00:00:00 Speaker 1: Hey, I'm Tyler. 00:00:01 Speaker 2: You're listening to the Element podcast. What's happening on my woods people? This is the Element Podcast, brought to you by First Light. And my voice sounds really good today because I yelled at football practice. I like it, you know, I've had that just like that depth man, that comes from the diaphragm, you know. 00:00:29 Speaker 1: Sound like our buddy Brent Reeves a little bit. Yeah, you actually impersonated him earlier and it sounded pretty nice. 00:00:33 Speaker 2: I can do it, man, if I if I just yell a little bit that. So we've been doing football practice and by the way, it's the hottest year ever. It's one hundred and five degrees right every day pretty much here, and Dusty, we haven't had rain like a month. 00:00:46 Speaker 1: Uh. 00:00:47 Speaker 2: Conditions on the range are pretty pretty rough right now. 00:00:51 Speaker 1: Uh. 00:00:52 Speaker 2: But that's why football players are good from Texas that are from Texas. They grew up in the hot, Dusty. 00:00:58 Speaker 1: One of many reasons. Stuff right now, in like, at least in the UIL stuff though, they're requiring them to cancel practice if the surface is such temperature or whatever. So I feel like those kids are just gonna die on Friday nights instead of in practice, So. 00:01:11 Speaker 2: I'm not sure. Yeah, yeah, I'm not sure if you know this, but I think society is getting soft. I think they're get a little soft. Yeah, I don't be in tough old boys. There is like some level of like safety that is good. Yeah, you know, but like I know what happens, and there's some things that happened, you know, to people. 00:01:28 Speaker 1: It's it is. 00:01:29 Speaker 2: It is sad, but you know that nobody's forcing them to play football. They wanting to play, right, and uh, you know, it's just one of those things that it could happen to anybody, right, Yeah, you just never know, honestly. 00:01:42 Speaker 1: If there's I just feel like it's swinging too far. If this is a deer hunt podcast by the way, but if you if you don't train to perform, to do the test that you are scheduled to do, when it gets too time for the task, you're not going to be good good at it. You're going to fail, which rolls us right into what we're gonna talk about. 00:02:04 Speaker 2: It ain't even deer hunting is a little bit podcasts, but we talked about other things. 00:02:12 Speaker 1: Uh yeah, so it's hot right now, and we decided if you listen to the last podcast, we were on location in New Mexico hunting nue Nuevo Meico. 00:02:26 Speaker 2: Uh. 00:02:26 Speaker 1: Uh we were hunting uh antelope and having a tough time, and uh, we're gonna talk a little bit more in detail about like some of the setups that we were using, some of our application, some of the things we might change, and then what that looks like going forward this deer season, if maybe some of our antelope experiences, uh change the way we think about archery setups or approach or whatever the thought may be. You know, because really one of the things that you as a hunter should be doing and every time you go hunting, is to take what you learn and apply it to the next go round. If you're not doing that, then you're missing out because it's going to help you kill deer or anelope or whatever else. Right, you got a facto it over there? Yeah. 00:03:15 Speaker 2: The prong horn anelope, according to Google, this is as a result of a little over a half million results on Google, can run sixty one miles per hour. I've heard it's said that it was it's the fastest land animal on Earth. I've heard it say it's the second second fastest animal on Earth. Fastest in North America for sure. Right here it says second fastest animal in the world, and then it says cheetah sixty one miles an hour, So I'm not sure if it's like sixty one point one. 00:03:42 Speaker 1: Dude. 00:03:44 Speaker 3: I've heard a lot of different numbers for the cheatah speed. I have too, Like right there it says cheetah's fifty to eighty. I've heard eighty. I've even heard one. 00:03:51 Speaker 1: Hundred on cheetahs, and I never would believe it, no way, dude. Yeah, Like there they're paumty moving one hundred miles an hour. Yeah, you know, but Nolan Ryan can move his paul faster than that, and he's sixty five, so however old he is, differ looked in that stuff. Like it the way they radar gun pitches and stuff. 00:04:11 Speaker 2: Yeah, they they like try to like actualize his his speed. 00:04:14 Speaker 1: He's throwing like one of six one o seven or something I heard maybe, yeah, yeah, I'm booking it. 00:04:20 Speaker 2: Because the way they they uh, the way that they gun picture pictures today is different than the way they gunned him back then. And it's actually like if it was to if they're a gun him like it was today, it would be like. 00:04:32 Speaker 3: One O eight, So I said Chapman, whuld have no no, he know? Come on, dude, and Rangers bro. 00:04:38 Speaker 1: With all that. No, that's what I'm saying. Yeah, he's a Checksas Ranger. Don't be this and not, I said Chapman, or all as Chapman any other really fast picture Rangers ain't got nothing on. It's a Ranger. 00:04:49 Speaker 2: He's a Ranger, pretty sure, is he not. Let's look this up, Brian. Do you know about that? Are you a baseball player? 00:04:55 Speaker 1: Eric would know? 00:04:55 Speaker 3: Uh yeah, if somebody's not up. I thought he was a Mets guy or something. Texas Rangers. Oh sorry, those are all Rangers. I didn't realize he was a picture for the Rangers. 00:05:05 Speaker 1: How about that? Anyways, neither one of those guys could hit antelope with a baseball, So even though they only run in sixty, they are the fastest things of life. They are, huh. So, Tyler and I went to New Mexico with two fairly different setups, and we both have reasoning for that. I'll explain my setup as to what I hunted Antelope with, and then you go ahead after that. I have a SR three fifty, which is a real fast bow and I have a fairly heavy arrow for that one hundred and thirty seven grains I believe is what it ends up being a total arrowweight. And I was shooting a big three blade mechanical because antelope are fairly small animals and you're not gonna have any problem getting that thing through them, especially with the heavier arrow. So I felt really good about my setup because I can hold those arrows in a really really tight group, even at very long distance. So I liked the way I was shooting that bow before I left. I also have a setup for really light arrows that I didn't shoot quite as well, and I was like, I'm just gonna take this one because I can just hit tacks at like sixty with this thing. So that was my plan. I headed out there, Tyler, What was your arrow set up? I had? 00:06:30 Speaker 2: My arrows were four hundred and thirty grain arrows with one hundred grain tip. 00:06:36 Speaker 3: So total airwaight four thirty yep. Yeah, And do you know what speed that was shooting? 00:06:41 Speaker 1: I don't. 00:06:41 Speaker 2: I'm trying to figure out if I can do if there's like a arrow speed speed calculator there is, but there I'm gonna I'm gonna try to calculate speed for you here real. 00:06:52 Speaker 3: Quick, Okay, So I'm shooting at like two sixty one I think is my arrow speed with my setup, and then Tyler's going. 00:07:00 Speaker 1: To put his end here. 00:07:03 Speaker 2: One air rate air rates four thirty just with no additional string rates. 00:07:10 Speaker 1: A little bit of that's not true. It cannot be. I think yours was like three or three. I think that. 00:07:15 Speaker 2: I don't think it was that fast. I think three oh three was the fastest we could get that thing. I thought we got it to like three twenty seven or something. We got it to three oh three was I think the fastest we could get it with like a super light arrow. I would imagine it was in the upper two nineties or something like that, maybe mid two nineties. 00:07:33 Speaker 1: So but you may be right. 00:07:36 Speaker 2: I just I feel like that was like as fast as we could get it. So that because isn't there there's a picture we have that says three oh three on the on the thumb. 00:07:46 Speaker 1: Now we used we used a light light arrow. Let's see in that. 00:07:51 Speaker 2: So anyway that I would assume I'm shooting like, I don't know, two ninety five, because I can shoot another seventy grains, I could shoot to eighty two. 00:08:00 Speaker 1: We got that one A three forty five, that super light one. Really maybe it was three. 00:08:05 Speaker 3: We should have shot that so yeah, for real eight tell you what smoke? 00:08:11 Speaker 1: Oh that is what we did, isn't it. Yeah, that's that's right. It was like a three hundred and fifty green total airawaight or something like that. 00:08:16 Speaker 2: So I'm probably shooting like three oh three, like Casey said, so quite a bit faster. 00:08:24 Speaker 1: Than what he's shooting. 00:08:26 Speaker 2: And I shoot also like another inch I think draw right for half I think half inch? Ye, So you shooting pretty fast set up? Yeah, it's pretty fast. It's our three fifty two. That's what I've been shooting, which I think I'm gonna go away from that this year going forward spooky. 00:08:45 Speaker 1: But anyway, that that was my setup. And how do you feel about yourself? Let's let's let's lay it on the table here. We took some shots at Antelope, right, and how do you feel about how you're set up performed while taking shots at Antelope? 00:09:04 Speaker 3: Uh? 00:09:05 Speaker 1: I don't know. 00:09:06 Speaker 2: My setup was fine, I think, I mean, yeah, it's it's hard to say. I can't place any blame on my setup. I don't think what do you think went wrong? If something went wrong and if you missed an antelope, I missed two antelope, okay, And I think the main issue is getting an accurate range more than anything. What's that what caused you range issues? The fact that you're you've been to Antarctica. 00:09:39 Speaker 1: Probably not if you were to stick your head. 00:09:42 Speaker 2: Up above the snowy penguin and see you from a long way that's where That's what I felt like I was doing out there is like Antarctica, but I don't know one hundred degrees hotter and maybe more than that. And it was like every time you you set up, you got seen if you set up high enough to range. So I'm trying to range between grass and you're hitting grass. That's the whole issue in ground hunting in the white tail. You know, we've talked about it a bunch. We don't love white tail hunting on the ground. We do it some because it's kind of what gives us a chance. But at the end of the day, it just is so hard to get arrange without getting caught. That's clear, and I'm unobstructed, and so you just don't know if you're hitting a piece of grass. It's five yards in front of that thing or ten yards behind it or whatever a lot of times. And then at that point, if you've been seen, then it's like, oh, well he's looking at me. I get drawn now based off of what we might have seen previous. These things are gonna jump the string bad, So I shoot low every once in a while. They wouldn't jump the string half the time. I think they're the weirdest things ever do. But they're gonna jump the string a lot. And I think you add you know some for you, you know, I'm just I'll let you talk about it more. But like you kind of progressively made your way down until all of a sudden that we were surprised that that wasn't happening. But it's like I decided, basically, pretty let's see my second shot. I decided I'm shooting way low because I've seen we have footage of these shots, and these things are jumping the string like no doubt, and so I go to shoot low. And here's what happened. I'll just tell the story of what happened real quick. Essentially, we had like a pattern going. So we go in in the morning and there's a cedar tree that or a few cedar trees. We can kind of sit in and hope these things come right back by us. The next day, I'd already had this group at fifty nine yards, but I couldn't long story short, I couldn't get them accurately ranged confidently. I had a fifty nine yard range amongst about twenty that were in the eighteen to twenty one. 00:11:55 Speaker 1: Yard range or so. 00:11:56 Speaker 2: So I was just hitting a bunch of a bunch of grass, you know what I mean, and struggling to get ranges. I head a fifty nine as the antelope was facing away, and I just didn't feel confident, so I didn't take the shot. They went past the cedar trees. And next morning we go down there getting the cedar trees. As soon as it's getting light, I see them. They get to ninety and mill around, these three bucks milling around for a while, and I see one come out the other side of the drainage pretty close. By the time I had seen him, it was too late. He was going like behind this little hill at probably sixty yards or so. So I was like, okay, we're saying still. I told Michael, who's there? These three are just meeling around for like fifteen minutes, and then all of a sudden they just get on their horse and start walking fast through the draw and back up to the side. By the time I can get them ranged in my gap, all three of them are like fairly broadside at fifty five. I range the closest one at fifty five, and they there's another tree, so they get kind of through my gap. When they get to the other tree, I draw my bow, thinking, you know, I probably need to do it now so I can get a shot. Otherwise they're just gonna get behind this thing. And so I'm thinking, i'man it caught. 00:13:07 Speaker 1: Well. 00:13:08 Speaker 2: I draw in the closest one like that's still broadside. For some time, he kind of just looks over because I think my release or something made some noise, and so he looks over it, but almost didn't even stop. He just like kind of continues walking, and he's like stutters for a second and then keeps walking, and I'm like, please stop, Like, surely they're gonna feed, right, They're gonna stop, right, They've been feeding for fifteen minutes in the same spot at ninety yards. 00:13:30 Speaker 1: He doesn't stop. 00:13:32 Speaker 2: Well, the other two do stop, but they're like kind of getting over the ridge on the back side, and I'm still thinking fifty five because I thought they were coming in a line, and just you know, all this happens so fast. But then so I'm thinking fifty five, and so I'm shooting my fifty yard pen and I'm thinking low too, because they're jumping the string really bad so far, and essentially I'm following that guy. He goes behind the hill and never stops. So I tell Michael, I'm like middle one, middle one, and I'm like thinking about which one do I shoot. Here he's kind of facing me a little bit middle one, and I hold below his chest basically like in the grass. As he's going over the hill. It's going to lob up over right, and I shoot and it looks like money. I mean, it's going just dead nuts where I wanted to. It's going straight at his chest, man, and it gets kind of over the hill, and I can't see it, and I mean I didn't hear it hit, so I don't know what happened. The footage is the same way from the same perspective, Like we have the arrow flight all the way to it kind of goes behind the grass. That's kind of on top of the hill and sinks to him, and I mean, I just can't, Like, I can see most of his chest in my mind's eye, and I can see it going right there, and the only thing I can think is I held fifty below his chest. He was actually at sixty probably, and I was thinking fifty five. And I also so we were in the shadows and the sun was in their eyes. I don't think they knew we were there. 00:15:04 Speaker 3: No. 00:15:04 Speaker 2: I think they heard a weird noise and we're just like, ah, what's that, and then they were fixing it, just go back to feeding or whatever, and so I don't I don't think they jumped the string and so I just had no help. I think I just shot under them. I'm pretty sure that's what happened. So I never found my air or anything. But I mean I knew immediately that there was no hit. So that was my I was actually my last shot. My other shot was very similar situation where the antelope knew I was there. They pretty much know you're there almost every time you sho had them, and just I ended up getting ducked in that situation. 00:15:33 Speaker 1: So I uh, I'm not going to tell people how many times I shot because it's going to remain a mystery until you watch the video. But it was more than Tyler is what I shot. I had a few more opportunities, and I also like tried some follow up shots and different things that were just to no evail as well. But you're on the stalking game, dude. You were doing it, man, I uh, well, kind of doing it. If doing it means like spooking them, I'm doing that getting shot the conservative play. And here's the problem is, like I we both are like just the way we are is fairly conservative and individuals. But in this situation I was pushing in a little bit more than you were because you kind of had like a good spot that you knew would work if you if you let it do its thing. I was just like, well, I know, we're some anelope bar and there's not really great spots. I'm just going to try to go stalk them, which produces shots. However, we don't have any conclusion as to which one works better at this point in time, so I don't know. But the first day I did get a shot in an antelope, and I was like, oh, I'm gonna kill all these things because I got a shot at fifty yards. It was a couple of antelope in a group, and they acted like kind of weird, they like, we got curious about what we were after we spooked them trying to stalk. So I ran up to us, and again I was having a hard time getting a precise yardage because I would click, you know, So I had my hand on my riser right and I had my arrange finder right here. Click and I go to loop on and they'd move like they just constantly. They're almost like a trout in the water, like they're just constantly moving around, you know. They're hardly ever, just like in one spot. So they just like are very fluid in what they do, especially when there's a group. Right when there's one, they'll just kind of stand up and look at you. But they usually stand up like eighty or ninety yards away, So you don't really get an opportunity at those, but like the group, it seems as if sometimes you get a better opportunity in groups than you do singles. But it's tough either way. I got a shot there and I thought that my sight was on fifty one and ends up I had it set to fifty three. You know, I have a roll in side. I have a double vertical pin, and my top side was set to fifty three. I knew I needed to aim low because I thought the animals are around fifty. So I aimed a little low and ends up I missed like probably an inch over the back. I mean it was so close, and in retrospect, the mistake was that I didn't aim low enough for what my pen was set to you, because you just cannot adjust that pin fast enough. But at the same time, if you don't have an adjustable site, you just have usually twenty thirty forty right, like you're gonna have to pin gap anyways. By the way, if you're going andlal punt, you got to have at least a fifty otherwise you're not gonna get shots. 00:18:24 Speaker 2: Less you're unless you're sitting water and blind. And this is something we probably should talk about. It is like we didn't want that situation. Really, we wanted to stalk these things. I'm just I don't I don't even sit all day for a big white tail, Like I'm not gonna sit for a long time. I at for a prong one. 00:18:41 Speaker 3: I would have done it, but we didn't really see them like conclusively hitting water, like the branch there at the house where that pond. 00:18:52 Speaker 1: Well, were they actually drinking water or were they just eating there every day? I don't know they were there every day though, I think they were just eating the grass behind it. So like I personally, I never saw an antelope put lip to water the whole time where we're a. 00:19:04 Speaker 2: Well, I guess I'm not saying necessarily water, but sitting something that they're going to do consistently in a blind you could get you could get closer than fifty in that situation. You just I didn't want to sit in a blind period, and so. 00:19:17 Speaker 1: We don't really have one. Yeah, we didn't bring brought a ghost blind, which we used and it was pretty effective. 00:19:23 Speaker 2: Yeah, but I bet there was one around, but we didn't bring one. Yeah, talk about a good way to get cooked. That's that's another reason I didn't. I just didn't want to do it. Like, I mean, the shade would have been great, but at the same time, you're not get much wind, so it's a it's kind of like what they say six to one way half does in the other you know, it's like. 00:19:41 Speaker 1: Jo said ten to one way, half does in the other one time when we're out there. It's like, I mean, I'm sure it's just the way he's heard it, but I was like, that doesn't actually convey the thought you're trying to make it conveyed unless I misunderstood in my mind have but that's what I thought he said. I was like, that's kind of weird. Yeah, I might start saying it just to mess with people. 00:20:05 Speaker 2: What he's doing to me, Man, probably right, Man, just messing with you around to you that's but I wasn't trying to cut you out. I was just trying to make the point that like you could get you could get shots under fifty if you if you hunted in a stationary spot, I think to spot in stalk. Man, it's like almost impossible to do that. 00:20:21 Speaker 1: I feel like, yeah, uh, there's a few little places that you might have could have. 00:20:26 Speaker 2: And I also different, there's going to be like different country that has like sage and stuff, but this we had no sage at all. I mean, it's just like a foot of grass. 00:20:35 Speaker 1: If you're doing good. Yeah, some of the grass is pretty tall, and like when I say that, I mean like fourteen fifteen inches, So you could barely crawl and be hidden, but a lot of it was seven or eight inches tall. 00:20:45 Speaker 2: Yeah, and you might have some elevation, but then you get to one hundred and fifty yards You're like, I can't do anything at all, dude. 00:20:50 Speaker 1: I had bloody knees and it was terrible. I did fit fine, Like we did a stalk one time. I didn't get a shot on. I was trying to actually get within fifty and I thought I could do it. I had a yuck at like that was gonna be like forty five yards from the antelope, and I was like, he's dead. He's dad, he's dead. Well, I was like three yards from yucky. He stands up, runs off, right, But we. 00:21:10 Speaker 2: Build a long buck. Yeah, they just do it. They just stand up. They do if that. That's another thing. If you're stalking a lone buck, it is completely a different deal than stalking some a group of them because they just completely like wash out and don't think about anything when they're when they have other guys watching for him or other girls watching for him. But when they're by themselves, they're freaked out. 00:21:32 Speaker 1: Yeah. 00:21:34 Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, they like have this thing where they just have internal clock where they sit there for twenty minutes and they say I haven't looked this way, and they look back or whatever. 00:22:06 Speaker 1: Like they just know to check every direction. And then the inverse goes whenever you have the group like you're talking about to not to be mean about antelope. I'm just gonna try to say this in a nicer way than how I really feel. They are not the brightest animals. They don't seem that way to me, at least. I think that whitetail are way smarter than antelope is, and elk too, But antelope have probably better eyes out than humans. I don't know. I feel like too, they pick like if you come over a ridge at a mile in your skyline, they will be looking at you, guarantee you. It's the wildest say people have said this. 00:22:44 Speaker 2: I thought it was just a cliche, but I truly thought, well, they're gonna be just like a white tail. It's gonna be I mean, a white tail can see gray. You can get away with some stuff, you know, but you can get away with some stuff. But like, they're gonna be like a white tail. They see gray, they see people walking around looking like sasquatches out there, But legit think they see better than white tilt for sure. 00:23:03 Speaker 1: And I don't know, a lot of this stuff might be Hollywood and it all goes back to like that t Rex thing from Jurassic Park. But like I feel like it's the movement, like they if something moves at all, they've got it. Now. There was times when I was like pretty close to some dozen stuff and if you're dead, calm still, they kind of ignore you. But you know it makes sense too as a plan's animal. Things that are still don't really cause you a lot of issue because you can see for a long way, so when something's moving towards you, like they're gonna pick it up. Yeah. Anyways, I feel as if an opening group do what the the one that's doing something, the other ones follow it, and oftentimes the one that's doing something is not making the best choice. It's actually the one that's kind of trying to die. And maybe there's like a survival aspect to that of like we're gonna you know, they're not thinking this way, but the way it works is like they keep the other one alive by also joining in with it and making up for what it lacks, you know or whatever, which when you're hunting them actually plays in your hand pretty good. All I'd say, uh, if one of them is gonna stop, the whole group's gonna stop. If one of them, it's like blackbirds in the sky when they're doing that thing. What's it called. Do you remember that fancy name? Whether they're like undulating or whatever and doing the blackbird cloud? I don't know. I'm glad you got your computer here. Yeah, just look blackbirds swarm and see what it's called. But that's kind of how anelope operate. One of them takes off, they're all gonna follow it, and if you see one go a direction you don't want it to, it's over. They're all gonna fall, even if they're not pointing that way. Right now, everyone saw that one will turn back, but usually the whole group will go where that one goes murmoration, not undulation, but memoration. That's it. So that can play into your hand pretty good on a stalk. And it actually a different stalk that I went on that I had to miss on was a buck that we were pretty familiar with. These things are kind of cool. They like they have like a range, kind of like white tail do. But it's it's much more identifiable by physical like land features right where. Uh, there'll be like this little valley that that's where that buck lives. And some days you'll have those with him, some days you want and or like they'll be like a fenced pasture, you know, a pasture out there is is like a compartment, uh, and there'll be three bucks that live in that compartment, and they might leave every once in a while, but for the most part, you're gonna see him almost every day in that compartment and get close to him hard. But we had one that we were real familiar with. We called him heart Shape, which is kind of like a little bit of a joke because they kind of tend to have a heart shaped ip rat all of them. But he really did. 00:25:36 Speaker 3: He hooked in real hard, and he was the first, real tight and narrow and heavy. He's pretty first an lope. 00:25:41 Speaker 1: We saw I think on the trip we were driving in the day before the season and saw him like in the road ditch and we were like, oh, we're about to kill yeah a little do you know in the truck stops they run away. It's funny how that works. But I like two thirds of the way through the hunt, I actually got an opportunity at heart shape. We were both kind of trying to make moves and ambush this guy. I was kind of out in the middle and you were kind of on an escape route that we knew they used often, and they ended up busting kind of up above me up the hill, and I had like a wash to walk in. It was actually really awesome. This like it's not even like a creep bottom, is like a big old deep wash where it just made a gully and you could walk around in and they're undetected. And we snuck up to a spot and they fed around so like they ran like three hundred yards up after they got spooped and just went to feeding again because one of them wanted to eat, so they're like, oh, okay, guess we can eat, you know. And this buck worked to sixty one yards, which I was like, I've got this so good. And he was quartering to me and I drew back. He looked at his doze because they were looking at me, which I was like, Oh, he's gonna be pretty calm. He's not even looking at me, you know, And I aimed kind of low, aimed like ride the bottom of his chest, thinking he was going to dip out, and I was just gonna hammer him. Well, he came out of his skin and wasn't there when my arrow got there, you know, like they're so fast absolutely just I mean he literally you can look it in the footage. He was like two foot to the right of my arrow, and my arrow's tracking good until he freaks out. And I think it goes back to their seining. They're not here in the bow. They're seeing it go off. They're seeing the arrow on the air or something. They have a really good reaction time on this stuff, and that that's another thing they I mean, they are not just straightaway speed fast. They are quick fast like it would blow my mind actually how fast they could pretty much get to top speed, you know. I acceleration is so fast. I couldn't believe it. But it was weird too, because you know how like sprinters get down into the stance to accelerate, like pronghorn don't like dip down to go fast. They just are there going And they also like our gyroscopic when they run. If you watch Anaelp run across the their heads do not move, their bodies don't move, and their their legs are like absorbing all the terrain changes. It's they're like they're cool, man, Yeah they are. I tell that story to tell the story. I can't remember. Oh. Later on in the hunt, I have a very similar situation stalk up on a buck with a bunch of does. This is like right at last light. Again, they don't see very good in the lower light stuff or when the sun is behind you, so you get away with a lot more stuff than long story short. I stalk up in this with this buck and his doze. He ends up kind of looping out around him. I don't have a good shot and I don't have a good range. It's like seventy five and he's kind of behind some stuff and like, no, I'm not taking the shot. He spooks off. I give him a whole bunch of which is like the way to challenge him or something. I don't know. We were kind of operating on the fly with the calling, but it's it's like, hey, look at me, you know, it's kind of pretty much what it is. Well, with that, the does all hooked back around and ran back to me because they were interesting and what I had been saying, I guess. But he runs up and then kind of loops back out and I get another good range on him at sixty one. 00:29:09 Speaker 3: Again, sixty one was like a funny spot for me. I dial my pins, that's funny. 00:29:18 Speaker 1: I roll my up. He into the right spot, draw back, and he is quartering two, but at a different angle he's quartering to I guess you'd say the left. So I'm like, okay, he's gonna wheel out as they do kind of away right, so I aim point of his shoulder, think I'm going to smoke him. And what does he do? Not a thing, does not move one muscle the whole time. And my ar goes past him and then he kind of freaks out because my arrow like hits the ground right beside him, and he kicks up a bunch just like, oh did I hit him? And I like put my range finder up to look at him tighter, and no blood, nothing, just completely missed him. So they're like just very unpredictable with the way they're going to jump and stuff they are. 00:30:04 Speaker 2: That's that's the difficult thing, you know. We talked to a buddy of ours that and he was he was a little hyperbolic, but he said he had bow hunted pronghorn for years and had like twenty misses and hadn't killed one yet with a bow, and I think it was more like ten. When we kind of were like really, he was like, no, I'm not twenty, but like probably ten or more. And uh, I think that that gave me some confidence that like we're not just you know, greenhorn. Yeah jokes here, we are greenhorn, but like in the analog game. But you know, as far as shooting stuff and shooting deer and stuff, you know, we have some experience. 00:30:41 Speaker 1: Here people in town too. 00:30:42 Speaker 2: It's just wow, man, how fast they are and how they are the weirdest animal I've ever hunted. Probably they they don't do hardly anything that makes sense. 00:30:51 Speaker 1: You can't. 00:30:52 Speaker 2: You know, we talked about you talked about me setting up on an exit route. Dude. Yeah, I mean literally, like the thing is, with a white tail, you could get on an exit route down by a creek. Right, That deer might come running down the creek or down into the draw. Right, He's probably not going to run across the top unless he's bad. Spook needs to get to the next straw. These things will just run around on the tops, they'll run in the bottoms, they'll run mid level whatever. 00:31:17 Speaker 3: Cliff face, Yeah, I see like a real steep thing that you think they're gonna go around. Now they can see so well that they just don't really care where they run as long as they're running away from you, in a direction away from you. 00:31:29 Speaker 1: You know, we talk some people in town a little bit. They're also hunting. You know. It's like it's antelope season for archery, you know, so everybody you see is hunting antlope and that's it because that's the only thing that's going on. And you know, you be like, heh, man, how'd your morning go? 00:31:41 Speaker 3: Oh? 00:31:41 Speaker 1: I messed it up at eight? He missed. It's like, okay, well, we're not the only ones that you know. 00:31:46 Speaker 2: It gives you a little It makes you feel a little better because you feel like when you're out there, well, man, are we doing this right? Or should we not even be doing this or that or whatever? And you know, you worry about what people on video on the video platforms are going to think about you. You know, you don't want to make a bad example of what you know you're trying to do. And then you realize in town and talking to some of your buddies on the phone, that like have done it before that you pretty much are just the status quo, you know what I mean. 00:32:14 Speaker 1: You're doing but everybody else. And that's what kind of hurts a little bit. Is I like to fancy myself being an alright hunter as a lot of us do, you know, And I'm definitely like average or below when it comes to handle, you know. So that's like, oh that one a little bit. It's a way to get humbled man, real quick. 00:32:33 Speaker 2: And I think I think it's uh, you know, potentially bad and also potentially really good for you going into deer season. 00:32:41 Speaker 1: Where it hurts. There's a couple of things. 00:32:43 Speaker 2: It's like the bad potential is like all of a sudden, you don't have confidence and you're shooting your question at every shot that you take it here this year, even twenty yarders or whatever. And then the potential good is is that you go, you know what, I'm not quite as good at this thing as I think I am, so I'm gonna work hard get better at it, right, and then that ends up getting you maybe closer shots in the in deer season, and yeah, you're more successful. 00:33:07 Speaker 3: So I think that one of my things for sure I realize is that range makes a lot more difference the further away. 00:33:13 Speaker 1: It is, like you can't think. And I've been this guy that thinks, like, oh I can kill white Till's seventy yards not a big deal, you know, Well, the difference in seventy and seventy one is probably like four or five inches. So like, I'm not saying I'm going to take that shot, but it's like a facsimile of the concept that man, don't if you got a white till at thirty eight, and it takes a couple of steps, like it's probably worth if you got the time, just go ahead and hit him again. Make sure it's on. 00:33:44 Speaker 2: Remember a few years ago on some Texas public I had a crazy cool day, but I ended up shooting I like skinned the hair off of a deer that came in behind a dough and I had ranged a spot, but I ended up shooting him for like it was in the I think he was like forty. I shot him for like thirty six. So there's like a four yard difference there. I probably you know. Here's the thing is like maybe you're trying to think about it. No, you killed that night, I killed it now. Yeah, but this one I didn't kill, and I was real sad. But you think about this, like if it's a two inch difference in four yards there or whatever, or three inch difference, and then say, on top of that, I shoot a little high or I aim a little high or whatever two or three inches, that's maybe five inches. That's the difference in like at least spining that deer and just taking the hair off of them, you know. I mean, it's it's a difference in finding a deer and killing that deer. And so it really like what you're saying, even even under forty yards like it does, it does. It's important, you know, And I think I probably was a little more worried about ranges back then, and still even that at that's funny. 00:34:54 Speaker 1: Is that, well, then you're shooting heavy ears, but before that you're shooting pretty light setups. Yeah, and the heavier your arrow is this is this is definitely the drawback with antelope is that the heavy arrow is not the way to go right. And so there is you have to kind of judge your quarry by what or drudge your arrow set up by what quarry you're gonna pursue. If you're shooting you know, an arrow in the four hundreds for white tail, it doesn't affect as much. If you're one of those heavy arrow type guys. The two yards makes a huge difference, yeah, you know, and that's gonna be the same thing with a like a recurve or whatever too. Like you're it's a huge amount of difference when you're shooting a slow speed and a heavier era. 00:35:33 Speaker 2: Yeah, and we did we did some like quick just kind of red neck math on one of your longer shots. 00:35:40 Speaker 1: We were able to review the footage. 00:35:41 Speaker 2: Really well because it was primo, you know, and uh, we figured out that like if he'd have been shooting my arrow set up or that weight right, that the arrow would have been like another at that distance would have been seven feet ahead and like. 00:35:57 Speaker 1: Faster get to the target. Fat. It would have been like you're watching sprinters going down a track when the guy's beating another guy by seven foot That's what it would be like. 00:36:05 Speaker 2: Yeah, so essentially, when my arrow would be hitting yours is still seven feet back. And you know the difference maybe in a spine shot on a deer that you are an antelope you take the hair off of or whatever, you know, So it's just I mean, obviously we could sit here and talk about this stuff over and over and over again. At the end of the day, man, God's gonna, you know, will every thing you want to that he wants you to actually take off the earth, you know what I mean. So I was looking at our buddy Hunter shot a deer in South Dakota, really cool video that I was watching the other day, I think Monday, And you know, when you look at where the arrow hits that deer, it was low and I kind of wonder. I didn't even talk to Hunter about this, but I kind of wonder if that deer was actually a little bit further than Hunter thought, because I think he shot his thirty yard pen and I have a feeling he's a little bit further. But because the deer was real amped up really far. And then we all know, if you've watched it, you know that, like, we were not very sure about that. 00:37:06 Speaker 1: I did not think he killed him. 00:37:08 Speaker 2: Yeah, and it was dead in a doorn aw, dude, that thing died on video. I mean you can hear him, you know, you can hear him crash and uh. And so it was just it's one of those deals where like and he was just he was so thankful. You know, he'd been praying about it a lot. But it is one of those things, like, dude, you can mess it up and and sometimes it just works out for you, you know what I mean. So true, you try to do the best you can. And I do think I'm with you on this, man like and I shot the I shot the lighter arrow set up. I think for analyopid's the way to go. I mean, right here on on what we were looking at on Wikipedia or Google or whatever earlier, it says that the average mass for a male adult pronghorn is eighty eight to one hundred and forty pounds, which is not. 00:37:47 Speaker 1: A mass measurement, by the way, that's a weight mention measurement. 00:37:51 Speaker 2: Yeah, so those that but that that being said. 00:37:57 Speaker 1: One hundred and forty pounds the bigger when we were at the one hundred and forty pounder, right, yeah, I mean we're not shooting at the shacks of the of the analytal. 00:38:03 Speaker 3: More than likely, you know, I probably shooting at like one hundred and ten pound animal. 00:38:06 Speaker 2: One hundred ten d and twenty maybe one hundred and thirty if you had a monster, which there were some nisens around but yeah, I mean I think that, like that being said, a four hundred and thirty grand arrow is going to do the job pretty much everywhere you get that thing, you know. 00:38:22 Speaker 1: So I think it is the way to go. 00:38:24 Speaker 3: Man. 00:38:24 Speaker 1: Oh absolutely, And I think that too. I'm not going to probably change, but at least the thought kind of runs through my head of like there really need five point thirty five or I would like to actually do the test the difference in five hundred and five thirty five, like that five hundred grain spot, no, just to see what the the drop is. Yeah, like the difference, you know, because before we left, I tested and I range the target at fifty fifty yards, took a step back to fifty one and it was three inches. That's what I was getting round about, you know. But so I wonder if you take the thirty five grains off or whatever it is, if it tightens it up a little bit more? 00:39:10 Speaker 2: Should be shouldn't there be like almost like an exponential factor where when you have a lighter arrow, you're shooting a faster arrow out to a certain distance, maybe because that lighter arrow will start to lose momentum. Right, that's way out there, but it's pretty far. So like say at fifty you're you're you have a lighter arrow, so it's going faster, which is gonna have a flatter trajectory, and gravity is also working less at the same time, right, So because well I think. 00:39:35 Speaker 3: That the gravity is still what's what's playing in your first thing too, gravity, so what's making it drop? 00:39:42 Speaker 1: Yeah? 00:39:43 Speaker 2: But the speed also, right, So a slower speed would it would make well. 00:39:46 Speaker 1: Slower speed just gives gravity more time to work on it. Okay, So I think it's the same same fact. Okay, but but it's it's a it is a good point that you're making. It's like if the arrow is in the in the air less time, then gravity he has less time to work on it. And it's just the way that's why airls fall, right that and drag, which drag is kind of pretty constant for most ers. But yeah, and I'm thinking about that for like whitetail or maybe elk, especially where I mean there's a lot of elk that are killed with four and forty four and fifty green arrows, like a lot of like the elk hunters that we watch and know that kill a lot of them, they kill them with lighter arrows. I've killed elk with a four and thirty grand arrow. I've killed an elk with a four hundred seventy grand arrow. I've killed elk with a thirty five. Yeah, so they'll all kill them. Yeah, but it's it's just like to what lethality do you want to? Well, I guess it's all lethality, the hard hitting aspect. How much do you care about that versus being accurate? Because that things at forty seven and stead forty five? 00:41:03 Speaker 2: Dude, I think this is like you have to balance everything in life, man like life. It doesn't matter if you're talking about you know, honestly, like you could if you don't balance drinking alcohol, you know what I mean, Like you're gonna. 00:41:17 Speaker 1: Be in trouble. 00:41:17 Speaker 2: You're gonna find yourself in trouble, you know what I mean if you And that's one that's like a negative kind of context thing. If you don't balance, Like say you're a little league baseball coach and you practice five days a week. If you don't balance that, yeah, I mean you're not doing I mean you just you can't just pour in like that. Man, that's just too much. Right, Everything has to have some sort of there's gonna be things that weigh a little heavier on each side, but you got to try to balance this stuff. And it's the same thing with this. It's like, man, at what point do I get the best results in accuracy that I maybe almost can't even shoot? The difference in like we talk about versus like also having the momentum we need to get through these things, you know. 00:41:58 Speaker 3: And I think that there's also the broader point of you could just figure out a way to be a better hunter and get closer and not have to mess with it too much. Yeah, and I think with you know what, till we try to do that. I mean, I love taking fourteen yard shots because it feels pretty good. 00:42:16 Speaker 1: Dude. 00:42:16 Speaker 2: I'm at a target at twenty yesterday and I was like, that's gotta be like fourteen, So like, please give me a. 00:42:23 Speaker 3: Twenty yard shot and then but Antelope, I guess is that we can either figure out how to be more accurate or we can figure out how to just get closer for more probable. 00:42:35 Speaker 2: I'm not sure if I'm getting any closer because my I mean, who knows, My knee was not feeling good on this trip, and I don't know. I mean, it's it's just seeing. I mean, you tell me it could happen. You might kill one with lid instead of steal next time. 00:42:49 Speaker 1: Dude, give me all that. Give me all that. Dude, it would be fun to go shoot one with a gun. I mean, I know, and honestly, guys, I love it both. It's just there probably ain't another animal except for like a duck, right, but like, ain't another furry animal that the rifle hunt versus the archery hunt is is such a polar opposite. Like you could just walk or not probably probably ride around in the truck and pick which one you want to shoot for sure, and just shooting you just hopping in the road ditch. Yeah, I don't know how legal that. 00:43:22 Speaker 2: Is, but like that's if you're on the property, you play, if you're on a two track, I mean yeah. 00:43:26 Speaker 1: So but with the with the boat, it's like it's the hardest hut I've ever done, Like you know, so it's difficult, but that's pronghorn man, it's fun. 00:43:35 Speaker 2: What do you what are you gonna Are you gonna change your setup this season? You're talking about maybe going a little bit lighter thirty grains or so. 00:43:42 Speaker 1: Got I forgot the arrows to do it. If I wanted to change my sight tape and stuff. 00:43:47 Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know. I mean, you're still gonna shoot the SR three fifty all year. Yeah, like a fast bow. I shoot the fast bow, I think, Man, I don't know. I think I'm just gonna stick. 00:44:01 Speaker 1: With what I got. Uh. But for antelope, I would change a turkey, for sure, I'm gonna change. Yeah. Uh, shooting a blow gun, that's right. If we even have to shoot a boat to turkey, sometimes they make you but otherwise I'm shooting a gun. I'll like to make them die. But I just because the other animals were hunting are mostly bigger bodied, I will probably continue shooting the bigger era because also you get a little bit more flexibility, Like with an elk. I mean, you got vitals that are bigger than a five gallon bucket, right, you know, Like if you're off three inches on an elk, you still hit lung It's a lung shot still, even if you were gonna hit the lungs on the other spot. Where antelope, if you're off three inches, it's the difference in the vitals and missing the animal. You know, so that's that's another huge part too. But you know, maybe for some of this, maybe like in December, I might look at because we'll be you know, mostly in the South, then I might think about switching to the five hundred grain and. 00:44:57 Speaker 2: Twenty pound deer that's right, big buck set. Yeah, yeah, I think for me, you know, I actually started shooting a new bow when I got home, or it's a bow that i've shot. So I actually shot a pig or shot at a pig in June, I think it was, and I missed him high right over the back, and I was it was like thirty yards. I was super surprised, right, So then I go home and the next day I get up and I shoot and my boat is shooting super low, and I'm like and it's like it's for sure off right, and I'm just like that doesn't make sense. 00:45:34 Speaker 1: At all, dude. I'm like, this is dumb. 00:45:35 Speaker 2: Something's wrong with my bow for sure, But like I thought tuning issue or what's going on. So anyway, I just like chunked it, shot started shooting. That's the lighter arrow for for the antelope, and I just practice practice practice with that boat set up, so I get done with that analot hunt. I come home, like, I want to test this arrow out or this this set up up out again, because this is my five hundred grand arrow that I shot last year that's going through this bowt So it's like, I'm gonna shoot this ladder through paper and try to see if it's tuned. 00:46:03 Speaker 1: Well. 00:46:04 Speaker 2: I shoot it twice. It seems pretty tuned for just a redneck tune job, right, And so I dished that. I go to twenty and I shoot and it's shooting low and I'm like, man, something's wrong with this. 00:46:17 Speaker 1: I don't know why, but I looked at it. 00:46:18 Speaker 2: I don't really do this much, but like I kind of grabbed the sight and like I just kind of like barely pulled on it, and it like slid the whole way down like almost out of the site, you know, a vertical, and so I was like, oh snap. So I moved it back up to about where I thought it was. I didn't have a good picture of where it was exactly, but I put it pretty close and then I got the alany ranches out. It was that bolt that did the vertical up and down was loose, bad, like really loose. So now I know what happened. Anyway, I tighten that thing back up, kind of dial dial it in a few shots here and there, and get it close at twenty and work my way out to forty. 00:46:55 Speaker 1: And now like that thing is shooting. Man, that bow is awesome. 00:47:00 Speaker 2: And that's it's a little bit slower bow, but at the end of the day, it shoots the arrows really accurately, really good and coming. When it comes to whitetail, I think I'm just gonna I'm just gonna stay with that, man, And I feel way more comfortable, uh, in the draw cycle and in the back wall hold that I hold that pen so much more steady than I do. You know you talked about this. You shot a kind of a Matthew's Ferrari for a while too. And those bows that shoot fast, I mean, if you can get them shooting, they're awesome. But sometimes, man, the littlest things can just make make those bows like have a ton of torque or. 00:47:38 Speaker 1: Issue at as a shorter axle to axle, which a lot of speed bows are shorter, and that really makes it better. I mean, it's just like you know, it's if you have like a stick, it's real big right, it's harder to make that thing move. 00:47:53 Speaker 2: That's why a little balance being guys used, or the tightrope guys use a long stick. 00:47:59 Speaker 1: It's inertia much. Yeah, exactly. 00:48:01 Speaker 2: Yeah, So anyway, that's I think I'm just going to stay with that that bow. You know, I really don't like the fact that, like it's going to increase my pen gap a little bit, but it's just it's shooting so well and I'm just going to try to make fourteen yard shots. 00:48:14 Speaker 1: I want to talk about pin gap. I know we're kind of getting close to the end of this thing, but uh, there's a thing that I learned too, and I've always kind of been like, oh, I like my bigger pin gap for the adjustable sight, because I can actually see where the little marks are. Whenever you have a faster ear set up, your marks are real close. Oh mine, we're super close. And then what that's a good thing. Yeah. That means that your your your marks are so tight that it doesn't matter if you're on fifty one or fifty two. Yeah, whereas if you're on if they're pretty far apart, yea, that matters, makes a difference. I know, I've never thought about it that way until just recently, like, oh well, if they're tight, then that means it's not as imperative that you hit it right on the little button. 00:48:53 Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, so mine word, I basically a black line all the way down with that. 00:48:59 Speaker 1: Shoot three zero three or whatever I was shooting, you know. 00:49:02 Speaker 2: But yeah, I I that pen gap thing is a little bit bothersome because I know that there's that difference and when you get out to like I feel, I mean, I shot at a shot at eighty the last two days really really good with that bow, like tiny groups, you know, and surprising surprisingly, and I'm just like, man, I probably should stay with it. But it just does like when you get to forty five yards. If you're gonna shoot a deer at forty five yards, say you're on the ground and he ends up being you know, fifty two or forty or whatever. It just it makes a difference. 00:49:37 Speaker 1: Man. 00:49:38 Speaker 2: It's and it's kind of hurts, hurts to think about. But yeah, just maybe you just need to clear my mind and just know that, like, I'm gonna do the best I can to get my rangers ranges and make good shots. 00:49:47 Speaker 1: A new hunt Man one thing on that ranges thing I think we can mess with our range finders. I was thinking about this that a lot of times there's a setting and in the hunt is not the time for me to do this. I just need to be focusing. But if we look, you probably have a like make it through the grass setting or a bounce off of whatever it hits setting, and we might be able to kind of mess with that for some of the ground stuff to have through the grass the grass setting. Yeah, it's a thing. Yeah. I just for sure kind of forgot about it until like day three and I was like, well, I ain't got time for this right now. 00:50:18 Speaker 3: Yeah, so anyways, Yeah, Also another thing that helps on that stuff too is to, uh, if you have some pretty good, pretty good range funder, you can just hold down the range button and scan and I'll just keep and just. 00:50:30 Speaker 1: Do some circles. Started using that. 00:50:31 Speaker 2: Yeah when you told me that, because I was that night that I had him at fifty nine in case he was like, you know, you can just hold that down, because I just I started shaking real bad because I was like, man, I'm freaking out. I can't get my range. It's like sixteen sixteen sixteen, Like that thing is not sixteen yards. But I started using that scan and it was it was helpful to use, you know. So another thing about you know, pen gap, getting close and just having confidence. One way to get really close to deer this year is to listen to the RUT Fresh Report, which is on the wire to Hunt feed or will be it's on feed to okay where it is, Oh, okay, I don't know for sure. So well, we did this last year for Mark on the Wired to Hunt podcast, but it's the rt Fresh Report. Every week we give you a few different dudes from across the country that let you know, in this state or this region or whatever, these whitetail are doing these kind of things, man, and you can expect this and in the next week or so. It's a good way to stay up to date in case you're going on a trip, or you might want to go on a trip. So you got some off time. You're a fireman next week, and you're a fireman now, but you got off time next week, maybe you you want to go, you know, because the rut's hitting or whatever. So uh, make sure you know we're gonna make sure and report or not report, but promote that for you whenever we figure out where it's gonna be, but you want to make sure you're you're listening to that. Uh, it's gonna be a good time. We're gonna Casey and I are gonna host it, so you don't have to worry about Mark, you know, messing. 00:51:54 Speaker 1: Things up for you. He says. You want to spe on the first episode and then we're gonna we're gonna make him go. 00:51:59 Speaker 2: Away, So y'all start about week two, you know, But no, it's it's gonna be a good time. We're gonna do that basically September all the way through the end of the year, so you can hear us doing that kind of thing, and we'll make sure and get that all to you the links or whatever you need if you if you want to follow that. Also, we're doing a Q and a podcast again, like we did. We put one out a couple weeks ago, but it was a couple of months ago. I think that we actually did this as a video Q and a podcast. So if you have a question and you send a video into our email or our DMS on Instagram or whatever, however, you can get just a vertical video of yourself going, hey, I'm just wondering about hunting scrapes on October seventh in this area? Am I going to see daylight? You know, daylight movement or whatever? And then you just send that video into us, we'll put you on our video. So if you're watching here on YouTube, like, it'll be like this, but we'll add you into the video. It's a pretty cool thing. And uh, we'll answer all your questions. We love talking deer and we love answering questions because it makes us think outside of the box too. 00:52:58 Speaker 1: So extra point. If you send that to us on the X platform, which formerly known as Twitter, extra point extra points, that's right. If you send us your vertical video on that, there's a real good chance we use it. So if you don't follow us over there on X, which is confusing right Literally, Tyler was texting me something about something on X last night and I was like, what do you mean on X night? No one's hunting an hour this year? What are you talking Aboutably should keep calling it Twitter. I know we were talking about it, and there's not a lot of intersection between Twitter users and on X users, but we sit at that intersection, so it gets confusing for us. But if you are on that platform. Send us a message for us on there. It's it's a it's a good spot to be a lot of freedom over there. And if you like, if you like kill shots, which we do not exclusively any but we like them, right, I mean speak part of what we do kill on the video. I'm commenting on that. That's right better. I got a lot of that this past week. That's pretty funny. 00:54:05 Speaker 2: Listen, when you sell film, you don't get too many kills. 00:54:09 Speaker 1: Five and didnt getting out of the rap up film that year. Just freaking killing them, that's all it matters. But it's good anyways, appreciate you all following along. Uh in the wrap up pretty much, just don't hunt Handlop with the boat. Just get you gun and remember this is your element.

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