00:00:02 Speaker 1: Welcome to the Wired to Hunt podcast, your home for deer hunting news, stories and strategies, and now your host, Mark Kenyon. Welcome to the Wired to Hunt podcast. I'm your host, Mark Kenyan. This episode number two oh five, and today in the show we are podcasting from Iowa and our two thousand eighteen shed camp, and in this one we recap the highlights of our epic shed hunting weekend, We hear about a few of the crews two thousand seventeen hunting seasons, and we laugh a lot. All right, folks, welcome to the Wired to Hunt podcast, brought to you by sit gear, and as I just mentioned, today's podcast was recorded from our two thousand eighteen Iowa shed camp this past weekend. And joining me in are my hunting buddies Peter Lynch and Ross Houseman, who you've heard on the podcast before and on my good Pale and founder of hunter a Maps Ben Harshine. But before we get to the contents of this week's episode, I want to drop a quick announcement here. If you're listening to this right around the times podcast launched um, I've got some quick news to share. This Saturday, March seventeen, two thousand eighteen. I'm gonna be recording a live podcast at the Ohio Deer and Turkey Expo in Columbus, Ohio from three to five pm at the Sick Gear Booth. So that's this Saturday, March two, eighteen, at the Ohio Deer and Turkey Expo at the Sick of Gear Booth. And the plan is to have a panel of guests for that podcast, including guys like Adam Hayes, Ben Rising, Johnny Eberheart, and probably a few more. And we're gonna have free beer. You heard that right. We're gonna free beer. We're gonna have a bunch of giveaways for some awesome sick of gear. Um, we're gonna have time for some Q and A. And it's just gonna be a really good good time. So be there if you can. Guess said three to five pm at the sit Ka Gear Booth. That's March seventeen, two thousand eighteen. Um, and this is in Columbus, Ohio. And if that's not enough, the party is going to continue after that at the back Country Hunters and Anglers Pint Night happening that night at Wolf's Ridge Brewing, which is also in Columbus, Ohio, and that's gonna be from six to ten pm. And there, you know, we're gonna have a bunch of fellow hunters and anglers getting together for a good time. There's gonna be some raffles I hear for more Sitka gear, some auctions, maybe even some more free swag, and you know, the chance to get some good beer and good food and talk hunting with a bunch of buddies myself, some of my friends from Sick Gear, and who knows what else. I just know it's gonna be a really good time. So again, it's gonna be a blast, and I hope to see you all there. And now for this podcast itself, As I mentioned earlier, this is just a really really fun podcast. Um it's more or less just a big BS session. But man, did we have a blast. We talked through the shed hunting weekend, We told a lot of funny stories, and then we moved into the two thousand seventeen hunting season for each of these guys too, so we dissect some of their successes, we discussed some of the mistakes. We dive down all sorts of weird rabbit holes too. So if you're in a mood for a good laugh and some hunting camp vibes. I think you're really gonna enjoy this one, so let's pause briefly for our Sitka gear story of the day, and then we'll get right into the main event. I hope you guys enjoyed this one as much as we did recording it, because man, it was an absolute blast. For this week's sick Of story, we're joined by Chase Rutherford, who tells us about getting to tag along on a big horn hunt. Um. It's a ten day hunt. UM. I was filming Patrick scrogan Um on his Rocky Mountain big horn hunt Wyoming. Patrick was in the Army and lost his leg in a helicopter crash, so it was a very tough hunt for him. UM. But we rode in nine and a half hours into the coolest terrain UM and the thoroughfare, which is the most remote, the most remote place in the Lower forty eight. We had hunted every day for four days and we ended up seeing some rams. Patrick ended up missing one. It was an emotional day, but we kept pushing and on the eighth day we set out at two am in the morning and headed up straight up this crazy mountainside. Our horses were slipping and it was crazy with the possibilities of dying. Um. We finally got to the top and just as the light hit the top of the mountain, the ram showed itself and that's when Patrick got off the horse and we were able to crawl up and he made a three fifty yards shot. Um. It was really emotional seeing Patrick accomplished this hunt. It's something I'll never forget. On Chase his hunt, he was wearing sick as jet stream jacket. If you'd like to create the sickest story of your own, or to learn more about Sitky's technical hunting apparel, visit sitky gear dot com. What are we gonna talk about? I assume we would talk about what we've just been doing. Just chiropractic chiropractic best practices. Right, does your tracker try call on emotion? Some things? Just sat still time because there was a startin amount of time and we were not walking because I did find anything. We sat down by the creek map. Yeah, yeah, that would be pretty slick. Yeah, we're walking a whole time. Well, according to this, you guys are sitting in your ass A few minutes in a time, so we're recording podcast. Now. Welcome to the Wired hun podcast, brought to you by Sitka Gear. And what we're talking about is the Iowa Shed Camp of two thousand eighteen for shed rally. We're down here and an unknown region of Iowa, and we've got Ross Hassman, Haman Hassman. Ross Hassa is here when we do this every time, we have Peter Lynch, he's a chiropractor number two. Chiropractor number one was Ross Hassman, Peter, and that's not all of them. And yeah, we lost Corky, Yes, we lost Corky. And then we also have been Harshein, who was a chiropractic recipient. Yeah, that was like my tip for hosting. You want do you want to describe what just happened here? So obviously in the presence of some fine chiropractors here, and I've just been thinking all day, man, I gotta get adjusted again. And when you know, come in here and I feel great. I think my cold is gone because of you. Well, he's like, and I literally just scheduled, right, I just scheduled my first So there we go. I want to give you guys a chance. Do either one of you want to promote your chiropractic practices to the fellow Iowa residence. This is your one and only chance. Oh yeah, why not. This is the biggest podcast in the world, So we'll do uh to Gaywa try State's chiropractic Dr. Peter Lynch, All right there, thanks mart Yeah. Ross, He's like, nope, come on, he doesn't want to. He doesn't want Peo to look him up from wre he haunts exactly. Thank you, Peter. Too much info. So we're down here in Iowa shed hunting. It's shed Rally, and Ben, the founder of Untera and a white Tail Properties land specialists as well, was so very very kind to hostess on his property. Extremely grateful. Thank you. That was pretty incredible guys for coming down, Thanks for letting us come down. Yeah, so we spent the day shed hunting. We did a lot of walking, it was It was a fun day. So I thought, I thought, since some of us are still here together, we could drink some beer and coffee and talk about the day, talk about shed rally, talk about the shed hunting, and then maybe catch up a little bit on However, when Seasons went to saince. None of you guys have been on the podcast. You've all been on the podcast before, but none of you have been on since this last season, so no one knows what happened. So Ben, do you want to talk a little bit about We've talked about shed Rally a little bit, but um what what what was the gist some people may not have followed today? You know, shed Rally is the um the world's largest shed hunt where anybody that wants to go on a scavenger hunt and find uh antlers. You know white tails cast their antlers every winter, UM, and you go in and look for him. And it doesn't matter if you know you're a you're a seasoned hunter, or you've got people that never intend on killing an animal, but they still want to get out and enjoy mother nature. I mean, you know, we've had we had several people with us today that they don't ever want to hunt, but they really enjoyed themselves. So that's what shed Rally is all about. It's been there was a campaign originally created by white Tail Properties and uh the idea is to you know, get get out there, um, you know, enjoy creation and use uh the hashtag as you're posting on social media, whether it's you know, Facebook or Instagram, hashtag shed Rally, all your pictures and it's just it's just a big event for camaraderie and to celebrate the animal that we all love, you know. And I guess it's you know, not even just white tails and mule deer too and elk and whatnot. And I saw a lot of elk sheds actually to on social media too, so um, yeah, that's that's what it was all about. And I decided, hey, why don't um we just get a big party together and go hit this this new farm that I've access to, you know, And that was We had a great day. Started a little slow, right, I was worried. Uh, yesterday we were walking somewhere and the three of me, Ross, Peter and Corey and Adam was with us. At one point, Kendalls with us for a little bit, and um, we didn't find a single thing. So we started worrying, if this doesn't go any better, we're gonna have to call this friend rally instead of shed Rally and just give me a bunch of pictures of his high fiving and huggang and this is a good time. Having friends. But luckily, uh luckily some sheds got involved today too. So how there's a little big group of us. There was there's twelve, right, twelve, I think there was twelve, Yeah, including Jack. He was the youngest one, my boy, he was two years older than his first shed hunt. So um, we we had a great tribe. You guys came down and and uh um Dan you know, Damn Zari brought Sarah. Um he bailed on us for the podcast. Yeah. Man, that guy's busy, he is. He's kind of a big deal. Yeah, he's at he big leagued us, you know, big league us. But no, we uh um. We started the day off. We all got together and we rallied up on top of this big this big ridge. So we're hunting. Basically, this farm lays out as a it's a it's a big farm, but there's a lot of farm, a lot of corn, there's a lot of tillable ground on it. So we got up on top of this ridge today is on the cornfield, and rallied and had some doughnuts and laid the map out and made a game plan, kind of zoned it out. I think we had three teams, right, three teams. We all scattered out and uh um, we didn't. We covered some pretty good ground until we found that first one, which was you you broke the ice and then soon after Ryan matched it up. Yes, we we walked a lot of good looking stuff. We walked that big ridge top down, then we went to the bottom, walked a bunch of grassy terraces and buffer strips, and I kept thinking, man, we were seeing a lot of signed there was we were all over edge, you know, we were just walking all kinds of sick stuff. Where it transitions from you know, your classic timber, then you've got a bunch of regrowth and grasses, and then you've got your your crop fields and and a lot of times those deers they're browsing overnight, going in the field for a little while and eat and then go and lay down in those buffer strips and come back in and a lot of times that's where you find your sheds. Right, We come around a good bit of that today until we found their first one. So that that first one was that was the icebreaker though, Yeah, we I was. We you know, when you when you when you've got such a big group, lots of times we have to kind of planet out. Okay, you take this line, you take that line, you take that line. Otherwise it just be a mess of people scrambling around. So you had jack on your back, so you kind of took the top of the field, and so my line was I was gonna walk just inside or just outside the edge of all these points that were coming out. Just it was almost if you took your fingers and stuck four fingers out um parallel, that's kind of what this field and finger structure looked like. So I was walking all the edges, and I don't know the third or fourth one. At the very end of the finger of corn, there was a little strip of grass before you dropped down to the timber and sitting right there times up with that beautiful crown, nice fresh four point side. Excuse me. Not long after that, moments almost you could hear Ryan making some noise down in the timber, and so I started heading that direction to see what was going on, and he found a shed. So I walked down there and maybe it was a hundred yards down the point, and um he pulled out this little ditch the other side. So within a couple of minutes we found both sides right there, not a hundred parts apart. Yeah, right before and right before then we had it into lunch. On on a high note, right, we all rallied rally back together for lunch. We had a good spread and uh, thank you for also for the food for your wife and you bringing all that. She just enjoys doing that. She loves hosting people and making people feel good, you know. So she did a good job. Yeah, thank you. Dan's wife found one too, Yeah. Yeah, so Sarah found the other one on the field edge. So that was three we had before lunch. Before lunch we all got back together. Kind of acreage. What do we cover in that? We covered a lot. I think we walked. I had I wasn't walking as much as I know Mark was. Um, I think I had three miles on the mobile map around lunchtime, about about three miles and you guys might have covered covered more two point six according to that feature on your do you want to describe? That's kind of cool? That was actually cool. Yeah, so uh we're talking about the hunterra mobile map. Um, it's the hunt Terror that you've you know a lot of people know of, is the the terror images the aerial photography and the three D terrain model that we put together so you can see all the natural rises and falls in the terrain of your ground. We translate that from the printed map into the mobile map, and it's an applications. It's a third party application you load into there. But one of the features is has GPS tracking, so it's simply tracks where you walk and you can tell you, um it's really precise, but it also tells you the distance too, So that's just it's a phenomenal tool. We we all were running it in our crew today, so we got to see where we covered and where we didn't. And I mean that can be great for shed hunting, but that can also be good for you know, if you're tracking a deer too, you know. So you've always like I've heard you talk about that and say that I never used that feature of it before, or I never really realized the utility of it until today. And what I could actually look and see where we really walked. That was that that was really cool visualize that to really see that representation. Um, I really like this, So I think from from now whenever I should, Yeah, I thought that was It's a great way to just know what you covered, where you went, see how far you went. We always talk. I bet you we walked five miles, but we walked time mountain and now we can see exactly. Um, that was cool. And now I was you know, you can drop pins too, so I was marking where you know some of these big hubscrapes were, and some good signs, some good crossings and whatnot. Still trying to learn the farm because we don't know too much about it to be honest with you. So that's what was fun today because you know, we didn't find a lot of ships in the beginning, but we're able to get you information. But you appreciate down the road absolutely. Yeah, you guys all came to me some man, you gotta check this one spot out. Big beds here and this is why I think he's been here. Rubs, scrapes, stamps, locations. It's awesome. That's what it's all about. Right, we're all getting together and just you know, sharing each other's wisdom. And uh, we had the hell of the time today we did. I should have sent you the Peter sent me a video of Corey explaining giving us scouting tips. They're talking through what were you guys describing just the rubs. How about the rub that was awesome? Corey just he's pretty what he thinks it's like a buck and uh we found these who's Corey by the way, Corky, Coco quirky. There was the rubs in a ditch and it made no sense. Why the deer will go down? It was down in like a steep, skinny ditch, like in between these two beds right here. You know that this pow, this this cluster of from and then another you could walk around on the grass and didn't make any sense. Why so I'll let you finish the story what Corey said, Oh, well, yeah, he was he basically, you know, his his thoughts were, um, this deer's uh, you know, he's he's uh, you know, there's some probably some doze out in the crop fields and and one of them, maybe a couple of them, are are getting ready to come and keep it. They're not quite ready, and he's getting worked out. It's probably like early twenties or early twenties of October over these shore. The deer is tarting to yeah, and they're starting to rub, you know, and get get fired up for the rut to come up, and he's just he's already got the testosterone going through him. And this, you know Corey described this buck is probably one that you know, it's probably pretty aggressive and and is is I'm just gonna drop right down into here right now, you know, not not leave this situation. I'll just drop right into this ditch and rub the nearest trees, you know. And he's like he's frustrated, like I'm ready to go, and the ladies are. Yeah, so I'm just gonna hang in this corner right here on the point of that there yea for no good reason. And there were old rubs there too. Yeah, really that was pretty remarkable. I've never seen a lot of big rubs on this farm. Yeah, I noticed some big I should have taken more pictures of him. There was a tree I saw, a big old cedar or something or a white pine if maybe I mean like a basketball diameter tree tore up. Yeah, so there's a there's some bucks in there, but yeah, yeah, for sure. I mean we killed two dandies off of it this past year. And uh, what's really cool is big giant bucks. Yeah, nice ones for sure. Um uh, not the one I killed, but another one of our friends we hosted this year. He shot a phenomenal buck on on November seven, I think it was. We called him the flyer Buck and he literally off his G two on his right side, had this big whale tail set of flyers coming off, and his G two was forked like a tune in fork and just a lot going on on his right side. Just awesome, dear, and uh so he kills this thing and then we found the sheds to it. We found the sheds which would and we think it wouldn't have been last year, but maybe the year before, so those things were sitting out there for a year. So um, super cool. Definitely him him with that big split split flyer coming off, and we're going to surprise him with you know, we're gonna surprise him with a with a gift and the mail here. Once we can get get the Times glued back together, it's gonna be pretty cool. So it's funny. We're in lunch and half the group had to leave, like Dan and Sarah had to leave soon and your wife and son and your your least partner's wife, Ryan the other Ryan had to go. And someone says, well, you know how it goes as soon as we all leave, you guys are gonna get into the sheds when you know it, when you know it. So we're Dan and Sara, we're gonna go walk this one area. And they had to leave early, so like, well, we're just gonna go over there and we'll walk a little bit nowhere and go. And then the rest of us were talking about going across the road or I don't know, somewhere else. So we all piled into the the four wheeler and the UTV and Peter decided to just strap on right on. Back to mind. Ryan on the I felt like it was eighteen again, right and four whether back in Michigan. And I thought you were gonna say, like you felt your eighteen going to problem again, get your arms around them real tight. Yeah, it's not good. You know, security gets that a good bonding experience, Robbins racing. So we I feel a little bad for Dan. Well do you feel Well, here's what happened. I was physically there and he was telling, right, we're gonna walk this timber right here, okay, and where we were it wasn't really timber, right, true? Right? Yeah? So I think in the end, so Ryan and I just went where he was parked, and we went straight through the corn headed for some it's probably not the best ground the walk, you know, like this beautiful prairie grass for the deer going to lay during the middle of the night. Welling, Sure you didn't, I wondered. They're like, wow, where are they going? Because I did think we were going across the road, and then all of a sudden turned turned down and went towards So let's go check this different style of ground out that we haven't looked at yet. We've had success ross and I in a different part of the country hunting that ship, hunting that kind of stuff like he talked about in the past for strips, and yeah, that's where we kind of You've got these fields and then you've got these grassy strips, waterways coming down towards the bottoms, towards the big timber draws, and so we go running towards one of those. You're in the four whether we're in the u TV behind you, and what happened. Uh, he's pull off a little bit ten feet in and I jump off, I look straight down, I go G two. He goes kind of looked at me like, no, go yeah, g two, but sixty eyes. It looks like holy explanation. And he's like, I can't believe. He said, yeah, like damn, that's a that's a big life. Yeah, got some eyes today. So and then within five minutes week he last tried to find the other one. He found a smaller one just underneath the tree at the same time. So they're like dirty yards away. Yeah. Yeah, So it was fun. So we go running down and literally it was right where Dan was walking guards. I did feel bad. I looked to the right and here he counters it was on Dan's path, So I took over Corey's job of sniping. I'm sure Dan's gonna mention you. Yeah, probably, you know. Yeah, it's all right. I adjusted him last time, so that's true. You adjusted Dan. Yeah, okay, it's just like an initiation, like I'm part of your guys, brother, you are part of it. We have a lot to offer. My neck feels phenomenal right now, So we did. I had got a good little adjustment there by cross hass as well, and that was that was impressive, just for you know, headaches and shoulder pain. That's not normal. You can get that. Look at you're saying it's not normal all the time, having headaches all the time. Something can be done. The stress of business owner, right, all all adds up into those muscles. Yeah, we're gonna work on that. Yeah, it's a work life balance, Mark, you're right. Entrepreneurs, we gather, Yeah, keep things figured out, I guess. But so all chass broke up. You found that, which was cool. I went down and kind of did our thing, you know, it couldn't pick it up right away, and all of a sudden, then we found Ryan's the other one, and all something we started then once you but the experience centers like, oh, we're in a we're in a what are we in? Ross? What kind of spot where we're they're bringing Mike up. Yeah, glory glory hole. Yeah yeah, it probably wasn't glory glory hole. That could be called that. Yes, that was definitely a glory hole. So Coco. You can see Coco's heads perked up. He's like the pace started to quicken. Yeah, you get this like this, it's a shed fomo is what I call it, fear missing out when you know you're in a glory hole of shed glory hall all of a sudden, like Okay, where is it? Where is it? You know, and so everyone starts walking faster. Everyone nobody takes as much time to take yeah, and people just scatter just it was chaos. Everyone incredible up the hill and you're finding right away, and then somebody found the match to that. It was funny because we're all surrounding this shed, you know, the first one we found post lunch and it was a dandy. We're all surrounding it like this the first antler we have we've ever seen. We're all likes taking pictures of it close and it's like a few autographs went out even yeah, yea, some chest bumps, you know. And the next thing, you know, we look up and there's another one, and then there's another one, and then we're like, yeah, that geez, that that's only a you know, move on to the next one. And Corky took off running. She was getting all excited. And then what happened next, Peter, Well, then since I found a nice shed, I'm like, well, you know, we're all here to find, so I'm gonna go up on the top of the hill and I like, I'll just take a second or two and I'll just glass the field edge because we're in a hot spot and nobody likes the corn anyway, so glass and I'm glassing like thirty yards off Corey's left hand side into the like the shorter walked past it though, So yeah, it kind of was. I'm like, I'm like in my mind, I'm like, you know, when you're an HD binoculars, everything looks huge. I'm like, oh, shut and you can see Corey's like, you know, it was so close to him. I felt bad for a second and for once, Yeah, it ran up there and it was pretty nice. I was like on top of the world. That was a nice, really nice one. Like if it was NBA jam you would be yeah, he's heating up. Yeah, yeah, is it the shoes? I was Bo Jackson and the tech mobile. So you you found the one from the former, then Ryan's boy the small one underneath the tree, and then we walked up and so one found another small one. Did you see the small one? I think yeah, I found a little dinker. You found the small found the match right after that, and he did, and then he just gave it to you, gave it to me, and then Corey did find find gave it up and then not long after that you spotted that big one, and then did they find another little one over there? And this is all in like a but it's interesting is the two studs that we found, well that you found, we couldn't match them up, right, So they're out there something, Yeah, they're they're they're out there. And then so Dan he's like, peace out on you guys here as you look at I thought he might have went back to his car and they had to leave, right, and what do we know? They continued on. They continued to greener pastures man, and they ended up picking up for all nice ones. Yeah. That one that Sara found I think is gotta be the most genetically superior one. I mean, no more than three could have been a two year old. And it was a big five points, big frame, Yeah, big four on it. I mean that was that was that was pretty neat seeing uh, good variety. We were walking up from a distance that was ross and yeah, no Ryan was with us, and I thought there was waving seventies around. They looked huge from a distance. Yeah, that was awesome. They found four good ones and then we all kept looking and me and Ben we found the old ones. You found the old flyer one and I found a really nice old ran in the first one you ran into was that was one of the bigger found. I wish it was fresh. I mean it's not fresh for some reason, being old. Felt a little bit yeah sub sub whatever it would have been before. But still I mean probably a six inch side yeah um, but just bleached white. You know, it's a little bit lighter weight after they've been out there for a while. But still awesome to find that. And then not long after that, the flyerbuck we find bleached up. He was actually cracked, like the flyer was broke off of him. But it was right there. So field edge, I mean, how did you get run over field edge? You have field edge up against the fence basically in some grass right there. I don't I mean, must have dragged you know, drug some sort of implement across to to snap it like that. But it was all still right there, and the in the fracture was like a puzzle piece, like a carpenter's router or something. You know, we're gonna be able to get that thing back together. So that was just super cool, awesome. You know, it's not all the time when you close you know, you kind of you kill a buck and then you find his shed afterwards, right, that's kind of easy. That's pretty wild. And then things slowed down for that though, when we came back Bactoriality and we found one more yet. Oh yeah, you found that fund that one. Yeah, that's gonna be a nice buck. That was probably I think it's one and a half split G two framed up in split two solid frame yeah, split bro, excuse me a problem? Yeah, way off one? Yeah, one? Not bad? So how many was that? Fifteen total? I think? And all in the last three or four hours of the day, right, most of them were in like an hour and a half or hour. Even It's gonna be a few more out there, Oh yeah, I think there's definitely still more sheds out there for you guys if Yeah, for sure. Yeah. So it was cool to do that, and man, we just just scouting is just this is just such a great time to go out there is all the drab colors of of late winter, um, especially when you get some moisture and there's some mud, you know, and these deer trails just stick out like a sore thumb and you can just get on these things and figure out parts of your property without really affecting it whenever it comes time to hunt. Um, you can do so much homework right now, it's the most critical time from a scouting perspective. Of people have said it before, but today was just a great example. I mean we really covered a lot of stuff that we would not even think about walking in come hunting season. So do you feel like you learned some stuff today, even you know, combining shed hunting and scouting like you took. You have some takeaways after today's walk and hearing from everyone, Yeah, I mean hunting perspective, absolutely, yeah. I mean this this farm lays out completely different than the other property I hunt and the other ones. You know, it's cattle farm. It's got CRP and the cows are pastured in the timber, so it's you've got a different ecosystem. They're basically you know, compared to this. Composition of this farm is clad sick brushy draws, creek bottoms, some hardwood ridges and knolls and uh and then a ton of crop ground you know, and it's completely different. So, um, something I really keyed in on was where a lot of the you know, um uh kind of in between these fingers where you'd have I don't want to say a transition area, but you can kind of tell there's a main trail coming out of the cover, and a lot of times you'll find before they hit into the wide open field, there will be maybe be a grass patch. They're just kind of an open area or where that edge is is feathered into. You know, it's not quite pure timber, but it's it's still a little bit of cover and just as they're coming out and there's almost always a scrape there, you know, And that's that's pretty cool to remember down the road to be able to maybe set some cameras and what lot too. And I picked out a great treat to observe observation. Stand um with that with Corey when we were heading towards you to go, when you picked up that that that nice one. Um we passed a cottonwood, that would just be awesome. It'll be honest, Uh, anything south or west, but I basically can see that whole face that we walked this morning, our team that we walked. You know, let's a lot of ground and uh, I'll have to get up high, but man, what a great tree I found right there. And I can hopefully use that to learn you know, early in the in the season and figure out what bucks are coming up this far will be so good for observation stands like the views you have, especially like this year. If it's all planned and beans like the velvet footage and the velvet scouting, you're gonna be able to do. We'll just be premo. Yes, you could be could be pretty good. Then you got those white pines just as you enter. Yeah, that's that's unique. Pretty little section there, Yeah, I mean pretty random. I saw quite a few. Oh yeah, that was tore up in there. Yeah, that was super thick. You can't even walk, did you guys ever walked through that or not? I walked the when we got ahold of that place last year. I walked. It would be on the west end of it where the creek comes together, and there's a we found a dead cow in there. Yeah, but oh man, what a crossing right there. And it is it's crazy thick. There's some blowdowns, a lot of signpost rubs. It's all yeah, blowdowns, super thick. Yeah, huge signpost rubs in there, and kind to overlook maybe you know, it just seems like one of those overlooked areas where you pull your you pull your truck into the property and he's that bunch laying there watching the whole time. I don't know what a tricky spot man. And it makes so much sense, It makes so much sense a deer which would would would hang there and observe it was. It was awesome in there. So what's the deal with this farm? I mean when you picked it up, you got you know, it's a new lease and you came into it. When did you When did you figure out you're gonna be hunt this place? Last year? Um? I think we walked it in I want to say April, so you think it was I think it was in April. Yeah, excuse me. We got um, we got to walk it right at the tail end before it got crazy thick. So we did as much scouting as we could, the two of us on this place, and and um, you know, we set cams but it just wasn't enough cameras too to cover what's there. And u um, basically we just wanted to excuse me, used the year to to observe. And your first two kills were substantial. Yes, how did your season? How did your first season the new property. Go, Yeah, I killed well, right, yeah, man, I was fortunate. I've been I don't want to say snake bit, I've done it to myself, you know, but I've messed up a couple of deer since moving here. One one sixteen, just didn't put good enough shots on him to kill him, and really started to battle, um, some confidence issues, you know. So it went back into the drawing board and taught myself, tried to reteach myself how to shoot, and I switched to a back tension release, and I think that helped me figure out how to execu just in practice or did you actually use that in the field of hometown unt? I used it in the field as well. Yeah, So I ended up getting a couple of releases and and uh in running them from February. Started shooting in February basically and on through and really got comfortable with first the back tension. We're getting way off from my season, but this kind of leads into it, you know. And and um, the back tension was a good way for me to execute a shot and follow through and be comfortable with a surprise and not be okay with that pin just floating on the target, you know. Floating on the target and not have to be one specific spot and then fire, you know. So um once I got through those those demons and and uh uh, basically, you know, pick this farm up and and it's always nice to have options. But my other farm just does not hunt well with the north wind. I can only access it from the north. So I needed to find something where I could have better longevity throughout the season to be able to hunt. So we found this property we can access from all sides, and um, I hunted, I hunted. Uh, let's see, I hunted late October two sets, two evening sets, and then um uh November two would have been my third sit and that's when I went in and and uh uh I went in and hung a stand on a on a spot of the farm where I knew would be a good bottleneck and it was up against some really good cover and we called it the sanctuary, right, and it was an area that was timbered and years ago and it's just really really thick, one of the spots that Ryan and I remembered in April, and uh put on a really good rattling sequence there at three o'clock and I was on the phone with my wife, and uh, because she was in Italy and I'm I'm talking to her on FaceTime, you know, in the stand in the stand. Yeah, So I rattled and we haven't we didn't talk for like five days because of the time they so she calls me like I have to answer it, you know. So I'm kind of leaning against the tree, just looking at her, you know what We're talking and and uh, and about all five probably five minutes, maybe a little bit more. Here he comes out of the out of the sanction where I could just see his crown and his black cap on his forehead. And I'm like, I remember telling her, oh my god, there here comes a giant. And I just stuffed the phone in my pocket. I don't even know if I hung up her. I just stuffed the phone in my pocket. And uh, he came in. He got behind a tree, and he was kind of looking you could tell you didn't quite know where I was. So I feel like that rattling sequence brought him. Um. I think when I rattled, he was far enough away, or he was out of it enough. Maybe he was just kind of, you know, just chilling during the daytime. But he didn't come over right away. So he didn't quite pinpoint me. So when he came around and a couple more grunts, I mean that told him right where to go. And um, I drew on him at about forty and followed him in and just followed his vitols on with the pin and everything just really slowed down. And it goes back to that kind of reteaching myself to be comfortable with, you know, at the moment of truth, and just was thankful I put a good shot on him, and uh, I basically watched him go down, but I didn't quite see it, you know. I gave him a couple of hours and uh, um, gave him a couple of hours, and and uh I went I went back into recovering him with my mom and with Jack and and uh as soon as I shot him, I called Kate back. I said, I'm sorry I hung up on you, but I just put an arrow through a great dear, you know, And and that was just a cool moment. So I imagine that's yeah, yeah, but that your biggest ever. Yeah, yeah, for sure. Yeah. Yeah, he's he's just really cool, dear. He's uh, fifteen inches wide, pretty tall, mega heavy, you know, just the weight of his aunt antlers in general was um, pretty was the most impressive part. It's a main frame, he'd be a main frame nine. But his his what made him a nine point was a crab cloud four on his left side, which is pretty cool, and it just kind of went out, was like a classic curved crab cloud, you know. So as an eight he you know, if he was if he didn't have that as an eight point, he would have been really impressive. Right, But threw a couple of kickers and had added more inches, but um, super heavy. We walked up on him and it's just like, oh my goodness, how we're going to get this thing out of here? And uh we drug him out and in uh uh the celebration was on. Man, it felt told. Um. So, I without any history with him, I think he was probably six plus. He was just a hog, you know. It wasn't certainly in his prime. Um. The jaw bone, on the other hand, I'm not quite sure. Um you know, if like the job bone was looking more like four possibly five, right, But then again, I'm not quite sure how good I am as far as you know, scoring these these things. Looking at a ton of job bones. I don't have much history with so I'm gonna say the teeth into um figure out how old he was. But he was fully mature and just when I was pretty pumped and put my tag around after, you know, after yeah, thank you guys, thank you. Yeah, I would say, So that's awesome. And then you mentioned earlier another mega giant buck was killed in the property. A couple of days later. Yeah, a couple of days later, a buddy of ours from Michigan came down and they were hunting kind of you know, off and on throughout the season, and and uh, he came down and put an arrow through the flyer buck that we we had pictures with in the summertime. Um, and just a cool like I think I should be. I guess he'd be like a main frame eight, but he had a bunch going on on his two with a flyer and a split and everything. Yeah. Yeah, not a little guy for sure. So another another really big animal, uh weight wise, body wise, so to you know, dominant bucks that we killed off that farm. So I mean that who knows, we might be dealing with a bunch of four year olds is coming year, which is still a great problem to have, right Well, yeah, based off of the sheds. We found him. We found sheds from at least five different bucks that should be four year older this year, right, and we know there's probably a lot more, definitely, Yeah, I mean, and that that's not a that's not a representation of the only things that are living on there throughout the year. And this is a great red farm the way it lays out, something from the neighborhood could come scooting through here, and there's a lot of bottlenecks in it. So hopefully we can have success. It's coming year. Yeah, that should I found. I'm curious to see what that looks like next year. But that was real thick thick bags. Yeah, good mass. I cannot imagine what life would be like hunting a farm with five four year olds. That sounds amazing, yeah, I mean, but then again, it's a right. It's all relative. It is all relative. I'm by no means uh being jaded by the circumstances of having that right, But that's not I mean, that's um, you know, you could be chasing a couple of three year olds in in Michigan and be having just as much of a unique circumstance, you know, So it's a it's all depending one where you're at, what you got, what's going on? Having a good time? Right? Absolutely? So you talked about this big giant flyerbuck. Uh here, Ross, you've got a story related to something like that. You want to tell us about your season, because we we had you on the podcast in fallen. We did that analyzing four successful rout hunts. That one podcast where we talked about my killed during the route, we talked about Dan's killed during the route, we talked talked about Quirky's Quirky's killed during the rut, and we talked about You're killed during the rut that year. But we haven't had you on to talk about your seventeen season. Had that go down? It was? It was awesome, awesome, yere I actually got a chance to kill a big flyerbuck myself. Um, give us the whole history. The story is this, dear, the whole history, whole thing. Ah. So first, what what'd you name this dear Jim Lee? And where in the world did that come from? Trailer park boys? Do so? Um, he's like the trailer park supervisor or whatever. He's a drunk. Can I also point out, I'm sorry keep interrupting your story? I love your names for bucks, and I really love the fact that you named one of your bucks after one of my friends from grade school. I got a buddy that I've noticed as the second grade named Jason Tran. He is not a hunter in any way, shape or form, but he often he follows my stuff because we're buddies, and he'll often leave random comments that make no sense stuff. Yeah, that's how I got to know Jason Tranch. He doesn't know who I am, but I always thought he was funny because of the comments, and I knew how how good of a friend he was of yours. So I'm like, that's a good name for him. So you look like a Jason Jason Tramps. He got a big mega eight point named Jason Trainer hunh Yeah. Yeah, he's He's he's on the He's the one that I want to get next year. Worried no Ross, which was awesome for Ross. It wasn't this first time he said this buck or nothing. Yeah. This was the first year that. Yeah, but you know, well that's what that's what I went in the season sane, but you know something, But you were going after him, Yeah, I wanted to history. Yeah, yeah, so sorry, go back to your store of the history. It was. Yeah, it was so like a couple of years prior, I was getting pictures of this buck with super potentially had like all these He's one of those like young bucks with all those like little sticker points and he's got like splits and it's like, you know, if he get makes it a couple more years, he's going to be a really great buck. And uh, and I don't know he maybe it was maybe it was a huge two year old. Then he might have been like just an awesome three year old with a lot of potential. I'm not sure. Um. But then the next year I started getting pictures um again and uh this year that year he had big split so he had on the left side, he had a big split G two split G three on the right said he had this big inside kicker point. He was just an awesome buck. But he had like but he was probably like hundred thirties frame with all the that junk. Um. So going into the year, I'm like, man, that's a nice buck. But I didn't really want to shoot him. I wanted to see him. Yeah, yeah, this is this is last year. Yeah, yeah, two years. So there's this Uh. In the farm, there's this big like primary scrape. All the bucks hit it in October that are in the area. Um And come like mid October to late October, every single buck in that area hits it, and a lot of bucks, even the mature bucks, will hit it in daylight, even in the mornings. Um So I went down in there when the conditions were right, and I got set up over that scrape, and I got a chance to see him and he came in and actually my my gun instinct when he when he came in he was coming in, I'm like, oh, that's a nice book. But I never even grabbed my bowl. And then when he got past me, he was like thirty yards broadside and he's going past I'm like, oh, that's Jim Late, And I was like maybe, And then I was like kind of panicking, you know, like maybe I should have grabbed my bowl, but I shouldn't have. He he never like he never like got my heart racing or anything, and he shouldn't have because at that time he just wasn't what I wanted to shoot. So um So he walked. And then later on that year I got a chance to see him again and he was he got into like all I've never seen like I've seen dear sparring here, dear sparring. You see it all the time, but never like all out fight. You know. Oh man, that was incredible. And he was going with the water the buck uh Kevin vander Boom. So it was that. That's what another. Yeah, he's a hundred seventy and is just head yeah, big dog. Yeah. So the Firebucks going with it, going at it with this guy. Whatever happened, don't know, he's I don't know, Yes, I don't know. I wish I knew, um, but yeah, they it was one of those times you sit in the stands a slower than slow and I don't know if it was mid afternoon or when it was kind of mid midash day, and it sounds like two baseball bats just somebody just cracked him together. Whoa you You're just like kind of jumping like what was that? And I'm looking around then you can just see that brown flashing through the timber and holy cow, it was like just two huge bucks going to town. And it's so funny. Um because the two sorry about that. My microphone wasn't close enough to him. I'm getting yelled at the mark over here. Now you turn your head. You turn your head too much. The best in four headsets and we'd be fine. We We've already described the fact that wired Hunt is not doing very well because I buy Budweiser happy to drink, so you can't expect me to afford for So that was a microphone gesture. I'm leaving. That's all things work in Hollywood, Okay. So so talking to the right here is that good? That's a pretty good farther away, closer, closer, far closer and suddenly not interested. Yeah, whatever whatever you gott Yeah, yeah, blah blah blah um. So yeah, um that was it for that year. And then the next year got some pictures of him again, except for he didn't have those big splits. He just had big flyer that was split off the left G two and then he had like a nice inside point. In this year, he was bigger. He was more like a hundred and fifties inch frame with trash, and I was getting pictures of him. I'll just keep the story short because I can just talk forever and people would be bored with that. So so then, um, I wasn't really getting too many pictures of them as much as last year. But then I had a picture on um, a little food plot, and I got a picture of him coming back into the into the farm that morning, and so I was like, um, this was November seven or something like that, seventh, and so I got a picture of him coming into the farms. I'm like, Jeezy's got to be in the area, and chances are he's probably with the dough right now. So it was like a southwest wind. There's a really good doll betting area in the back of the farm off of bluff. Um, I have a stand set up in this tree. That's good for it. Yeah, that's standing in the tree. Yeah. And then let me finish in the tree on an inside corner. Um, it's on the inside corner downwind of this betting area. And so years past two, you know, you bucks will cruise the ridge that's right off the stand and cruise obviously that dope betting area. So I've been sitting there for quite a while and then, um, it wasn't seen too much to get the occasional like little dink cruising through. And then all of a sudden, I just heard that big, deep guttural grunt. That's just like unmistakable. You just know it's like that. It's a big buck. Can you do that? Because you're pretty good at make grunts. I don't know if I can do it on the spot. Oh really good, So it's serious talent over there. Good. Hey, can you guys vouch for my I did? Why don't you give us? Oh? I will try, I will try. I'm gonna pull the mic away from my mouth here, you're I don't do a bugle. I'm just with no just my mouth. The neighbors. O, oh my god, that's some serious talent there, man. Okay, I can't believe that. How much do you practice at it? Like? What is Kylie saying about that? That's how hots I bring Kylie in a night to the bedroom. Yeah, that's why they had a child. And so that's however came to me. Oh my gosh, okay, your son will hear this podcast and wow? Ye that was great. Yeah, okay, so back to whatever we're talking about. You hear this grunt? Oh yeah, you hear the ground? Yeah? I heard that grunt down in the bottom, you know, And then I knew, okay, there's a big buck down there. But then I heard like he'd be chasing around, and then I heard some tending grunts, so I knew, okay, now there's there's a big buck with the dot on there. But I just could never get a get a good look at him. It was just like flashes in this and that. And then he occasionally um kind of worked his way away for me down the valley, and I could hear him just leaving, and I thought, okay, well, bummer, not going to really see what what that was? Um great and conor anyways, and then as a night went on, it was like that last thirty minutes, like suns starting to set, starting to get less light. And then all of a sudden, I hear some footsteps and a look, and here's a doll and she's kind of coming towards me along the thick ridge. And then I heard that grunt again, that big deep grunt, and I watched a little bit longer, and then I could see him, just see rat coming through the thick stuff. And I'm gonna interrupt real quick. There's nothing better then a deer that's dialed in on his dough. You know what I mean. He's grunting, you know, and you know they're coming and he is just so occupied with her, you know, nothing else in the world matters to him. That's I love that. And then you just pray that that do is gonna come by. Yeah. Absolutely, there's no way you're gonna bring him in, right, you know, it's it's all up to her on which way she goes. But yeah, I was in the red that's right there. I mean, you know, I was in the right area. But whether they came past the standing that day, it was just depending on where she wanted to take him and he she was. I mean, if anybody's ever seen a buck tending a dough like that, they move painstakingly slow, like it is just slow, and the dough doesn't move much. She's just standing there. Most time she'll browse a little bit, she'll lay down, and he'll usually give her some room. Um Unlike you know those younger box like we see her in the rut, like you'll see younger bucks, they'll be chasing does all over the place. Well, we don't see that with mature box as much because they're not stupid and they know, like they know not to push the dough around, like if they're on hot dough, leave her alone. You'll you'll breed her when she's ready. Yeah, And uh so he's just he's just sitting there behind her, like, you know, ten yards and they're just moving so slow that it's to the point where it's like, God, I don't know if I'm gonna have enough time. I don't like they're gonna get here, but it's gonna be dark and then and then I'm starting to think, how the heck am I gonna get out of this tree stamp? And and and and is it fair, say Rocks that you are one to worry about stuff? He stays. He stays streme, positive all the time. No, no situation. I was. I was. I was calm where calm, cool and collected. Yeah, yeah, you know sometimes you get fired up most times sometimes, Yeah, No, I was, I was. I was good, all right, good, I don't know, nice, nice? All right? Sorry, I'm I'm a killer mark you are? And then you get the job done? Well, ever worry I worry about where to sit. I don't worry where um perfect trees. Yeah. So so anyways, he's, uh, she's standing there. She cuts across a little trail, there's an opening, but they're just I don't know. They're just out of range for a comfortable shot. And she kind of worked away parallel to me, and then she dropped down into another valley, kind of out of out of sight. So I thought, well, based on where she went, and he's gonna follow her, I'm not gonna really get a shot. Um, awesome encounter. That was great. You know, I was just right to end the night, uh, you know, successful hunt, even though I didn't get something. So he followed her, did the same thing when I expected, and he was just the whole time. He's just raking, raking, bra She's rubbing trees. It's just awesome. It's just just a great show. And I'm sitting in the tree and all of a sudden, here like a little twig snap right next to me, and that dope pops out. And I looked down and I look at that dough and I look up at him and I'm like, holy sh it, it's gonna happen. And I that's what I said. I don't even think I said it in my yes, I did. I looked at him like it's gonna happen, and she was standing there. He turned and walked straight to me. He stopped at maybe like twenty yards and at this point he's facing me, so I'm watching him and my eyes are going back and forth and watching him and watching her her, waiting for her to make a step to see if he moves and makes that make takes a turn. Um. So she did take a step, and she actually decided to go back the way she came, and for her to come out where she was there was there's no reason for her to do that, Like it made no sense. I don't even know why she did that, but I'm glad she did. And so she made a move to go back, and he like immediately did that spin to go back the way it came. So he wasn't gonna like parallel to me and go broadside. He just spun, And at that time I knew, like, and that's one of those things probably just where experienced, you just know what to do at that time, because most people would have probably just he would have spun and they would have drew, and then they would have never stopped him. But I drew. I like, I'm pretty sure I don't even know what happened. It was like a blur, but you you draw and stopped him at the same time, and I stopped just in time where where I could tuck it right behind his shoulder, really really strong, but where I was comfortable and I could make a great shot. I hit him right behind the behind the back ribs and that buck went down like less than five seconds. He was done, And yeah, that was that was incredible hunt. So he talked about him a little little more. I mean, he's got an eight inch flyer. Yah, I think I think it's like a shoot hall On. I think it was seven. It's like seven inches, and then if forks it's it's real thick, kind of webbed, and then forks off it's a great book. He's like nineteen inches wide. Did he lose a little rack? Didn't he break off some smaller stuff? Yeah he did. He had like a big curly kind of point. He probably would have grossed one seven if he had that. He busted that off, which whatever, But that's another thing about this book. He was kind of like he was up. Well, I saw it, like I mentioned before, I saw him fighting Kevin vander Boom and uh and the other years he was always busted up. So that was one of my fears. Like this year, I was like if I'm gonna kill him, I gotta kill him early because he's gonna be busted up by November. You know. Fortunately this year he just busted off at one point and kept everything else sound intact. But but yeah, it was a great hunt. It was awesome. That is awesome. The best part was when I when I killed him, I knew he was down right away, you know, And I texted you guys in the group text or whatever. You're horrible, but I love doing that to you guys. We and we really really get mad about it. You're the worst because we've got what you leave everybody hanging. Oh yeah, I love doing that. I'm like, oh, I just just shot Jim Lahey, you know. And then they're all like texting back and forth. Picture it didn't happen, because we always say picture it didn't happen, And some of some of the guys like, who's Jim Lahey? And then they're sending pictures. Oh my god, you know is this one because we've been seeing pictures but Dusty. And then I'm texting back, man, guys, I don't know, it's gonna be a long night, you know, and stuff like that. And then yeah, you kept him on the hook. Oh no, I love doing that. Ross and I were the closer, so I get some off the off the off to the side text, Yeah, like what the hell are you doing to those guys because just wait till tomorrow. I don't say anything like, oh, well, you guys want pictures all the time. And I was by myself and it was dark and I couldn't take decent picture. That's like I always a picture first, though, So I just took a picture of that flyer and I sent into that like, oh buddy, yeah, awesome, that was awesome. That was pretty incredible. Yeah, that was exciting. And then I think, if I remember right, you killed Jim Lahey and then you text us about it that morning, and that was the morning that Further killed his buck. Me and Further were in Ohio. I remember getting the text messages from you in the morning and did kill him the same day. No, I think you killed your buck the night before, but you were telling us about the next morning. That's when you decided to tell people. Yeah, so you were texting us about Jim Lahey and then I am seeing Further's buck come running by me and I'm like, oh, Jesus's bucking. Then that whole thing that was a good a couple of days, it was, it was, it was a good time. Yeah, it was awesome. All right, Let's pause here real quick for a word from our partners at white Tail Properties. This week with white Tail Properties, we are joined by Rich ba, a land specialist out of southeastern Iowa, and Rich he's going to be telling us about how he patterned some mature bucks without educating them. What I like to do is, uh figure out where a buck's living. And so during the late summer and early fall months, I'll run trail cameras around my farm, probably one for every forti sixty acres and try to figure out where the different mature bucks are living. Um, you really have to keep an eye on that, you know, once October November get here, because they often tend to disperse and and move around a little bit. But but I still use cameras, and I have them in areas where you know, I'm not going to disturb the deer to check them. One of the things you know that that's key to me is I just don't pressure deer. In early October, I figure out where they're living, you know, where they feed and then really don't hunt them until the last week of October, one week in November, when I know they're gonna be on there feet before dark and still on their feet after daylight. Otherwise, you know, you risk educating them and making them go nocturnal. If you'd like to learn more and to see the properties that rich currently has listed for sale, visit white tail properties dot com backslash bo that's b A U G H. So then I had a great little story there. You had a great story there, Peter, what from this season do you want to talk about? From here two thousand seventeen seasons? Is there anything that stood out? We had some great experiences. Yeah. As a chiropractor, I were very busy. I'm talking talking deer hunting. No By'm saying yeah, but I don't. I don't. Yeah, I don't take off a lot. I don't take off a lot of time. So tell him about the plan for like next year. In that public land spot that we talked about years ago, I hunted the state land spot and I could see this river bottom from where I was, and at about ten o'clock, a just a giant walk through there and I put it my you know, put it in your mind, but you just don't think about why he's there at that time in the morning. So it was the last one of the last eight agree days, like in the middle of October. S Ross and I went scouted down there for just to walk the property this state land. We bumped a buck that went through the water and to the other side, so we decided to scout a little bit better. Found some early season scrapes and some robs, and I said, I'll just sit up in here, you know, tomorrow or the next weekend, and uh lo and behold kind of rain, didn't it. I don't remember. Well. I set up on that deer. We came back in it was like a one, so we let him go and um but I wanted to be in a different spot from where I was, but when I got in there, it was pitch dark. So long story short, set up in a different tree than I wanted to. So I based on that experience years ago, I said, I'm gonna stay a little later because I think stay till like nine through to your ten. And I thought maybe something make sure would come down. But we didn't know real We didn't know why, I think because it was missed at that time, I go, I just had that experiencing, I'm going to test it, and it was raining, so I thought they might missing. I thought they might freshen up the stuff. Sure enough, this monster mass monster came down and just went to the one tree where I wanted to be by, freshened up that scrape, went right back into the tyms on that. Yeah, so that's massive if it's an a point or one forty all day, real thick. And then if it was a ten, it was pretty good size, and you know, and then um, so that way that that hunt, I took the long wind, and then there's another way and go just straight down a ridge, pair of waiters and be up on it. So I started doing that for the rest of the year, and moved in to where that deer was fresh up that scrape. And then a different boat came in equally as impressive. This one was gosh, that frame was one frame, but that thing was yeah, yeah, that was beautiful. So he came in kind of like you'd want a deer to come in, and it just was a little too far up. So well, now you know you've got a good spot for next year, because you know why, now you know why the bucks are doing that, you know where to be in October. I think it's a they talked about that primary scrape. I think it might be one, and it's a certain time frame. I think I hunted a little bit later and it wasn't as good. So yeah, so that's that. I'd say mid Well, the first weekend was like twenty early and that's when that mass monster came. And then the next weekend I went down there again in that big big eight with a or big nine with a just a huge frame. Yeah. Is that the one that you had a similar situation to me, sort of where you got cough guard. Yeah, if you want to dig a little deeper, we can do that, um please. I was watching We used to be able to hunt the private behind that, so I was watching this valley and there's always deer and there, so I was kind of scoping, scoping back and it's it's probably quarter to eight, you know, prime time, So I'm just watching back there because I did notice during another hunt that a deer did cross the water and it was bucked. So I'm like, I'll just check what's going on. And as I turned around with my binoculars in my hand. That's when that that real nice second buck came through and I was not ready for him. So yeah, the shot would have been of my reach for me possibly, but it was just nice to see. So well, don't feel bad about getting caught off Guarden. Happens happens to many of us in this room, or at least one other person. So, yeah, we were talking about some other stuff the other night, Peter. I don't know if you want to talk about it or not, but some of the thoughts around, um, sure, just you know, how to get more comfortable in those moments. There's some of the things that you're talking about wanting to work on this coming year. For me, it's got to be at the moment of right there, like Corey talked to me about after because why why at that time where you looking behind you with your binoculars when you those deer, where do you reach Anyways? I mean he goes at that time quarter to eight or seven, just as it's a great light, to great light, to whenever my bows in my hand, ready, he goes, They're gonna come in like ghosts in the darkness, you know, and just be ready. So have you ever seen that movie? Oh, it's lovely. Yeah, that's a good movie. Good movie. You seen that Negative in the Darkness. I can't stay up through any movies, even if it's a Rambo at four o'clock in the afternoon, this one, I'll check it out. What has we got, Val Kilmer. You got Michael Michael not Michael Jackson, Michael Michael, not Michael Keaton, not Michael Jordan's Douglas, Michael Douglas. Thank you, Michael Douglas. Yeah, which is well Kilmer. And basically this is talking about the man eating lions. It's the man Eaters of Savoy and they're in the Chicago Museum there in the Chicagomy has been natural history and there was this railroad trying to be built through Africa, I don't know, and they were stuck at a bridge point trying to get the bridge and these two lions killed I don't remember what the number of an astronomical number of people. Yeah, and so the movie talks about this whole situation they had up bringing a professional hunter and to try to kill these man eaters and yeah, it's intense. Check it out. So the ghosts in the Darkness are what Peters trying to prepare for yes, Traditionally, I could you imagine sitting in next to a tree with man eating lions walking around? Could you be prepared for that moment? I have enough gunpower at home, that's for sure. My dad was crystal so but so sorry. No, It's been my problem continually each year is the moment of truth, getting that shot, or I can get onder all day. I see a lot of deer, so fortunate that way, but moment truth is just not something I've had a lot of practice with. So and I think I think that it's it's something that a lot of people struggle or I will wait for that perfect shot. I mean, I think about how many times I've had good sized deer there. And I'm fairly picky too at times. But Mike, that's not I'm not I'm thinking what if Coreya shot with ROSSI shot most likely, but for me, I just didn't feel right. So I think Ross alluded to something too, when when you were talking about you have so much experience in these moments. When Jim Lahy started to do that turn, You've been through that before, You've seen that before, you knew, okay, I need to stop and draw and take that shot right now, and you knew, Yeah, it was a fast moment, but you you understood that, you had the time. You were comfortable with that. But to Peter's point, if you hadn't been through that, or if you hadn't you know, had been fortunate enough to kill a good number of deer and go through that, it's it's a lot harder to handle those moments of truth. And that's why. And everyone's got to do their own thing. But I do think it is helpful too when you're getting into hunting to kill some does, to kill some younger bucks, to take it in one step of the ladder of time. At least that's what worked out for me. Um, But I know you're you're figuring out your own kind of path too. Well. Yere, I did shoot that decent buck up in the same same vicinity I remember winning I go one third year better and I saw it come in, never looked at the head again, and unfortunately shot wasn't true. Uh, And we I did see the buck the next day he ran off with a arrow window. But so it can work for me. It's just a matter of making it work for me. Can I psychoanalyze you? Please do on the air. So have you ever have you ever thought about changing your what you want to shoot for your for your bow buck for some reason? I want it huge? You want? Yeah, you've been very picky about that and why why is this? There's probably a little bit of anxiety. But making the correct shot helling doesn't come easy to me. I don't think it comes easy for a lot of people, right, but just for me, maybe not so much. Uh, maybe there's a little bit of that's my dad's bock m. I never really talked about that before he's passed, and he'll never get a chance. I want that bow one to be just pretty special. Yeah, maybe that's unrealistic, but yeah, that's cool. So interesting. Now what about doze? Have you age your opinion not a little bit? Do you want to shoot a dough? We talked about this a little bit. You've been reluctant to do that in the past. Um. I think if I get myself more dialed in, it might be something easier. I'd have a I picked up at twenty acres and uh, I can't really see that tone, but just twenty acres in the outskirts of my town and there's he's an eight year old man. He's like, he doesn't understand this whole. It's substance, this shoot this deer for somebsence. He goes, Peter, you're gonna get a dough here? So I could see that may be happening. Now that'd be cool. Yeah, that'd be cool. There's nothing better, I guess. I always think there's a buck coming right, so why would I? I was worried that that one the one time you do let the aero fly and shoot that dough, then there's the the big buck walking right behind her. Yeah, October one, go out there a first day October two or something. I mean mentally, I decided that before I even go hunting. Yeah, yeah, I think you're right. That's a that's a decision you gotta make and play for. I'll tell you what, killing heavy duty man, it's a heavy deal. There's times I considered, should I just be a camera guy? Hey? You know it's it's not I feel like, boy, this is such a complicated subject. But I mean, in Upper Mischigan I'm from, I've shot shovel deer, small four keys and things and it never felt great. But I've done it. Shoot him with a bow, never with a gun and shooting him a close quarters it put an arrow throom is a way more intimate. If that's not I don't even know if that's the right word. I think it way more intimate experience. Then then shooting him with a gun, and uh, you know, I think I mean most people that um have any sort of I don't see moral compass. Boy, I could be pissing a lot of people off here. But killing is is uh something that is a powerful moment and and and it's surely it's it's obviously with you. Mark and I talked. I live in the city, so I I shot my dear and I shoot in my back yard. But if my wrist flicks my arrows in the neighbor's yard, I'm looking for him like, well, this isn't good. It's kind of selfish on my point to be doing that. So I don't make it a priority to get to a spot to shoot for you off. So I'm only shooting twenty yards in my yard or whenever. In reality, if you look at a hunter, I'm responsible for that shot. So if I'm going out there without lost confidence, I just won't take it. Then sure, yeah, yeah, And then it's like Oh my gosh, I'm gonna kill this thing. And this is yeah, if it's thirty like that buck that came in Corey Roscoe's shop is thirty five yars is beautiful. I wasn't ready because I wasn't looking. But if I would have been ready, but I have still taken a shot, probably not. Yeah yeah. And there's some world class hunters that only take yard shots. Yeah yeah. So there's nothing wrong with so, and that's their their decisions. So I learned from them. I mean, that's what they do. Everyone's got whatever they're comfortable with that. But I have a buddy who was an amazing shot and for Michigan he knocked on down at fifty because he was comfortable because he shoots at a hunter. Yeah, he doesn't do it all the time, but no wind conditions were right boom yeah yeah yeah. So what's the goal for this year, Peter? And we gotta practice more? There you go. But at the end of the two thousand eighteen season, when the season is done and you look back on it, Okay, so one goal is that you want to have practiced more of your bow. What other goals do and it could be a kill goal or could be anything else or or what what would be your goals by the end of the season you hope to accomplish. Let's see, well, kill deer. I gotta make it just a special for me, that's about it. Um. I've got properties where I've got big deer, and I got propertly where I have decent deer. So just I seem to have always waited for that big one if it doesn't happen, so it's maybe just get that one thirty on the ground. I got enough of those one t I don't know, Yeah, so is one is one thirty? What feels right? Like that's like for the special? I seem to find a pointers inches inches or a hundred and thirty pointers saying yeah, he's saying yeah. It sounds terrible to put these kind of unrealistic or just to say that it has to be this. It could be just anything, but or does it come down to some with something me and Dami guess a few weeks ago, it's like you just have that feeling like that maybe that's it, but maybe that kind of buck for you is what you've found gives you that factor. And I think some of this is framed by where you live in Hunt. You live in Hunt in Iowa, where there are lots and lots and lots of big deer relative to a lot of other places. I think if you lived in Michigan or you live in Pennsylvania, you lived in wherever, and if you hadn't come out here and seen experienced all this a hundred old take for example, when you moved to Iowa. When you first came out here, you were seeing gad and eight pointers and you were thrilled, and the first one twenty I'm like, wow, Ross is like settled down. That's right, that's a that's a basket. No, no, no no, I was no. When we first came two year olds like, yeah, yeah, that was that was tough. Everything looks big. Most likely I should just shoot a deer to get it out, anything to get out of the system. Build a confidence. Absolutely, there's a lot of reality to that, and there's a there's that's an admirable, admirable thing man going out there and just taking an apple animal and being happy with it, regardless of what anybody else thinks. I mean, that's because muscle literally killed a beautiful buck and shout right through the heart, died within thirty ft where three yards where I shot him and it was great. Yeah. Yeah, And I think I think the gun is less intimate, but it's more it's a competence. Yeah. And I would never want to try to impose on you like and I hope we're not doing that. No, But that's the biggest thing is your values are yours mine or mine? And mine are great and so are yours? Yeah, and so if you if you want to hold out for a special buck, more power to nothing wrong with that at all. But you know, but I can but seriously, I can't call myself a hunter. I am a goes out hunting. Well, it does not kill, I'm not killer. Maybe, And from a from a purely pragmatic, pragmatic standpoint though, simply from what will help you be more successful as a hunter? Killing more does or taking a first step and killing the first Bucky get a chance they're doing that a few times will help you in the future. And I know you know this we've talked about. I mean, if this isn't rocket science, um, but if there's nothing wrong with choosing not to do that, but it's something to consider. Like Ras said, those experiences are what helped prepare you for the moment when you do have that special buck in front of you, because it's a lot harder to do that in the very if, if the very first buck you ever shoot with the bow is a hundred sixty mega giant or something, that's a tough moment to handle the first time. Now I know you've shot. They're dear too, But no, you know we got the story where last I think we shared it last podcast where that one pointer came in and jumped the did everything read the read the script? I shot a gangster style because of how I had to, and my wrist must have flicked at the last What does this wrist flicking thing you keep saying that you do? I do it. I used to shoot my condo and I for some reason rist wood flick target panickers could be yeah, I've in your condo. Yeah you hit the wall. Yeah, my wife was not impressed. Yeah. Yeah. There's one time I was shooting in the basement of a place where you're renting, ah, and I had the target set up in the air, went through the target and it hit the water pipe off beat below the shut off valve to eight units. Oh no, yeah, talk about so what does that do you say type two or level two? Usually type two? Is that type two? Far? Yeah? Well, yeah, like it was the most It was a terrible experience at the time, but now it's hilarious when I think about it. But uh yeah, water just it was just so much force coming out everywhere. I was filling up coolers and running up to until like a plumber came. I can only imagine what you were I was looking like at that moment. Big mistake. So yeah, be careful when you're shooting, because even when you hit the target, still can you should blind bail man? Do you have a blind bail You know what that is? I think there's a podcast The Guy Talk we talked about leave. I'm just at ten yards of five yards and just three yards no, just no, You're not gonna miss. And you shoot with your eyes closed, and you get used to the feet release of the arrow, and you feel that arrow send and and and you don't you don't react to it. It just goes. And you do that with your eyes closed, and and you build confidence internally, you know. I mean, yeah, I think in some respects I thought about this show. I got maybe I should learn my everything about scouting, hunting. I could relay a lot of stuff when I get in a train. It's a little different than the textbook goes away and you're like, how do you read this? I'm I'm probably a good be on that stuff a lot of other stuff. Hey, but knowing a bow and probably a c I don't you know. I think that's just to me. It's a tool. I go grab it and use it. But how do I know it better? How do I know what these You know some of the how the setup is, how that works for it. And I think that's a good idea. Yeah, And I think I think you're sharing your experiences right here and your some of your struggles and your thoughts stuff. This is really helpful stuff for a lot of people. It's important stuff talking about because I think so much of what you get in the hunting media today and sometimes we're guilty of this too. We've got the best deer hunters in the world on here who seemed invincible and their ice cold and oh my gosh, this guy kills a big de kills four big mature bucks every year. It can seem kind of daunting, like how can I stack up to that? And it's important to remember the world just people. We all make mistakes, and each one of us are at a different place, and we have our own stroke and challenges. And I think hearing about stuff you're going through in the decisions and things you're trying to figure out, that looks back to the old videos. I had a lot of deer in there, but never kill. Yeah, you've you've certainly seen a lot, and you've had en calendars, and you've had opportunities and but it's not easy take that final stuff. Well, we always talk about what you think about your bring about. I never think about the kill part. Always thought about all the other stuff involved with hunting. Yeah, it's interesting you you talk a lot about one one time we're uh one time we can. I tend to use humor to escape the reality of not shooting. One time we were down here shed hunting and we get into Peter's truck and we hadn't been riding him, We had not been due, we hadn't been riding with so no one had been in this truck prior to this. So we hopped into his car. So I had my fun in my pocket was outside and in my circle. You record self affirmations you hear it's really big on self improvement. Different. It was like, yeah, so you tell yourself and stuff enough, it's gonna just implant your subconscious in it. Your body has nothing, your mind will attract it to you. So the car comes on and then on the speakers really loud, Peter Lynch, you will gross X hundreds of thousand dollars or whatever. Peter Lynch, you will that. He was repeating these goals. We just died. That's funny. Did yes, I have had a boy. Well to you, my practice gets that income. I don't know what. I don't know what the dollar yeah, yeah, but to the point of vision. But if you don't put that into your your hobby, yeah, it's not gonna be something. Yeah like Ross. I know Ross God, he manifests everything into his life because he thinks about Corey. They all thinks about his bucks. You saw that today. He actually has a I think I think I saw him make a scrape, piss on his back legs a little bit. I kind of rubbed him together look back. You know it just carried on. But you know something I do to your point about um handling that moment, the truth, I'm betting Ross you probably do this. Maybe I think you've talked about it, maybe you two two Ben. But when I get into a tree stand, I get all set up. Once I'm all settled, and one of the very first things I do is I look at each one of my different shooting lanes or different places where a deer might be able to come through, and I imagine, okay, if there's a buck coming through here, and I visualize a buck coming through this way, visually, I actually will make sure I can draw back and visualize hold my bow drawn about. Okay, could I shoot theory up? Can I imagine I'm visualizing a deer come this direction, Okay, imagine drawing back. Yep, I can get a shot there. I will do that in every different, every different way. So you think through what that scenarre will look like. You're also seeing. Can I maneuver? Can I get my arm drawn back? Can I do all these different things? If that happened, If that happened, if that happened. And I think that that really helps me remember as a kid and I was shooting the backyard u Permichigan, just with those basic bowls, just you pull back, boom, let go, and remember the deer. I we talked that deer. I did she with with the bow and penetrated And remember when I got up there, everything was perfect. That's the one where I said, I'm gonna get a one thirty. I saw the deer, identified it as a shooter. I didn't look at it again, actually had the camera perfect, pulled back and then when I got through the peep sid, I'm like, where am I? Because I couldn't identify were I had to look away and come back again. And then that was it. That's where it went a half inch high, put that right in the shoulder blade, penetrated maybe an inch two inches and there lived. So yeah, it's all those a thousand tiny little things in the last one second can go wrong, and it's we've all been there, brother battle and battle and the inner demons, and uh, if you want to you know, if if it's important to you to work through them, it's it'll happen, you know. And so yeah, anyone that's listening to this podcast has heard that. I've had plenty of my own struggles that way too, Dan Johnson as well, and we've all we all have absolutely love so well. I hope that we get you on here and the Fall of two has an eighteen. Peter with your story of the successful hunt. Me and Corey always talk about We talked about you a lot, you know, Peter, I know I feel it, and we we talked. You know what, when Peter does get that buck, it's going to probably be the biggest buck to any of us are ever killed. You probably will end up that first one. It's going to be that one in the public land. And he was talking about the big frame. Yeah, I like to see like a hundred. Then that property again, a little property had it's a twenty, and it was pretty amazing. A lot of big deer ahead all year, and I didn't see too many during the hunting time frame, but I felt like a monster could come from this ridge through the paragraphs, through this little twenty to go somewhere else to check those And and I had sat too long the day before. I was really extremely crabby. All days sit too early. Remember this, You were crabby too, Yeah, next day, I compare, I could barely sleep, and Ross text me, let's get breakfast, Like yes, I'm walking back from my stand through this twenty and my truck is only five yards away. I can see it and that's hard to you know, like, let's go, we can do it. There was a one seventy coming through the progress, like I kind of thought would happen, and it didn't happen because you're you're already walking to breakfast. That's all right, but you know who knows with that deer when I came back by where I was, but I think I could have saw him, So that's something because Sam and just let him go buy me because I didn't shoot him. Joking, of course, but joking of course. All right, Peter, any final thoughts from you, any final things you want to cover? No, I think we're good. Well, why I love hunting bigfoot. That's maybe for another time. You are a squatch believer, aren't you. It's just entertaining entertainment. Yeah, if you get lost on YouTube, go down a rabbit hole like a big foot. Let's check it out and you're listening to it. Okay, So, but Ross made a Ross made a buck grunt and I made an elk bugle. I heard you can do a pretty good squatch call. I don't know you've sent us a you've sent us a video of you making a squatch call before. Yeah, he's ross is kind of an instigator. It sounds like a World War two areas. Yeah, come on, we should I do it really loud? Sure? Why not? Just move the speakers away? I kind of like kind of that guy that of the group that is the you're good at it? Yeah, thank you appreciate that. But you are. You are the wild card of our group when especially when Dan's not here, You're the wild card. Ben. Have you ever heard one of these? Before you're ready? It's supposed to sound like a World War two World War two air raids siren. And we'll do it for your audience because this is what they're tuning in for. That is that a male or female? That's an alpha male? Because I did it. It's an alpha squatch and it's important to be doing gifting. I gifted a little bit out of your property today. Just say no, what does that mean? Uh? Young snickers and apples? Just leave him there for first watch? Yeah? What does this do for them? Keep him on the property? It just keeps him there. And there wasn't well, there was no tree breaking. That what that mean? Would you if you ran into squatch? Would you mess with them? Or I would leave? You would leave, they're dangerous. Yeah. Wow, to see again rabbit hole on YouTube, you just listen to stuff like wow, this is there's the whole world subculture tell us what we need to watch out for. Alright, So let's say you're in said stand alright, stand said stand the stand where you're hunting. You're in the stand up and we've all had this where the everything goes quiet, So there could be a predator nearby. But if there's oh gosh, I can't believe I'm putting myself out here like this. Remember his chiropractic practice. Yeah shit. But but you know, it's it's just purely entertainments. And so then the people say, if you smell sewer next to you, there's probably a sasquatch running around trying to get you. You're gonna get a whole new honest, because there's you're gonna subtitle sasquatch and the talking points and people are going to tune into this. You're welcome. So yeah, sorry, continue, that's what he smells were gas. That's a problem, Yeah, because they smelled atrocious. So if it's so, if you're the whole point of this is there's this book called four one one David Polate is missing and it kind of gets into it. So it's an interesting book about disappearances on national parks. We're going down to different We're going somewhere, but this is a there's a lot more. Yeah, so it's just ire. Yeah, tree knock and well you were knocking last week. I hang, I hang with the weird crew here. Ben. Well, when it's snowing out in your shed hunting, it's like, what else are we gonna do? What is tree knocking? Oh gosh, that's when we must have watched Bobo on Discovery finding Bigfoot. You hit a tree with a stick, and that's how. That's how, That's how they communicate with each other. Okay, Yeah, it's kind of like yeah, yeah, it's like, well, it's like a sasquatch will say I'm over here, and then it could be communicating to another scat squatch over here. These people, Yeah, there's this many that they have an intricate communication. The Geese they have a sentinel who will sit high and watch everything and communicate to the others, and then they knock on trees. Yes to let it. There's no Oh you must have been reading about this. No, I'm learning no kind of inspiration here. Well, so I don't know, yeah, where I got it right. Well, it's been nice knowing you Mark. Thanks for having me on the podcast again until next year. Any any final thoughts, Peter, we'll go around the around the horn here and wrapping out. I just think it's it's been a great day. Thank you for let us walk the property. Appreciate it. Yeah, good time. Ross thought Ben thinks a lot. It was a great time. Um, great people. Yeah, that was. Everybody's just awesome, And uh, I think it was just it was super fun watching everybody get excited finding those sheds, and I just hung back watch everybody. It was. It was awesome. And because we're also pick up twenty if I wish that, Yeah, if I wasn't worried about finding sheds myself, what I should have been doing was like I should have stood on a hill and just videotape the whole thing and just seeing that scatter and all the exciting it was quite entertaining. That would have been great. It was, it was. It was a great time. Shed hunting is just awesome because you know, deer hunting a lot of times it's solo, you know, and and everybody kind of does their own thing, but getting together shed hunting you can when else can you mess around the woods like that with a group of people and have a good time and sure and uh have some good laughs. And you don't get to really do that during deer season as much unless you have like a deer camp or something like that. So so I always look forward to this time here. We need a deer camp. No, I'm really glad you guys came down. Had an absolute blast mission accomplished today, right, I mean, we we found some has a bit more importantly we had we had a ton of fun, and um, it's awesome get to know you guys a little bit. I've heard a lot of good things about you. So it's great to spend a day within uh you know, going back to shed rally. I mean it's uh pretty rewarding whenever you get some people out there that don't necessarily have any familiar familiarity with hunting or anything, and and uh you can let him into our world a little bit, and uh, we need to do more of that is what it comes down to, right, And you know we're not gonna get into this big I'm not gonna get on this big pulpit or whatnot. But it's a good thing to introduce somebody to the outdoors and um, you know, hey, we we did that today. Shut. Hunting is a good way to do that. Absolutely, just a fun excuse to walk in the woods and enjoy camaraderie and have a good time. Yeah, so we did it. Awesome. Well I'll just uh, I'll end with a little plug for our buddy. If you need a map for your property, Ben makes the best ones out there. You do some awesome, awesome work with Hunt Terror maps. I love my map. I got him on the wall behind me so I sit there at the computer desk working and then I can spin around and look up there and daydream and think about where I'd rather be in a tree. Um. I sent to my brother for Christmas, even he hadn't heard of Hunter, and he's blown away. It's going to be in a picture frame basically in our house or his camp. Awesome. So yeah, so he's pretty pumped. It's very cool. And as we alluded to earlier, the mobile map was really was a really cool tool today too, So he's super useful. So I'm glad you glad you guys like him, keep up the good work man, And where can we find that stuff online? H Hunter dot com. That's uh, that's where where we are. We got we ramped up our our social media presence. We're doing a lot of um, a lot of posts with Instagram and facebooks to look us up on there as well. Awesome, Thanks guys, Thank you looking forward this looking forward to shed really two pieces and that's a rap, folks. Hope you enjoyed this strange, wandering, bizarre conversation. We we certainly enjoyed it at least, so uh. Just a final reminder, like I said at the very beginning, we've got the live podcast this Saturday, March seventeen, two thousand and eighteen. Really hope to see you guys there and hope to share a cold beverage with you as well at the podcast or afterwards at the b h A pint night. It's gonna be a lot of fun. Uh. And then finally, just want to say thank you to our partners for making all this possible so big. Thanks to Sit to Gear, Yetie Cooler's, Matthew's Archery, Maven Optics, White Tail Institute of North America, Trophy Ridge, and Hunter ra maps, and finally, thank you all for listening, thanks for being with us, thanks for tuning in and tagging along for all of our adventures over the years. I appreciate it so much, and until next time, stay wired to Hunt.

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