00:00:01 Speaker 1: Welcome to the Wired to Hunt podcast, your guide to the White Tail Woods, presented by first Light, creating proven versatile hunting apparel for the stand, saddle or blind. First Light Go Farther, Stay Longer, and now your host, Mark Kenyon. 00:00:19 Speaker 2: Welcome to the Wired to Hunt podcast. This week on the show, we're going to discuss the many ways that developing a running habit can help you become a better hunter. And we're diving into all sorts of best practices and recommendations for taking your running to the next level when it comes to increased training, taking it to the trails, better nutrition, taking part in races, and a whole lot more when it comes to developing physical and mental toughness. All right, welcome, come back to the wired ton podcast, brought to you by First Light and their Camo for Conservation Initiative, which gives a portion of every sale of First Light's Whitetail Camel pattern. A portion of every sale of that stuff goes to support the National Dear Association, which is an organization that I am passionate about and interested in and excited about. And I'll tell you another thing I am passionate about, interested in, and excited about that's running and that might not be something that you would think would show up on a white tail hunting podcast, which usually Wired Hunt is, But if you've been listening the last couple of years, you know that's been something I've been diving into more myself, and you know I found with this podcast And maybe you feel differently, but I have found that when I pursue and dive more into the things that get me curious, that get me intrigued that I want to dive into a rabbit hole on when I chase those things, it usually ends up leading to better content for you guys, because if I'm not interested in it, if I'm bored with it, it's going to translate into the content. And so I am committing myself to continue to chase and explore and further, I don't know. Explore, I guess is the word I'm reaching for, and I already said it, but I'm going to continue down those paths when it comes to whitetail hunting, when it comes to hunting in general, when it comes to conservation, when it comes to ways to grow as a person or in this case, with a set of training, practices and habits that help you become a better hunter, to help you become a more effective human. I think it helps you out in a whole lot of other ways too, And that's running. That's what I found running to be for me. As you guys know, I am not the Cam Hagnes type. I'm not some super uber elite athlete. I'm not that person, right. I'm long, lanky, skinny. My friends say I look gumby, So I'm not impressing anybody with my physical prowess or my physique. But here I am on a podcast talking to you about running and why you might want to consider adding running to your regimen, why you might want to continue doubling down on your running habit if that's something you're already doing. That's the case we're gonna try to make today, and my guest is Weston. Paul Weston works for Mountain Tough, which is a gym and online digital gym, I. 00:03:31 Speaker 3: Guess you would call it. 00:03:32 Speaker 2: They've got a whole suite of video courses you can participate in, and they do a lot of really cool stuff. They get a podcast, all sorts of resources to help people train specifically for mountain hunting and mountain hunting related pursuit, mountain related pursuits, athletic pursuits, and Weston has been someone who's reached out to me and giving me some advice as I have pursued trail running in a little bit more serious of a kind of way. And so that's why he's here today, because we're going. 00:04:01 Speaker 3: To start at the. 00:04:03 Speaker 2: Beginning talking about why you might want to consider these doing these things as I just described, and then go further down the line explore, Okay, if you decide you want to run, or if you already are running, how do you do it better? How do you build a habit that actually helps you as a deer hunter, that helps you maybe train for your first out west hunt, or maybe you've been going out there chasing elk or antelop or mule there and you want to get better at it. We're going to discuss different ways to train and to run in such a way that you can get better at these things. How can you develop more not skilled, but how can you develop the set of characteristics needed to perform at elevation? How do you climb mountains better and feel more comfortable doing it? All this kind of stuff that will help you as a hunter, whether you're deer hunting here in Michigan or elk hunting in Montana. This set of practices, this training, the mental discipline required to do this stuff consistently is going to help you. So that's what we talk about, going to dive in towards the end on you know, if you really want to get into this stuff heavy the way I'm trending right now, if you want to start running races, if you want to start doing long distance stuff, we discuss training ideas, we discuss nutrition, we discuss you know, how to choose what kinds of distances are good to ramp up to, and a hole much more like that. So I enjoyed this one. It's a change of pace from what we usually discuss, but I would highly encourage you to give this one a listen and to stick with it, because you know, whether you are a diehard, you know, exercise nut, or someone who just wants to have more success than the deer woods, there's something here for you. Also, before we get into that, I want to give you a heads up on something that is exciting and coming up here soon, and that is the twenty twenty four edition of the Working for Wildlife tour. We're back a second year of the program. If you are not familiar, you got to keep hitting my microphone. Sorry, guys, if you're not familiar with this. The Working for Wildlife Tours this thing I kicked off last year in which I am traveling across the country participating in different public land volunteer habitat improvement days. And the idea here is to shine a spotlight on the fact that there are these kinds of events all across the country that you can be involved in that give you a chance to do something good for wildlife, that give you a chance to give back to the public lands that we all enjoy so much, and that gives you a chance to meet other like minded hunter and anglers, you know, get involved in this community, meet some new friends, meet some new hunter fishing buddies, and do some good work at the same time. So that's what these things are all about. We did six of them last year. They were amazing. We made real progress, We made of real impact on these landscapes and helped all sorts of critters and had a dang good time doing it. We've got three of them scheduled so far for this year, and the first one is coming up soon. The first event is May eighteenth, twenty twenty four, in Kentucky. The second event is June one in Pennsylvania the Alleghany National Forest, and the third event is August twenty fourth up in northern Minnesota on the edge of the Bounder Waters. The first two of these events are in collaboration with the National Deer Association. The third event is in collaboration with Sportsmen for the Boundary Waters. All three events, we're gonna be doing various types of habitat improvement work to make better habitat in the ground for white tailed deer, turkeys, birds, small mammals, all sorts of stuff like that. There's also going to be some hunter access programs, some like fence removal, a whole slew of different things that are just improving our public lands as well. So you're gonna have a great time. We're gonna do some good work. I would really like to see you there. I would love to meet you, shake your hand, hear your stories, sign a book, take some pictures, whatever it is. Hope to see you there. Mentioned May eighteenth is that first one in Kentucky at the Daniel Bloone National Forest. You can get the details and sign up. There's registration links by you know. The easiest way is maybe just google twenty twenty four working for Wildlife Tour. Oh go, or go to the mediator website that's themeateater dot com. Look for the registration article there, or search for it in the search bar. Anyway you can find working for Wildlife Tour twenty twenty four. I'll get you there, sign up, come on out. I cannot wait for I have a great time and it's just in like a couple of weeks. So that is my one plug for the day. That out of the way, I think we should get to my chat with Weston. He's a great guy, a you know, a wealth of information when it comes to running and trail running. He's a guy who's gone deep into this world doing ultra races, doing this kind of top tier level stuff, and he's a terrific communicator or about it too. So you're gonna see he's passionate about this and uh, we're all gonna benefit from it because of that. So with that out of the way and without any further ado, let's get to my chat with Weston. Paul, All right with me now on the line. I am joined by Weston. 00:09:21 Speaker 3: Paul. Welcome to the show. Thanks for having me, Monica. I'm excited to be here. Yeah, me too. 00:09:26 Speaker 2: I gotta tell you something that's kind of funny. Ever since I first saw your name pop up on Instagram or wherever it was that I first kind of digitally bumped into you, it's thrown me off because I grew up friends with a kid named Paul Weston, no way and so and so every time I see it, it takes me. It's like jarring because I'm like, is this the name, Like, what's the first name, what's the last name? 00:09:54 Speaker 3: Who is this guy? 00:09:56 Speaker 4: You? 00:09:57 Speaker 3: I should probably he's probably got some of my mail in the past. And I know I get called Paul Weston constantly. Yeah, any like most email interactions, people just see west and Paul and they just spond, Hey, Paul, you have a legit reason to call me Paul. 00:10:17 Speaker 2: Yeah, he was a good guy. He was a good guy. So the name seems to follow good folks. But yeah, I'm glad to be speaking to the real Paul. Well the west and Paul. See I'm already struggling, but yeah, we're talking. We're talking running today and I want to publicly thank you for something that privately you did, which is reach out to me when you saw that I was kind of diving deeper into the trail running world and I just kind of reached out out of the blue offering some advice and some thoughts and stuff. 00:10:50 Speaker 3: So thank you for that. Really very welcome. I was like, anytime I see that somebody asking that question, what advice do you have, I'm like, oh, I've I've got advice because there's these things that runners don't talk about, or it comes up in conversation like years after you start running, so tips and tricks and I love sharing those. I geek out on it for sure. Yeah. 00:11:13 Speaker 2: Well, like I was saying, I'm eating it all up right now, just like taking into fire holes of information as I've kind of taken this next step myself. But I'm curious, you know, to kick it off, how did this all start for you? Like, how did running become a part of your life? 00:11:30 Speaker 3: This this goes way back to my childhood and it probably as roots and when my sister and I would get in trouble, my parents would have us run around the house as punishment, so we had to make laps around the house. But that didn't last very long for me because I got asthma at a pretty early age, and so I got out of having to run around the house. And I had an inhaler and so all growing up, not all growing up, but definitely into my high school days. I mean I got out of running all the time because I had such bad asthma. And actually there's a President's Physical Fitness test that used to go on and I could never get the blue badge. I always got the red one. And the reason being is because I couldn't run, So I've got to watch everybody run and do their thing, but I always sat out, and running for me was something I never participated in until college. And when I went to college in Montana. I grew up in South Dakota. I went to college in Montana. It was something about the maybe the change in geography that we didn't have as much pollen in the air, or that I finally grew. So I didn't grow for a long time, and I grew out of asthma in college actually, and so I would run for dry land training. I was a ski racer, and so I would run in college for jial and training, and it was amazing because I was always the one standing on the sidelines, and my asthma went away. I didn't need an inhaler anymore. But I didn't really I didn't like gravitate towards running as something that I would want to do as a pastime. I just did it for training and it was nice to participate in it because it does give you the benefit even as a downhill racer. And then move it up to Bozeman. My wife and a group of her friends, they ran a whole bunch. They ran these ragnar races and they were just having a great time together. And I would watch that and they would train and do all those things, and they had such a fun time. That intrigued me a bit. And I also had a hunting buddy who we did a trip one time and we were walking and I just walk all day, like I just always kind of I'm just curious, so I will walk all day, probably why I'm not as successful as a hunter of a hunter as I should be. But this is a lot answer to your question. But this is how I got into running. My buddy told me at the end of that trip, he said, you should do the Bridge of Ridge run. He's like, you could, you could do the Bridge of Ridge run. And he had just observed me walking and over the course of you know, oh, probably eight maybe nine days something like that on that trip, and I just kept walking and walking and walking, and we covered a lot of ground, a lot of miles, and at the end of that he said, you should do the Bridge of Ridge run. Well, my wife's group of friends they were doing a trail race and because they were coming out of these ragnar like road races, and I mentioned that to them, they said, well, come on a trail on a training run with us. We're doing this local race that happens before the Bridge or Ridge run. So off the couch, I went on a training run with them and I ran, like, I think we did seventeen miles that day, and I'm like, we jogged. No trail running. People will call it trail running, but it's a lot of walking. It's like a it's a hidden secret and it is a lot of walking which I can do. And so I ran seventeen miles with them. I signed up for that first race. It's a thirty eight k so yeah, it's not a not a marathon, but it's a Mountain race, and I did that. I went and did the race like I did one training run and then went and did the race, and it was so incredible, the people, the people that support the race, the aid stations, the competitors, the finish line, all of it. I was hooked, like immediately, that one race just totally hooked me. And I'd also applied to be in the Bridge of Ridge run, and so following that race, that race was like the I think fourth of July and then the beginning of August, I did the Bridge of Ridge Run. So a combination of good influence around me and the running culture and the positivity that exists in it, and then my hunt and buddy just me, yeah, you should do this because of his observation of me walking so much and scarying sobody out. Man. 00:16:07 Speaker 2: That's so interesting though, because that's like my thing. Like the only thing I excel at physically is I can hike forever. Like all my buddies just know, like I'm a mountain go I'll just hike and hike and hike and hike, and I hike longer and faster, I don't stop. And I finally found like my one thing I was not the star of the basketball team, the football team, baseball team, anything. I was like a hustle player who'd kind of be on the he'd be in the team, but on the bench. But I finally found like a thing that seems to naturally assume me, which is just going for a long ways at the steady pace and kind of the same deal. My buddy's like, man, you could probably do these endurance races. And I always thought, God, no way, But I'm kind of realizing, like maybe it fits my personality or something, because what you're saying is so true with my experience. The I got to ask you about the bridge run, but I'll wait, yeah, because I've I've seen videos about that and been in trade and it looks incredible and I want to do it someday. But but I want to before we lose anyone who's thinking like Jays, I'm I'm just a whitetail hunter who you know, hikes in maybe a mile at the most, you know, and you know there's some like mobile deer hunters, so like the like the athletic spear end of the white tail crowd is like going to be hiking in with maybe like twenty pounds on your back and going in a mile mile and a half sneaking in Like that's a challenging white tail hunt. So it's very different than like a challenging elk hunt. But still that person might be listening to this and be curious, like, man, I know I could probably do some stuff to make that easier, to make myself more efficient at that, to be able to do that kind of stuff for ten days straight. And that kind of person might be wondering, like, why should I care about running? Why should running be a thing I add to my regiment or my routine. If you were gonna like, let's say we're at a bar and you happen to stumble into like a midwestern bar with a bunch of guys who guys are girls who like to hunt white tailed deer but are pretty serious about it, yep. And we're sitting there at the table eating burgers, drinking a beer, and you have to make the case to them, like why they should think about running a little bit more seriously or make it into a habit or something like that. What's the case you would make, like how would you try to convince someone at that table that this is a conversation they want to dive into more. 00:18:33 Speaker 3: Absolutely, the case I would make to them is, as a white tail hunter, the mental fortitude that it takes to be a successful whitetail hunter is the same mental fortitude that it takes to be a trail runner or a road runner. It's and they have it. That's the case that I would make. I was like, they have it because they do the sits, they put in the work, they look forward to it so much, and they're putting all that effort into it. They they want to do it for a long time. I'm guessing I would ask them, if you if you do want to do this for a long time, and so I would back up the mental fortitude and saying like you have this, you have what it takes with let's do this for a long time. And I do want to drink beers that I want to have cheeseburgers at the bar because I love that. So for my cardiovascular health, I'll do this to supplement then what I look forward to in that in that hunting season and it and for me, I know, like I'm I'm a whitetail hunter to a certain extent, like I got into it I'm my father in law, like my Western Michigan. So my father in law got me into it, and I just know the mental fortitude that it takes to do those sits and to be patient, and so I know that that's what we have in common as a runner and a white tail hunter, and not that running is for everybody, because sometimes people you might not be able to run, but you know rucking or just walking. That cardiovascular health, the benefit to that is the big thing for me. I'm like, I'm probably to a fault. I would like to do this for a long time and hopefully this is helping that. So my cardiovascular health would be what I would back it up with. 00:20:32 Speaker 2: Yeah, so let's assume that I know nothing, because in many ways I don't. How is improving my cardiovascular health gonna help me be a more effective hunter? Like how is that going to translate into my time of field or getting to where I hunt or or anything else? 00:21:01 Speaker 3: As a yeah, is that kind of girl? I the cardiovascular health and being able to maintain a pace without getting worked up. When I think of that, I think of going in with all of my warm clothes on to do a morning sit, and like, how sweaty you get yeah, exactly right. People people are you know, like peeling layers off and it's cold, and if you get sweaty, guess what, you can't sit up there as long because you're stuff sweaty and you're cold. And the style of training that running is is oftentimes a low and slow training. Will you go through the zones you like, zone zone one training, Zone two training, it's when your heart rate starts going up and up, Zone three, zone four, And then we joke around about, you know, the other zones that are out there, but zones one and two, the low and slow, the walking that that really that emphasis on just a jog, are the most beneficials beneficial and those are the ones in my experience, and too, I was like, I'm not an exercise physiologist or you know, a trainer or anything like that, but those are the zones that help you keep it under control so you don't get worked up and you're not sweating. And so if you can maintain even a slow, steady pace and you're not getting you know, overly sweaty, that's a good thing as a hunter. When it comes to being able to calm down, there is the benefit also of like that maybe target panic that those sort of things, but your your heart plays into that. So the healthier your heart is, the better your shot theoretically is going to be, so that when it does spike, it comes back down that heart rate. We don't want it to spike, you know, too much and just stay there. We want it to come back down and calm down so we can execute that shot. And so that's like the buck fever thing, but running does play into that as well. So yeah, yeah, that's my that's my thoughts. 00:23:04 Speaker 2: Yeah, it seems like I've long known and thought that the better, like we we don't all need to be Cameron Haynes. You know, Camra is just kind of like that person who everone you know that's like a what's the word, like the archetypepirational. Yeah, but as a whitetail guy or girl, you know, we don't all need to go that far. But I've always thought, man, the better physical fitness that you can be, the fewer roadblocks you're gonna have, the fewer speed bumps you're gonna have along the route to doing the very best you could. There's so many things outside of your control as a hunter, even as a whitetail hunter. There's so many different variables that are all the way out of out of your control. Every little thing that I can tweak in my favor, everything that I do have some agency over. I've always thought, man, you should try to maximize that as much as you can, because ninety percent of it still is up to mother nature and what those critters are doing out there and random chance. And there's just so many times where physical, physical obstacles can keep you from doing the right thing. If you are hiking along and you know you really should get to that back valley at the back of the chunk of public land, but you're huffing and puffing and exhausted, you're more likely to say, Oscar, I'm just going to sit here and not know execute the plan the way you wanted to, or maybe vice versa. Like you're done hunting for the day, and the right thing to do is to take the long way around so that you avoid the evening food source where all the deer are. Now that's after dark. But after the hunt, you're tired. You had the long hike in that you know earlier that day, and you're thinking, gosh, I don't want to walk two miles to get out the back way. I'm just going to walk straight to the road. Who cares, I'll spoak a bunch of deer. But I'm too darn tired. I don't want to be that person. I want to be the person that says, I got two miles. It's the right thing to do, no big deal. I've trained for this. I'm fine. I'm gonna do the right thing. 00:25:01 Speaker 3: There's so many direction Yeah, like you have that choice, and if you're you know your physical state is interfering with that, you can change it. And that's like one, that's one thing you can buy, like all the gear you can buy, have all the stuff, you can do all that, but the bottom line, like your body, what you put in is what you get out, so that input you know, as a as a hunter, and and too, It's so true. It's not not for everybody. Running is not for everybody. But I'd encourage everyone always to just be active. You know, go on a walk, and yes, campaigns is running all kinds of stuff, but shoot a walk with a with a heavy pack on your backpack, you know, the equivalent weight of your tree stand and going and getting outside and the benefits of that. Plus in the Midwest, there's so much beauty. Everything's greening up, and like you're you're in the deer woods oftentimes, Like you can get out there and you can see it, and you can learn so much by running just gives you the opportunity to learn so much of Hey, if you've got a trail system, you're hunting public land, gosh, you can pick up on a lot of patterns and that sort of stuff too. Plus you get to be out in that beautiful environment. I do know, Like running in say Wisconsin or something like that, I was like, the deer flies would always get me. So my mom's cousin she has these little sticky things that she puts on the back of her hat because she runs it like every day. She's in Wisconsin and she runs every day, And so when I'd be out there visiting them, I'd get one of those little sticky patches, and those deer flies would stick to it because I've run too slow. That's amazing. 00:26:47 Speaker 2: Anyway, But speaking of like gear other than sticky pads for your hat, one of the nice things about choosing running as one of your main training methods is like it's so accessible. You don't need to pay for gym membership right out the gate. You don't need to buy a bunch of heavy equipment. You don't need to buy any machines. I mean, if you just want to get started, you just need a pair of shoes that are half decent and you can go anywhere. Yeah, that's so, it's just so few barriers to entry. And it seems like, you know, there's a million different ways you can go when it comes to physical training for pursuit like hunting. There's many different levels of intensity you can take it. But am I right in thinking like, at least for your standard whitetail hunter who wants to establish a better base of fitness that they're not huffing and puffing when going to the stand or when hiking in or when climbing trees or anything like that. Like, it seems like cardio stuff that running is going to help you with. That's like checkbox number one that you need to hit. 00:27:49 Speaker 3: Is am I right on that? Yeah? It definitely that that your ability to your your body's ability for your muscles to take in oxygen so that you can utilize that off oxygen than any sort of cardiovascular fitness run in riding a bike and elliptical like those sort of machines that just get your heart rate up, and your heart rate doesn't have to go that high. It's a conversation pace. Honestly, if you can carry on a conversation with somebody while you're doing that exercise, that's the pace that you want to go at. That is actually the one that gives you the most benefit. I'll still put a disclaimer that I'm not an exercise physiologist or anything like that, but but having a conversation and being able to maintain that effort gives you your your body's ability to increase red blood cell count so that you can take in more oxygen so that you can adequately use that oxygen then and and it's really quite easy. So running running is that like go and it's a jog and it's slow, and that's okay. There's training blocks for for us as runners when we get like really geek out on it and we want to go for it. In the endurance space, there's zone zone two training and you don't want to go above that, so you spend all of your time running low and slow because in the long run, it pays off the most and It's kind of like with everything, like doing it slow is doing it right? Doing it slow is you know, doing it fast right. Those sort of sayings. So you've heard people say it, you know, for a long time, regardless of where you are, those types of sayings. That's that's the benefit to you of that that cardiovascular training, which, yeah, a pair of shoes, a pair of shoes that doesn't you know, hurt your feet that are comfortable when you put them on, and you can go and go get out in the morning or the afternoon or the evening and just see like this beautiful creation that we get to be you know, present in. And then you get to see it outside of hunting season too, which is which is awesome. You get to watch those seasons change. Man. So true. 00:29:57 Speaker 2: So so if someone wants to if someone's at the beginning stages of this and they're like, hey, you know what I gotta I've ran off and on, or I used to play sports in college and I've kind of drift away. Life gets busy, work gets buy. If you've got kids, whatever it is, and you've fallen off the bandwagon a little bit, what would your advice be for someone who wants to pick this up, try to develop some kind of running routine or habit to get the kind of benefits we're talking about. What do we need to do to enjoy this kind of benefit? Do I need to run fifty miles a week? Or can I get away less? Like what's that actually look like? 00:30:32 Speaker 3: Yeah? No, don't run fifty miles a week. Definitely not off the couch. You would be a crazy person if you do that, and you'll have ailments or you'll find out I can do that, and then you'll go win races. Probably. But starting small is always so important. And when it comes to I'll just say, like getting up in the morning, for instance, and going for a thirty minute walk. Heck, go for a fifteen minute walk. And if you can jog, jog for fifteen minutes and come home like I my limit that I set on my phone for Instagram each day is thirty minutes, and I hit that in no time. It's too easy. I could have got a I could have got a run in, and I could have gone a few miles actually at a ten minute mile pace, and so you could go a couple miles, you could go a few miles. But just starting and creating that habit so that you look forward to, say getting up in the morning, hearing the birds chirp because it's spring and it's wonderful out and just leaving your getting out the door and turn around and coming back and then getting up the next morning and doing it again, or getting up every other morning and doing it. But it takes you know, typically what three weeks to a month to create a habit, and so for an individual to like look forward to doing that, you don't have to get on a training plan and and just go for it big and start up in your mileage. Just just look forward to it, I would say, and go set a goal for yourself and set a small goal and then get the confidence out of reaching that goal, because it doesn't matter the miles. Like you, I ran a marathon a day. Bob Campaignes would even say it nobody cares funny, but yeah, I'm like, but but really like what matters is that you're doing that for yourself and you're getting out there. And I mean, it's nice to have a buddy an accountability partner as well. So if you if you have somebody that you know would maybe hold you accountable. My wife, like, she has a coworker who's a workout buddy and they both work out at different times of the day, but her friend, her coworker texts her every morning that she does her workout and says, I did it, And the same could go for you know, if it if it's your spouse or your kid or a friend, somebody out there would help hold you accountable and then you could encourage them to go and do that as well, which is a nice way to like, Yeah, I want to I want to wake up, I want to do this. The other piece for me is I love popping in a podcast. I'm going to listen to your podcast anyway, so why don't I move while I listen to your podcast. It's a great combo, and you know, then listen to it, listen to a book, listen to another podcast that you haven't heard of, listen to music, and kind of enjoy that as well, because it is time like you're going to spend that time anyway, so just be active while you're doing it. 00:33:39 Speaker 2: Yeah, that's there's a book that I love called Atomic Habits. But James Clear, I've talked about it. You know, listeners will know I talk about a decent bit. But uh, but the things you're talking about are right in line with like his approach. You know, attach these like positive associations to the thing. So make it easy to get started, make it fun, you know, make it something that you want to continue to doing because you've got all these other positive things attached to it. And then you know, after a month, all of a sudden, you've done it for a month now and it's been fun, and then the thing itself, you all all of a sudden start realising, hey, I'm enjoying this for the sake of it. And then it continues and it's a perpetual cycle, and it does seem you know, like anything anything fitness related, and I think running included, it comes down to consistency, right, Yeah, Like a couple of big runs is great, but a lot of medium or short runs over a long period of time, that's where you start seeing gains and improvement is when that's becomes a consistent thing that you can keep doing and keep doing, and then improvement start racking up. 00:34:44 Speaker 3: Yeah big time. And then you watch those and you do you truly look forward to once that's a habit, It's it's something that you look forward to doing that you don't want to miss out on And I'll say with running, a lot of us we're we're out west, we're Montana and Midwest. We have our seasons and so it's not like you got to run through the winter, like enjoy your enjoy your winter and when spring comes around and like go and run, because too much of one thing is always like it's always gonna bite you. Too much of one thing of just running all the time, I mean, it comes around more and like I'm so obsessive about this that other parts of my life are falling apart. So the running is a problem. But but but you don't have to you don't have to run year round. Like it's something that you can pick up, you can turn into training for a hunting season. I was like, there's a lot of people now that are they're getting ready for the Turkey Woods, and they're and they're getting into a fitness routine to get ready for turkey season, which who would have thought like somebody would actually do that, But they know because they're on their feet a bit more, they're walking, they're covering ground, and and they want to be able to, you know, not be overly sweaty. They want to be able to execute a shot as well. And so we see that in the in the turkey hunter population that there are actually people out that are going, hey, I want to lose some weight because I don't want to be lugging this around. And I love hunting turkeys, which is amazing. 00:36:22 Speaker 2: Yeah, so when it comes to like making it fun, yeah, you know, fun enough that you keep wanting to do it that you start seeing these things. I've ran on the road for I don't know, at least a decade, fifteen years, you know, out of college. I was kind of a bum for the first five years of full time work, just like I was very focused on work and just did not I guess I take that back. I guess I've been running ever since college, just just off and on. I'll have periods where I'm doing it and I know I need to do it, and then I kind of fall off the bandwagon. Then I get back on it, and it's been off and on, and I think it's always been one of those things that for me was like it felt like an obligation, like I knew I should do it. I felt good after I did it, but that the actual on the ground time I wasn't always enjoying until I started leaving the road and going to trails. And since I kind of somehow, I don't know how this surprises me because I love hiking. That's been like one of my favorite things to do is go hike. So for some reason, I'm so dumb that I didn't realize that going a little bit faster on a trail would also be fun. So since I moved my running from the road to the trail, my excitement about it and like my my actual enjoyment in the moment has gone up by like ten x, just because I'm not worried about cars. I'm not worried about you know, just staring at the road or houses, I can actually immerse myself in nature and you're taking in the trees and the scenes and the ups and downs, and you're crossing streams and you're smelling everything around you. I'm seeing deer and turkeys, and all of a sudden, it's you know, as you mentioned, it's like it is a natural world immersion kind of thing and a physical benefit that you're enjoying all at the same time. So for people that are taking that jump shifting from like road running or running at the track or running on the treadmill, and now they want to take it to the trails and they're maybe you know, hillier, more elevation, single track stuff, mixed terrain. You know, this year was when I finally got more serious about that side of things, and so I've been trying to like, you know, one of the first things I started thinking about when I realized I was going to be doing more of this was like, am I gonna blow out my ankles? 00:38:31 Speaker 3: Like? 00:38:31 Speaker 2: Am I gonna be tripping and falling all the time? Like there's all these little things that never thought about when running that all of a sudden, I am What are what, in your opinion, are the most important things that a new trail runner needs to be thinking about. That's that's different than just taking a jog around the neighborhood. 00:38:47 Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah. Road running is its own version of difficult because of the beating that your body takes running on pavement. So shoes are like a big help there, just a good pair of shoes on on the roads. But when you switch over to trails, you are working on uneven terrain, so your shoes are important there as well. More grip so you get a trail running shoe, something that's comfortable, but there isn't like a lot of ankle support in those shoes. They're a pair of running shoes, so don't expect them to be a pair of hunting boots. But even a pair of hunting boots, you don't want to have weak ankles. So trail running in that consistency is going to naturally strengthen your joints. It's going to strengthen your ankles. Over time, you're going to get stronger. That's why starting small is so important, because you want to give yourself a base. You want to give yourself a foundation, and you want to build on that. And a strength regiment for a trail runner is really crucial along with mobility because those those sort of ailments will manifest themselves. My case in point is that trail run that I did, that very first one that I ever signed up for. I really couldn't walk after that, Like I was so stoved up, and I learned about these things that we have and our bodies called our it bands ilio tibial band. Yeah, that runs like it's very very long. It runs from like your back all the way down to your ankles and I have excruciating pain after that, so it's it's like too much, too fast. And then I learned all about how important stretching was and how you can combat these things by stretching. And then that strength portion is your durability. So your muscles, they're they're here to protect your joints, and so if you have strong muscles, then they are going to do their job in protecting your joints. And that's really really valuable as a trail runner too. So and it doesn't have to be a crazy you don't have to buy a whole bunch of equipment all that sort of stuff to have a strength regiment. You know, Lunges are awesome, Squat jumps are fantastic. Anybody can do core, so we can do planks instead of set any time, like we're just going back to high school days of you know what we're doing. We're running and that's simple. Those simple fundamentals really do work quite well. And if you do have a backpack, putting weight on your back is really beneficial as well. You're not going to want to run a long distance with that weight in your pack, certainly if you're starting out, but it does help condition your body and get it ready for and adapt to those trail conditions. 00:41:41 Speaker 2: Yeah, well you didn't do it yourself, so I'll do it for you. I gotta plug what you guys have got over at Mountain Tough, because you know, I was able to use the I think it was the Mountain Foundations course over the last couple of months leading into this most recent race I just did. 00:42:09 Speaker 3: And you know it's it was. 00:42:11 Speaker 2: I'm not I'm not a guy that loves the gym. I like being outside doing stuff, and so I've never been a person that's like all about the machines and stuff. So body weight has been usually the thing that I found like fit me most and and your body Weight Foundation's course has been really good. 00:42:28 Speaker 3: Like I've enjoyed it. 00:42:29 Speaker 2: I felt, you know, it helps out there, the mobility, the core stuff. You know, I just did this. I did a half marathon trail race last weekend and just felt like a breeze, even compared to the last couple I did in which I thought I trained a lot, just a different level. And I don't know all the things I can attribute that to, but I have to believe that becoming more well rounded has helped with that and and yeah, so so highly recommend that that's it. 00:42:58 Speaker 3: It's super cool. It's and just that you notice that there's a difference. And yes, it's more trail time. Ultimately you're spending more time on the trail, so you're going to feel better. But the strength component in how you recover, that's really big for me. Like I know when as I was running and my body was starting to break down, because that does happen with runners. Now most coaches will recommend a strength routine. They want they want their runners to do some sort of strength, not just run all the time. So that image that you have in your mind of somebody that's rail thin and and really fast, like, yes, those people are out there, but you're even seeing that change too because because the strength programs that are out there are getting better and better, and so for like a body weight foundation program, it's really simple. It doesn't require any gear. It's just different movements that you do on a cadence and you've created that habit, so you roll it into your train, you roll it into your running, and then you walk away from that race going gosh, I'm not so devastated. It was really fun. Bottom line, it was really fun. And I'm going to look forward to the next one, and I know that this is gonna manifest itself in other areas positively for me. Yeah, man, it is a. 00:44:23 Speaker 2: It's, for lack of a better term, just a really good feeling when you're out doing an event like that. And like I said, I've never been. 00:44:34 Speaker 3: An elite athlete. 00:44:34 Speaker 2: I'm not an elite athlete, but I'm going by so many people that seem like they're miserable and struggling, and I'm just feeling great and just going along the whole thing. I just kept thinking to myself, like, man, like this is why you trained like this, feeling right here, Like ninety five percent of everyone you're going by just seems like they're in hell, and I am enjoying myself flying up the hills like struggling. I'm just going at my easy, good pace and kind of crushing it. And and I'm not, like I'm not the guy that crushes sports usually, but this like like I can now I can do that. And that was like very encouraging to see, like you put in the work, it pays. 00:45:16 Speaker 3: Off, yeah, big time. And and yeah, that is that is a testament to what you're doing. And how curious you are about it as well. But I like the big thing for you as you're going through this and anyone else is like, these are enjoyable experiences that you wouldn't do otherwise. They just happen to have the benefit in the in the hunting realm too. So I always have that in the back of my mind. It's like, as I go into this, uh, yes, maybe I won't have as much at a post tissue on my body when I go into winter, so I'm gonna be a little bit more cold. But but you could even do something. You could do something for that. You could enjoy the running seat and then be okay with consuming maybe some of those fats and having a little bit of insulation. One of my good running buddies always said that as we're going into winter, he's like bears hibernate and we are mammals, And he would just remind me of that, because sometimes runners can get really obsessive about these crazy things, and that's when it's too much. That's when it's taking over your life and it's destructive. But by and large, we're made to move and moving through the terrain, our local topography, regardless of where you are. It's really cool. Whenever I go to a city, I love to go try to take a run and check out that city, you know, early in the morning. Something that is I'm way out of my element, right, Like I love running on trails, but to go and see that wherever you are its own sort of beautiful for sure. And I just know the Midwest and the trails systems that are out there. I met a long time ago. I met some guys from They were outside d C in Virginia and they were trail runners, and I've talked to them enough that I was like, I have to go see your guys' country. They're like, come and do a trail race. And so I found one. You know, just look look up online. There's trail races all over the place. And I and I went and did one outside of d C. And it ran across, you know, along the Potomac, and there's all the history and everything there, and I just I would never see this otherwise, and I would never see this this quickly. Granted I'm not moving fast because I'm not an elite athlete whatsoever. I just enjoy being out there and you know, high fiving people, seeing seeing the different culture that exists in the running community because it's so positive, like it's it's you're inundated with positivity, and there's few places in this world where you get that much positivity that quickly. True. 00:47:50 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, And you know it's funny we're bringing we're talking races now, and races kind of for me began as a thing to maintain my habit, like to maintain the practice. So like I originally sign up for my first race because you know, as I alluded at the beginning, like I've been running off and on forever, but I never stuck with it consistently. I'd always kind of fall off in the fall, and then that we continue through the winter, and then like spring would come around and I pick it up a little bit, but then I go on you know, vacation, and then it's just like that, and I finally realized, like I need a stick, like I need you know, the carrot and the stick method, right, I need a stick like hanging over me in the future that's going to be looming and if I don't run, if I do not train, I'm going to have my tail whooped by this race in six months or something. So That's why I originally signed up for my first race, was just to have that incentive, to have that thing coming down the line that's going to keep me honest, it's going to keep me going. And then I did it, and then all of a sudden, like it's slowly molded into something that I'm not just doing because it's going to force me to train, but now it's becoming something I'm actually enjoying. But there's a there's a lot of people that I think are having that same discovery now, Like this is a very unscientific method of analysis, but of like all the things that I post about on social media, my audience is like hunting and fishing and conservation, Like that's the kind of stuff I usually write about or post about. But when I throw on running stuff now, I probably have more engagement in questions and interest about running than I do about any of those things. 00:49:26 Speaker 3: Like it blows up. 00:49:28 Speaker 2: So there's a lot of latent interest within the outdoor community about getting into this stuff, and I'm seeing more and more people signing up for trail runs, signing it for ultra runs, marathons, half marathons, like lots and lots of people I think are kind of discovering this now. And I don't know what that's about exactly, but it definitely seems like there is a growing movement of people realizing like, man, this is a thing that's worth my time. 00:49:52 Speaker 3: Are you are you seeing that? 00:49:53 Speaker 2: Is that just my am I just noticing it because I'm getting into it myself or is there that kind of thing going on at a. 00:49:59 Speaker 3: Large Definitely, No, we definitely notice it at Mountain Tough. It's incredible when people do start creating a habit and changing, you know, their fitness routine and getting into something. For us, we really see a lot of them start Mountain Tough and then naturally they get to a point where they're they're like, I'm I want to sign up for a trail race? Can you help? Can you help me with the plan? And and we don't have any like running specific plans, but we we do have great programs to help with the strength piece. And then there's running incorporated into them. And I tell everybody, I'm like, go sign up for it. You can, you can absolutely do this, So there's more interest there. It is a it is a timing thing, you know, count hunting, and it's all of its popularity and having that date or deadline out there of hunting seasons coming whatever, whatever season you're looking forward to, like it's all like you're always preparing for it, and so us as individuals as hunters, I think that putting something on the agenda and having something else to look forward to and that that way, shape or form and fitness is just ti tying into that now. So that's I think a lot of it is You're right, you need that carrot dangled in front of you. Hunting season is always that, but it comes around once a year, right, so it takes a long time to get to it. So having another one of those milestones is really valuable. And I think the accessibility, like regardless of where you are, there's races going on, there's local races, and so it's not the yeah, the running is going to beat you up and ruin your joints and all that is like there's data out there to prove otherwise for sure. And the longevity piece I think plays into us as hunters when we look at conservation and what we're doing. I just always go back to want to be able to do this for as long as possible. I want to be able to enjoy this with my family and my friends, and I want to be able to set this say it's the public lands and the opportunity that we have out there. I'm like, let's just do this for a longer period of time. So running in cardiovascular health hopefully like things happen. Certainly I could keel over tomorrow from a heart attack, but I'm going to do my part not too so that I can continue to do what I love for as long as possible. And I don't care to live forever, but I just I always admire those individuals that are older and that are still really really active, and oftentimes they tend to be those ones. I met a guy at a tactical officers deal that I was at here a couple of days ago up in Helena, and his name was Ron and he was seventy two and he worked on Fort Harrison and he was, yeah, just a really one of those cool guys. It's his retirement gig and whatnot. And he's like, oh, yeah, I don't I don't need a fitness app. I was like, yeah, doesn't look like doesn't look like you do, and he's like, no, I walk. I walk every day. I'm like, really, how much do you walk every day? He's like six to ten miles every day. I just I went, holy smokes man, that's the stuff I geek out on because those type of individuals. And then he proceeded to show me. He was like, yeah, I track it all and I do do all these things, and I'm like, that's so cool. So in my heart I like that. I know that there's a Midwest guy out there. It's like a traditional bowhunter that's running these races that nobody knows about, and I'm like, that's the guy that I want to meet. I want to I want to meet. I want to hear stories from that individual because I know that they're out there and they're out out West and they're in our trail running community and stuff too. So there there are those individuals. But when it comes to whitetail hunting, I was like, I know it'd be cool, it'd be cool interview for me to do. I was like, I want to find that. So maybe there's somebody out there. Your listeners will definitely know somebody that's out there that's doing doing trail races and is hunting well into their seventies and eighties I'm sure that there are. 00:54:11 Speaker 2: Well, it's it's it was so funny, Like even at that race I was at last weekend, I had four or five different people come up to me that that recognized me from my work, like just in like a very short little window when I got to the finish line. So like that is like a very small sample size of telling you how many of our kind of people are doing this stuff already. 00:54:32 Speaker 3: To have that many folks is telling So it's so cool. So so on this. 00:54:39 Speaker 2: Race thing, you know, I have loved it. I'm getting more and more into it as we talked about. One of the things I've thought about is like what's the progression of distance? Like I'm the type who when I get into something, I go hard and I go deep. And I've already been reading and thinking about like one hundred mile races and that kind of crazy stuff. Yeah, but what's like, what is like a safe or responsible or smart progression of distance. So I've done half marathon so far, I've signed up for a thirty I'm doing a thirty k this summer. But then I'm thinking, okay, so I did a thirty k like serious trail run this summer. The way these races are broken. It's not like you can do a thirty k and then you can do a thirty four K and then you can do a. 00:55:24 Speaker 3: Thirty eight k. 00:55:24 Speaker 2: It's like thirty K or fifty K or do you want to go fifty miles or one hundred miles? There's the big jumps. So how like what should I be thinking on that? 00:55:37 Speaker 4: Like? 00:55:37 Speaker 2: Could I do a fifty k next year? Is that insane? Should I do thirty k's for a couple of years? Should I go from a thirty to a full marathon? 00:55:45 Speaker 3: Like? How do you think about that kind of thing? We trail run? Is it? It's its own unique beast And like a marathon, a marathon is its own beast too, because you're running all out that fast or ting to run that fast on pavement for twenty six miles, right, So it's its own form of difficult trail races and the distance. This is one of those things for me, and I'll speak from my experience. And then two like, my experience is based on my community and people that are around me, and I asked them these questions. I have asked them these questions for forever. So when it comes to a thirty k. Typically you're going to run a thirty k a little bit faster, like you're gonna push yourself in a thirty k because subconsciously you know that it's not that far. So if you can come to terms of running a thirty k, then naturally you're starting to look at other races out there, and you can. It's not crazy to want to run a fifty k because that's the next one, and you're right like, that's like the next offering that's out there. A fifty k. You're not going to run all out as fast as you run in a thirty k. You're going to pace yourself like that's the beauty of training. And that's where I'll go back to, like right away pitching this to some guys that are drinking beers and having burgers in the bar. It's like, you have that mental fortitude, I know, because you're a hunter, Like I know you have it, and if you want to, you could go do a fifty k guaranteed. And a fifty k is a fun distance because it is a little bit further and you get a little bit more time to experience everything out there. Your body will go through a few other things that you wouldn't go through in a thirty k because now we're talking calories, we're talking the nutrition that you need, the more of the hydration, so you can't wing it necessarily in a fifty k. From there, then we go up to a fifty miler, which is a little different training style, and then you'll see a hundred ks. So the hundred k distance is really fun because your average pace is about the time you're going to finish in because it's essentially sixty miles, so it's it's this funny race that you just keep an eye on your average pace and that's how long it's going to take you to finish, which is incredibly eye opening as a hunter of how much time it takes to get from one point A to point B while you're so locking. Can you explain that? 00:58:25 Speaker 2: So you're saying that if your average pace is like twenty minutes a mile, you're going to finish in twenty hours? 00:58:30 Speaker 3: Is that right? Twenty hours? Yeah? Essentially, I'm like the hundred k for me was I was just like, I can't believe this. And then the further you get in the race, the slower you're going, and the like the sooner you want to finish, but it just doesn't happen because your average is your average. The math doesn't lie when it comes down to it. And then you go up from there and there's crazy people are going so many crazy distances. But we can and and if you're inclined to do it, you you should, you should experience it. I will put that with the caveat don't let it take over your life. Don't let it, you know, like take away so much from your time with your family and all that kind of stuff, because that's not worth it. But if you do want, if you do want to go for it, I was like, we are totally capable. I The crazy thing for me as a as a Western hunter is when I realize that it alk needs to lay down in rifle season and al needs to lay down and recover. Should you bump one, you can just walk and you'll catch up to them. Like it's it'll take you a little while, and it's gonna be through some steep, nasty terrain, but you will catch up to them because they have to recover. In us, as humans, we don't we are able to continue walking and walking and recovering while we're doing that. So we don't have to like sit down and rest necessarily. Now for cardio vascular health, isn't that great, We do have to sit down and rest, But us as a as a hunter, I was like, that's an eye opening thing. White tails are totally different. I'm not saying you're gonna walk down a white tail because you do not want to do that. They'll be they'll be gone, they're they're you know, that's the beauty of white tail hunting. But just knowing that even on that topic, you can blood trail one for as long as you need to blood trail at four yeah, I'm like, yeah, yeah, I'm not giving up. 01:00:26 Speaker 2: So and actually, you know there are guys out specifically the Northeast. They'll track them in the snow, they'll walk them down in the snow out there. So it is a thing in certain regions. Yes, so yes, this would be very good for that. 01:00:40 Speaker 3: And they drag them out too. Yeah, that's like the tradition, drag them out. Yeah, it's a heck of an endeavor. 01:00:48 Speaker 4: Oh my gosh. 01:01:00 Speaker 2: So, so you mentioned something that has been one of my struggles, which was, you know, time away from family, right, Like I've I've I'm already gone a lot for work, and I'm unique compared to some people and that, like I travel a lot for work, but I'm already going to be gone, you know, six seven, eight weeks a year traveling for work, and then you know, just daily work seems to take a lot. And then I've got other hobbies too, Like I'm really into fishing and I've got all that kind of stuff. So I've always felt like I felt bad adding another time suck into the world. And so when I was training for like doing these first races, I was doing it early in the morning and still would feel like, you know, on the weekends, I got to do like a you know, two hours or so away to do a run, and that was sucking into a Saturday or Sunday morning with a family. And when I was thinking about jumping from half marathon to marathon, one of the first things I thought about was like, gosh, how much more training time will that be? 01:01:59 Speaker 3: Do I need to be you know? 01:02:00 Speaker 2: Does that mean every Sunday I'm gone five hours or something or four hours? Do I really want to do that and be gone longer? What kind of advice do you have for someone who's in a similar situation in which they want to do something longer. They want to do a marathon or thirty k or fifty k or one hunter miler or whatever the thing is, but they're trying to figure out, like, how do I balance this with family and other obligations. Do I need to run for four hours every single day? Or is it not that much. 01:02:29 Speaker 3: I'll speak from my experience here as well, because as I really fell in love with running and then went over the top on signing up for all the races I had just started off on my wife, we had our first kid, and there was a period of time in there which was awesome. Once he was sleeping through the night and I could go and run and it was just my time, Like I got I got out, I did that, I was able to come back, and then we had a second and then I was quite obsessive about the time on my feet. But it was really really cute. I'd just get up earlier and i'd get back home on say a Saturday morning, they'd be waking up, make pancakes, do all that stuff, and they'd say, you know, dad, daddy, how was your run? And I just love that because I know that that's making an impact on them and they're seeing that. Now I wasn't gone all day long, but I was making it back in time, and that's a period of time for my life that I was like, it was really evident to me that I was making a memory for them that was impactful and it was active, it was fitness focused. But they would ask me about how my run was, and then they would go to these races and my wife would be at the finish line with the boys and they just get to cheer me on and next thing you know, they'd come up the trail and they'd run to the finish line with me. And those sort of memories are are so impactful for both of my boys, me and my wife as well of just setting that example of you can go and do these hard things I did them. I was the example. I'm at this point in life where I'm older and I'm finding that I love this. So you're you're just along for the ride. But they just would geek out on it and it would just you know, for me as a dad, that's the most special thing. And what a carrot in front of you When your kids are there and they're watching you, you know they're they're seeing all of that. So that comes back to now that my kids are runners or anything, but they don't like mine. Like even at eleven K with my older boy when he was nine, he was like, I kind of want to do that, and I was like, let's sign up and do it. Like we got a little hydration pack and all that. So setting that example is the one piece. But yes, then when you train further distances, you're gonna want naturally spend more time on your feet. And for me, that's where I supplemented in more of a strength program and less time on my feet because I was seeing it where it was such draw when you train for one hundred miler you do have to run quite a bit. But where I saw my balance come into play was adding more of the strength then, so I'm getting that durability. I'm building some muscle to protect everything. And yeah, time on my feet might not make me the faster runner out there, but I'm dying sure, very very durable, and I can make it that distance. And so those are the sort of things where I just rolled in more of a strength routine. It doesn't take a whole bunch, It doesn't take a whole bunch of gym equipment, you know, kettlebell, dumbbell, cooler to step up on, and you can add in that one hour, say even forty minute training block of strength that will pay dividends when you run. And so for me, with a busy life and all of that, that's where I was like, I just started blending the strength. And it was really cool too because Dustin who he started Mountain Tough, he was a big time runner, and we saw it correlate to hunting. Actually, we saw where the strength supplement helped. It helped in hunting. He did primarily, but then I started seeing that, you know the benefit of that when I stepped into the Elk woods, because I was more equipped to put a pack on and carry it. And that was a byproduct of running and not spending as much time out there and spending more time at home. So little bit more strength and a little bit less time. And then anytime you're traveling that sort of stuff, just embrace it and go for a run, go see the sites, go hit a trail. That's an awesome thing to get to do. And you're on the road anyway. 01:06:49 Speaker 2: Yeah, better sitting in a hotel room. 01:06:52 Speaker 3: Absolutely, even a Hotel Gym was like, yeah, go outside. 01:06:57 Speaker 2: Now, what about training for elevation? You know, I mean that in my case, like my next race at thirty k we're talking about that's like fifty seven hundred feet of elevation gain or something like that. I mean, that's gonna be It sounds like a beast to me at least. And we're going basically going to the top of the t Town range and then back down. But I live in Michigan and there's not a whole lot of hills here comparable to them. So what are some of things folks could do to train for elevation, whether it be a trail race that they signed up for they're going to travel across the country to go do, or you know, training for an outcome they've got coming up and they want to run and they want to do some stuff that's going to help them prepare for that too. 01:07:38 Speaker 3: Yep, this will this will go back to the amount of oxygen that your muscles can can take in. So your muscles, that's your VO two max and the volume of oxygen that you are able to get to your lungs ultimately, and the better that you can and equip yourself to have a high VO two max, the better you're going to do at elevation. And that goes back to the conversational pace running. That low and slow style of running is really a big benefit when it comes to helping increase your VO two max. And there's other things that you can do in the running space to there's studies out there too of certain distances like track work and that sort of thing that will help increase your VO two max. But when it comes to a mountain trail race with a whole bunch of vert that vertical climb and descent that you're going to go through, the benefit to you of having really strong quads, glutes, hamstrings, core is that's unparalleled, so your ability to tax your quads. But you can tax your quads like right now, if you were to do ten lunge jumps, one each side, your quads will be on fire doing ten lunch jumps. And even for me, I was like, and I live out here and I can go up a steep trail whenever, but but your quads take a beating, especially on the descent. So having strong legs all around, and I will say quad dominant because that's the downhill that's your deceleration, and but you don't want to forget your glutes and your hamstrings as well, and that's where that strength element comes into place. So you know, box step ups, that sort of stuff, lunge jumps, air squats. We do a bunch of wall sits in a lot of our programs too, and so like, well, I burned your quads, but you sustain that. And so those are the sort of things that you can take in to then that trail race and say, hey, yes, my legs are gonna hurt, but at least I've done this work ahead of time, so I've prepped them. I've kind of been experiencing that painful quad burn, glute burn, all of that stuff ahead of time, so that when I'm in the race, I'm taking in more of the scenery and the race itself, as opposed to say, and I'm devastated right now. Yeah. Yeah. 01:10:07 Speaker 2: My three days a week, my four year old doesn't have preschool in the morning, so he's just with me. Uh and so a couple of different times I've been home with him in the morning and I'm gonna do my Foundation's strength workout and I have to do those damn wall sits, and I'll be in the living room back against the wall and I'm like ah, and I'm like kind of cussing silently inside my head. 01:10:35 Speaker 3: Walk it was like, what's the matter? 01:10:36 Speaker 4: Dad? 01:10:36 Speaker 3: Why are you so mad? Right now? 01:10:38 Speaker 2: I'm making faces? 01:10:40 Speaker 3: Amazing you tried doing this, Colt. You'll see he's gonna come and stand on your quads the next right, Yeah, how's this dead? 01:10:49 Speaker 2: It's funny though. You talked about how the kids see you and kind of want to do it too. So they've you know, they've seen me that come to my races and stuff like that, and they've been like interest in, they cheer me on and all that kind of stuff. And I found some little film on YouTube about someone doing a hundred mile race and they washed it. And now whenever they see me put on my shoes, they're. 01:11:09 Speaker 3: Like, can we go on a hundred mile race too? 01:11:11 Speaker 2: They think I'm going off for a one hundred mile race every time I go out running, and so sometimes they want to go and do one hundred mile race. And so what they do is they put on my watch and they put on their like hiking shoes or basketball shoes, and they'll run laps around our living room and every lap they'll say, Daddy, look at the look at the watch. Have I got one hundred miles yet? How far have I gone? 01:11:30 Speaker 3: And so far? 01:11:32 Speaker 2: My six year old did two miles and laps around the living room once, so he just kept going and going and going. 01:11:38 Speaker 3: So it was pretty funny. That's amazing, Like just to see your kids gravitate towards something like that because of what you modeled. It's amazing. But that's a job well done and so cool that they laugh about one hundred mile because they have no contact, no idea, but in their mind, I'm like, it's a big deal. They're crush from there. So cool. 01:12:02 Speaker 2: So you talked about training specifically for like some of those things like coming down off the hill. You know, the descent is going to be really impacting your quads and stuff. What about like actual I don't know if techniques the right word, but like when I'm when I'm running this first really big mountain run this coming year this summer, you know, walking all the hills, what degree hill? Should I walk? When should I run? When should I walk? Should I I mean as far as like tactics on the trail, I've read stuff about like when you're descending. There's some people that just seem to do big strides and just like fly down the hill, and there's other people do like short fast steps running down the hill. 01:12:44 Speaker 3: Do you have any thoughts on like actual. 01:12:46 Speaker 2: Technique or or approach to actually being there on the trail and running in a way that's going to be effective. 01:12:54 Speaker 3: There's there's a few things when it comes to to mountain running and that you're you're coming out in middle More, you have rocky, rooty trails. Oftentimes it's fast footwork that's gonna be the benefit that you you come to that race with because you have those technical trails, maybe they're muddy. That sort of technical piece is really important. So that's the that's your ankles, that's your knees, your calves as well. So when it comes to technique, it's just your running form. I'm like, you're you're gonna have running form on a flat road, but then you're gonna be it's gonna all break down and you're gonna be hiking. Honestly, there are people out there I'll throw I'll throw Chester Floyd out there because you know Chester, yeah, and he he's an absolute phenom when it comes to running really like he he there's a few people out here that I know can run up these really steep faces. Chester is one of those individuals. He can like literally run, but it's the same speed at which maybe a little faster than me, but same speed at which a lot of people are hiking. So you have a longer stride, you can lean into that stride and you can hike because each step you're going to be going a lot further than if you were to pitter patter and run along. But Chester is one of those individuals. He could pitter patter and just run all the way to the top of things, and then he can just descend. But he has a shorter stride as well. Also he's an incredible athlete too, So I've never seen somebody climb and descend, especially descend as fast as he does. But for you with a larger stride, just lean into that and do that hike. And you get that from hunting. A lot of people will use like running style trekking poles in those races, and that's a great thing too, to keep your your body upright, so then you're opening up your lungs more and you can you can use those poles to kind of help fight the fatigue, and us as hunters, like we use them a lot. But in the trail running world they're getting more and more popular. Sometimes some of those races don't allow them. If there's a whole bunch of people that they don't allow the poles. But you could look into that and see if that's something. But like leaning into that and putting your hands on your quads when you're in that race and pushing off your quads just as like my arms are helping me a little bit, but your stride and that like it, your stride alone will be a big benefit to you in that race when you go to the climbing portion that the descent, Like it's hard not to be on your heels when you descend, but oftentimes that's just the lack of quad strength as well. So you kind of want to I oftentimes think of it like skiing when you're going downhill. Just have a little bit of flow when you're running downhill, enjoy it like there's cool little trails and rocks, and you know, try to look at your where your feet are going and have that fast footwork. You know you'll be fatigued all of that, but enjoy it and let your arms you know, float out on your side as as balance goes, because you'll probably take a stumble here and there and it's rocky and nasty. It's gonna be up high, so you're gonna want to You're gonna want to have good balance, and that kind of goes back to them that strength portion as well. It's like, yeah, you hear everything, everything's really stable, and that'll help you on the descent as well. 01:16:31 Speaker 2: It's funny when you talk about descent. I found myself when I'm going down Now, these aren't as big as hills as you guys have out there, but when I'm going down the bigger hills here as I've been training, I find myself thinking about those Hoka commercials like whether like fly Human Fly. So I'm like running down the hill and then my hems fly Human Fly, and it kind of like just enjoying it, just like kind of like like I'm riding a bike down a mountain kind of and just like letting momentum while trying to you know, have good good form going down and not tripping on something, but the same time like kind of having fun with like that extra little something when you're going down. 01:17:06 Speaker 3: Yeah, that's interesting because I think of yeah, skiing or mountain biking and how flowy the trails are. And then when you have a really get a good pair of cushion shoes and enjoy that cushion like it's there. It's there for a reason, and if it lets you flow a little bit more and lets you cruise along. I think it's would be funny if you were to like watch a video of a bunch of people coming downhill at a race, like we all think we're going really fast and we're out of control, but it's actually quite slow. Probably, right. 01:17:41 Speaker 2: Okay, So you think I could do a fifty k next year, Let's hypothetical, say if I could do a thirty k fifty five vert, there's a fifty k in the same area, that would be like a little over six vert or something, and then be fifty k. 01:17:57 Speaker 3: Yeah. 01:17:57 Speaker 2: As far as training wise, bumping up from train for a thirty up to a fifty something like that, anything off the top of your head that you would change dramatically with that jump or is it kind of the same thing but. 01:18:09 Speaker 3: A little bit longer. Yeah, you won't have to you won't have to run as fast training for the fifty k, so you dial dial back the speed at what you're training just a little bit. You're gonna want you're going to be doing more vertical so you're gonna be climbing more and descending more. So that's where you're going to want to make sure and double down on the strength portion of that. And yes, it is it's a little bit more time on your feet, but it's not that much more time on your feet from a thirty to fifty. But in my experience, yeah, you're not running as fast in a fifty k. You got to pace it out so you can enjoy that as part of the training and do a lot of that Zone two which then will pay off should pay off in your hunts. That's where you'd probably notice it too. 01:18:56 Speaker 2: Yeah, So another piece of all this that I've started thinking about is once you start getting that distance or even further, And I think this this ties into folks who are gonna be doing big elk hunts or mountain hunts as well as like thinking about nutrition. 01:19:24 Speaker 3: How do you fuel yourself so. 01:19:26 Speaker 2: You can maintain your you know, pace or whatever is you're trying to do. For four or five, six, seven, eight, ten hours. Walk me through like what you're thinking about when making decisions on how you're going to fuel yourself on a long run like this. There's a thousand different things out there, I've come to find out as I've been researching and trying things out myself. But what's what's the West and Paul approach to fuel during a long distance run? 01:19:57 Speaker 3: I love snacks in trail running, and races in particular, have so many snacks that's a carrot out in front of me that I'm like, oh my goodness, I'm looking forward to what snacks they have. But they'll set up all the tables at the aid stations and you have your pick of gummy bears and m and ms and potato chips and all this stuff. It's kind of junk food, honestly at a lot of trail races. But your body is when you're in a race, your body is using everything that you can throw at it because you're burning so many calories at such a fast rate. So you can snack on a lot of that stuff. However, the thing that you don't hear about a lot is the stomach issues that you get when you throw a bunch of junk you down your throat in a race, and then stuff comes back to bite you. So the further the distance the race, the more you're going to experience that. So maybe not in a thirty k or shorter distance race, or you're going to experience the gia shoes, but you definitely will experience those should you do it incorrectly in a longer race. And nutrition, Like, it's more and more popular to kind of dive into nutrition us as hunters. We have wild game and so much of it, and we're on that path like, hey, we're harvesting this, we're putting good things in our body, and we're looking forward to having those meals in a race. You can always bring your own snacks, but you want a lot of carbohydrates. There's people to like in There's all kinds of diets out there. There's people that follow this, that and everything. And I've pretty much tried everything as well, because I've just I get curious and I'm like, huh, I'll see if that works and if that works. But a well rounded diet and day in and day out is so important because you're getting everything that you need. And in a race it's important to think of it as as the same, Like I want to be well rounded in what I'm doing, and so you bring your snacks along. You'll have a lot of carbohydrates, You'll have a lot of sugars, and then you're gonna want the proteins and fats as well, because you're proteins and fats those are your slow burn. Those are the ones that give you the law, like that endurance over the long run, that longevity during a race, Like your proteins and fats are really important. You can't just survive on carbs alone, and you can't survive on sugars alone. Sugars in particular are the ones that will blow your stomach up. So it's like a layering system of snacks when you're in a race, and you can start out with a good breakfast or a good dinner the night before. People carbload. I think that's just a common running thing, is like to carbload. But actually, if you haven't been consuming car carbs to that extent, it's not a good idea to carbload. Like if you've been running and you're watching your health and you're watching what you eat, you're probably not consuming that many carbs, so to carbload the night before is actually a bad idea. And well, one of my buddies, Nick, we have he had like spicy elk sausage and made pasta and and I was still like, we still tease him about that because I was like, there's no way I'm going to eat that the night before a race. He said, he suffered. But but if you think about it, with the blend of those, there's so many great resources out there now, or there's so many great nutrition supplements that sort of thing that you can get for running. In particular, I gravitate towards more of the natural ones with the fewest ingredients in them, and so they make awesome gels now they're called spring Energy. They're they're they're so good. I actually look forward to to consuming those and any of them them that I have left over, they go right in my hunting pack and I'll use them like they're actually that good. And so those are you know, like like rice is carbohydrate component, and then natural sugars from fruit and that sort of stuff. You can still have your your snacks. A long time ago, I ran a race and there's an older gentleman in front of me, and he didn't have like the pack and all the stuff that a lot of us racers had, and so I was naturally curious and I kind of caught up to him and and he had a little handheld water bottle and I was like, what do you do for nutrition? And he's like, well, I got like trail mix in my pocket, and I was like, do you think about trail mix? It is actually that blend. That's why trail mix exists because it's that blend. And so I'm like, I'll copy that. So I love trail mix like it's a it's a good go to. It has a blend, a little bit of everything. You got the protein from the nuts and stuff that's in there, and the fats from those, So those are the slow burn your body will tap into those. But the big thing is that you just want to stay on a cadence. So oftentimes people will set a watch or set your phone to go every forty five minutes to an hour to remind yourself to eat and drink because you won't want to, Like, if you feel really good in a race, you're like, I'm not hungry, And the longer the race, the more you want to put that aside and say, I know you, my mind says that I'm not hungry right now, but actually I do need to fuel, and so making sure that you get that on a routine basis is what allows you to finish well in a lot of those races. I had one race a number of years ago where I was just like stumbling. I was just stumbling along my nutrition. I was dehydrated, and they've been making bacon at this aid station, and I just remember having a couple slices of bacon and it took me about another yeah, about forty minutes or so, and that stuff kicked in and I came back to life and I was like, that's the slow burn, you know, fat and protein that you get from bacon. And I just I was like, oh, I'm so glad I got that. And I came back to life and finished the race. And not because it was just bacon that maybe finished, but I felt that impact that it had on my body at that time. 01:26:09 Speaker 2: Well, I've done like so much reading now about you know, all this kind of stuff, and there's so many examples and stories I've heard where people will have that kind of thing happened, where something they ate or drank at an aid station or something they remember they had in their pack. All of a sudden, it brings them back to life, like they're totally bonking, and then they had a second set of wheels. And yeah, sometimes at I sometimes would have thought that's like overblown, but it seems like it's not. And speaking of Bacon, this last race, I told myself I had no time goal. It was like, hey, I just want to like this is my first like relatively hilly one like single track trial run race. It's like I just want to finish its training round. Let's just like do good, you know, natural pace, and just stop at the ad station, see what's there. 01:26:58 Speaker 3: Have some fun with it. 01:27:00 Speaker 2: Because the last race I did, I was like trying to at a time goal, and so I was like I'm not stopping, I'm just burning right through. So this time around, I was gonna enjoy it a little bit. But as soon as I started going, and then as soon as I started like passing a lot of people, I got to a point like a couple miles in where I was like, all of a sudden, I felt like very competitive. I was like I wonder if I could like maybe I'm better at this than I think, like I blew past all these people and all of a sudden was like I need to try to like I need to go for like I want to see where I can actually rank on this thing. And so I ended up not stopping at any aid stations because like my competitive juice has got it flowing and I actually wanted to, you know, to see what my time could be. I did not win the thing, nor beat nor win my category, but ye and a half felt like every time I've done a race, it's like a different like adrenaline burst, Like there's just something different that gets you to a different level, which is kind of fun. And I did finish top ten for my age bracket, which is fun. There you go, So that was something. But yeah, I'm telling myself for this next race that I'm going to again not be like going crazy fast. I'm gonna stop at the A stations and like enjoy a cookie or something ridiculous. But we'll see what happens on the day of. I might end up getting crazy again. 01:28:16 Speaker 3: I like, those are the things that races do bring about, and that competitive nature that's an amazing thing to tap into and to push yourself. It's we can push ourselves and push ourselves in other areas, but this is a race. It's one day and you know, like there's that little glimmer of hope and you're like, well why not, Yeah, why not just go for it. The further the distance the more the longer it takes to recover from pushing, because you'll end up hitting those walls or bonking or cramping up or like all that sort of stuff that you experienced. But even that, gosh, you just you just walk right out of it. You'll walk You'll literally walk right out of it. And it's amazing what the human body is capable of when it comes down to it, because we're like, we're made to survive and we're made to be able to push when we need to push, which is which is a cool thing to get to tap into that we don't do that often. I was like, sometimes we might say that in in a hunting scenario, yeah we pushed a little bit or we you know, but say back to whitetail hunting, you're not pushing. You're not pushing yourself to get to the stand necessarily. Uh certainly, certainly you're like I'm gonna get there at this time, and I'm gonna crawl up in there, but but you are going to push yourself to make that sit or you know, change the game plan when you need to, so you do tap into that same sort of mental side. Back to the hunting thing, I was like, we are we are certainly made to do this, and we are certainly made to move, and it's just it's just really fun to happen in a race scenario. 01:29:57 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, it's Uh, there's so many things that happen in that scenario that help. Like in this last one, I found someone who was at my pace. 01:30:05 Speaker 3: But a little above it. 01:30:07 Speaker 2: And like when I got to the last quarter of the race, and I was just like behind him the whole way, but I could feel like him kind of pulling away a little bit, so I could tell he was a little bit faster than I was, and I decided I'm not gonna let him lose me. I'm gonna stay on his tail. And so like just having that like someone to stick with that, he pulled me through the last quarter ye faster than I would have otherwise, and I just kind of said, like, hey, you're not losing this guy, And I kind of pressed that mental switch and I shifted gears and it was great. I'm glad I did it, But if I was just doing a training run, it'd be a lot harder to do that all on your own. Or the last one I did when I got to the last like two miles or whatever. Kind of a similar situation. There was a guy who I kind of latched onto, and same thing. I could tell it. Naturally he was faster than me. His natural pace was faster than I wanted to go. But I decide I'm going to beat this guy, so I it became a one. 01:30:57 Speaker 3: On one race. 01:30:58 Speaker 2: And he didn't know it, but I knew I was in a one on one race with him, and like that final, the final half mile or whatever, I had to like put the burners on and ran as fast as I ran like all year, probably to beat that one guy. 01:31:09 Speaker 3: But I did, and it felt really good. Cool. 01:31:12 Speaker 2: And those little things don't really matter in the grand scheme of things, but they make for like that additional something, that little extra challenge that pushes you a little further, takes you to a level maybe you didn't know you could get to. 01:31:28 Speaker 3: And all of that stuff. 01:31:30 Speaker 2: I actually think about this when I'm training and I'm going up a hard hill or I'm tired or whatever. I will think about November when it's two degrees out and freezing cold, and you've been in the tree stand for twelve hours and you're miserable and you're tired and you want to pull the plug. Are you going to pull the plug? Or are you going to push through this? Or when you're hunting elk and there's a bowl at the top of this mountain two twenty five hundred feet above you and you've got to bomb up that thing, are you going to do it? Like in these moments when I'm tired, when i want to be done, That's like the stuff that I play in my head to make sure that no, you're to push through it, and this is how you do it. And we're practicing for those moments, even though I might be running on a flat piece of pavement, I'm training my brain to be able to push through those walls. 01:32:14 Speaker 3: Right. 01:32:15 Speaker 2: I think that's what a lot of this does for us. 01:32:17 Speaker 3: It's so spot on when it comes down to it, that's that mental fortitude piece and to tap into that, that's where the power comes, honestly, and we yes, we get a little glimmer of that and hunting season, and we know the areas that we could improve on. Certainly, I'm just going to speak for myself. I'm like, I know that I could push a little push, a little bit further, push a little bit harder. I know I could be patient when I need to be patient and not walk all day. But but yeah, back to the whitetail hunter that's out there, I'm like, I know. I'm like, you got it. You got what it takes. It's between the ears and tap into it. Just maybe running is the way you tap into it. Maybe there's some other fitness regimen that you get into that helps you tap into that, but it's a way that you can access that on a repeated basis. You can do it, and you can create that habit and you can tap into it. And it's so awesome to be able to switch over to, yeah, that difficult hunt, what you're looking forward to all of that and play all those scenarios in your mind, and then the race is over. You're like, check, I did that. I've got some confidence out of it. I've got some of these cool stories and I've tapped into this area of my life that I wouldn't have otherwise, which is which is a beautiful thing. Yeah, yeah, so true. 01:33:41 Speaker 2: All right, I've taken a lot of your time this afternoon, it's Friday. I've probably got good things to get off to do, so I don't want to I don't want to use up too much of. 01:33:49 Speaker 3: This precious resource of ours. But is there. 01:33:53 Speaker 2: Any final thing that we haven't talked about yet or something that you know, just let's let's selfishly keep me in mind. And let's say that next year I want to do that fifty k or a fifty mile or something. I'm gonna take another big jump next year. Yeah, what's one more thing I should be keeping in mind over this next twelve months as I do my first big mountain run and then start training for the next bigger thing. Any other advice, any other category of thing we haven't talked about yet that that I need to be thinking about. Is kind of as a sendoff parting. 01:34:28 Speaker 3: I'm gonna I'm I'm gonna encourage you to go for it. It's like if people say send it, go for it. Because and it's funny, I wasn't a runner, right, I've had asthma all did all that stuff and I've still like, I really love to run. Do I do it all the time? No, I have. I have had periods of time where I'm super obsessive about it and I you know, it kind of can take over certainly, But those are those are good times in life to have had. But it is something that is so powerful and it manifests itself in other ways in life. But oftentimes when people you've you've probably heard it already, Oh you did that race. I could never do that. Yeah, well, They'll say, oh I can't, I couldn't run that far, And in my heart of hearts, I'm like, yeah, you can. Anybody can do it, honestly, Like you might have some sort of ailments that you should not run, and you know those, but there is you are already pushing yourself if you're overcoming those sort of ailments anyway. But but for a lot of people, it is a it's an awesome simple way to go and just tap into that that mental side, that mental fortitude, the mental toughness that you do have because we have it in common because we're hunters and we're competitive all of that with ourselves, and that's an amazing thing. So I'd just encourage you to go for it. I'm like, sign sign up for it, sign up for the fifty k. Heck, like put on miler out there on the docket and work towards it. I've been putting in for four years to this hunter miler and I haven't gotten in every year, and it's always a kind of a relief when I don't get in, and next year I'll get in, and I'm like, I'll look forward to that. It is. It's a good caret to have out there. And if you want to do a hundred miler, I'll I'll come pace you. Just pick it and I'll meet you. So I hope you're not saying that flippantly, because I might. I might buy it. Do I offer that that is my offer stands I will. I was like, I love. I love to see people tap into that. And that's one of the things that I've learned to love about the trail running community and these races that are out there. Yeah, they're they're kind of silly in the big scheme of things, yes, it and but for us, as humans were made to move, were made to travel and go, go and do it, like, because you'll learn a whole bunch about yourself and you'll be a better hunter because of it. I guarantee you'll be a better hunter because of it. But more so than being a better hunter, it's like, hey, just like tap into these things and then handle the rest of the stuff that life throws at you with grace and patience and all that and running just kind of teaches you that. It just breaks you down. 01:37:18 Speaker 2: Yeah, it seems like a tremendous training tool for so much of what life throws at you. 01:37:23 Speaker 3: Yeah, big time, big time. Have you done the rut? Yeah? I have I tattoo. I have a rut tattoo on my arm. Yeah. They give that at the finish line, right, Yeah, I'm a rut I'm a rut fan certainly. But they they moved it last year, they moved it a little bit far further into archery season, and I'm I was like, I can't, I can't go. I really want to go and hunt. It's always the opening weekend, or it had typically always been the opening weekend, but it's it's spectacle. It's one of the coolest events that I've ever experienced, events in all categories that I've ever experienced. A It's just a it's a unique culture. They started off with a bugle, so that gives me goosebumps when I think about the bugle that kicks it off, and it's just they've they've nailed it. And I asked Mike Wolf, Oh, I don't know when he did the sign ups in January they do like the locals only sign up night, and like, did you ever envision it getting this big? And he's like, no, no, never never thought it would. Actually, it was just the local kind of a local race. That's the way it started out. And they drew a bunch of big names. But gosh, if you I'd encourage anybody to sign up for that. It's it is one of the coolest races that's out there. It's different. It's not a hometown race. It's but but it's but it's big and there's just a positive energy that's there that's unmatched, and you get to just see the coolest country. There's alcohol over that. That's ski Hill. There's alcohol over it. You won't see them because everyone's running through, but there's there's alcohol over it. So it's pretty awesome. 01:39:06 Speaker 2: Well, I've heard that is technically more of like a like I think they call it a sky run, Is that right? Yeah, just like that style, like ridge line, like really really up there, crazy route. It seems like it's it's very it's very rugged. 01:39:21 Speaker 3: The the scree and everything that you experienced in that race is everything that you would if you were on a sheep hunt. I'm sure I've never been on a sheep hunt, but I'm sure that's similar. Certainly, it's like all that just gnarly rock ankle biters. I say ankle biters because I always inevitably step on one and it just comes up and snaps the side of my ankle and I just get a little angry at that rock. Just funny. 01:39:50 Speaker 2: Yeah, it looks it looks pretty sweet. That one's on my list for someday. That's a good Bridger. The Bridger Ridge Run is on. 01:39:57 Speaker 3: The list for some day. 01:39:59 Speaker 2: The the Tee Town fifty K I was telling you about, that's on the list. My buddy Yanni's doing the Big Horn this summer. That's on my list for someday. It's so good the Big Horn. 01:40:10 Speaker 3: That whole community, that's that's that's the thing. I was like, you gotta go experiences and people come out and they support it and that the Big Horn and Sheridan and all that country down there. It's like everyone descends on that race to cheer people on. It's it's insane and that's like the heart of that's really good out country. There'll be bulls no joke, bullsel bugle in June when that race goes on. I've been there, I've heard them. It's like, I'm just like, what in the world I heard that they did that, but we'll never actually experienced it and sure thing, Yeah, that's awesome. 01:40:45 Speaker 2: All right, Well, I got to ask you one last question I'll get you out of here. For folks that want to uh try some of the strength training stuff we've talked about, can you give folks recommendation? Where can they find stuff with Mountain Tough? How can they get involved? Maybe what would be like a first program to consider If they're getting into the kind of stuff I'm getting into and they want to add that base of strength, how would you recommend they do that. 01:41:12 Speaker 3: Yeah, we love to encourage anybody to go and check out Mountain Tough, even for your audience, Mark and like extending that to them. We could do a thirty day trial on Mountain Tough, so you can just check it out. You can just poke around in there because everyone's at a different place and we don't want to be pushy ever, but we want to meet people where they're at and help get them on a path. Like I said, we don't have a running program, but we do have the strength piece covered, and we do have the cardio piece covered. But we could do a thirty day trial and say use code wired and go and check it out. You do, won't cost you anything. Just go ahead and check it out and then cancel it if you don't like it, and keep doing it. Awesome. We just want to encourage you, so I'll shoot that over email over to you with the details about that. But like gosh, we'd love people to get in there and and just see and hopefully it's a stepping stone to sign up for a trail race. That'd be amazing. And you don't need Mountain Tough to sign up for a trail race or start running. Go just head out your door and if you're not if you're not feeling like running, just go and walk for fifteen minutes and then just enjoy the beauty that's all around and then get up two mornings from now and do it again. And I'm certain people can tap into that anytime they want to. It's just just a matter of right time, ride place. 01:42:37 Speaker 2: Yeah, man, amen to that. I couldn't say any better, And just thank you. Thanks for sharing all this, thanks for the for the offer there for listeners to get in there and give this stuff a try. 01:42:51 Speaker 3: Man. 01:42:52 Speaker 2: I've just been enjoying this so much and seeing the benefits and excited how it's going to help me this fall and future years. And man, it's pretty funny geek out about this stuff too. So I'm getting in and I can just see myself spiraling further and further. It's it's getting it's getting his claws into me. 01:43:10 Speaker 3: Oh you're yeah, it's awesome. I'm like, I can flash back too, because I was like, I got my boys are yeah, like they're they're little and they're seeing that and and it's a big it's a big deal. I can tell you that, it's a it's a big deal to go and do it. And I guess, like I said, I caution people not to let it take over their their lives, but I was I was conscious of that, and I'm like, you know what, it's taking a little bit more time from home, and I I do want to be there and then flag football and all that sort of stuff. And I was like, you know what, I'm okay not running for as long as I thought, and I'll still finish a race and I and I'm good with that. But but having those having those pieces out there and shoot your kids running hundred milers in the house, that's that's one of the best things I've ever heard. I love it. It's pretty darn funny. I good kids, good kids, that's so cool. Good, good job for sure. And yeah, I'll continue to encourage you on this path. And yeah, I got I can. It's one of the things about running too. I was like, how I end up striking up a conversation and learning people's stories and getting to tell all these cool stories. And you get to do that in the mountains and I don't know any trail, any trail anywhere. I'm like, it's it's just one of the byproducts. So I appreciate the time here. We could have been running this whole time. I know. 01:44:28 Speaker 2: So maybe next time when I'm when I'm up in Bozeman, next time, I'll be there this summer a good bit. 01:44:34 Speaker 3: Maybe I'll reach out, we can go for a run. Let's let's do it. That would be that would be amazing. Get to chat more and and uh yeah go ahead of trail for sure. Awesome. 01:44:43 Speaker 2: Thanks Wester, you bet, Thank you all right, and that is going to do it for our chat today. Thank you again for joining us. Hope you enjoyed this one as much as I did. I hope that if you're not consistently running, you might think about adding this to your routine, doing a little bit more getting outside and just moving a little bit more. I really do think this is going to be something that can help you become a better deer hunter, no matter where you hunt, no matter how you hunt, getting a little bit more active out there is going to help. So hopefully this helped kind of give you some inspiration to do that and maybe some tools to take it to the next level. If this is something that you're already doing but you want to kind of expand the challenge or find new ways to take it to that next level, I think there's been some some ideas here for you too. I want to reiterate what Weston mentioned. They're offering a thirty day free trial for anyone listening to this. If you want to sign up and try that body weight strength routine that I've been using, you can go to the Mountain Tough website and use promo code wired that's wired. 01:45:49 Speaker 3: Or there's also a. 01:45:50 Speaker 2: Direct link in the description for this podcast in your podcast app. Just look in the notes there you'll see a link. Click that and that will take you to a sign up page as well. 01:46:00 Speaker 3: So free day or free thirty day trial check it out. It's good stuff. 01:46:04 Speaker 2: I've been running at myself this spring and enjoying it and definitely appreciate Weston offering that to all of us as well. So with that all said, appreciate you, thanks for being here. Until next time, stay wired to Hunt.

Save this episode