00:00:02 Speaker 1: Welcome to the Wired to Hunt podcast, your home for deer hunting news, stories and strategies, and now your host, Mark Kenyon. Welcome to the Wired to Hunt Podcast. I'm your host Mark Kenyan in this episode number two and sixty five, and today in the show, I'm joined by Codydquisto of Lone Wolf Custom Gear to dissect his uniquely aggressive and purposeful approach to making his own luck in the White Tail Woods. Hello, and welcome to the Wired to Hunt podcast, brought to you by Onyx and today, as I just mentioned him, joined by Cody de Quisto. Now Cody, he's the son of Andre Dequisto, who you might know if he's the founder of Lone Wolf tree Stands and a very well known, accomplished deer hunter. UM, a little bit of a legend within many circles of the d I Y deer hunting community. But Cody stands on his own as a tremendously successful hunter too. He's taken scores of big mature bucks. Many many doesn't this very aggressive mobile way, and it's it's a style that's becoming increasingly of interest to folks hunting public land or private by permission spots where hunting pressure can make things tough. You've heard me talk about ways I've done You've heard my buddy Dan talk about ways that he does it, and a number of other guests we've had over the years. But I feel like Cody takes things maybe next level in certain in certain ways, very interesting style, and I wanted to pick Cody's brain for a while about this, kind of get the first hand scoop on how he's doing what he's doing. Um So that's been on my radar, But earlier this month, earlier in January, Cody pop back up for me because Lone Wolf Custom Gear became the talk of the two thousand nineteen a t a show with a reviving of this brand and a whole bunch of new products that Cody and his dad have been working on. So this is kind of all the buzz over the last couple of weeks, and it made me realize I really got to get Cody back on here. Now is a great time to chat with him. And finally that's what we've been able to do. We got it scheduled, we made it happen, and what we're gonna do here today is talk a little bit about the new company, you're kind of this new revitalization of the company and some of the new products coming up. And then we spend the majority of the episode then diving into a bunch of very specific examples of how Cody hunts and successfully tags so many different mature bucks. Um, it's very interesting. I really enjoyed his perspective and his strategies, and a few of the points he makes along away are just man, they're they're things to live by, some really great things to keep in mind as we head into this next season. So I'm excited for you to hear this, but I do want to give you two quick heads ups before we move on. Number One, there is a little bit more adult language in this one and some others, so just fair warning on that. Uh, if that's not your cup of tea, you might just want to skip ahead to the next one, or skip back to another one, or maybe just don't listen to this one with the little ones present. And Secondly, about two thirds of the way you're so through our chat, we started having a little bit of a sound quality disruption. I apologize in advance for that, which it didn't happen, but there are a few sections where things get a little fuzzy on his end. Um. I decided though that we're gonna keep that content in here because I just think it's it's really interesting, the full interview intact. I feel it should be there for those who want to listen. But I do apologize for a little bit of that sound issue that you will catch again eventually. So with all of that out of the way, I think we should just jump right into it. Let's take a quick hot second to thank our partners at Morton Buildings, and then we'll get on with the show. So, as I've mentioned, I'm excited for this new partnership with Morton Buildings because I've for a long time looked at Morton Buildings out there on folks properties and been very very jealous Morton. They're the builders of very high quality steel pole barns and steel buildings. Um you know, they can be used just as storage for your tractor and your hunting gear. I've seen others where they're full born Paul barn houses where you have a large storage area for your truck and your tractor in your forward, but then also maybe half of it is a living area. Um Man. I've kind of dreamed of having my own little hunting properties someday and a Paul Barn house on it. That is is what I'm hoping to someday have, And it's kind of neat to be able to talk about on the podcast here, and it can't tell you about my dreams. Maybe someday it will happen. But from what I understand more is the place to get this done. They have over a hundred years of experience. They're fully customizable. Like I mentioned, you can have a Paul Barn house, you can have a huge storage facility, whatever you want. They have several different features that make these particularly high quality, like their energy Performer installation. They have high ribs steel, It's very low maintenance. And right now there are some special promotional prices going on that are running through February. So if you are in the market for a new barn or Paul barn house or a little living space on your property, you can head over to Morton Buildings dot com to learn more. All right with me now on the line is Cody de Quisto. Cody, thanks for joining me here. Yeah, thanks Mark, thanks for having me on. I looked I've been kind of looking forward to the last couple of weeks. Yeah, me too, it was. It's actually been something I've wanted to do for a while. Um. I think I maybe reached out once a long time ago, or we might have met very briefly at some trade show a couple of years ago, but now it's finally happening, and um, A man of the timing is good. I think because you and your company, Lone Wolf Custom Gear has been all over social media rate lately, a lot of people asking questions about what's going on, new products coming out, a lot of excitement I feel coming around it because because your dad started Lone Wolf a long time ago, many of us have used Lone Wolf tree stands in the subsequent years, um, and they've been you know, amazing, amazing products. And now you guys have got some new stuff happening, which is which is exciting. So I think maybe the kickings off, Cody, I just I feel like there's there's just like some questions around what this company is, how it's different than it used to be, what your involvement is a Lone Wolf Custom Gear versus what you used to do with XLP, or maybe you're still doing XLP. Can you kind of just walk us through what you're doing now, what's up with a new brand or the old brand that's now revitalized the new products. Um, I just just walk us through that. Yeah, yeah, no problem. So UM. I mean essentially what you're seeing now, you know is Lone Wolf custom gear um, pretty much the same as the original Lone Wolf brand. UM. You know, we added the custom gear because we we branched out into a couple of different avenues. So uh, you know, it's always been obviously known for tree stands, climbing sticks and and that sort of thing. Um, but now we have some some cameras and some other products so um. But essentially what it is is it's a family based company or own company that that uh you know, my dad started back in my teen eight four out of the garage in the backyard, UM innovative and design these tree stands, and you know, spent a long time building that brand. UM, and it's kind of been dormant for a while. There has been a loan of tree stands present for the last tenor sold years or actually might even be a little longer than that. TUTA. Yeah it's just teen years actually, so um. But that what you see is is a licensing agreement. So UM he built up his UM his line of tree stands, climenades and stuff like that, UM and licensed those patented items as well as the name brand UM to a company and sort of got out of the business for a while. UM. And it was, you know, we always had the intent to relaunch the brand UM and I think we were just kind of waiting for that right time. UM. And this year marked the thirty thirty five year anniversary of of the brand, so we figured it was it was the perfect time to launch that. And so with with the relaunch of the brand, like you mentioned, there's a few new products coming out you guys, I don't know how much you want to dive into it, but a new revitalized take on your tree stands, UM, updates on your climbing sticks. Can you walk us through some of that stuff, and then maybe a little bit on the other products you guys have to Yeah, yeah, So that's that's definitely UM A big thing UM uh that I'm proud of for this year. So so what I wanted to do UM, you know when one day and I started talking about the you know, the relaunch of the brand and kind of getting back into it is UM is really make a product again that cater to you know, our needs and guys like us, you know, sort of like what happened back in the nineties when Dad you know, came up with that cast luminum in patent that technology. So, uh, it's a little bit of different, um, different track you would say, than what I've been doing with xop um. You know, trying to appeal to the masses, get a stand that that is good for everybody. UM, bring that cast luinium technology, you know, at a more affordable price, and just you know kind of as an industry all around. UM. So this is definitely dedicated to more of a mobile style hunter. So what we did is, you know, we have hang on an extet of climbing sticks. But it's more than a hang on climbing sticks. It's a it's a complete system. So UM, it is a hang on that completely eliminates all the little things that we were upset with or didn't work properly or function smoothly on the old models. And it integrates with the climbing sticks everything from you know, transporting your gear too, you know, inefficient up the tree one time to get set up. UM, lightweight, innovative features, so UM, I like to definitely look at it as a system. One of the biggest things on this system is the uh you know, we're calling it like a framepack feature. So what it is is the seat actually locks into the casting and it essentially turns your stand into a framepack. So, UM, it's really cool. You have a nice shelf that can support whatever weight you want to put on it. You can pack game out with it, you can put your extra clothes on it. You can if you're filming, you're a camera guy and you got all that equipment. UM. It gives you a nice dirty shelf to rest your gear on. UM. And when you couple that with the new sticks that actually um plugging together like no other sticks on the market. They actually flush and they mount right to the stand, So you have a nice even, you know, even shelf there, UM, and you're not loading one side of your stand he ord and the other UM. So it makes for just just awesome, awesome transport um and just ultimate like function. Yeah. I see that it's seven and a half pounds for the stand, now, is that right? Yep? Yep, The stand total weight to seven a half pounds UM. We got two sets of sticks. We have a full length like a three step um and that is that's right around two pounds at sticks, and then our compact size it's it's a double step that one fits right into the profile to stand and it's like you're, um, you're m'd say, you know, maybe you're more more mobile friendly stick, you know with those guys who really want to get as compact and low profile. And that one was just a pound and a half. Yeah, that's uh, that's really really nice to see. I remember even with gosh, the old assaults that I used to have, those are pretty darn lightweight, and I think those are still like twelve pounds or somewhere around that. So this is quite a quite a chunk of weight and act off that too. So for folks going going really mobile, that seems to be a great option. Now. I've actually kind of added a little bit of a tweak to my mobile set up because I do I do a lot of this to hunt a lot of public land new spots, even on my private private properties. And I started using a saddle this past year and I saw you guys have got a saddle platform to what's the deal of that? Yeah. So, and that's another thing that's kind of been um, you know, the whole I feel like the industry as a whole has been has been climbing and edging back towards this this like um, it almost seems like it's getting more in a mobile type um style than it even was to begin with. You know, I think back then it was like there wasn't mobile hunting. So the introduction of those stands made mobile hunting this thing, or at least more of a thing from semi permanent models. And now it's like a you know that that that circle back to the old way of doing things are a little bit older way. Um. I feel like a lot of things getting stagnant. So along with that, you know, a popular model that Dad had um designed in the Lone Wolf line before he uh licensed all let out to the new company was the Assassin and that was sort of the first of you know, the first of its kind, like it was it was just a new thing, you know, it was there was guys using tree settles a lot, and guys are on footpegs or on light stands and stuff, but there really wasn't a platform designed for those guys. And that's what they did, and it went It went over pretty well, but it was it was I think it was still missed. It was overlooked at that time, and not many people got into it too much. UM And now in the last couple of years we've seen a big influx of just guys going nuts for the saddle type hunting and you know, getting more mobile, trying to get lighter weight. So we found it. You know, we knew that, you know, one of the first stands that we would do and developed along with this lightweight hang on was a saddle platform. And what we have now is essentially designed in the image of the original Assassin, a little lighter weight. It's got the cool, you know, kind of techie look that we got with the new UM you know, water jetting material, all solid, solid aluminum, and it just it's mean, it looks really me and it's got a lot of extra extra function than the old one did as far as you know, perimitive grips and you know, more leveling, just as solid. It's just uh so that was definitely something we knew we wanted in the line UM just to kind of um not only accommodate the guys hunting like we are like me personal and I don't use saddles. I just I'm so I got my stand set up so dialed in that it's it's just what I love to do. But there's nobody out there that's really designing the highest most you know, the highest quality, you know, best products for those those mobile guys. So we wanted to get that every angle. Yeah, and I'm excited to see that. I know, um more and more people are trying to find different platform options for those saddles, and I know some guys are actually taking low wolf tree stands seats and modding those to become like d I y platforms. And I guess some folks that that works. Although I don't know how safe it is. I'm not saying I would recommend it, but it seems like a real platform designed to be a platform, like you guys are doing. That's probably the safer, uh, safer options. So it's it's good to see you guys are putting something like that out there. Yeah, yeah, I agree to. You know, it's it's you know, not that the not that the seat the tree stand seats aren't strong, but you know, they're just they're just not designed for that you know, they're they're designed to be a seat, They're not designed to have you know, all that weight being pivoted off the side. So, um, I think this is gonna give you know, and to aout the same time, I feel people like kind of tinkering with stuff and doing their own custom designs. I think this stand is going to give a guy, you know, just a really awesome advantage being able to buy a stand that designed for that purpose, that will work in the scenarios that they're using it. Um and also to you know, we've we've made this stand now integrate with our new Compact climbing stick, so it may sure like the ultimate little little set up. You know, you've got to You've got your your Compact sticks on your saddle platform and you just kind of you know, you're all set up at that point. Yeah, I think those new sticks are something I'm gonna try out here soon because as I've been tweaking my mobile set up, trying to get more and more lightweight, I've still been using the old sticks. I've got a couple of different pairs from maybe eight nine years ago now, and it seems like there's there's definitely some options that are significantly improved, this being this being one of those. So I'm excited what you guys are up to, Cody. Um, it looks like some really cool things. And I guess before we move on the main thing, Um, I do want to spend a lot of time you're talking about is is why you and your dad are so well equipped to put products with this together, because of your hunting success. But if people do want to learn some more about the new gear you guys are out, where can they find that online? Uh, you can go to www. Dot lone Wolf custom Gear dot com. Um that has you know, a lot of info on all the new products, products to come. Um, we are still populating that website. You know, it's kind of a it's a process and we're still you know, working on all the final models. We're going to open up you know, a lot more information here in the next couple of weeks. Um, But you can get some good infro there. You can sign up for the newsletter and figure out you know, get any inside in scoop um and all the new products. Awesome. All right, So your dad started lone Wolf. He I think that it was basically him who started whitetail addiction TV two and had a lot of folks that kind of learned from him as far as you know how to hunt, like Adam Hayes people like that that. I think a lot of us know about today. See, I feel like there's a lot of history that you probably grew up around. Um, with the things that your dad was doing. How did that impact How did that impact why you hunt? I'm sure there's a lot of ways that impacted how you hunt, But growing up in that, how do you feel like that effects like your y still now? Um? I it's a good question. Um, I guess going back to the beginning, I mean, you know, coming coming up in that sort of circumstance, I think you know, into that to that point, like you mentioned, I I got into hunting right when you know, kind of the cuss or the white tail addictions. Um, you know started being being a thing, you know, right when filming your Hunt's got was getting more popular and all that. So you know when I had a bowl in my hand, I uh, um, you know from the start, there was always a camera on me and it was kind of it's kind of weird at first, um, But honestly, to tell you the truth, I think at first it sort of turned me off, you know, being uh, I guess you know in a in a in a sense having such a big shoes. Um, it was maybe you know a little bit here and there. I didn't really didn't really get bit by the ball at first, and it wasn't pressured into it. So um, once I did become just obsessed with the sport. And I I've seen that, you know, I developed that passion that I've seen all these other guys that I was always surrounded by coming up and not people that I came up with, but you know, just Dad, the guys he hunted with, like you mentioned, and and um, I think that's when I really just kind of went, you know, went full bore and you know, being being competitive. My you know, I always had that urge like you know, I gotta well, I gotta get it done, you know, So it was, um, sort of just a I don't know, I don't know if I'm even asked answer the question. I think it's a tough one because I feel like it's one of those questions that a lot of us don't really have to think about very often, because why do you hunt what we just hunt? Because it's what we do, it's what we love. Um, So it's it is kind of surprising sometimes to sit back and try to think of but I thought it might be interesting just giving kind of the context that you came up in, I mean to what you know. Oh sorry, yeah, you know, I was even gonna say. You know, I think I really think too that like the guys who are really into it, I think there's something inside you man, like it's it's one of those it's one of those primal things I think, just to you know, to when you start doing it and like we were just talking, you know before we're on the phone, and you know, those those close encounters and you know, um, you know kind of just giving it to your all and and figuring out the pieces of the puzzle and making it happen, and uh, you know, especially with a with a bow, you know. And I think it's there's a certain type of person, certain type of mind that maybe like clicks with that more or or loves it more and gets gets more kind of infatuated and obsessed with that that experience and that sport. So I think a lot of it's got to do it just uh, I think it's in you too. You know that that chess match, it just can can just get you going down the down the pipe and you can't stop. I can definitely relate to that, um So. So, I've been kind of keeping tabs on what you've been up to lately and how you hunt, because, you know, without needing to refer back to you guy too much, he's someone I was paying attention to you for a long time. And then when I saw that you were doing some of the same things but doing him in your own way and having a ton of success, that was that was really intriguing to me. Um So, I guess I think I've got an idea of this in my own head, but I want to hear it from you. Let's imagine you were like on an elevator and you're going from the fourth first floor to the tenth floor, and someone on the elevator asks you to describe how you hunt, like your hunting style, and you just have like the one minute it's gonna take to go from the first floor to the tenth floor. How would you narrow down and describe your basic hunting style in that one minute? If you had to kind of get it down to the most essential I would definitely say, um, aggressive or you know, I'm trying to think of words like aggressive, consistent, you know, um, uh you know, UM, I guess it's the biggest thing I would say that I've learned, you know, throughout the years and and stuff that I've taken from Dad, stuff that I've learned on my own, is that make your own luck. Luck is not. I mean, you can get lucky, but if you if you go out in the woods and you think yourself, Okay, I need to make this happen like that, don't let anything come to you, you know, bring yourself to that situation. That would be like, how that's how I look at it every time, you know, Okay, hey, I could sit on this field as you wait, but I'm not gonna do that. It's not I'm not I'm an impatient person, you know, I'm like, Okay, I need to find this. I need to find what's going on. I need to get myself in the right spot so I can get so I can get the job done. So, UM, I would definitely think, uh, you know, more of aggressive kind of go go go style and just the opposite of the opposite of lazy. Yeah, yeah, I heard you. I heard you want to another interview say that you don't get out just to get out, like you're never ever gonna sit somewhere just well it's a it's a Saturday, I can hunt. Someone's gonna sit in this tree and hunt and see what happens. It sounds like that is never what you're doing. You are always hunting somewhere for a very specific reason at a very specific time because you think you're gonna kill right then and there is that? Is that an accurate summary? Yeah? Now, I mean I that right there, that is the goal, you know, going into the season, I tell myself, Okay, you know you need to be on it, you know. And I'm not going to say that I've never sat somewhere that I didn't you know. You know, there's there's definitely times that that I have gotten into a tree for no reason and just sat there to be out and I was like, well, you know, you're not gonna kill and if you're not out here, you know, And then I sort of smack myself in the face and it's like, you could be doing way more than this to to you know, be successful, to just you know, get down and go go look around or or you know, start some eyes in the game plan. So um, it's just like the whole thing with what kind of you know, when we talk about mobile. It happens to me all the time. I'm not gonna say it doesn't. Sometimes I do get I get caught up in old stuff, or I get caught up in and waiting, and then as soon as I I'm just really good at checking myself out of it, you know, and noticing when I'm doing those things, and I immediately changed. So um, to to your point, Yes, I want to be in every time. I understand. I want to know that that you know, either the deer I'm after or a good deal that I think is you know, in that area, could die, you know. And if I'm not in that spot, I just you know, because I think I think a lot of it's it's like a lot of it's mine too. And if you're not in that spot, and it may sound sound wacky, but you're sitting there and you're you know, it's just if you're all negative in that stand, like, I just don't think anything is good that's gonna come from that, you know. I mean, you know some people, you know, I mean, it does happen sometimes, But I think those guys who are getting you know, that luck and just by a chance killing a good one are just it's a completely different, you know, different story. Yeah. Now, I gotta I gotta imagine that in order to be able to put yourself in those kinds of positions during hunting season where you're that confident about being in the right spot for a specific deer for a specific reason, I imagine there's got to be a lot of work that leads up to that moment that makes it possible. A lot of scouting and stuff. Um, we're you know, we're right now talking in late January. Postseason scouting is obviously a hot thing as we get here into February, March, April is snow starts melting, different things like that. Can you kind of walk me through what kinds of things you're gonna be doing in the coming months to start laying that foundation? What like specifically are you doing? Um? I definitely, I definitely do a lot of shed hunting. You don't. And but to be honest, even like shedheim, you know, I'll look around, I take no um A lot of times I shed hunt pieces that I already hunt, so I already kind of know what was going on late season, I know what was going on early season. Um, and I honestly hardly ever hunt shed hunt like new pieces. Um. I think that would that would definitely help me, and I'd definitely be looking at, you know, all the sign that happened during season on those shed hunts where the horns are. I've I've heard a lot of good things of you know, killing deer where you find their sheds. I've never really personally correlated anything specific to that, like, I mean, you know, I find I know a lot of guys who they use that as a big piece of the puzzle. Um, when I'm looking for sheds, I'm more so looking at trying to get okay this year. You know he's gonna probably be a shooter next year. You know the area he's in late season, I'll probably surmize that much. But I, um, you know, I've as far as late season and this time, I mean yeah, I mean picking up horns, I guess, uh, you know, I always take note of where or do your feeding and fields where I see them when it's really extremely cold out where you know, all that kind of stuff. I mean, you know, trails pop up. You've got highways that start when you've got deek snows and and and those sort of things. But as the snow melts, um, I think it's a really good picture before it greens up and everything becomes just you know, covered up to see what happened that late last season. If that's if that's the stuff you're looking for? Yes, so so is that kind of stuff you're looking for? Or maybe what I should say is when is the most important sign for you? Like when do you really try to scout? Is it just as soon as as soon as i get the bowl my hand and I'm ready to kill something that's like my um, I've and and it it might be different than a lot of other people and how they go about things, but I I've went through in the in the years of of like i'd say, come coming into my own as like as a hunter and really figuring out my own style and how I do things. I tried to do a lot of summer scouting. I tried to do, you know, and I've you know, all those things like you know, I was out there, you know, setting up stands after the season or you know to where I've seen you know, good bucks in that area, um, late season, and they're like, oh, this this is a really good spot late season. You know, let me just have to stand there. I'll go find where they're you know, a nice hot creek crossing in the middle of summer, and I set up the stands on there and into whereas I killed good deer you know, the following year. And it definitely helped. I think it. I honestly think it. It hurts just it helped to know general patterns and stuff up the land, but it never really paid off like it does for me walking into the woods. As soon as I know that I can go figure something out, as soon as I know I can really go after something, finding out what is going on at that exact second. You know, I've I've I've I've hung stands late season on deer before and those deer now remain it next year. And you know, so a stand that I was banking on thinking about last year, Oh that you know that Big eight was split in two was coming out here last year, He's probably gonna be around here. You know. I'd make all these you know, I'd surmise all these uh you know things that I was thinking. I was like Okay, he's probably gonna be right here, and I I'd be figuring it out. And I just think that I was getting ahead of my I think I was helping myself for next season. And then next season would come and you know that deer might have you know, not not made. It might have got a racking faction, or he just wasn't there for some reason. I got poached or you know, into where uh, and then you know, the summer signed. You know, all these deer are frequent in this well. As soon as they come in a heart antler, I mean, boom, the pattern changes. They're eating something different there. You know, they got more testas when running through them. They're just not as lax of there in summer months. So I just really started focusing on you know, I take that stuff into account and I and I do it here and there. But like to me, it's like, you know, it's like sitting at that race, you know, and when that freaking gun gets fired, that's when I'm like, boom, what is going on? Where's it happening? Now? How do I kill something? You know? I try not to think about that stuff. Well, yeah, they were there late season, but who gives a ship. You know that deer was here in the you know, in the summer, I was getting I got pictures on the velvet at all, you know, I hear that from a lot of guys. I gotta have pictures, pictures of them all the summer. I velt right here and they're hunting right there when the season opens. Instead of going to look for a sign, figuring out exactly where that there is now, well I stopp getting picture them three weeks ago. Well white you hunting there? You know. I mean so a lot of people just get caught up. And I might sound like a broken record, but on the past, um, I think it's very important to to take things in here, take things in the now and just figure them out. And if you find out what's going on now is what was going on in the past, well whatever that you know, then then you're right. You know. Then you've you've checked your work. You know, you're not you're not just banking on past sign. You know, if if you go check it and it says, oh, yet this deer is still doing what he was doing in the summer, well then so be it. Go kill him, you know, But but what if he's not you know why you know why I commit to that. So, um, I don't know, I feel like I might what we even went off on a tangent. But but that's sort of sort of how I feel about the um a lot of the summer stuff. And another thing too, I I really do think that these deer um, well no, I don't think. I know, these deer make bigger gains, um, And they're more susceptible to be killed if you leave him alone and you're not trumping through the piece that you're planning on hunting and you're not doing a lot of that. Although I think they might take a little bit more of that at that point in time because it's not so you know, I think the summer there, everything is more relaxed. Nothing's really like you know, being hunted or whatever. But um, I do think that's a big thing as well. And it's a big advantage too, like if you know, if you know you've got some good deer on the fort of your hunting, stayed hell out of it. I mean you let them let them have that, let them let them hang out, let them let them grow their racks and the stress for the environment, you know, and then boom, I just I jump in there right as soon as I can kill them, I figure out where they're going, where they're betting, you know, I try at least, and then you know, you have that element of surprise instead of you know, throughout the summer you're in there trimming stuff, you're leaving cent, You're you're walking around, You're bumping the deer. You know, you're you're putting unnecessary stress on those deer um, you know, before it's time. It's it's it's almost like kind of showing your cards a little bit, uh in a in a poker game, you know, I mean, like, why why do it? That's the kind of that's that's the that's the mentality I take into it personally. And I and don't get me wrong, I know guys that that scout the piss out of their property and summer they kill good bucks every year. So I'm not saying it's not the it's just the way I you know, the way I kind of look at it. But so so that makes sense. But then my immediate next question, though, is how do you do that kind of scouting to figure all that kind of stuff out during the season without having the same negative impact that you talked about in the summer. So how do you get in there learn this stuff without spooking those deer out right then and there when you actually can hunt them. Um, I feel like that's the big like balancing act I imagine you have to handle. So in the answer to that is, I don't care. I know that right when I go in there, I will be setting up a stand that time and I will be waiting for that dear. So I don't that completely. That doesn't even enter my mind. You know that that thought processes. You know a lot of guys, Oh, I don't want to go in there because because I'm gonna ruin it. Well, I don't think like that. I go in there, Well, I have to go in there because I want to kill him. Because I want to kill that deer. Now to that to that point, you know, if I know there's a if I'll look at arials, I'll surmise where I think if a deer was in that area where you come out speed you know or whatnot, And I you know, I'm not going to go trump right in there the first day. I mean, you can find out a lot by you know, scouting an edge where you know, you know deer aren't betting or edge of a food source and hanging a stand, um, and you know, damn well, you can be in a spot where you can kill him. But my mentality on that is simply, well, as soon as he finds me out, I'm gonna be in a position to kill him. So I don't care, right because when he's when he's having that aha moment, you're slipping an arrow of if there was that's that's kind of the you know that that's definitely the uh, the game plan, you know, I mean, if if if you can sneak in there, um and uh, you know, I mean think about it. That dear has never been tipped off of you. You you haven't been scouting that place, you haven't been leaving any he's been. He's been there, you know, doing his thing the whole time. You come in, you find him and you're immediately hunting him instead of coming in finding the spot. You scout around, Oh man, this would be a good spot, and then you hang a stand. You know, you leave it. That deer might even start to kind of straightler from that area, or at least I think that, you know, if you're doing that stuff months before the season, and you're you're going in there, and then a lot of guys will hang camera. It's like right on there there standing thing that they hung and then they'd be checking those even though they only check them like once a month. But any any messing around in there, I just think, you know, if, if, and even if you know he's there, if I know he's there, I'll get the hell out. I won't trim a damn thing, I won't hang a stand, I won't set a camera there if I know, what do I need five pictures of him for? If I know he's there, and I plan on killing the opening with the season. So that's that's just the kind of way I look at things. I don't, you know, it's I don't know. I also I don't know if that makes sense, but but it does, I hope so so so I know you kill the buck this past season on I think it was October twelve, maybe um was that hunt the way that things led up to it. Was that a good example of what you're describing here, And if so, could you actually walk us through, like from October one through October twelve, what you did each hunt leading up to that kill. Finally, I'm kind of curious to hear if you, like you knew about him, you made a move on. I tell her first it wasn't quite right. You tweaked it again. I made another move? Is that is that kind of what happened that this year? This year? Um, definitely is in the typical fashion of how I normally hunt. I killed him in the in the timber, you know, on the way back to his bed, after figuring out where he betted. But as far as a clear, clean example of what was going on and in like an early season and not messing up the property, um, it might not be the best example. I have other deers that are like perfect. You know, you can you can uh line up the story, you know, um, day by day. This one was more so I had no idea where he was. I was more so focused on a different side of property. Um. You know it. It actually showcases maybe another lesson to be learned, you know. I I knew there was a good buck on a different different area. I was hunting a different area of the majority of the beginning of season, you know, and I was hunting this deer and hunting this deer, and you know, it's one of those things where sometimes you can't, you know, you can't allow yourself to be that pinned out. So I, you know, started started branching out and started looking in different areas instead of just hammering home on the same exact area. You know, if if you have that opportunity. Now, I didn't know this buck per se, you know, It's just it was more so like, hey, this is this is a good buck that I would kill, you know, not like, hey this is the buck that I want to kill. So you knew that based stuff of what off of like big rubs you saw or like in past years you saw you know, this one, this one I had a I actually had a trail camera um out on a on a field edge, UM in a position to where I like it was a it was a spot on the field edge that it's it's a primary scrape every year. You know. It wasn't it obviously wasn't scraped when I hung in the camera. But I knew that as soon as that season will start rolling around, I would have you know, that thing would be starting to get shredded up. They shred their velvet in this area. I've seen it, you know years before ars and they started just raking the seacre tree. It's a it's a big, overhanging seedar tree on the edge of the crop field. So I just had that camera out there, knowing that you know, hey, I'll probably get it, you know, at least a bit of inventory, you know, come when the season opens and see if there's anything that that's you know, we're shooting here. So I ended up getting one picture of this deer, which immediately gave me some information, even on that fact that there was only one picture of him. But there was a picture of him, and it wasn't the best picture, but I was looking at it, I'm like, okay, you know that that that deer will probably do. Let me, let me, let me try and find them, you know. Then I um, but to that point, that was a couple of days before season, and I checked that camera, and then I started to surmising my game plan. Um, you know, I started hunting for that deer before I even knew about this other this this book that I ended up killing. Um. But as soon as I found out about that book, you know, then I just or even before I found out about that book, this deer was was proven, you know, I mean, he was definitely had a long he was traveling a long ways, and I was, I was, you know, trying to get at that, and then I just decided, Hey, you know, I'm gonna I'm gonna actually gonna increase my odds here. And I started looking at other places as well, because you know, I didn't know, I didn't know where that buck was at, I didn't know how often he was freaking that area. Um, I had to dive in right away and started trying to figure out those things. But at the same time, I knew I wasn't gonna pin myself down and spend the entire season right on that spot where I got the camera picture, just because you know, I am trying not to take that for um two specific either, just like a single picture on a camera. So so okay, so you how many times did you actually hunt in the area where he ended up killing that buck? Actually like thinking, okay, I'm gonna try to kill the good buck that's in this area. How many hunts did it take till you actually had to happen? So can you tell me about the first and why? So? So this one, this one, like I said, this one is a little bit it's not I wouldn't say, uh, it's a little bit simpler than some of the other ones, and we can dive into something like that, like you said that maybe really rings home on that Nose County. But this this all comes about of like, okay, you know this is a this is the home farm. You know when I do you know, I just know from years that like okay, when when signs popping up here and you know, a deer's you know, I might see it deer feeding in in this area, I immediately start to you know, ring in my head. Okay, well I think he's you know, I make those. It's not like being on a new property and and thinking and having to really go, uh look, so this was just a simple, um, you know, scouting session where you know, I mean I noticed an ice trail, some big tracks I you know, paired debt with you know, seeing a buck out in the field. Um, and I kind of, you know, immediately it was just like, okay, well, I think he's he's either betting, you know, on the backside of this ridge or the one over. So it was like slip up there, check it out. You know. I seemed a good sign on that ridge. I've seen what I you know what I anticipated that nears track was because I went out in the field, you know, looked at it. Um, there were some there were some light rubs popping up, you know, coming in from the corner of this wood lot that I figured he was probably you know, scraping on as he was coming in and out from his from his betting areas. So I just I slipped up on a ridge that, um, you know I've hunted in the past, Um, that I knew would be the perfect ambush point if he was coming in with the wind I had, you know, I mean to to bet in that corner. And I knew in my head that, well, ship, if he's not, if this is another book and this is not him, and I don't kill him this morning, I'll kill him the mile, because I'll go on the next ridge over. And I was, you know, I was just sure in my head that he had to be better in one of those spots. And then if I didn't, if I didn't run into him on that other ridge, well then I had really just started to dissect it and and kind of you know, looking between and see what I was missing, and but end up happening on the first one on the first time, so it was actually the second sit um. But with that being said, you know, I've been I've had properties that have you know, never been on and it's like, okay, you know or haven't been in two to three years, and it's just day one. You get in there, Okay, you've got no no previous information, nothing, and you gotta just figure it out. You gotta you gotta go look for something you know and and then you you know, you move from there. But this one, uh, you know, I feel like the more you hunt, the more you hunt certain farms. Uh. You definitely kind of not only just in general, but you should. You should have an idea of where you're you know, where your dear typically better where you um what previous history coming back to help you for sure? Um, you mentioned the fact that you looked at those tracks. How big I don't know if you actually ever measure or put your hands up to or anything like that, but how big of a track do you need to see to like interest to you to say, oh, yeah, that's that's a big mature buck. I mean, you know I've seen it. It. Uh, it's weird because you know, tracks don't lie. You're gonna have a you know, I've hunted. I've killed good deer on just a single track, on a single trail and really thick stuff and shot him at five yards just sitting on that track, like, well, what the hell was it? This is a big deer. I mean, if it's a you know, if it's a deer, I don't want to shoot well whatever, but it's a big track. Um, so I do like the track thing. Um a four finger track, I think is is a is a tank. Um, there's there's definitely um, you know deer that I've shot that are some of my biggest deer over one seventy that didn't have a big track though, you know. So I mean they're just they're just a younger deer. So you can't but you can't go wrong with with with hunting big tracks if you got if you got big tracks, you got big gear, you got old deer. So I mean it's not nothing wrong. Just here had a pretty good track. I didn't measure it, you know, I just I see it. I'm like, okay, that's a good box. You know it was you know, it was national, um nice and wet. You know. I was thinking real deep into them love. Um it was good side, good size, you know, displayed quite a bit and um, you know, and that leaves me even the rubs I phone. You know, it's not like I phone. You know, trees of this bucks that were you know, twenty inches wide that were just shredded the ship. I mean these are little, um it's a little sapling type trees. Um that I think it was just casual you know, um, you know, regulars bass and stuff like that. So I mean I've hunted, uh, I found areas and and see you the thinks that were just shredded. I mean you'd think the trees and there were freaking huge and then high and all that stuff. And you know, some you know, you gotta figure it out. You know. I've had you know, a hundred thirty five deer and walking like, oh man, you know, you're you're thinking this thing's gotta be hulock like the way this place looks. So I mean a lot of that could be deceiving, but that's where you got to stay on it. And um, I mean when I seen that tra I knew I knew a d percent you know, just we're he was in the field where the track was, you know, where your typically bed, where I thought he'd be bet and it was just you know, it was all there. Um. I feel like that is the secret sauce kind of that a lot of people struggle with. Is you know that maybe they figured out, Okay, I need to be mobile, I need to move in, try to find this hot sign or whatever that's gonna help me know where to hunt right now. UM. But actually saying that is a lot easier than doing it, like knowing this sign that's worth setting up on. UM. So I'm kind of curious you alluded to some other examples of past years where you have kind of done this from the get go, started out early season and worked your way into one. Um. Is there another example you could walk us through where you did that? Um? I'm kind of particularly interested in, like what specific sign led you to do X, which led you to do why which led you to kill that deer? Um? I know you killed an opening day booner back in two thousand and fifteen. Is that a good example of that? Um? Yeah, I mean that's a pretty that was that was a place that I hadn't um hunted in a couple of years. UM, And I was actually, uh, I was on the road, and um, I think it was it was Kansas, and I was talking in Kansas, and I was just and I had never hunted in cancer before, so I was just you know, turning and burning, you know, hunting as much find out as much afore as I could happen and all that stuff. It was real early, it was real hot. Um, there's a lot less sign out there. It was just it was different. It was a whole different ball again when I was used to like thicker more, you know, stuff like that, and I and you know, so opening day I came, you know, so I had already been you know kind of you know in that in that mindset, and then opening day came and I uh literally just went and walked the property. You know, I got the I got the wind of my nose and I just started looking for looking for good sign. So I started, uh you know walking. Um. I actually had to hook her on the back side of the property just so I could you know, have an idea. Um. And I walked through the whole the whole west end of the property. UM. And my goal right when I got there was two Okay, you know I'm gonna I'm gonna go set up a spot that I think I can kill one in the morning, and I'm going to then you know, go hop up hopping a spot for the evening, just to just to see what's going on. So UM, I ended up, you know, coming up, coming up a crick and um, you know, finding a a little rub line, you know, go out the side of the hill. You know, definitely you know, was was picking some interest, but UM, I went more so UM I was trying to I was more so trying to find where I was really trying to kick very here honestly what I was trying to do. Um, And this was normally I think I I think I had about four days. So if I typically would have went there and I was there for as long as it takes there, if I had a couple of weeks, I don't think I would have been this. I would have probably started off and a more of a you know, outside the timber approach. But um, it was one of those things that I didn't have a lot of time, and I knew I only had a few days, so I went with the soul intent you know in my mind to check out a book. So you know, I got the UM, I got to win like I said it, uh you know, in my fever, and started scouting these these uh these ridges and uh now there's a really stick on the map and I've killed deer around it in the past. So it was one of those things where, you know, I didn't know that some stuff was going on here, but I literally ended up able to um sneak up on this buck and I seen him betted. You know, I could see a rack in the you know, he was really sick brier patch. You know, I'm talking like just supernarly, and I've seen him and I'm thinking, okay, all right, well, you know, immediately in my mind, I'm thinking this books dead. So I then purposely, like kind of was even loud about it. I I sort of jog toward him, like just just know, got a sort a jog toward him. Not I didn't sneak up on him. I just you know, I wanted him to know I was there on his own accord and get away safely. So I just I kind of just you know, dragging his direction. Got let me get out of there. I looked around. I found a couple of beds in the spot that he was betted, you know, and I did not think deeper into it. I literally set a stand. I pulled up my phone. I've seen what the wind was going to be the next day, um, and I said, okay, you know it's gonna be a north wind. So I looked at that area where he was at. You know, I found some I found some tracks around there. I've seen kind of some trails that were coming into that. I surmised where I thought he was coming from. And I set a stand up four north wind, and I literally walked out of there. In my mind, okay, well that he is dead tomorrow, let me see if I can find a better one. So I went down, walked across the entire other side of the property. UM. I went to my truck, grabbed another tree stand, and then I went out and I actually hung a stand on the south end of the farm, completely opposite end. I didn't want to mess with anything that Buck I thought was gonna be doing tonight. I said, okay, he's gonna probably go about whatever he's doing in the evening, which I don't know what the hell he's doing in the evening, but I want to be away from him. So I was like, let me go see, let me check the other side of this property and see what I can't get into it. So, um, I found a little good trail through some six CRP betting, and I hung up in a sapling like four ft high and literally and I actually passed up a hundred that night. First sit of just getting out there, walking, getting out a good trail. It was as simple as that good trail, beating the CRP, good tracking it all right, Well this this seems as good as play as any. I'm gonna feel my tech in my morning anyway. So you know that was kind of the thought I had in my mind. Hunted there. Um. You know that one night UM backed out next morning, you know, I came in from the opposite direction due to what the win was doing. I just wanted to have a little bit of a better own access from where I've seen that trail where he was coming through. I didn't want to bump him if he was still on his way there. I got to put in that stand and killed in my seven ten at ten yards. I literally was, you know, ten yards down wind of the bed that I just kicked him up out of. I don't know if he was going to bed in that same spot or he might have betted, you know a little bit down or it was a giant thicket in there, and there were kids everywhere. But I knew that, you know, I just called myself, well if I manipulate you know this area is because as I can, you know, I I'm gonna kill him so and he died. So it's just kind of one of those uh um, those those situations of constantly moving, you know, even even the fact of like I remember talking to Buddy mine He's like, why don't you just jump? And I know, my old man, you should do this a lot like he would have jumped right in that stand when he said it, and you know, just in case that buck with came back, um, and he would have killed him at evening, you know, if he would have came back, I personally, I like, uh, I've had more luck, you know. Um, depending on the temperament of the deer. Like if you bump a deer off his um, his uh his bed and and sometimes you see him and they'll they'll almost like scamper off maybe like fifty yards and stop and look back. That might be a deer You want to be in that stand right away. I mean, if you know he you know what I'm saying, like he might or I think he might have a little bit more of a easy temperament and be more prone to coming right back and you know, you might kill him. He might come back to bed right in that spot when he when he thinks you's gone. Um, if the deer completely leaves, I'll usually give it, you know, I'll let him sort of. I think there's almost like a like, uh I call it like a beat pattern, you know, like a deer might have a pattern, and a beat pattern. You know if he if he runs into danger, he might resort to a bat pattern. And then you know, when he feels like it's all legit and copsthetic, he might circle back to his normal activities. So I in my head, I'm categories and you know, this deer, I mean, this deer took off. He was gone, I mean, you know, like a bat out of hell. He's in me and ran, you know. So um, I'm thinking, Okay, well I'm gonna let him. He's probably in the bed, bet up somewhere else, you know, God knows where, maybe go about a different evening pattern. But I think he'll probably cycle back through and and come back here. So I gave that one an extra day and it proved h it proved to be the right choice. Man. So this is the infamous bump and dump strategy that um, that I've heard a number of people talk about, but in particular your dad. UM, I think has kind of gained a little notoriety around that. UM. I feel like the kind of the crux of pulling that off seems to be setting up properly for that hunt that next Like, how do you actually set up on the bed. So I'm kind of curious what's going through your mind when you you bump a deer, you know it's a buck you want to shoot, when you make that decision of which tree to set up for. I know you mentioned in this case he looked at the wind direction. UM, but can you pride any more detail as far as you did you try to set up within range of the trail or a specific bed, or did you think about how the buck might approach when he came back the next morning or anything like that. So yeah, I think that UM. You know, you know you mentioned the bumping dump, and that's something that you know, I the old Man coined and I think people years ago I thought that was like, you know, something completely crazy, and um, you know that goes along to where some guys like to be in there right away. Um, some guys you know, wait, I've I took what he always did and I you know, not followed it verbatim. But okay, I sort of found on the way and started killing deer where I you know, it almost weren't better for me the other the other way. So with that being said, I didn't start really killing deer with this said for for a while. I mean I I screwed up a more big deer, try and to pull this off. Then, you know, it took a while. And to that point, like you said, you have to where a lot of guys mess up, and I hear it a lot is they'll find these spots, they'll find the deer, they'll kick them off, They'll they'll be in a perfect situation to kind of bring the whole thing home, and they'll they just won't. They won't manipulate the spot. Right. So what I think that comes down to mostly is is really pay attention, look around, don't get um. I think I think the biggest thing is, you know a lot of guys don't really concept the wind direction um, or they think maybe like, well, if I put my centlock soon on, I I should be able to get on, get anywhere in here and kill this deer. And that's it's, you know, probably not the best best attitude to have. Um. Every time is different, but you have to take I think you have to take everything in account. So, UM, if there's one thing my old man told me back in the day, um that I sort of remembered, uh, and then I've definitely adopted in setting up tree stands in any situation is like, um, you know, don't I don't know what exactly said, but in the lines that don't be greedy like so, you know, so I tell people a lot this you know nowadays that I talked to like you know, something that I you know, learned from him back in the day. But you're never gonna get everything. So so many guys and especially guys like us like we're we don't kill there at fifty yards like we we can't or I mean I can't speak for that. I can't kill there at fifty yards. My you know, I like them close. I like a super close shot. You know. I don't want to worry about having a because I don't shoot that much, probably, but but I just so back to what you you know, it's you're never gonna get at all. So so many guys go in there and they start looking like, okay, there's bed right here, there's a rub there, there's a trailer there, there's you know, um, you know just over here this and they start like trying to they start trying to become infatuated with covering uh, you know, a football field size area when like, realistically, if you just if you if you prioritize and you think, you think about it, you know, so win direction is number one. You know, you can't let's say, let's say you got his trail right, you gotta you gotta beat trail coming into that to that his bed or or this little betting area right. Um, and you know in your body that okay, you know your mind or whatever your mind, your body, what you're thinking about it. You're like, this deer is coming up this ridge on this trail. The you know, the sign tells me this, and he's betting in this, um, he's bedding in this you know this bed right here, and you got it all figured out. But if you if you don't have a wind hunt that trail, well, you're you know, you can't hunt it. So so many guys like I said, well no, I think i'm and then they try and they try and tell themselves why I think I'll get away with it. I'll bring my those eyes in here or else. That's where guys start messing up, like so, first and foremost, I look at the wind. If I you know, even if that near was two right right, I bumped them out of there, and I looked at the wind. The next morning they would have been at east wind. I wouldn't hunt it because I couldn't have. There was that spot. There was just it wasn't plausible. I just so happened to be having a good wind of what was going on. So I think, and I used to try and do that. I used to try and fight it and force it and think like, okay, well yeah, I know he's on this, you know. But to that point, you know, so first and foremon as a wind, you know, I mean, you gotta get a wind that's gonna um let you hunt that area. I think, all I know, um, you know, Then I started looking at like, okay, would'd rather shoot a bedlar rather sho trail. What I'd rather shoot. I'd rather shoot them all. But I let the wind dictate what I can cover and where I where I understand um in that area, that's that's that's it. Yeah. So one of the questions I have then, regarding the wind you hunted on is if hear some people talk about how they tend to see mature bucks coming to their beds. I've heard people talk about like a j hook where they might circle in and come down wind of the bed that they want to get to and check it before walking into it. Have you seen anything like that or do you think about anything different as far as how you anticipate a buck moving in. I've seen that, Um, but I don't. I don't even think about that like I I have you know, you know, I always keep that knowledge in my head about like okay, well, dear, typically do this or you know there are big bucks in the past have done this, or you know, um, but I very rarely try and some all bucks up into into um into like a you know, all the same thing. Um this dear trying to think of how that exactly exactly laid out? Um. I knew that the only place that I could shoot this year with the north wind was um, it was actually I think I was probably twenty yards from where he was vetted, um, you know, ten yards from the trail, and there was a lot of other sign that was that was farther over. Like you know, I could see he was. He was, you know, browsing around, rubbing some stuff up and like he was doing a lot of stuff in that area. But I knew that's the only ride could beat. So you know, to that point, if he would have came in in in jay Hook. But if he would have came and you know, um, you know with the wind in the wrong direction, you know, like the like the popular or whatever that may have been, it didn't matter because that was the only place I could beat. So that's not gonna you know, affect um, you know, be being in there now. I also looked though, and I'm I mean, I pretty much I dial it down to where Okay, like you know this, I've seen the trail, you know, I've seen his tracks on the trail coming up that ridge, So I knew he was looking around that ridge regardless, you know. So it was just one of those things that um, you know, in that scenario, I I took that. I took all I to get, you know, that was it? Yeah, I love that point you make about the fact that you can't be greedy, like you can't have it all. I I definitely used to fall into that same trap where I was thinking, I need to cover this and this and this and or or I do the what IF's game, so I would like to think about where to hunt, and I think, well, he might do this, so I should be trying to take advantage of that. But what if he did this, Well, then I may want to move my trees to inten yards further this way, because then I can maybe cover that lane. And then maybe if you hit this scrape and then you have like six different what if scenarios and you try to maybe set up for all of them. But then what inevitably happens, at least from my experience, is that if you try to set up for six what if scenarios, that so you maybe have a decent chance at each different scenario, You're not set up perfectly for any one of those. So it's it's kind of a shitty situation if he does any one of them. But what I've started to do more and more and I'm curious to hear if you think this is if this makes sense or not. But I've kind of started to do this. I'm I'm in my head. I'm kind of calling it like my truth and assumption, like a methodology or something. I'm I'm coining this thing in my own head as I'm saying it. But but I look at the situation and I say, Okay, what do I think this buck's gonna do? Like, what do I think is the most likely thing is gonna do? And so let's say I think the most likely thing is that he's betted in Spot A and he's gonna walk from Spot A down this trail to feed in Spot B. If I had if you put a gun in my head, that would be my number one guest, based off of the sign, or based off of past experience, or based off trail cameras, whatever dad I have. And so instead of looking at that as one of like six possibilities and trying to set up for all six, I'm now saying, Okay, I'm going to assume that my number one guess. I'm gonna assume that's truth, like that is what's going to happen. And then I make all my decisions, assuming that's a truth. So I'm going to set up perfectly for that one thing. I'm gonna access perfectly for that one assumption. I'm going to you know, everything is going to be for that one scenario. And I'm kind of fine. That's working better because most of the time you're gonna get it wrong anyways. But if you set up perfectly for one scenario, every once in a while that scenario does happen, and then you end up having the perfect situation to get a shot, versus you know, never ending up getting the perfect situation because you're always setting up for six What ifs um? Does that make sense at all? No? Yeah, I understand um. And And it's it's sort of like, you know, I kind of have the same philosophy and stuff, like for how my my standard set up, Like if you know, I might be covering you know, a trail and US grape or whatever. But and there there's the opportunity to get more. But I have to like set my stand just a little farther over and I know, I, okay, well that that shot will be a standing shot. This want to I don't even do it because like I killed the majority of my dear with I always put I'm sort of a definitely a I wouldn't say O C D per se, but like there's a there's a thing though, there's a there's a way I like to do things. And it's always the same. And the majority of time when I kill a deer, I'm I'm sitting down and I know exactly where he's gonna be, so I'll I'll cut out a lot of access stuff that I could cover just to have my stand at perfect direction towards there's minimal movement, and I'm ready to kill like like in that position, Like I love shooting sitting down and all my stands, you know, I take that account. So I I start to like you said, you know, you got your you know your a route or whatever whatever you're saying it is. But that's what I'm picking. That's what I'm setting up on them. You know if it if I hunt her, you know, you know on my winds, good he does something else, well I'll kill him the next day. I'll move on to the next day. You know. It's it's I'm ready rocked in that scenario. You know, there's it's just one of those things where okay, but if that if that deer comes in, he doesn't think he's gonna do It's not like one of those deals were like, oh, well, you could coming behind me, and then all of a sudden you don't realize it and then he's behind you a fifteen yards and there's no way you can stand up turn around. Like I never I never want to have that happen, Like that's the worst um, that's the worst feeling in the world. Or even just never want to get handcuffed. Now I've been handcuffed in the past, and that one, No, it's not happening anymore. Like it's just I'd rather miss one, and I have missed a lot. I'd rather miss one, you know, just clean, you know, and and being right on the money. Then something something stupid like that where you can't even get a shot, you know, and you never even knew you know, he could be dead, but you didn't. You didn't you tried to, You tried to be a hog and tried to cover too much area, you ain't set up right, and you didn't think it out, you know. I think it's very important for these guys even too, like when they're setting up stands or anybody. Think it out man, like, think okay, think about your thought about this, Think about where I hear is gonna come from. Think about what shot you're gonna take when you're gonna draw about like a lot of that. You know, there's there's all this scouting process and finding spots and and setting up stands, you know, and then there's even more to it. It's like, you know, some people do all that and they do it great and then all of a sudden they just crumble when the beer shows up. So I think, you know, having it in your mind, no one, what's going to happen, no one, you're gonna kill, no one when you're gonna kill, like all that really makes a big difference. Yeah. Yeah, those little details they matter, Oh yeah for sure. So speaking a little details, um, drilling in just a little bit more on this specific kind of bumping dump type scenario. When you get in there, you've figured out based off the wind and a little bit of the area you can see, you figure out the right tree set up, and um, do you worry about doing any kind of trimming once you get up to the tree or or anything like that, or do you say, okay, I'm just gonna hang the stand right here now and not touch another thing because I don't want to leave my scent anywhere or mess with that anymore. What's your balance? So just goes staying before I got my shirtain way that I do it. So I'm gonna pick that tree where I can get in my position and I can be ready to rock, you know in that seated shot you know across the left shoulder like it's it's that's just what you know, or my my shoulder. It's just that's the way I do it. So if I gotta trend, if I gotta freaking cut down a um, if I gotta cut down the tree slized my leg to make that happen, I'll do it like if if if obviously, if I can, if I'm not, if I'm a you know, a piece store, um, just because I know I'm gonna be there waiting and I don't carebably I'll senter that freaking area up crazy as long and I'm so bad. If I know I can't get in there, well then i'll keep I'll get out and I won't I won't toun with it. But your first shot by shot, and you know, odds are by the time they realize, oh ship, you know something. You know this this is not the same place. You know, unless you know how they are. You can have dad if you do it right. So, so taking this tree stand setting up question a little bit further than can you just walk us through in general, how you actually go about setting up your mobile stand, whether it be uh, you know, whether it's a bumping dump or just a regular hunt you're sneaking in to set up your standing hunting that day. Um, like the exact specific scenario, like you set your backpack on the ground, you hook up a row, Like what exactly do you do from the moment you pick your tree to the time? Year up in it? Okay, so this is, um, yes, this is how I go about it. Now I'm gonna go through it. How um, I'm gonna use like even our new setup which makes this this this completely and a game changer, completely different story now with how this works. So, um, you know, typically I have I have my stand in my backs um sticks understand, packs it up, you know, strapped to that bone hand. You know, I always always pretty much have my bone hand. So, UM, what I will do when I find that spot? I will you know, take the stand off my back, and you know, with the intention of that being the only time that stand cooped up my back is the first time take the stand off my back and taken the bag, put it on the ground, and I hook my co rope up to my bag and my bowl, so my bag in my bowl are sitting on the ground. You know. I take the sticks off my stand and I put the stand back in my back. So now I got my stand on my back, UM bowl and the UM bags looked up at my tie rope. So then I just I start. I started at the tree. You know, I usually put about UM depending on how I need to get I might start out with a couple of screwings or whatever, or just my sticks. But I put the first one to two sticks on the tree when I'm on the ground, you know, one at at that stepping level and one as high as I can reach. UM. And then I have the the last two sticks UM or three or four you know on my stand, so I can reach right back and grab him as I'm going up. So UM, I just my my goal is to get up in one shot. UM. I don't want to come back, and you know, don't now if if I'm setting up something I'm not gonna hunt for you know, a couple of days, I won't even or I'm not going out until later. I won't even drop my door, or I'll just leave it there. You know. I'm not I'm too worried about getting up there in one shot. But I'm going on like a hanging hunt. I definitely want to get up there once. I don't want to be sweating. I don't want to you know, have any you don't have it be uh um, you know, kind of more difficult than it needs to be. So um. You know, go up with the sticks hanging to stand down, you know, then I get my stand said it, and then then I can pull on me here, you know. So it's it's that one, that one one shut up cover. I mean, I'll definitely look for cover over anything. I don't hunt high. Um. I'd say ninety percent of the times I'm I'm between eight and fifty feet um, you know, and more so even I said, if I had to pick a height that I was at, like if I had to pick one, height would probably be you know, majority of the time maybe ten ft twelve feet, you know, if I'm in the bottom and I need to, you know, get away with some some you know, the thermals or whatnot. Or if it's something that I need to get real high, I'll get I'll get as high as I need to. I'll get twenty sometimes. But UM, I would rather be low and high any day. So is that for Is that simply because it allows you to get up faster and with fewer sticks, or is that because you know, you just don't want to be high, or is it because the better shot angles or you know, why are you doing that? I think it's everything. So I like, less equipment on my back at all times is definitely a plus. Get up quickly. Um, there's tends to be more cover down low. Um, you know shot angles. You know, nothing's cutter than a you know, ten yard shot, and you're just a couple of feet higher and deer. I mean it's sometimes you get real high and you throw some creased angles and it's and it's a pain. Um. But I truly believe that there's a there's a there's a spot in there. Um sounds weird, you you might think it's um kind of the opposite, but I feel like there's a spot in there where you're not like eye level, you're not opposite street, and it's almost like this little money zone that I feel. It's like it's like a miss. Now, don't get me wrong, when you hunt is high, you have to be you gonta have your wits about you. You gotta be s healthy. You can't be swinging your for head left and right. You can't be you know, uh, playing pac Man on a percent of time. I mean, you know, you've got to be ready to rod and you gotta know what you're gonna do. But like when you're in that, when you're at that height, I almost feel like they look for you. They're not even you know, people talk about about they're looked up all the time, you know, and and which they very well might do. And then might be because you're sitting that they've seen in the same stand every day, or you're you know, and they used to looking for those street stands or whatever. But I do feel that there's a there's a mid heighting there that people are scared than that because they think it's too low. But I do it, like think like that's a better height to be at. I feel like there's less association from with danger at that height and you know, it's it's so I feel like it's kind of a in every aspect i'd just like to be you know, especially if you get some covered. Man, if you get some like real not really cover that low. I mean, I think that's the most invincible, like seniors like those you know, not real mature seniors, but man pan street off the ground and a senior tree. Um, I didn't talk. That's like that's like what death should look like in the in the dictionary. I mean it's it's, yeah, that's hard to it's hard to beat that. So. Um So then that brings me to trimming a little a little bit more on the trimming aspect. Are you Are you then in a situation like that, leaving as much cover as possible and just trim me out a lane to your to your one best spot you're like a location or do you try to have multiple shot opportunities available to like how do you balance that? Um? I definitely go so normally, mean, especially like a sediar situation, if it's really thick, I'll definitely focus on the couple of main You know, there's there's some stuff that's so thick that I hunt that you couldn't possibly trem lane every every trail, So that's where you gotta be more focused in on and a lot of times when it's real thick, I'll just I might even just set up on one trail. I say, Okay, I know he's gonna come down here. I'm gonna be seated ready to shoot him, you know, and this is my only shot, you know. I mean, I gotta by the time I see him, at the time he's dead, it'll probably be two seconds, you know. So there's a lot of that that I would like to to go on you know, um where you can't really see a whole lot. But to that being said, if I can trim a little bit extra and cover a couple of lanes, I will, Um. I'm pretty uh, I'm pretty critical on myself of of how like I don't know what you'd call it, like my my actions in the stand, Like you know, I know that I'm not getting busted. I'm not moving around a lot like I'm you know, I I sit like percent a time, like just waiting for so I'll sacrifice a little cover Like if it's if there's a bunch of stuff that I think, you know, let's say let's say I can't you know, let's say there's so many hot trails in this little spot, which is which is hardly ever, but that where I need to cover cut electra stuff. I'll cut of the electrac stuff like I need to. I'm I've never been like a you know, a trimming nazi, like I need all this stuff. I need to be covered here, I need to be covered there. I'm definitely not like that. But I also don't drop every day and live down on the tree. So I just I guess I find a happy medium to where, um, I get enough shots and I got enough cover. Yeah that makes sense. So so this whole way of hunting, you know, sneaking in with a stand on your back and sticks like you alluded to earlier in our chat, Like that's become a whole lot more popular over the last i don't know, five years or so, give or take um. More and more people are realizing the benefits of hunting new areas. You know that those first time sits can be so great moving around a lot. So with so many more people kind of taking this approach and you having you know, a ton of experience doing it, also having learned from your dad, who was one of kind of the pioneers in this kind of hunting. When you see or hear all these other people trying this kind of hunt, what do you see as being the most common mistake that you see people making or hear about people making. Is there anything out there that just makes you cringe when you hear about other people trying to do mobile hunting in certain ways? Yeah? I think I I think what makes me cringe is is when people they people failed to notice the obvious. So with all the my biggest and the whole reason why I never really even talked to anybody about hunting. And you know, I don't always get questions from people. I've always been trade show and killed so many good deal like why don't you why don't you talk to I've never wanted to give somebody information and have them take it wrong and mess up or something and be you know, touched or anything. But when people avoid to realize the obvious, Like so, my biggest fear is like even this podcast, people listen to this, and everybody will go out and look for that deer on that bed, and like that that's the only thing they think of in their mind, Like that's you know. And I've had even buddies like this too, you know. So it's like, you know, they go out there and they they hear about this this. You know, they've heard about the bumping up. They hear about oh, man, you know he's been he's been doing like you know, a revise bumping up. It's a little different he's got you know, like they take what we said, Oh, he's got to be the b pattern and that's what I want to do. I'm doing that. And they go out into the timber with that only thing in their minds, and they they avoid the obvious like I've I've seen it happen. I've seen guys so so infatuated with signing a bed or killing a deer over its bed that they overlook like just like low hanging fruit. And that right there is what is what really drives me next because and and here's the perfect example. I was hunting a couple of years ago, um with a guy never hunted before, and you know, I was seeing a buck that I knew was coming out to a certain certain egg field and feeding, and you know, it was just like one of those and he kept saying, why don't you going to kill that buck. Why why aren't you going in there? Or I'm like, I'm not gonna go in there, or why an't you gonna find his bed? Why didn't he dead yet? Why? And I'm like, dude, I'm not gonna go look up his betting routine. And if I don't, if I can kill him on his field edge, like he's literally coming out to this field as soon as I get that west wind, I'm slipping in there. Like you know, it's one of those things where where so many guys then they get they get so infatuated with the one way of doing things. You gotta keep your eyes open. You've gotta be open to all aspects of it. That if I'm looking for a bed and I find a hot trail, I'll stop. Oh you know, I was looking for a bed, but ship, this is a hot trail. Let me let me jump up here and see what happens. Like I'm not gonna go start just going nuts if I don't have to. So um, I don't know if that makes sense, but um, you know. And then to that point, I think that deer died three days later on a field edge, and I don't kill a whole lot of deer on the field, yes, and I'd rather kill him in the woods. But like what, you know, there's no need to make things harder than they you know, then they need to be same thing with scrapes. It's like, okay, well you know you gotta you gotta scrape. It's getting pounded. Let's see you walk by every day. That thing is getting pounded every day, and it's just I mean, it's just getting hammered. Put the damn scrape. You know, some people, like God, they got like this this um, this this thought. Why can't you know? Some they they think it's too easy. They're like, oh, well I can't. You're not gonna come back a scrape and shoot in daylight hours or you know, you hear you hear that the old fable tale of not fable tale, but you hear the tales of like guys shooting bucks right and next to right by the parking lots and puppic crowns. Sometimes people are so don't get me wrong, Yeah, the deeper you can get them, farther away from people, you can get as good. But some people overlooked at that completely obviously obvious sign that is right at the parking area you know. I mean, it's just want to and they see it and they sink in their head it can't be, it can't be it's right next to the parking area. Well, I promise you it is like that. These design ain't lying you. It's not fake, you know. So I guess, yeah, that maybe a long winded explanation of it. But what overlooking the habits, I'd say, yeah, man, that's such a great point, and it's it's you kind of brought up something that that I'm sure we're all guilty of just some degree, which is right. You hear, you hear these kind of rules sometimes in the hunting world, like don't hunt scrapes because of whatever. You know, lots of people have shown research that it's it's just nighttime activity now or so much of it's nightimiative versay, don't hunt too close to parking lots or um. Yeah, there's all these kind of maxims out there that many times maybe you're true, and so they get talked about a lot and then that though, becomes like a rule that some people have, and it's it becomes a real negative. If you're never willing to color outside the lines. Sometimes if you're not willing to see what you said like the obvious sometimes or try different things, or be willing to be flexible you know you're gonna miss out. And uh, you know. One example of that, and this is something that I, um, I fall into this myself quite a bit, is the the popular notion that hunting mornings in the early season or in the late season is something that's maybe not recommended in a lot of cases. And so I've been someone who said that often, at least in my scenarios. I found, like, man, it seems really risky a lot of times to go in there in certain situations, and maybe the upside isn't as high. So because of that, I don't hunt a ton of warnings now, I know, though there's certainly scenarios where it can be great. I know you're a guy who does really like those early season mornings. Um, can you kind of walk us through why that works for you and why that's one of those rules that maybe shouldn't be so set in stone always? You know? I don't. I don't know, and I think, um, I know, I've talked about this a couple of times, but I do not know where the know she came from? So I think maybe a combination of you know that that quote unquote lull of movement um or um you know, temperature or whatever it may be, that it's keeping people out of the you know, from hunting in the mornings. I think a lot of that stems with people are so conditioned to hunt a certain area and have a certain image in their head, like there's there's so much like, you know, everybody wants to shoot that that that buck, you know, coming diagonal into a freaking decoy on a field age like, and they they have they have all these visions that I think they see through mainstream hunting today, that that they picture in their head and they want that to be right, you know. So you know, guys, you know, this gets built up and they have an idea of how they'd like to kill something or at least what they see on TV, whether it be through you know, on this luscious big food plot you know, um, which is deer coming right in or or you know whatever, and they fail to realize, like you know, you have to um, it's a different like when these deer are killed in the morning, at least when I killed these deer in the morning in October, I'm these aren't. These aren't great hunts that like you you you'd go home and tell your buddies about. They're not like, dude, I've seen you know, I've seen three bucks and they were sparring. Or I've seen I've seen twenty deer today and you know, and and it's um uh you know, or or I was loaded, I was covered up all more. And these are these are specific little missions to kill a specific deer most of the time, or like with me, a lot of these times, like when I kill in the morning in October, like that's the only that's the only deer I see. And and you know, it's it comes down to one of those things that you know, I've said for a long time that I'm I'm sure I probably you know, um picked up from somewhere, but like, well, you want to stay here and have a good time, or do you want to kill it, dear? And if you really ask yourselves that, you know you're gonna see more, dear, and you're gonna have quote unquote better hunts in the evening in October on food sources or whatever the hell you're doing. But you know, I mean, I think they're gonna have more it's gonna be a shittier hunt, but you're gonna have more success. So I think a lot of that is is a is a way people envision themselves hunting, and not a lot of people like there's also that fear of getting into the woods because now you know, you're probably not gonna have all that much luck early season October on the field legs in the morning, like, that's probably not where you want to be, you know, Uh, you want to be more so where they're bed and you know, you know, figure out that pattern and be closer in on them and get them, you know, coming in there. So I think it's just it comes down to it's a different it's a completely different hunt, a different style. Um, you know altogether that makes sense. I don't know if I'm can in circles or what. No, it makes sense. UM. Now I want to lay out a scenario for you and you tell me if if Um, I'm guessing. I guess. What I'm trying to say here is I'm guessing that that morning hunt approach in October is situational. Right. There's certain situations where it could work really well. There's certain situations where maybe it's not as is recommended, and you tell me if this is if you think it's right around. But let's say you hunt just a small property. You only have a twenty acre property of which there's just one good betting area of timber on it, and on any given year, you'll be lucky if there's one mature buck, and that one mature buck usually like you don't get a whole lot of chances of that deer because you're in Michigan and there's hunting all around you, and if you if you bump that deer a few times once or twice, you're probably not gonna see him moving Daylyn. That's maybe what you know about your area. Now, if that is your scenario, would you agree that pushing in there for morning hunt into that one betting area you can hunt in early October that might be pretty high risk. And maybe in that scenario you would say, well, maybe you try something different, because if you go in there in the morning and he doesn't give you a shot, but you have to walk out of there and blow it out or whatever it might be, is that kind of scen there and maybe hey, it's it's too risky, you shouldn't do it, Versus maybe you got a big property with a bunch of different betting areas. You could hunt in the mornings and if it doesn't go good today, you could try again somewhere else tomorrow. Is that make sense? You know? So so there's yeah, there's a I would come at this from so many different angles. I would. I would literally, you know, depending on the property, depending on you know, I think you said you have neighbors are hunting right now when you're hunting, that's what you're saying. I would saying that example, a lot of you know, depending on depending on perimeter pressure. You know what this means, you know, I would take I would really start diving into this. So I mean, do I have a history with this deer? Like, is you know, do I know where he's feeding? Am I seeing him a day? Like? Do I got pictures of him? Is he a deer that I think he's there? Do I know he's there? Like? Is he like if I know? If I know that deer is bettered in that? You know, So this is your forty you should know this thing that's the back of your hand. I would think from shed hunting and all this stuff, if you have that idea where that deer is on that forty, Um, and you know he's better there, and you like maybe he's going out to the I don't know where he's coming out, but um, you know that's where I would calculate. Okay, well here's a chance, like you know, is this dear a world record? Like where I you know, like where like and if I bump him and he runs, like I know, there's a guy in a tree stand, you know, freaking I could see him in my com binos, you know that would that would definitely have a have a factor. I've always been the kind of guy that like, you know, if well, if I bump them, I'll find another deer. You know, I'll go, I'll go, you know, hunt a different deer or whatever or if or if if something something happens with that. So I think that would take a play. But where I think guys have the most benefits if they like, if this is your forty and you know this thing like the back of your hand, like and you know where that dear is betted, You'll probably have a really a good idea of like, oh ship I could get in this story and I could be invincible, you know, I mean, how is your access if you can't if you got to run through the betting area or uh, you know, access will play a big factor. Um, I do not think I would be able to resist going in and hunting that deer in the morning. I think I would do that immediately and I and I think, you know, eight times out of those time, I'd probably come out with that deer. You know. But there's also the you know, the factor, well is he coming? Like one of your food plots, like is he coming? Are you seeing him come out? Is he traveling? Like can Like it's one of those things like avoiding obvious, like yeah, you might know he's better there, but are you seeing him in the evening? Like is he is he just making it out there at last light? To where like you think that a couple more days or a week you might kill him, you know, because you also got to think too, my biggest concern, Like in that situation, I think I'd probably be on that beer. You know, I would probably hunt him a couple I would hunt him in the evenings a few times if I was as scared to get in there and if nothing was happening, I would go to the deer instantly because I've lost out on so many deer that when they start getting squarely laid out over and when the ruck kicks in, somebody else is gonna shoot that deer anyway that deer is gonna be So if you only got forty eight years, you better get your get the let out and go after that sucker because the odds and him making it through a freaking rut and then through a gun season and then like you know, I feel like you're being patient and holding your vices are they're they're completely like you know, if you if you want to talk to me in a gambler man, you're more likely to succeed going in there, and maybe you might bump that buck out of there, but he's better there for a reason, You're more likely to succeed by pushing the envelope then, you know, betting on that thing making the entire season. Yeah, yeah, that's that's something that I always, uh have been reminding myself of, is that fact that they're betting somewhere for a reason. Like these deer they're not they're on a whim. They found a safe spot and even if you muck it up once, like they're gonna want to go back to it. Yeah, if you go in there every day for ten straight days, that he might be screwing things exactly. You I've seen people just butcher betting areas, like they're literally in there trying and no fault to them. Stuff they're trying to learn. So they go in there all the time. Well, that's not the best. You know that, that's not what you want to be doing, because because by us, for sure, you know you're gonna you're gonna run into that situation where you know, if that deer is getting pressured that much, he's probably gonna you know, it's just it's just the fact of it. You know, whether that be two times for that deer or six times, I could you know, I'm sure that will depend on how long he's been there. You know, a lot of times there're pecking order two, so who are like you know, some of them you don't want to move because that's there, that's their zone, Like they've earned that zone, they've worked for it, you know. Um, and if they move something else, a lot of times come in you know. And that's so I mean, there's a lot of different different ways to look at that too. But you mentioned you mentioned a couple of times that you would go in there and hunt that morning. You know right away you get in there instantly and take a stab at him. Do you mean that literally or do you mean like the first time conditions are right? I guess what I'm asking is, are there any certain types of weather triggers or something or moon or whatever that makes you think, Okay, this is the best possible day to hunt one of these mornings set ups? You know. I know that a lot of guys talk about red moon times or hunting cold fronts, different things like that. Do you wait for anything like that to give you a little better chance or do you just go? Um? I pretty much just I would pretty much go and I would just make sure that when I went in there to make the uh, like, I would make sure my ASSISI situation was right for for that time specifically. Now, if you got you know to that point, you know, if you've got a really on moon face coming up and you've got a nice food plot that you think this there is gonna be you know, that's more so like where okay, I'd probably time that, like if if it's gonna be one of those you know, you know, red moon times where you think that bluff is gonna be feeding being your food plotter in a nearby you know, as point in like three days. Well, I, you know, I don't know if I'd go in there, and I'd probably give that a shot, you know, if it all depended it on you know, what information I had to me, but not that I would wait for an optimal time to go in there. I would just make sure that when I went in there, I was completely right for you know now like you know that comes back you know on the property. I look at it and know where he's betting. It's just completely ship with these wins. I obviously wouldn't go in there then when I had these funds coming up for if I had any start of east Head, maybe make sure I had a you know, the best win for that spot. And it really makes it a lot a lot better and you can really think about it more when you know the area, Like if you've literally set boots on where you think he's bett it, well, then you can really forming at a game plan, and you might if you think he's so you know, dead's hed in that area, you can you know, you can wait a couple days like okay, it says it's gonna be chilly this morning. I'll probably be a stew a little long and owning I'm gonna slip back there, and I wanna you know, I want to. I'll catch him a little later coming to come into it better. So yeah, I would definitely, um, you know, used to is like that to my advantage. But I also like to never let that stop me from hunting. Like what I know, that's when it comes back to avoiding the obvious. I do believe in the moon phases, right, So I mean I've watched the moon. I take that into account. In no way or shape or form do I let that dictate, you know, everything about my hunt. I have killed great care on field as just when that moon tastes is seeing you know, to be in any it's that time. So it's just you know, in vice versa, it's I take it into account. You know, I'm taking account thing. Okay, if you're gonna be more like cakes to be feeding at the time, you know however that works to take you pull out whatever it is, make him, you know, more like that as a whole. Nothing beats that time. So it's like that, you know that that signs there and what you know, it goes into the moon fays Well, don't tell yourself. Oh well the moon phase says this, So I can't be hunting this right now. That's that's just I don't. I don't. I don't get that for sure. Yeah, I think that that makes a lot of sense. It can be a helpful you could be a helpful tool. But if you just like anything kind of a lot of things we talked about, right, there's a lot of different kind of tips out there or things that usually this is the case, but if you ever get too deep into any one of these, you start missing out on the obvious things that are all around you that you need to be taking advantage of. Exactly. There's just there's so many things that like, this guy might kill there, and he's a freaking and he's a he's a moon he's a moon advocate through and through. This guy might kill him, you know, all these big gear and he's a you know, betting area Taylor and two and through. And then you know you got an other guy was there that only hunts field there, just only hunts about a southeast wind and only not someone goddamn you know, a certain rare flowers, blood, you know, all those things might be great, but it's like we're a guy. I think he has to take those things in, you know, and and figure out, um, you know, figure out for yourself. You know. I was in what its helps, but it's it's you know, just like to that point. But you know I have, um, everybody's got thrown smile. But to be open and to and to be able to adapt, um is where you're ultimately going to be the it's gonna be the best hunter you can be. And and I think experiencing those things, like you know, you're better for him. Like you know, you go through those you're constantly learning, you know, and you've got to keep a constant open mind. If I see something like it against everything that we've been talking about, like on this podcast next year, I will completely throw everything out of the window and go into what I'm seeing, what is true, what's real right for me? So I think that's a um, you know, if if there's something where I think because I've I've been in that situation before too, like i've uh, you know, a big deer that I killed a couple of years ago. Like I was started to seeing silence, right on this road and I'm like, and I really see it, and I'm like, you know what? And I was thinking like, could that be here? Could that be this? You know, there's this big Bucks cup and hunting. No, No, he wouldn't be right here. He's a smart for that. He wouldn't be right here, you know, And until I slapped myself in the face and was like, who says He's like, well, you know, maybe that's the smartest before. You know, maybe this is where he and I mounted it. You know, I heard it that and then four days later I ended up telling it here. It's just one of those things that you've got to pull yourself out of that that, you know, making assumptions and you know, pigeonal and everything. Yeah. Yeah. If there's anything I've learned from, you know, running this podcast over the years, it's that there are so many different ways to do this thing, and you gotta stay open to new ideas and try things out and learn as you go. If you get stuck in a rut, I mean, that's one of the worst things you can do. Yeah. Yeah, So we're running up on time here, I'm gonna if I don't catch myself here, I'll sit here talking to me for six hours and your day is gonna shot. Um, So I want to just wrap it up with with a couple quick final questions. If you had to do a really quick like self analysis and think through what your biggest weakness is as a hunter, because we've talked about a lot of things that make you successful, why you've done so so well in the woods. But is there anything that you could pick out that might be a weakness of yours that you maybe its hurt you a little bit at some point as a as a hunter. And yeah, as a hunter, um not I think I get so I get so um caught up in there's there's probably two things that come that come around right away and when one would be um falling back into that. I think it's natural for everybody, and it's a big thing I preach because I know it's one of my weaknesses. And that's why I try and tell anybody who's interested in listening to not do it. And that's dwelling on the past. I there's so many times where I getting getting situations and I have that I have that corn and tore I should go in there and set up should dick me twenty minutes. It ends up taking me twenty minutes. Did I start to replay all highlight reels in my head and think about that slimmer that I killed, that that tree and oh that tree I set up before, it's a regular rock on the trim thing like it's right in the area. And I, like I said, I keep myselfing us again and I'm like, what are you doing? You know, like, that's not the trade this year. The trade this year is X trays over, Like, don't be lazy. He's trying something that tree to feed over and get down and and that I think that is a big I think, um, that's probably one day thing. And like I said, I try and um, I considered a weakness that, but but it's constant in my head. So it's something I personally I still hell for because you know, I think it's natural though you know, you know, thinking about things like that. The other thing would be, um, um, probably what I'm gonna focus on now, you know, more so spending more time on the archery end of things and the honey of things. Like it's it's weird, you know, you talk to different people and you see like where you know, you can see where their time is spent, and like, I'm so so much into the hunting and the chess game and the figure out that I'll I'll consistently create opportunities for myself the entire year. But like, like you know, it's like, dang, you know, I should have been shooting more like I didn't. You know, I didn't follow with that shot. I didn't follow through with that shot. So I you know, so I missed him, you know, or you know a lot of that kind of stuff. So I think maybe, you know, on the back end of things, you know, one of my biggest weakness is not looking at um all the aspects of it, you know, like like just archery, Like dude, man, you know, get tech, you with your you know, get familiar with your boat a little bit, you know, get to know this, get to know that, you know, do a little bit more. I'm so like just hunt, hunt, hunt, scout, scout scout, like you know, and and it's um, you know, not not a place I really put a lot of my time. Well, uh, that was gonna be. The next question is what's one thing you might do differently this year? So you got that one covered, which is interestingly one of the things I'm gonna be doing too. So um yea man, Cody, this is uh, this has been fun, really interesting stuff. I've enjoyed your perspective, I think, uh, I think a lot of it falls in line with a lot of things I've been thinking about. So this is great to hear from you. If if folks wanna I want to learn more about what you guys got going on with the gear and everything, you want to give us that website address for war time, Uh, it's www dot long Wolf Custom Gear dot com. Um. And you know we're also on on Facebook and Instagram. We just we just started those pages as well, so I mean we're gonna be uh posting stuff on there. Um And yeah, I mean that's that's pretty much will be the main avenue for the products. Um and uh well also to my you know, my personal Instagram page. I'd like to like I'll be putting out some inside scoops and some of the products and release dates down there as well, so that might be good avenue for people to get would check as well. Perfect well, I'll definitely make sure we've got those links up there. And man, I just want to thank you for taking the time to chat This is a lot of fun, Cody appreciate it. Yeah, thanks thanks again, Mark, Man, I just you know, that's what that's what we do. Man. We love talking about this stuff, so it's always fun. It is a good time, that's for sure. Well, until next time, Cody, good luck with your offseason prep and hopefully shoot some slammers. Is here? Yeah you too, Mark, and that's gonna do it. So I'll just leave you with a few quick reminders. Um as usual, if you haven't left a review on iTunes, it would be hugely appreciated. It doesn't take very long and helps a ton. Also, if you want to see more of what I've got going on and more of the wire, dhunt content over on the Wire Dun Instagram and posting a lot more now doing actually daily Instagram stories. They're sharing different information, sharing what's going on in my life, some things I'm learning about. It might be interested to see what's going on there, So heading over to Instagram and follow Wire to Hunt and otherwise I just want to say thank you, thank you for tuning in, thank you for your support, Hurt, and until next time, stay Wired to Hunt. H

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