around the Mississippi line. Uh, Thanksgiving first part of December seems to be sort of the hot time. Now you get farther south than that, you start getting into into various pockets of animals that uh for a variety of reasons, and biologists have I've tried to find the answer to this question and in pieces for years, you know, and biologists don't really know all the reasons some of those some of those deerer restocked from different areas. Uh. You talked to biologists down in Florida, and they'll tell you that that uh, you know, down in real South Florida where they have a you know, a July both season and and dear hard horn Um, they'll tell you that that, uh, the rut is timed to you know, for for the fall and drop to be in the dry season, because you know, if it were in the spring, the falls would drowned down there. So you know, there are a lot of different biological reasons and and things that Mother nature does sometimes that uh, you know, it's it's kind of fun to try to figure them out. But at the end of the day, Um, you know, they just kind of are what they are. But um, for the areas that I hunt, the Mid South area up here into Kentucky, Um, you know when I say it's pretty predictable, Uh, the months of November through about the first half of December, you can get on you know, broad and white tails in this region pretty pretty consistently and see some pretty good action. Man. I had some days in Tennessee last year that were just just crazy. Um, you know, bucks chasing dose and things like that, and and you know, I think another reason for that. You know, I think maybe ten or fifteen years ago, the deer hunting culture in the in the Deep South in particular wasn't the same that it that it is now. Um. You know, there was kind of the mindset of, you know, the best size antlers are the ones just big enough to wrap your hand around so you can drag them out of the woods. Um. But that that's changed, um man is I think you look at Tennessee, for example, hunters they're just you know, thirty miles from where we are in Kentucky. And I mean you just look at the Pope and Young entries in the Boon and Crocket entries and the difference between those two states. And you get the guys down in Tennessee who are like, no, wait a minute, it's the same damn country down here that it is in Kentucky. Why are they killing so many bigger dealer or else. Because we've had a one buck limit since who knows when, and for a long time they were allowed to shoot eight or nine. Um, they gradually cut it back to three, and now it's down to two. Uh. And and that's been largely because the hunters have lobbied for that sort of thing. Um. And and the same thing goes you know, in Mississippi and now I think a few of those Deep South states know Mississippi, and in Arkansas and Louisiana, uh and in Texas, I believe, um, just trying to remember some figures off top of my head. I mean, they average more of three and a half year old plus deer and then or harvest than than anywhere else in the country. And and it's not because a bunch of regulations have been forced on them. It's because just the hunting culture has kind of embraced that. And I think when you embrace that, um, you know, when you when you embrace that that management approach for a healthier herd and age structure, you get a more pronounced rut out of that. And uh, you know, regardosus of what what the time of the season it is, it's it's you know, it's gonna be a little better. You're gonna see bigger bucks out chasing does and that sort of thing. Yeah, and you know, um, I feel like here in Texas, it's it's pretty contentious really that shift. You've got a lot of a lot of people who still just want to shoot Bucks and you know, leave those mama does alone kind of thing. And then you've the states kind of slowly uh expanded, you know, dough hunting throughout the state, especially like you know, I'm gonna speak on a very relative term to where we hunt here in this little section of Texas. Um, it's seems to me that when I was a younger child, I can remember hunting in the rut and you just couldn't. I mean, you just never knew when things are gonna happen. And then over the past two or three years, once we've implemented dough harvest and uh kind of have really you know, our age structure used to just be all out of wack buck. The dough ratio was crazy. Um, you know, things are starting to even even out a little bit more in the past, you know, maybe five or six years something like that. And I almost feel like what we used to talk about as far as there being like a trickle rut or you know, a very uh slide bell curve as opposed to most places, that's kind of started to reduce. And we're getting a little bit more you know that that I mean now November seven's a really good day to be in the woods. When I was younger, i'd be it's too hot for that. That That ain't going out there November seven. You know, man, It's it's really really changing. It's funny how that cultural shift has actually had a biological shift. It seems like it does, it does well, and it's um, I think, uh, you know, I think more than ever. Um, definitely more so now than when I was growing up. Uh. You know, hunters are becoming very interested in the biological why of all of it, you know, biologically speaking, Why am I seeing this? And how what can I do, uh to make this experience better? Um? What can I do to make this experience better on this little property that I hunt, this big farm that at least or statewide, you know what I mean? Um, And so I think a lot of hunters that's that's been a general cultural shift I think, you know, for for most white tail crazy regions of the country. But I think the Deep South has has probably embraced that earlier and and uh more holy than than uh than than maybe some other areas of the country. Um. So you know. But two, I mean it's um, it's also one of those things, uh you know, I mean you talked about East Texas. Well, you know, Hell Texas is the size of nearly the rest of the Deep South combined, you know. And there are a lot of different um rut timings in Texas, just as there are a lot of little variances are you know, here and there. And I think the thing to remember, um that that sometimes hunters forget you know, men they're sitting on a ridge in November and uh their buddies texting them. They're like, man, there are bucks chasing doughes everywhere. I just have one make a scrape under my tree and you're sitting there and you're like, I hadn't seen a damn thing and seen it here, And you're like, well, you know the road over here sucks. Well it's you know, it's it's all. It's it's more localized. And so many hunters believe if you've got a hot dough within the thirty acre you know radius in front of you, when you happen to be sitting in a tree, it's gonna look like the right's pretty damn good. Um. But if that dough hasn't come into you know, hasn't come into heat in the area that you're around, and there's one on the next thirty acre radius around you that you may not see a deer, and it's um, I think hunters can can forget that at times. I mean, I'm guilty of it. I mean I'm sitting entrying the command that you know, I don't I don't know what I'm doing wrong. And sometimes you're not doing anything wrong. It's just, you know, it's just the one the cards played out right, right, And we've talked about this a little bit. You know, Texas has I don't know how many, but I can think of, right off top of my head, four different rut periods, you know, peak rut periods in different regions of of our state. And like I said, it's huge. Um, the state should be several different states probably, um, but just you know, if you're at the base of off of region, uh, you know, I mean, you gotta love that it's Texas and it's uh maybe geographically it should should be several different states. But I think that's part of what makes Texas sure we're out of it all. I can guarantee you that you know, and and uh we enjoy seeing all the different parts of the state and and uh having the ability to still be in state but see something that's radically different than normal. You know. Um, but um, you know you you also spoke to this. The Gulf States can can have a lot of different, um, crazy little pockets of February rut action or whatever it might be or August. Um, what if you're traveling around, you know, what's your what's your key source information? There? Are you looking at word of mouth? You know, talking to people you might have met over the years in different regions or are you looking at to biologists in the area to try to understand when you might want to take that out of state trip and key on the rut? You know, I guess, um when I have researched and written on rut timing and then it experienced it for myself, you know throughout the Southern States. Um. Yeah, I mean generally speaking, one of the first good calls you can make is to a dear biologists, um, you know, and just kind of ask them because uh, you know, the way that they're getting their data is not because of you know, sitting on the front ports and oh man, I saw a buck chasing a dough on October must be the peak of the rut. We're getting it from you know, uh, timing of of the fawn drop and back dating you know, gestation period and and I mean that's uh, that's a pretty pretty dead set way of you know, predicting when the peak of the rut is. And uh, you know, once you once you know that period when when most of the doughs conceive, we'll just subtract a week from that and that's when the fox are gonna be chasing them. And that's when the first ones are gonna be coming into eating. That's probably when the best action is going to be. And so you know, that's that's always a pretty good way to start researching the news spot if you wanted to travel to to hunt the rut. Um, let's just look at those peak conception times and subtract five six seven days. Um. Beyond that, I mean, you know, the the hunting that I've done in in southern Tennessee and uh, you know areas like that, Um, you know, a couple hundred miles south of where I live. Um, you know, just over the years. You know, you go down there and I mean, yeah, late October, first of November, you're gonna see buck sign for sure, you're gonna see scrapes and rubs and things like that. But that that really good, you know bucks chasing those things like that you do just kind of it's not a I don't know, it's it's not what I would call a dramatic difference between here and there. It's just a little bit later, you know. Um, it's just just one of those things that you notice. Yeah, So why do you think people get so caught up on state lines when it comes to hunting? You know what we talked to a lot of people, you know, through podcasting and stuff, and and you know it might be like, well, we don't have them in those big sindaros and Skei flats like y'all do, or it'll be you know, I mean, I'd love to go down there and hunt where they rattle like they do, like y'all do, and like man, we could probably drive to Kentucky where you are before we can get to us and narrow from where we're at. You know, it's it's it's kind of crazy. But why is is it a marketing thing? Or why do people get so caught up on I want to go hunt this state or this state? Um? Well, I don't. I don't know that it's a that it's a marketing thing so to speak, but it's um, you know, I mean I think hunters pick up on you know, which states are trending for their deer hunting for example, you know, I mean, um, you know, gosh, we've how many articles have we written for field and streaming outdoor life ranking you know, the deer hunting in various states, and you know, we will usually have some kind of formula that um that we used to pick those and I think when we do that, we we try to do a really good job picking which ones are best, whether it's a you know, whether it's the top number of of all time you know, record book buck entries, UM, or the or the the states that have contributed the most in the lask you know, whatever period you in the last five years or last ten years. Uh. And then like the last time that that we ranked them, we we also um kind of combine that with you know, how easy is it for a nonresident to get a to get a tag? Um, what kind of public access is available? UM? You know, what's the average uh, you know, age of a of a buck killed there? I mean dose can you shoot when you go? I mean, guy goes out of state, and even if he doesn't get a chance at a at a good buck, he wants to come home with a meater at least I do. UM, So can you can you shoot a couple of those while you're out? And so we'll we'll try to put together lists like that, UM based on kind of that collective formula. And and so that's how you get states like Kentucky, UM, that are are in the outdoor media a lot um. You know, whether it's in a in a magazine ranking, or whether it's TV shows coming to hunt them for for specific opportunities. And you know, um, Kentucky for example, I mean, yeah, I mean our I love him here during the rut. But I mean I would say, you ask your serious traveling white tail hunters. They want to come here to kill a velvet up. You know, they want to come here the first of September and and kill a big velvet book. Um. And I you know, I don't know that it's the best state in the country for that opportunity, but it's right up there, you know what I mean. Um. Now, a lot of people get here and aren't quite ready for the ticks and mosquitoes in the heat when they sit in a tree stand September one. But um, but that's that's one of the draws. And that word has gotten out about that, and it's gotten out through magazines, through television shows, and uh, you know, there's there's obviously, um good and bad associated with it. Uh. You know, you get some of the locals they are like, gosh, I wish you writers would just shut up about hunting Kintunty. You know, it's hard to find a place to time here anymore. Um. And I'm sure the same thing goes for you know, for for your local Texas hunters. Um. You know, guys that used to have a lease or or a farm that they hunted all their lives and now they can't because you know, selling deer hunts is big money in Texas, is big money everywhere. Um. And so I think that's where a lot of that comes from it and probably where some of the some of the I guess less than positive attitudes that you alluded to earlier come from. You know what I mean. Um, It's it's just you know, simple human jealousy, yeah, is where a lot of it comes from. So it's unfortunate. Uh. Man, if if if there was a something I could fix about you know, hunters in general, that that um, that envy would be right up there. But it's not just hunters, man, It's just it's the hearts of men for sure. You know. It's I'm with you on that, man. And unfortunately, there's uh a platform for everybody now to voice their opinion, you know, so uh we get to hear about it on more than just a local level. And if you're at a an article for Field and stream that ends up on Facebook, there's gonna be some negative comments on there, you know, because people think that somebody cares about what they're saying. So it's, uh, it's unfortunate. But I will speak to the people that listen to this Facebook as being awesome individuals. To this, to this, uh podcasts is being awesome individuals because uh, we haven't had a negative comment yet. I don't think, uh we have. Well, you're not done with my show yet. That's what That's what I was alluding to right there, now that we have you know, you know what I mean. It's one of those things. I mean, you know, you look at the Field and Stream Facebook page, the outdoor Life Facebook page. I mean, uh yeah, it's easy to post up a piece that you've written and you're really proud of it and think it's well researched and and uh and well done. And you posted up there and um, somebody gripes about it, um and says something nasty and personal and you know, kind of attacking you. And you're like, man, that's really depressing, you know, that's my feelings. But at the same time, when you look the overwhelming number of people who comment are nice. You know, they they they've taken something out of that, they enjoyed reading it, they learn something from it, they're sharing it with a bloody uh and it's it's easy to forget, I think with social media in particular, just because that you know, we talked about being anonymous and behind the keyboard and all that. But the other thing too, is like that negative comment is right there in front of you two reminds you all the time, um, that that somebody left that, and uh, you know, it's yeah, it's part of it. But at the end of the day, it's I do think it's best most of the time to remember that most people uh that are engaging with that piece, they do like it, they do find some value out of it, and uh, you know, just not let the bad stuff get you down here. Yeah, it's good pointing. I think a lot of times, you know, sometimes at least there's uh, um, there's that discrepancy. Uh So I guess we were kind of we've kind of talked about parts of this, but you know, um, yeah, somebody you know, talks about on our you know, I guess that we have on the podcast here and may go, yeah, I wish it was you know, I wish I could just rattle in fifteen dar day like you guys in Texas. And the thing is, you know, we don't live in Texas. So the same thing. You might write an article about how great the hunting is in you know, Kentucky, and I don't know, maybe in eastern Kentucky it's not as good. And somebody you know doesn't agree with what you're saying there, so they gotta think they gotta say something about it. And and so there's that too. So I mean, there's I guess a little validity for for the naysay er there. But I had to ask you, man, why why are the ticks so bad where you're at? Has this been like is this something that has developed in the last decade or is this something that has always been there? Man? I remember when I was about six years old, I went out behind mom and Dad's house and went BlackBerry picking. Came home with two milk jokes full of them too. Um. But that came in and it was hot, I was sweating, and I remember my mom tried to get me to take a bath, and uh, you know how it is here, six year old boy, you the last thing you want to do stop to take a bath, um, and I didn't. I went to bed that night and got up the next day. And there are no telling how many dear chicks I had interbedded in me. Um. So it's been a problem. Maybe they've gotten worse in recent years. I don't. Some people say they have. I can't that they They've been bad as long as I can remember. Part of the world where we have. You know, they're actually better here than they used to be. I think you do you have fire ants where you're at? No, you don't. I think that might be it said when I was a kid, um up until about was probably six or seven when fire ants first got here, And ever since then it seems at the tick uh issues kind of just I mean there's still a few around. I get like one or two every time we go out, you know, but used to it's like what you were talking about, you know, if you went out, you know, checking trail cameras or whatever, you'd end up with ten or fifteen on you. Yeah, and I think finance really have changed that. You know, we're a lot of things really, I mean, it's hurt the turkeys and all kinds of stuff, but you know, it's kind of changed that tick part up a little bit for us at least. That's kind of crazy. Yeah. So have you ever participated in that early season that July Florida hunt? Have you ever done that? I never have? Um not a guy actually who's coming down here. Uh, you should be here in just a little while to squirrel hunt with me this week. Uh is a uh editor at large for Field and Stream, Mike Shay And he was actually just down there a couple of weeks ago and killed the nice buck and said it was it was a surreal thing. Now. I've hunted in Florida a lot. I used to take a both hunting trip for pigs down there every year and the turkey hunt down there a lot. And I love I love to hunt Florida. Um, I just think it's a cool place, uh, interior Florida anyway. Um, but I've I've never deer hunted down Yeah. It's so it's a rut hunt in July. Is that correct? Yeah? From from what I understand it is. Um, you know, I don't think people go down there with the expectation of seeing, you know, a bunch of bucks chasing those and things that. But um, you know, they're they're definitely you know, they're they're hard antler, they're leaving bucks out and things like that. Yeah, I'm just I'm just curious because I you know, like I'm here in East Texas. I know how hot and humid it is, and it just I love to deer hunt, but I just I'm not in the mood to deer hunt right now, you know, I am, I am, but I need I needed to be less than nine degrees with high humidity, you know. And so like, I just wonder, a how fun that hunt actually is and if that's something I should explore in the future, know, like, and then also how do you target you know, how would you target deer running deer in that area? It's just interesting to me. I might have to talk to Mr Shah at some point and see what he thinks. Well, I know he was hunting on private land down there, and there's a you know, um uh a lot of you know, people hunt around feeders a lot. I mean, it's um, it's it's thick. Uh. It's not always the most productive place. Uh the girl food plot at least the places that I've hunted in Florida having then and so there are a lot of feeders and and you know, kind of a hunting style that's pretty similar to the areas of Texas that I'm hunted s. Yeah. So you know, you just talked about hunting on feeders where a bait stayed. I don't know if y'all are or not, but that's kind of a big thing in the South. Um, how do you feel about hunting over bait? Do you think, well, you know, we all know it kind of works, but do you do you like it? Are there better tactics or what do you think about that? Well, I mean it's a um people talk about hunting over bait and and you know, uh, there are a lot of different ways to to hunt over bait and and yeah, to answer the first question, Kentucky is is a baiting state? Uh for deer. Um, you can't shoot turkey's over bait. You can't turkey hunt on a farm that has bait on a period. I guess, really, dear about the only thing that we can hunt over bait here, Uh, Tennessee is is not you cannot bait in Tennessee. Um. I think you can have bait on the farm, but you have to be you know, a certain distance away from it, Laura, don't let somebody I think that I'm telling them the regulations run over bait in Tennessee. I don't remember him off the top of my head. I just I know the places that that I hunt in Tennessee. I mean, we just we don't have any bait. Um. It's just not really doing this any good. Um. But you know we um. One of the reasons I think that uh Kentucky's velvet, you know, hunt the the early season hunt in September is so productive is because you can hunt over bait um. You know, deer will come to a corn pile in early September. They'll come to it in the late season. Um really well too, but but early September. Um, you know, it's a it's a really productive way to get a bachelor group of bucks um not only up on their feet, but positioned in the spark where you can get a shot at them. So um. So yeah, I I do hunt over bait um, you know, primarily during the early season and and in the very late season, I will set up over a corn pile. Um. You know, how do I feel about it? I mean, you know, obviously I'm not gonna tell you that I hunt over bait and say, you know, I hate it. Um, you know, it definitely works. Um. And it's and it's I don't want to say it's a necessity, but you know, if you're in an area in Kentucky, that's that's hellly hunted. Uh. You know, every all block of woods or property uh is you know, probably a pretty good chance somebody's deer hunting on it. Um. And if they are, they've probably got a cornpile going. And it's uh, you know, it's a way that somebody can really increase their chances of shooting a deer, getting one in bow range and you know, and and drawing them, you know, from wherever they need to draw them from to get a shot. So it can be if you're hunting in an area with a lot of bait around you, uh, and you're not baiting, it can be it can definitely affect your success rate. It can be tough to to get a deer in front of you. UM. Now you know, from a from a biological standpoint, I mean, you know they're there is evidence to suggest that you know, artificially congregating deer like that around a bait source, UM may lead to or transmission of CWD and even uh you know, and and even him ergic disease because he has so many deer right there in a spot um, you know where I have to see pretty conclusive evidence about that. You know, it would not bother me at all if Kentucky were to say no more bait. Um. You know, it's uh if you know, if it was shown to be detrimental to the health of her, because after all, as as hunters, uh that that's our first obligation as to the resource. Now saying all of that, Um, you go to a place like South Texas, where generations of deer are raised on protein feeders and corn feeders and cotton seed and all the things that they feed them down there, it's hard to go anywhere in the world with a more vibrant population of wildlife in South Texas. Um, you know, I mean you have just you know, uh and you have predators down there. But if you have faun production that's just through the roof and turkeys and I mean, um, you know, it's hard to look at that and what an integral role uh feeders and and bait play in you know, and not only the hunting culture down there, but really the management strategy down there and say, well, it's the bait. It's a bad thing, you know, it's it's just it's one of those things as a as a hunter, it's it's it's kind of a it's kind of a tough thing to give a you know, an all inclusive answer. So, um, for now, it's legal in Kentucky. Um, I don't, you know, pour out tons of corn. I don't run feeders. I usually put corn out on the ground. Um. You know. I I would prefer to let my food plots do most of the work. Um, and they do all of the you know, the nutritional work. During the off season. For me, I will use corn to you know, try to position a deer in front of my stands, like get a good shot at it. Um. But you know, UM, that's that's kind of where I stand on it right now. So UM I do it. Um maybe you know, not suspicious, but maybe a little bit you know, maybe with an open eye towards you know, Hey, uh, I want to be sure that this is not impacting the resource in the negative way. I haven't seen so far, um that it has. But you know, but there there's some questions out there some valid questions out there that you know, I guess, uh, you know, we'll just have to wait and see. Yeah, for sure, I and I think that you and I are really close on you know, how we feel about all day. I I feel that uh CWD. We've talked about cwt D a lot on this podcast with our guests, and you know, it's a real unpresent danger. Um. And I can definitely see where corn can or any type of baiting, you know, for that matter, I can really have an effect on that. Uh. We don't really live in a CWD area right now. You know, there's always the idea that it could be here soon, but so that doesn't concern me as much at least in our location, you know where. And there's a lot of places where you can see where it would be that big deal. But I almost feel that, um, you know, separate from that, there's an animosity like amongst the industry for corn, and you know, everybody leans towards uh, food plots, you know, and food plots of the way to go in. Food plots benefit the resource so much more. And and you know, if you're if you're putting out you know, sixty acres of plots and you're really feeding the deer, you know, that's one thing. But I tend to believe that a large majority of hunters are making kill plots, you know, one of them are doing food plots. And to me, you know, it's six one half dozen the other with corn and food plots on that And I truly believe that a lot of this food plot talk is geared because money. You know. Yeah, you can sell bags of food plot stuff for eighty year ninety bucks, or you can sell equipment or you know, uh a TV attachments and stuff like that. It's hard to sell much more than a sea of corn, you know what I mean. So I don't know. You know, you said you're a food plot guy in the corn guy. Are you kind of doing the food plots for you know, the benefit of the wildlife and the corns, like the concentration point. Is that kind of what you do? Yeah, yeah, that would that would be the way to look at it. Um. You know, I spend a lot of time not only doing food plots, but um prescribe fires and things like that on on our farm. And uh, you know, I mean most of the year, uh what like of a deer's diet as forbs and things that they're gonna find growing in in old fields and things like that. Um, you know, it's it's things that you are killing if you're just going out to push hog your fields, you know, I mean when you push hog and repeatedly you get stands the grass and ascue that that you're just don't eat um. And so I spend a lot of time working on that aspect of it. The food plots. Yeah, the food plots narrow it down a little bit more. They helped me kind of build a hunting strategy. But mean, uh, you know, a lush two acre clover and chickery plot that'll feed a lot of deer um. You know, you can get uh, you can get support several doughse light tating dose in the off season. You can support groups of bucks with with good forage. That's that's going to make them healthier. Yeah. Sure, it's it's concentrating them a little bit to make your hunting more effective. And then like I say, uh, two acre plots still pretty good size. Maybe some people can shoot the length of it with a bow. Um, I might be able to hit the target, but I'm not gonna shoot it. A deer from that helps me get them up there about nineteen yards or I like that's where it's at. Um. So that's that's kind of my my attitude toward it. I think if you're thinking of it, um at least around here from a management standpoint, I mean, yeah, food plots and uh you know, um, timber stand improvements and selective cuts and prescribed burns and whatever all you're gonna do to your property. I mean, that's that's that's a long term beneficial thing for your wildlife, your your deer included, um, and the and the bait is too, is to position them so something you can get a shot. And I mean, yeah, there is a stigma kind of in the hunting industry about hunting over bait, you know, to stell you. I mean, if you watch a TV show where somebody is killing a velvet buck in Kentucky, all about odds, they're shooting them over bait. Um, that's you know. I mean you can try to film around that or or right around it or whatever you want to do. And I've I'd never like to do that. I mean, um, you know, it's not a simple matter of going out and just pouring corn on the ground and waiting for the deer to show up. I mean, there's a there's a strategy, and there's an ongoing commitment to making a set up using bait where you're gonna be able to access it in and out without scaring deer, where you're gonna be able to get that deer in there without him smelling you or seeing you first. Um. There's even a method to the way you poured out on the ground that's gonna position him for a shot. Um. You know, there are a lot of little tricks that that go into it, things that you know, the guys up north who who've bated bears all their lives, you know, those guys know a lot about bare habits in the way that they react to things and and do things. And you know, by the same token you you learn a lot about deer uh doing things like that. Yeah, you can set a feeder up in the middle of the field and that goes off and deer come out there to it. I didn't mean you're gonna be able to shoot him over with a bow. So um, So that's there is you know, a stigma about that. Um, But I don't know. I've I've never been shy about writing about using bait as as part of your early season tactics, especially because it's it's the way so many it's not really fair to interview an outfitter in Kentucky for their best early season big deer tips and then leave out the baiting part because that's what everybody's doing. So just that's the same thing everybody's doing in South Texas. So yeah, I'll tell you, man, if as many ticks as it sounds like you guys did, I would probably burn my farm every three months or so. Uh No, But I um, you know, I I another thing that that I kind of think we might have failed to mention, maybe in a roundabout way we have, but you know, shooting shooting deer at bait. Um, I feel like I've seen a lot more uh well placed shots happen at a deer that it's sitting there eating bait. Then guys that are shooting at deer that are walking that they have to grunt stop stuff like that. I mean, there's nothing to think about, you know. I mean, I know guys saying mature buck is is going to be nervous around bait and this and that. But at the end of the day, he's also if he's eating there, he's gonna be stopped still, you know. And I mean my dad, he he hunts bait uh of a time pretty much. And uh he's I mean in the last ten years, he there's been like one deer that has actually gotten out of his sight before it fell down, you know what I'm saying. What I mean, he's he smokes him. And I think that's just uh that part of that is, you know, not having to grunt stop a deer and have the opportunity for that deer to jump, jump the string and all these different things. So there's there's a lot of positives. I'm I'm a proponent for if the state, like you said, it's the state believes that, uh it's a good thing for the wildlife, then then uh go do it. But I guess I go ahead, Yeah, I don't, you know. I mean in Kentucky, for example, I think if you were to ask most of your biologists around here what they think of baiting, they're skeptical of it, you know what I mean. Um, but it's uh, you know, part of managing wildlife is balancing uh you know, the regulation with the social acceptance and uh man we're we're pretty far down the road of you know, Punderson Kentucky want to hunt over bait. Um, it would be there would need to be a really compelling biological reason um to outlawed. Uh, you know, and and that just that just hasn't happened here yet, you know what I mean? I mean the you know, yeah, when you look at when you look at a bunch of deer congregating on one spot like that day after day, that's that's not natural. Um, It's not the way things are supposed to happen. But again, um, you know, it's just that that compelling link to that and and the disease transmission. Um. You know, I think that it's there's been some links shown, um, but I don't know that there's been that definitive links shown enough so that that biologists in you know, in a state like this where we don't have c w D yet, UM, I have been able to say, you know, hey, we we need to stop this now. You know c w D was Uh, it's it's closer probably to me than it is to you guys in uh in East Texas. And I would say, um, you know, man, I knock on wood and and and cross my fingers and hope they don't discover it here. Um, but man, it's a it's a scary thing. I mean it is. Uh, it's spreading across the country. Um, you know, it's it's always fatal. We still don't know what all it is capable of doing to the deer herd, and it's popping up in new places all the time, and so you know, it wouldn't surprise me if it were discovered here and Kentucky Department Fish and Wildlife Resources said, no more bait until we know what's going on here. And uh, hey, um, um all for that. If that's the decision that needs to be made, because they're the they're the managers, they're the biologists, um, and the other ones that I've got to trust to make those type decisions. That's that's good. So let's visit Let's visit the Rut a little bit for a second here. Um, if you could plan out an entire season of hunting in the South and try to hit Rut most of most of your trips out of state or wherever it might be, what would that look like? Um, well, I would I would have to start out right here at home, Um, things really start kicking here usually around I've told a lot of people over the years who've asked my favorite day of the rut. Um. October for whatever reason, has been a day that has historically been pretty good to me. I've killed a couple of really good deer on that day, UM, and and had some really good uh you know, kind of early rut action. UM. Seen some big deer up on their feet cruising at that time. I've seen some good chasing at that time. Now I've also set in a stand around October and not been able to tell a difference in that in the first of October, it's just kind of hit and miss, you know what I mean. But it seems like around here from about really from about October, you know, up through you know, the end of our gun season. Uh. You better be in a tree as much as you can, because it it can happen during that window. UM. Our guns season usually opens the second Saturday in November. Uh runs for about three weeks UM here where I live in western Kentucky. It's it's different, uh different slightly different structures for in different zones in Kentucky. But um, for the most part, I mean, it runs during the peak of the rut. I like to be here, uh during that time. Um, you know it. Uh, let's say I kill my my one buck in Kentucky that I'm allowed. Um, the next place that I would go would be northwestern Tennessee, which is right here close, you know, right across the state line. Um, it's starts kind of moving a little bit later. It seems like something my better hunts as I as I get down in there a little closer to Thanksgiving, you know, or certainly November twentieth something like that, I can count on the action being being pretty good there. Um from there. Uh, you know, let's say I kill one of my bucks in Tennessee there and I want to try to kill the other one. I've had some really good hunting down around Memphis. I if we lived down there for a couple of years, I worked products unlimited, um and uh. And so the action down there tends to really kind of peek around the first of December, right around that Mississippi state line. And UM, so yeah, I would kind of kind of try to focus on that and then if I'm gonna hunt, um, you know, much later than that. In December, I like to go to Texas. Um. I love to hunt Texas. Um. You know, I especially like to hunt uh South Texas. Um. You know, it's just I think that country is neat um you know, the there's a lot of wildlife and uh you know I should I should emphasize I like to I like to hunt free range South Texas. Um genetically crazy deer. But you know, I killed a good deer in South Texas last year and had a had a heck of a good hunt, and that was that was early December, and they said we were a little bit ahead of the rut. But um man, I'd love to go down there. They do kind of some running and gun and I think once the once things really get going and rattling things, and um I I would be all over that. So that makes for a pretty pretty full deer season. I've never hunted those really late ruts in in the black Belt or anything like that of Alabama. UM, you know, just just having't had the opportunity to do that. Um. You know, I researched him a lot. I've certainly communicated with a lot of hunters from that part of the world. UM. But I but I've never had a chance to try myself and and usually by by that point, I've been hunting white tails since the first of September and I'm ready to shoot some ducks. So yeah, that's how I feel. Yeah. So, what's a rut tactic that you would use in the South that you might not use as much, kind of in that Midwestern style deer honey? Well, you know, I mean, so far as tactics go, I don't I don't think that really changes a whole lot. Um. You know, white tails are are white tails. It's it's the same as I'm a huge turkey hunter and travel everywhere the turkey hunt. Um. And there's you know, debate on which subspecies is the hardest and and all that. But I mean, at the end of the day, if you've got a gobbler that's got a bunch of hens with him, he's hard to call in um, you know, And it doesn't matter if he's an Osceola or Marian's um. I guess thinking of hunting white tails during the rut um, you know, I I'm trying to keep it pretty pretty simple. Um. You know. I worked for realtory for for quite a few years, and one of Bill Jordan's favorite things was food does bucks, um, you know, find the food found the dose. That's where the bucks are gonna be. And so although I love to shoot those, I shoot a lot of those, um, you know, as I've gotten a little older and maybe a little less trigger happy. Uh to let a dog walk by. I found that. Um. If you're in a spot during the rut, and I don't care if it's you know, Stuthern, Tennessee or Missouri, UM, and you're seeing does, uh, you probably just need to stay put. UM. If you're consistently seeing does. And if you're seeing them coming through uh you know, a pinch point in the timber or coming out to a food plot, it really doesn't matter where you're seeing them. If it is the time of year that some of those dose should be coming into heat, uh, that is where the bucks will come to. You may not see him every day if that is where they will be, because one of those those will come into eat and the bucks will come out of the woodwork to finders. So it's that is kind of my UM, I guess, my overarching philosophy. Wherever I'm hunting deer during the rug, um, you know, and really about any time of the season that I'm hunting, dear. I mean, they're just they're an animal that's dominated by their stomach. Um. Always the first question is where do they eat? And the second question is where do they sleep? Um, And you know, figure out somewhere to intercept them. Between that and uh, you know it's it's always a pretty good strategy. Yeah, you know, you made the turkey hunting comparison earlier, and I'm gonna I guess this is a question to you. But I had someone kind of give me advice one time of how you know, you hunt turkeys out in wide open country. They're used to calling and going to those calls and seeing things. Will you go to like the you know, the deep force over there where you're hunting east and stuff. Sometimes those Easterns you're able to scare the mess out of them if you hit a call, you know, and they're too close or something. So do you feel that deer kind of the same way, you know, if you're hunting some of these southern states where it's majority majority of you know, old mature timber, that calling doesn't work as well, you know during those rut times is what it would, you know, kind of mourn that open country or different areas. No, I don't necessarily think that. I think an open country. You can see the reactions. Um. You know, animals will respond to calling if it sounds real to um. Some of the best rut hunts that I've ever had in Kentucky. Uh, We're dear that I've rattled in or grunted in. Um. I'll never forget. When I was sophomore in tastball, took a buddy and then he had never killed a deer. Uh. And we set up on the edge of a food plot that dad had planted, and a little buck came out far into the property. He was hunting with a muzzleloader. Now, so I'm gonna try to rattle that bucket and I hit the others, and this giant buck just charged out of the brush right in front of us. Uh. Hey shout that sucker through both lungs at about thirty yards and killed it. Um. And uh, you know I mean that you couldn't have You couldn't have filmed the rattling hunt on a high fens place in South Texas and had to go anymore textbooks than that. Now, if I had that happened since no, Um, but I have rattled in other deer since Um, I've I've called in deer. Um, you know, I've I've definitely bleeded in a lot of deer. I think the difference in the in the east and especially in the South where the woods just tends to be thick. Uh. I kind of compared to predator hunting in a way. Um. You know, you watch a predator hunting video or predator hunt out west, Like man, these guys are calling in coats every set. Well, you're probably calling in a lot more around here than what you see. Um. But as soon as you give a code or a dear, the indication that something is there that he ought to go check out, well, the first thing he's going to check it out with is his nose. Um. And they are pretty good at checking something out with their nose while also staying out of sight. They just are and and I think, um a lot more dear respond uh two calls than uh, you know, than than we believe one because we don't see him. And then too you know the definition of responses. Yeah, I mean we we see people rattling on TV and calling on TV, and those bucks come charging in, just like the one that my buddy shot when we were kids. Um, well you don't see on TV are the fifteen other sets the guy made before he had that one responding that way to get that really good footage. You know, there's a there's a lot of footage when you're filming a hunt that that you know, the viewer doesn't get to see, and so that can create, you know, kind of a false sense of you know, of the success rate in places like that. You know, if you're around here and you've got to buck out in the food plot and you grunt at him, and he looks at you and lays his ears back and kind of bristles up a little bit and walks your waist some and then just eases. Oh well he he has responded. Um, he just doesn't he doesn't see anything or you know, or he suspects something is wrong. He gets a little whip of a thermal. Uh, he thinks your dear decoy looks fake. Whatever it is. You know, he did respond to that sound. But you know they're they're not dumb. Um, they know something about it isn't just right? Yeah, I guess uh inn wrap up here. The last thing I'd ask you is you said that you like to kill a lot of dose. What is your favorite white tailed dish? Oh, without a doubt, it's fried backstrapping him um here, you know, we um we publish a lot of a lot of really uh you know, kind of kind of challenging venison recipes. We we lean on some some pretty good shifts too to uh you know, prepare venison and and and provide us with different recipes, especially in field and stream. And then some of that stuff is really good. Um, but it's you know, some of it can be pretty daunting for you know, for for the person cooking dear meat for the first time. And you know when people, when new hunters in particularly, ask, you know, how how do I cook this? I'm might you know, uh, take it, cut it, being tenderize it with a skelet or a mallet or whatever. I like to mix mine with a little season flour and some ritz crackers and crush it all up and bread those steaks and and prime and olive oil for a couple of minutes aside. And I mean they're they're delicious, you know. It's it's we have that for breakfast, you know here on the week and nearly nearly every weekend of the year. Um. You know, besides that, I mean we we straight grind a lot of deer meat. We eat it in spaghetti and chili and tacos and all all kinds of stuff. And occasionally I'll I'll go out of my way to try to cook something you know, fancy with a nice presentation. But I mean, we eat a ton of deer, uh, And we really just don't think of it as something that's any different than than beef. Um, it's just what we you know, if we're going to have something that calls for a ground beef, it always has deer in it. Um. And um, we'll throw some backstrap on the grill or pan fried or whatever. Um. So so that's my favorite. Yeah. Well, I think I'm gonna go grab lunch now that you did that. So, but I appreciate your time. Will thanks so much. I know you're busy, um real quick for you go. What's the best way for someone who might be interested in connecting or just seeing what you're up to lately, what's the best way for them to view that? Well, what I would love for him to do is subscribe to Field and Streaming out for a life magazine. Sure, yeah, we'll link to that actually, but we um we have you know, of course, um pretty pretty big social media followings for both brands, um on on Facebook and Instagram, and so you know, we can I'm I'm posting a lot of stuff out there and so are the other editors, and um, you know, year round, there's there's something going on, hunting efficient related, a lot of its white tail related. That do a lot of other stuff too, So yeah, people can can keep up with me out there. Cool. We'll link to all that in the show notes here for the listeners. UM, I know it's coming up in like ten days, but good luck this fall will appreciate it, guys, y'all too? Alright, thanks, all right, let's see you. Well that's cool, man, It's it's exciting to me, but also kind of disappointing. Like some of these people are like twelve days away from hunting, you know, in the hunting white tails, and I'm like over here, like it's still while. But at the same time, like I said earlier, I mean, I just I'm not crazy about hunting in the heat, you know what I mean. I like it to be nice and crisp and cool and we're even cold and just just feels better. Man. It's nice to walk in when you're not sweating. You know. That's why I'm worried more about going to the mountains than i am trying to find a not eat green white tail. Exactly. I'm the same way. I'm I'm just ready to go to Bozemann. It's gonna be a good time and I'm ready for some cool, crisp mountains. Am Oh, hoppers, Oh my gosh, hoppers and poppers. Man, we needed fish. We need to we need to get our game plan ready. Oh I know it. Man, We're off air, but okay, so everybody be sure you're following us on social media this next week starting about Thursday at midnight one pm Central. Actually, we will be landing in Bozeman, Montana. Uh or one ams ear that. Well. I think we're getting there like eleven fifty three. I'll probably posting the story from the plane, just partying. You know. It's right first class how we roll, not really, um, but it should be a good time and we will keep you plenty update with all the happening. So we're gonna go up there, get some podcasts done, and um do some fishing and hopefully do some wildlife viewing if you order me and uh learn a little bit about some c w D. That'll be so yeah, kind of like the first part of the week is gonna be like us just having fun. We're kind of gonna maximize our time in Bozeman, and then come Sunday afternoon, it's gonna be great. Well on straight business, but a lot of business as far as CDBD education and just learning about what different parts of the country are doing in CWD control. And then we'll also probably eat pretty good while we're there too, because I would imagine they know what's going on. Yeah, I'm gonna try to harvest the buffalo while I'm up there, are you yea some steaks and you know burgers but bison burgers. Yeah, that kind of thing. So um anyway, I'm excited about that opportunity. But for real though, I do want to try to eat some trout. I don't know if you got that in the plants, but it would be yeah. I do like a big tasty rainbow. So anyway, uh man, that Cardpool was it was okay, it was okay, it was just cool things that happened. But what was lacking, Well, big boy big Boys. Last name big Boys. I mean, I don't I need a little more time, you know, I don't. I couldn't. I could name him big boy. He may just end up being a big boy or Bruiser or whatever. You know, Like I just decide on at that moment to say to you. But if I figured, like it comes Bruiser, are you gonna say that? I probably won't. Yeah, I mean, it's it's pretty. That's what I talked to be a little more creative, you know, I like to be creative. We're so creative that our property names don't even make sense. That we are so abstract man or so cool. But yeah, basically all we had was we had, uh, several bucks including like I don't, I don't know. It looks like about a two year old that's got a really nice set of horns or antlers sorry antlers on top of his head and uh, he's you know, he's not a shooter on this property, but if he was on public, I might have to smoke him. Um, but anyway, he you know, it just we've got a few pictures of or I guess videos of bucks, but there's one so I don't know. We did not sure what happened. But Casey made a good point. Then it's probably raccoons had climbed up on this small sapling behind the camera and dumped it over on top of our camera, so that there's just like limbs in front of the camera. So I don't understand why every time we hang a camera it seems like something goes wrong like that this thing has been out for like four days. You know, if it was public, I would be I rate, you know, and this is you know, we're all about looking camera soak. But I feel like this year we've learned a lot about how like, you know, you might have go checking things pretty often because bad things can happen, and they have every time. It seems like, I don't know what's frustrating. Maybe that means we're like setting ourselves up for a good season to just actually kill, you know whatever. If I would definitely trade like a bunch of good like truck camera photos and not killing a deer for like we didn't have a very good truck camera season and shooting a couple that would be fine with me. Yeah me too, me too, But one cool video or a couple of videos we had on there. There was this Uh, small little year and a half buck that uh was browsing the leaves off of that tree that the coon had been over. And so he's like like literally like a foot in front of our camera just munching on leaves. It's pretty cool, you know, but not not exactly what I wanted to see. Um, and I don't know. We're back at it again, fresh card in there and probably gonna try to check it before we got to Bosman and uh and kind of make sure there's everything looks good in there before we go, and hopefully by the time we get back, he'll be back on that camera. So by the time we get back, man, Uh, it's gonna be real close to velvet coming off, you know. Like it's excited. There's a lot of these keys that you get like as dear season approaches that you know it's about to be time. One is like when you start seeing deer with hard antlers. It's like, oh my goodness, Like I'm getting goose bumps. Yeah, no doubt, dude, I'm excited. Um, we gotta from now on pretty much we've got it lined up to where we've got some we're gonna have some cool stuff coming up. Man, so I'm excited about it. Uh, hopefully we can locate a good buck on that property, that sweat equity property years as well. And uh, you're going out to do some public land camera stuff I think today, aren't you? Yeah? I think so, I think I am. I'm I was really excited about it earlier and now I'm like, who's starting to get real? It's smoking hot out there. You're gonna definitely need some water, but I unfortunately had prior plans and not gonna be able to make it. Sorry, Um, but I am very excited about the sweat equity you're about to put into this property, this public property. So anyway, I'm ready for lunch, and I'm sure you are too. And uh, I don't need food. It's about time to I know, yeah it's and I can't need a car. Uh. But anyway, I guys, I hope you are standing cool out there. I hope that you're getting out and uh checking those cams, hanging the stands, cutting shooting lanes and whatever else you need to do out there. And UM, hopefully we'll talk to you again soon. I hope you enjoyed the podcast, and if you do, don't forget give us a review. You'll be in the runner for that on x maps Premium membership. So anyway, remember this is your element, living it h

Save this episode